Obtaining Itinerary Prices for 2008 Tanzaniz Trip
Jul 4th, 2007, 07:59 AM
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Obtaining Itinerary Prices for 2008 Tanzaniz Trip
Hello all, Because everyone has been so helpful in our planning for 2008 Tanzania trip, I thought I'd pass along my first itinerary and pricing for your comments. We started out thinking June, but could be August since we have had a few comments positive towards that month..any suggestions on June vs. August?
Having said that, I contacted about 5 or 6 local operators, Sunnys, Hippo, Buckbuck, Coastal, Africa Mecca (dumped that idea; they wanted $50 upfront just to talk) Green---" and a few in the states, Africa Direct, ATR, CCA in S/Africa -- I gave each the same itinerary and the fact I wanted to fly-in (physical limitations require less road and more game time) I can go 4 hours on a game drive but can not include 4-5-6 hours driving to and from unless I have a chriopractor with me!
Here is the first on received from Sunnys' - VERY quick on the return
Day 1 Fly into KMI, connect Lake Manyara National Park to fly to N. Crater Lodge - all inclusive with game drives (prob. just the evening, 1st night)
Day 2 N. Crater lodge; all inclusive with 2 drives
Day 3 Early am transfer Lake M. airstrip for flight to Grumet River Camp - all inc. with game drives
days 4, 5, Grumeti - full days game package
Day 6, AFter breakfast, transfer Grumeti Airsrip for flight to Selous, met and transferred to Selous Safari Camp - game package with lodge
Days 7, 8 - Full days game package wtih lodge
Day 9 early morning game drive, afternoon transfer to Selous air strip to DAR to catch eve. flight home
Price including transfers (air and ground) and park fees
7,122 p/p
Any insights, suggestions, opinions?
Thanks D.
Having said that, I contacted about 5 or 6 local operators, Sunnys, Hippo, Buckbuck, Coastal, Africa Mecca (dumped that idea; they wanted $50 upfront just to talk) Green---" and a few in the states, Africa Direct, ATR, CCA in S/Africa -- I gave each the same itinerary and the fact I wanted to fly-in (physical limitations require less road and more game time) I can go 4 hours on a game drive but can not include 4-5-6 hours driving to and from unless I have a chriopractor with me!
Here is the first on received from Sunnys' - VERY quick on the return
Day 1 Fly into KMI, connect Lake Manyara National Park to fly to N. Crater Lodge - all inclusive with game drives (prob. just the evening, 1st night)
Day 2 N. Crater lodge; all inclusive with 2 drives
Day 3 Early am transfer Lake M. airstrip for flight to Grumet River Camp - all inc. with game drives
days 4, 5, Grumeti - full days game package
Day 6, AFter breakfast, transfer Grumeti Airsrip for flight to Selous, met and transferred to Selous Safari Camp - game package with lodge
Days 7, 8 - Full days game package wtih lodge
Day 9 early morning game drive, afternoon transfer to Selous air strip to DAR to catch eve. flight home
Price including transfers (air and ground) and park fees
7,122 p/pAny insights, suggestions, opinions?
Thanks D.
Jul 4th, 2007, 10:46 AM
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I wonder the same as Patty.
For a flying itinerary, as you have, it's usual to use the guides/vehicles of the camp/lodge visiting. If you prefer to have a private vehicle, theh outfitter can arrange on your behalf, at a hefty price, for a private vehicle from the individual property. Then, and if no private vehicle available, would an outfitter recommend using their guide/vehicle, also at a daily rate. To indicate this from the onset is strange.
For a flying itinerary, as you have, it's usual to use the guides/vehicles of the camp/lodge visiting. If you prefer to have a private vehicle, theh outfitter can arrange on your behalf, at a hefty price, for a private vehicle from the individual property. Then, and if no private vehicle available, would an outfitter recommend using their guide/vehicle, also at a daily rate. To indicate this from the onset is strange.
Jul 4th, 2007, 11:08 AM
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Well what happened was I got on the tatoz site and went through the list and contacted whom I could. Apparently some of the operators are only intersted in sending out their guides with an itinerary and camping safaris. AT least that is the feeling I got. I had to send several emails indicating that what I wanted to do was Fly-in to each lodge. The larger named tour operators
were fine with that (except I think Roys wanted to put together a tented safari ONLY); its been such a process some of the names are hazy and I am out of town right now, so my lists are not at hand.
Then I asked on this board and several names came up: Good Earth, Sunny, Hippo, Bushbuck,and a couple others who still have not replied . Then I went to ANOTHER forum and got some names (which included some the travel agents names) I would not hesitate in going with a US based agent if I could find one that would be upfront with me.On my last trip,I was told individual lodges rates were not disclosed...well then how am I knowing what I am paying for???They said they got a lump sum figure from the tour operator (I suppose this person was in Africa -) and THEY (states) would not break it down. I don't know about anyone else,but if I buy a car, I sure do know what I am paying for and if I want to upgrade, the "anit-theft", or the "off the chart engine" will cost me "x". I could have bought a small car for what my last trip cost; so I was taking the advice of the forum and contacting the operators individually.
Good Earth wanted to use their own guides/drivers and gave me a price for each lodge MINUS game drives. Well that did not make sense to me! So they are now back to the drawing board on this one.
Let me say, I am NOT at all against anyone making a commission; afterall that is the business; what bothers me is that no one will tell me how much out of the total cost...I think its only fair the consumer knows; therefore we can add, subtract, go up or down on luxury - or not - depending on the price quoted on the property, not the bulk trip. Am I wrong in thinking this. I'd love the travel agents to weigh in..Except for the huge trip to S/A, we have never done such a costly trip, and so whenever I contacted Hotels, lodges, etc.myself for a trip that we were taking (usually OFF SEASON so we could get a little break somewhere along the line) and get a price I could afford for a semi-or even deluxe lodge. When I brought 2nd and 3rd parties into it, no one wanted to give me a breakdown. If this is the normal way everyone does business, then I will accept it; I am just a bit skeptical when I am given a total price, yet no one will tell me why!
I did get a price of the air to and from each lodge from one operator which I appreciated so I could at least see how much I was paying to avoid driving - and it was well worth it to me.I could not go if I had to put in so many hours on the road. And we saw tons of game flying above them in our little charters in SA. It was quite fun and we enjoyed it.
CCA did send me an email stating their rack rates, and told me if I used an agent they take their fee off the nightly rack rate so it is up to them what to charge. that at least gives me an idea ,but they also said if they were huge customers they could get a better than rack rate price and then even more of a discount.IT was up to THEM how much they wanted to sell it to me for. Am I right or wrong in asking them what that price is?? Thanks?
And buy the way, anyone take a look at the itinerary offered by Sunnys. It is my first price so therefore not quite jumping on it, but thought I'd pass it on for comments. Thanks so much..hopefully a much more educated consumer..sooner or later! D.
were fine with that (except I think Roys wanted to put together a tented safari ONLY); its been such a process some of the names are hazy and I am out of town right now, so my lists are not at hand.
Then I asked on this board and several names came up: Good Earth, Sunny, Hippo, Bushbuck,and a couple others who still have not replied . Then I went to ANOTHER forum and got some names (which included some the travel agents names) I would not hesitate in going with a US based agent if I could find one that would be upfront with me.On my last trip,I was told individual lodges rates were not disclosed...well then how am I knowing what I am paying for???They said they got a lump sum figure from the tour operator (I suppose this person was in Africa -) and THEY (states) would not break it down. I don't know about anyone else,but if I buy a car, I sure do know what I am paying for and if I want to upgrade, the "anit-theft", or the "off the chart engine" will cost me "x". I could have bought a small car for what my last trip cost; so I was taking the advice of the forum and contacting the operators individually.
Good Earth wanted to use their own guides/drivers and gave me a price for each lodge MINUS game drives. Well that did not make sense to me! So they are now back to the drawing board on this one.
Let me say, I am NOT at all against anyone making a commission; afterall that is the business; what bothers me is that no one will tell me how much out of the total cost...I think its only fair the consumer knows; therefore we can add, subtract, go up or down on luxury - or not - depending on the price quoted on the property, not the bulk trip. Am I wrong in thinking this. I'd love the travel agents to weigh in..Except for the huge trip to S/A, we have never done such a costly trip, and so whenever I contacted Hotels, lodges, etc.myself for a trip that we were taking (usually OFF SEASON so we could get a little break somewhere along the line) and get a price I could afford for a semi-or even deluxe lodge. When I brought 2nd and 3rd parties into it, no one wanted to give me a breakdown. If this is the normal way everyone does business, then I will accept it; I am just a bit skeptical when I am given a total price, yet no one will tell me why!
I did get a price of the air to and from each lodge from one operator which I appreciated so I could at least see how much I was paying to avoid driving - and it was well worth it to me.I could not go if I had to put in so many hours on the road. And we saw tons of game flying above them in our little charters in SA. It was quite fun and we enjoyed it.
CCA did send me an email stating their rack rates, and told me if I used an agent they take their fee off the nightly rack rate so it is up to them what to charge. that at least gives me an idea ,but they also said if they were huge customers they could get a better than rack rate price and then even more of a discount.IT was up to THEM how much they wanted to sell it to me for. Am I right or wrong in asking them what that price is?? Thanks?
And buy the way, anyone take a look at the itinerary offered by Sunnys. It is my first price so therefore not quite jumping on it, but thought I'd pass it on for comments. Thanks so much..hopefully a much more educated consumer..sooner or later! D.
Jul 4th, 2007, 11:43 AM
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DanaA70 - I agree with your concerns and what you are asking for.
For example, a year ago when we went to three countries, South Africa, Zambia, and Kenya, and three camps MalaMala, Nsefu, and Lil Governors, my TA broke the total cost down by camp and by flights between camps, and also by the cost of staying a couple nights at hotels (e.g. Norfolk) for transfers. With this we knew what each leg of the trip was costing and could decide if that was what we wanted. (It was, we did, great safari).
Now also, I'm not sure how this ties in, but my TA used the African services of Thompsons, Robin Pope, and A&K (for each country). So my TA did not exactly do it "all by himself" either.
regards - tom
ps - the rates for the camps (that we paid) were the rack rates that I saw posted on the internet.
For example, a year ago when we went to three countries, South Africa, Zambia, and Kenya, and three camps MalaMala, Nsefu, and Lil Governors, my TA broke the total cost down by camp and by flights between camps, and also by the cost of staying a couple nights at hotels (e.g. Norfolk) for transfers. With this we knew what each leg of the trip was costing and could decide if that was what we wanted. (It was, we did, great safari).
Now also, I'm not sure how this ties in, but my TA used the African services of Thompsons, Robin Pope, and A&K (for each country). So my TA did not exactly do it "all by himself" either.
regards - tom
ps - the rates for the camps (that we paid) were the rack rates that I saw posted on the internet.
Jul 4th, 2007, 11:58 AM
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In my experience, it seems most tour operators in East Africa quote complete itineraries rather than components. I believe others here have commented that ATR does give you breakdowns in their quote (although they also have a strong tendency to push you toward certain camps). You can find many camp/lodge rates on their websites or email them for their rate sheet. Selous Safari Camp sent me their rates by email when I inquired. Also Eben lists the rates for many camps on his www.go-safari.com site. You can then get a good idea of the cost of one camp relative to another if you want to upgrade/downgrade. The internal air carriers such as Coastal, Regional, etc. also post rates on their websites. The additional costs would be park fees and ground transfers such as Manyara airstrip to Crater Lodge and vice versa which I don't believe are included in their daily rate. OK, so this is probably not the answer you were looking for 
If you want to work with a US agent, you can email Sandi at [email protected]
If you want to work with a US agent, you can email Sandi at [email protected]
Jul 4th, 2007, 12:07 PM
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Patty, Well Yes it certainly helps! I just like getting an IDEA of what a lodge is charging; I really hate getting lump sums mailed to me, so thank you for giving me more web sites to spend ALL of time perusing, My husband calls my pc my cracktop. Because I get addicted. THAX D/
Jul 4th, 2007, 04:17 PM
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Dana, I completely agree with you that you deserve to know what you're paying for when you put together an itinerary. A few years ago, I tried a US based TA that "specializes" in Africa and they refused to break down their quote. Now I understand why. They passed it onto someone else. I see why any agency or outfitter would advertise their own itinerary and not be able to break down the prices but when you come up with your own itinerary, you should be able to know what each camp costs. I like the outfitters/TAs who give you the rack rate price and then their discount.
I will say that I think it's wisest to go with someone who specializes in East Africa if you want to do a Tanzanian trip. I was helped by many on this board (Patty, great air info!!). Sandi and Eben were so helpful because they knew the latest information in Tanzania. That really counts when you are planning this kind of safari.
I don't have opinions on June vs August - we went in June and the weather was good. Just bring an American plastic fly swatter. No, bring several.
I will say that I think it's wisest to go with someone who specializes in East Africa if you want to do a Tanzanian trip. I was helped by many on this board (Patty, great air info!!). Sandi and Eben were so helpful because they knew the latest information in Tanzania. That really counts when you are planning this kind of safari.
I don't have opinions on June vs August - we went in June and the weather was good. Just bring an American plastic fly swatter. No, bring several.
Jul 4th, 2007, 04:52 PM
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Thank you Clematis! I just do not understand if we are spending the money we do not know where it is going! Would you feel comfortable sharing your operator's name? I too feel those who contribute are owed a big HURAH@ But I still do not know who to use! Since I know what I want, I do not want to be paying a t/a the money to do it "all over again." I cannot contact the lodges directly - believe me- have tried, so I just want the FAIREST price, not looking for a deal...just fairness. Maybe its a seller's market; I do not know. But thanks for all the input!
Does anyone want to comment on Sunny's pricing? Tx D.
Does anyone want to comment on Sunny's pricing? Tx D.
Jul 4th, 2007, 05:24 PM
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Dana, the point I was making is to get someone who specializes in East Africa (mine did not). I second the recommendation someone gave you on this thread for sandi and also for Eben which I think is kiliwarriors.com. They both knew the layout of the land and how long it would take to get from point A to point B. Now that you know the itinerary you want, it's not too much trouble for an operator/ta to give you a quote. Take your time until you're confident you have someone you can trust.
Jul 4th, 2007, 05:30 PM
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I don't know the 2008 rates for those camps but Sunny should be competitive and there's no reason to believe they're not giving you a fair price. You can always have a few different operators quote the exact same itinerary to compare. Good luck!
Jul 5th, 2007, 03:30 AM
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Hi Dana.
I won't be any help here, but i just had to say I am going through the exact same thing as you.
I have obtained various quotes and then obtained similar/same quotes from each of them and then become so confured and undecided about which company to go with because they each have good points and not so good points.
I seriously never thought deciding which safari to go on (or where) would be so difficult.
It's great fun, the excitement is unbearable and the anticipation is wonderful, but, it IS hard work! LOL.
We (my daughter) and I are going either September, October or November 2008 to either Kenya or Tanzania.
We just can't decide which we prefer.
Good luck in planning your trip.
From - a fellow (first time) safari planner.
Sue
I won't be any help here, but i just had to say I am going through the exact same thing as you.
I have obtained various quotes and then obtained similar/same quotes from each of them and then become so confured and undecided about which company to go with because they each have good points and not so good points.
I seriously never thought deciding which safari to go on (or where) would be so difficult.
It's great fun, the excitement is unbearable and the anticipation is wonderful, but, it IS hard work! LOL.
We (my daughter) and I are going either September, October or November 2008 to either Kenya or Tanzania.
We just can't decide which we prefer.
Good luck in planning your trip.
From - a fellow (first time) safari planner.
Sue
Jul 5th, 2007, 03:36 AM
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P.S. Clematis1 - I would like for the t/a and operators to give the rack rate and their discounts too! I have YET to find one who will disclose anything. CCA told me they give a discount and to expect it to be passed on; yet every ta I spoke with says they do not do that! OH how frustrating!
I have a quote from CCA and they gave me a l0 percent discount and a free night for every 3 spent. I just thought it would be nice to give a local my business but perhaps I was being too generous with my giving, as I dont see much given back. CCa hasn't given me a total price yet but in our correspondence they told me about the l0 percent and the nights given. At least they were upfront. Given that, I will still continue my contacts with local operators and perhaps A.Serendipity and Kiliwarriors (for some reason I was under the impression Killiwarriors just planned mobile trips and mountain climbing. Glad to find out I was wrong! So will try them too. Appreciate all the tips you and others have given. D.
I have a quote from CCA and they gave me a l0 percent discount and a free night for every 3 spent. I just thought it would be nice to give a local my business but perhaps I was being too generous with my giving, as I dont see much given back. CCa hasn't given me a total price yet but in our correspondence they told me about the l0 percent and the nights given. At least they were upfront. Given that, I will still continue my contacts with local operators and perhaps A.Serendipity and Kiliwarriors (for some reason I was under the impression Killiwarriors just planned mobile trips and mountain climbing. Glad to find out I was wrong! So will try them too. Appreciate all the tips you and others have given. D.
Jul 5th, 2007, 08:56 AM
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Tom's trip report http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34881694
