climbhighsleeplow

Hi amfs

Ngorongoro Farm House is very nice.

Rack rates for double rooms:
$125 pp HB
$140 pp FB

sandi

amfs -

Ngorongoro Farmhouse is a good option, not as large as the Serena and a short drive to the Crater. Climbhigh... has provided rack prices, so why not see what Roy Safari can do for you on this property... I'm sure they can.

Patty

amfs,
Ah I see. I guess the deciding factor then would be how much you want to stay at those 2 camps.

Can someone tell me how far the drive is from Ngorongoro Farmhouse to either of the crater descent roads? I understand it's located outside of the conservation area but wasn't sure how far. Or alternatively, how far is Ngorongoro Farmhouse from Gibbs/Plantation?

I think Liz's report said they left for the crater very early in the morning, so this might be a consideration for amfs versus staying at the crater rim.

climbhighsleeplow

This is really a tough choice and I am thinking as I am writing so bear with me...

Moivaro Coffee Lodge is more personal and less touristy than the Impala Hotel.

In Oct, Oldupai Camp is not a good choice. There are too many villages nearby and no wildlife. I would much rather stay at Ngorongoro.

I like the Ronjo Camp though - experience-wise it is much better than Lobo Wildlife Lodge but that's only if you are OK with the discomforts of this style of camping. It is not luxurious. Migration Camp should be a better choice than Lobo if you want more comfort. In October the new Serena Mbuzi camp will be another option in this area. Roys should also be able to find you a private camp here if you want one.

Tarangire River Camp has an edge over Maweninga in terms of view and location.

IMO, Ngorongoro Farm House is better than Gibbs or Plantation Lodge. These are all at least 3 miles from the gate - so it will take a while to get down into the crater from them.

I can probably do more with the Roy's itinerary. I also like their Chumbe option because your 5 nights each at Matemwe and Pongwe are a lot of the same experience.

amfs

thanks everyone for your help
This looks like our final plan, and we'll hopefully go with GE (but they havent replied to my mail I sent on tues....so it could be Roys or ATR yet!)
Can you have a gander at it and see what you think? Do the distances between places seem ok? Do you think we need the night at Gibbs farm if its close to Ngorongoro Farm house? Also, would we go to Lake Manyara on way to Gibbs or on way to Ngoro FH?
Finally has anyone got suggestions for places to stay in central serengeti? We chose the serena because we couldnt find any others. Is the centre good for wildlife in Oct?

Thanks!

Oct 4: Arrival Kilimanjaro - Moivaro Coffee Lodge, D
Oct 5: Arusha - Tarangire Treetops, B,L,D.
Oct 6: Tarangire Treetops, B,L,D.
Oct 7: Tarangire / Lake Manyara - Gibbs Farm, B, L, D.
Oct 8: Lake Manyara - Ngorongoro Farm house
Oct 9: Ngorongoro - Ngorongoro Farm house
Oct 10: Ngorongoro / Serengeti - Serengeti Serena Lodge, B,L,D.
Oct 11: Serengeti - Serengeti Serena Lodge, B,L,D.
Oct 12: Serengeti / Arusha / Z'bar - Matemwe Village-Shamba Suites(HB)
Oct 13 Matemwe Village-Shamba Suites(HB)
Oct 14 Matemwe Village-Shamba Suites(HB)
Oct 15 Matemwe Village-Shamba Suites(HB)
Oct 16 Pongwe Village (HB)
Oct 17 Pongwe Village (HB)
Oct 18 Pongwe Village (HB)
Oct 19 Pongwe Village (HB)
Oct 20 To Chumbe Island(FB)
Oct 21 Chumbe Island(FB)
Oct 22 To Zanzibar stone town. Overnight Emerson & Green(BB)
Oct 23 Emerson & Green(BB)
Oct 24 - fly home from Zanzibar

amfs

Hi all

Just after thinking (I am the worst mind-changer if you hadnt already noticed)...
I reckon we'd only need 1 night around Ngor crater, so do yuo think its better to replace 1 of the nights in the Ngor FH with another night in Central Serengeti?
Thanks yet again

climbhighsleeplow

Yes, I agree!

Central Serengeti is certainly worth another night or two.

The Serengeti Serena is an excellent choice (as far as lodges go) as it is very near the action (for wildlife, balloon rides) and a good jump off point for day drives in all directions but especially to the North for that time of year.

sandi

amfs -

>>Oct 8: Lake Manyara - Ngorongoro Farm house
Oct 9: Ngorongoro - Ngorongoro Farm house
Oct 10: Ngorongoro / Serengeti - Serengeti Serena Lodge, B,L,D.
Oct 11: Serengeti - Serengeti Serena Lodge, B,L,D.<<

Yes, another day in the Serengeti would be good and the central area is good for reasons mentioned by Climbhigh......

But ascertain from whichever outfitter you use

"will your driver be able to drive in any direction - probably further North (up near Migration Camp) - to find the migrating herds"

Of course, if this is of interest to you as there is no guarantee exactly where the herds at your time of visit. The herds may not have left the Mara; if they have, they may still be further north then where the Serena is located.

Some outfitters limit the distace their guide/drivers can go in any one day. So if you do indeed have to put on additional miles while in the Serengeti, you should make this clear to the outfitter so not to have any misunderstandings with your guide/driver.

amfs

thanks sandi and climbhigh for the replies. I'll definitely ask about the mileage limits, really good point sandi. Where would you recommend to stay in Central Serengeti as to be honest we'd love some nights in tents (with good facilities though).
Cheers!!
Another poss is to stay 1 night in ndutu lodge on our way to the central serengeti...what do you guys think?

sandi

amfs -

From Climbhigh.... earlier post:

>>Migration Camp should be a better choice than Lobo if you want more comfort. In October the new Serena Mbuzi camp will be another option in this area. Roys should also be able to find you a private camp here if you want one.<<

If you want tents and depending on you budget, if you don't want the rustic Ronji fly-camp - then Migration Camp or the soon to reopen (Septemer '05, if on schedule) Serena's Mbuzi Camp are options. These are further north then the Serena Lodge in the central area. Since this will be the first Serena camp in this northern area, my guess (only a guess) is that it will be on the line of their Kirawira Camp in the Western Serengeti - on a higher level then their lodges. Have Roy, ATR and GE provide prices for these.

Nduto is not the place to be in October... nothing happening here.

amfs

thanks sandi

I think at this stage i might stick to central serengeti as we'll have been doing a lot of 1-nighters in places and it might be nice to stop for more than 2 nights in one place. Although I do love the sound of migration camp!

I assume that if its a bad time of year for ndutu that it'll also be a bad time of year for Kusini?? I really like the sound of kusini after liz's report although she was there at a different time of year.

I finally feel i am getting somewhere with this itinerary, but IYO do you think I am mad not having any nights tenting?

Thanks

climbhighsleeplow

I LOVE Kusini (much more than Ndutu) and could stay there any time of year, but in your case it will be too much driving (and you don't have enough time). In October, your game drives from Kusini will be up towards Seronera anyway.

If you want a tented camp, you could consider Swala in Tarangire. Everyone here knows I think Treetops is very romantic, but at Swala you can sit in front of your tent and watch the wildlife (elephants, etc) just a few hundred feet away at the little water hole!

Another option: You can ask Roy's to give you some options for shared private tented camps near Seronera in central Serengeti.

Being a mid-range outfitter, they may/may not have relationships with some of the better camps such as Nomad, Sokwe, Sanctuary, Sayari, Wildlife Explorer or even Tanganyika Wilderness Camps.

Unfortunately, it it always takes some research to know about these camps and where & how to book them!

lisa

If you are looking for a tented camp near central Serengeti, have you considered Ikoma? It's a bit north and west of the Seronera area. Haven't stayed there yet, but we'll be there for two nights in late November. I've heard it's particularly good for lions -- plus it's just outside the park boundary so you can do game walks & night drives. Also a bit more reasonably priced than most of the other tented camps (certainly less than Migration, Kusini, Swala, etc. -- and less luxe too, although it looks comfortable to me). Good Earth was able to book us there -- maybe ask the outfitters you are talking to and see what they think. You can see it here. http://www.tanzania-adventure.com/ikoma-serengeti.htm

amfs

thanks climbhigh.
we've fallen in love with treetops (from reviews and reading) so dont know if I can be budged from there

Thanks lisa for the suggestion of ikoma. It looks like we will go with good earth so they could book it for us. do you know how far it is from the seronera area?

Patty

<the soon to reopen (Septemer '05, if on schedule) Serena's Mbuzi Camp are options>

I think cookndoc is supposed to stay there in June. I hope for his sake, they're reopening sooner than Sep!

lisa

If you take a look at the map at this link and see Ikoma Gate, Ikoma Camp is very near there (about 3 km I believe).
http://www.coastal.cc/serengeti.htm

amfs

hi all

thanks for all the help so far.
I think we're going to go with Good earth.
Just wondering if we are mad to go to Migration camp in Mid Oct in hope of catching some of the migration. Does anyone know if its possible to see some of it in Northern Serengeti then?

Thanks again!

sandi

amfs -

The herds can move at a "drop of rain" - so if there is even a brief shower in Octoboer, which is quite possible, they'll start the return to the Serengeti. But then they'll stop, turnaround and head back to the Mara. Then if more rain and they're heading back to the Serengeti.

We're talking animals who do "their ownthing" - so mid-October is fine for this area. Besides you'll have the opportunity to drive north on game drives and come across herds.

From year-to-year the pattern changes, so there are a range of months where the herds are likely to be found (Late-July - end/Sept early/October in the Mara; October - Nov/Dec in North/Northeast Serengeti; Dec/Jan in Central Serengeti; end-Jan to mid-Mar in Southeast Serengeti; April - May moving into Southwest Serengeti; May - June in Western Serengeti; July towards the Mara). But this can all change by weeks on either side of above months from year to year.

If I had based my first safari on seeing the Big 5, I never would have returned - I didn't see a Leopard till my 5th safari and it was in South Africa. And as Climbhigh... has mentioned from his experiences - you can see the herds for a few hours in one area; three hours later, they're gone and onto greener pastures.

We all know what we hope to see, but it's best to go with the idea of being surprised around every corner. Besides Migration Camp is a winner and there are a wealth of animal sightings to be seen in the area - even the herds, if only for a few hours.

amfs

thanks sandi

have you heard any reports of tarangire safari lodge? seems ok on the web but was thinking there might be a nicer (within budget) place to stay in the park. Any thoughts on tarangire tented camp?

sandi

amfs -

I believe Climbhigh... did a review of the options available at Tarangire. Click on his name and see what he said about Tarangire River Lodge versus River Camp.

They're two different animals. You have a choice of tent or banda accommodations at TRL, whereas, TRC is a semi-permanent tent camp.