Botswana or Zambia for special trip?
May 16th, 2006, 07:37 AM
#21
lerasp - I took my first trip to Botswana in Oct05. It was a magical trip. I don't have the budget some of the Fodorites have so I went mobile camping. (I'm female, almost 50, and it was a 17 night trip.) I can't wait to do it again. (But not in october - too hot!) Tentative plans to do this trip again with my kids in 2008 (a graduation trip). I took hundreds/thousands of pics. My favorites (only a hundred or so) are here http://www.pbase.com/cjw/album_of_ph...5&page=all
It's just a small sampling of what I saw.
I can't compare Botswana to Zambia (or even East Africa) but you are sure to have a "special trip" in either country. I don't think you can pick a "best" place to go. Just reading the trip reports and seeing the pictures that Fodorites post here makes me want to go everywhere!
It's just a small sampling of what I saw.
I can't compare Botswana to Zambia (or even East Africa) but you are sure to have a "special trip" in either country. I don't think you can pick a "best" place to go. Just reading the trip reports and seeing the pictures that Fodorites post here makes me want to go everywhere!
May 18th, 2006, 07:53 AM
#23
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To everone who did not like my comments on Wilderness, this of course is my opinion, personally my experiences have not been good and I would not recommend them, nor would my friends who had the missfortune to work for them.
Kwando and Selinda are an entirely different matter, and are certainly the best places to go in Botswana for "game viwing", the tents are more than adequate for me as is the food I have visited Zibilianja 7 times and Lebala etc 3 times. They are the only place that you have a reasonable chance to see Wild Dog, last year at Leballa the elephants were awesome, should I mentiom two pangolin sightings in two days.
As for Zambia I have been to South Lunagwa in October for 6 days with Robin Pope, not much but OK. Also in October but only last year, 4 Days at Lower Zambezi ok for elephants and impalla but not much else. Kasanka for 3 nights the best for Sitatunga, I did not go at bat time, but little else.
Kafue Lunga River Lodge and Busanga Plains 6 days very dissapointing, if you exclude Sable & Roan plus a good bonus of Oribi.At least there was no Tetse at the plains camp, also very expensive for the accomodation quality and totally inexperienced staff. The vehicles here are to be seen to be believed if you like old land rovers which dont work.
Kwando and Selinda are an entirely different matter, and are certainly the best places to go in Botswana for "game viwing", the tents are more than adequate for me as is the food I have visited Zibilianja 7 times and Lebala etc 3 times. They are the only place that you have a reasonable chance to see Wild Dog, last year at Leballa the elephants were awesome, should I mentiom two pangolin sightings in two days.
As for Zambia I have been to South Lunagwa in October for 6 days with Robin Pope, not much but OK. Also in October but only last year, 4 Days at Lower Zambezi ok for elephants and impalla but not much else. Kasanka for 3 nights the best for Sitatunga, I did not go at bat time, but little else.
Kafue Lunga River Lodge and Busanga Plains 6 days very dissapointing, if you exclude Sable & Roan plus a good bonus of Oribi.At least there was no Tetse at the plains camp, also very expensive for the accomodation quality and totally inexperienced staff. The vehicles here are to be seen to be believed if you like old land rovers which dont work.
May 20th, 2006, 05:38 AM
#24
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Hello Lerasp,
For a truly special trip, I would highly recommend a trip to Botswana -- the Delta is like no other place on earth, as are the Makgadikgadi Pans. Botswana offers a very wide range of activities beyond game drives, such as boating, mokoro excursions, fishing, and walking.
While it is true that some camps in Botswana are very expensive, it is perfectly possible to have a great experience on your budget. I'd suggest combining a luxury tented mobile with a few lodge nights and some time in Victoria Falls. A good tour operator could put together a very special trip for you whilst staying within your budget.
Mobile camps in Botswana are fully serviced (similar to Nomad Tanzania or CCA's Tanzania Under Canvas) -- no worries about your mum having to rough it! The staff take care of setting up camp and breaking it down, camp chores such as cooking and cleaning, and moving between campsites. Accommodation varies a bit between operators, but generally involves East African Meru-style tents you can stand up in, beds with crisp cotton sheets, private (sometimes ensuite) loos and hot bucket showers. In Botswana, most of the campsites are in private areas where you would have exclusive use of the site. Transportation between camps can be by vehicle (with a game drive on the way), by mokoro, or by plane.
The size of your group means that you could arrange a customised itinerary and private departure for little more than the cost of a pre-arranged itinerary. Mobile safaris are also somewhat less subject to seasonal fluctuations, so you would be able to travel in high season at relatively low cost compared to a lodge-based safari.
It's not clear how much time you have, but I would recommend something along these lines:
Victoria Falls x2
Linyanti or Okavango Camp x2
Luxury Mobile Tented Safari 7-10 days (Okavango, Linyanti, Makgadikgadi Pans)
Cheers,
Julian
For a truly special trip, I would highly recommend a trip to Botswana -- the Delta is like no other place on earth, as are the Makgadikgadi Pans. Botswana offers a very wide range of activities beyond game drives, such as boating, mokoro excursions, fishing, and walking.
While it is true that some camps in Botswana are very expensive, it is perfectly possible to have a great experience on your budget. I'd suggest combining a luxury tented mobile with a few lodge nights and some time in Victoria Falls. A good tour operator could put together a very special trip for you whilst staying within your budget.
Mobile camps in Botswana are fully serviced (similar to Nomad Tanzania or CCA's Tanzania Under Canvas) -- no worries about your mum having to rough it! The staff take care of setting up camp and breaking it down, camp chores such as cooking and cleaning, and moving between campsites. Accommodation varies a bit between operators, but generally involves East African Meru-style tents you can stand up in, beds with crisp cotton sheets, private (sometimes ensuite) loos and hot bucket showers. In Botswana, most of the campsites are in private areas where you would have exclusive use of the site. Transportation between camps can be by vehicle (with a game drive on the way), by mokoro, or by plane.
The size of your group means that you could arrange a customised itinerary and private departure for little more than the cost of a pre-arranged itinerary. Mobile safaris are also somewhat less subject to seasonal fluctuations, so you would be able to travel in high season at relatively low cost compared to a lodge-based safari.
It's not clear how much time you have, but I would recommend something along these lines:
Victoria Falls x2
Linyanti or Okavango Camp x2
Luxury Mobile Tented Safari 7-10 days (Okavango, Linyanti, Makgadikgadi Pans)
Cheers,
Julian
May 20th, 2006, 06:54 AM
#25
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I just started another thread on this topic, so shall join in here and save all the trouble!! We have 3-4 nights to spend on safari (from Capetown) and would love best game experience possible. Julian - what tour operator would you recommend for Botswana luxury mobile tented trip? With such limited time, is it worth it to go to Botswana, or should we stick to SA?
May 20th, 2006, 03:47 PM
#26
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Hello Travelgal,
As much as I love Botswana, with four days out of Cape Town I would recommend staying in SA -- you don't want to spend more time on planes and in airports than you do on safari!
Staying in SA won't meant you can't have a wonderful safari. SA has a huge number of excellent game reserves. For the best game-vieiwng, I would recommend flying from Cape Town to the Sabi Sands, the private reserves bordering Kruger National Park. I've spent quite a bit of time in the Sabi Sands, and the game viewing is superb, particularly for leopard.
I've stayed at Londolozi several times, and had excellent guiding and game-viewing. Other people on this board have great experiences at Mala Mala and Singita -- I'll be visiting both of those reserves on my trip this year.
http://www.londolozi.com
http://www.malamala.com
http://www.singita.com
If you would prefer to stay closer to Cape Town, there are also a number of great game-viewing options in the Eastern Cape. I'd recommend looking at Kwandwe:
http://www.kwandwe.com
If you particularly love elephants, River Bend Lodge will soon be offering elephant back safaris:
http://www.riverbendlodge.co.za
Cheers,
Julian
As much as I love Botswana, with four days out of Cape Town I would recommend staying in SA -- you don't want to spend more time on planes and in airports than you do on safari!
Staying in SA won't meant you can't have a wonderful safari. SA has a huge number of excellent game reserves. For the best game-vieiwng, I would recommend flying from Cape Town to the Sabi Sands, the private reserves bordering Kruger National Park. I've spent quite a bit of time in the Sabi Sands, and the game viewing is superb, particularly for leopard.
I've stayed at Londolozi several times, and had excellent guiding and game-viewing. Other people on this board have great experiences at Mala Mala and Singita -- I'll be visiting both of those reserves on my trip this year.
http://www.londolozi.com
http://www.malamala.com
http://www.singita.com
If you would prefer to stay closer to Cape Town, there are also a number of great game-viewing options in the Eastern Cape. I'd recommend looking at Kwandwe:
http://www.kwandwe.com
If you particularly love elephants, River Bend Lodge will soon be offering elephant back safaris:
http://www.riverbendlodge.co.za
Cheers,
Julian
May 21st, 2006, 03:09 AM
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thanks favor and jasher. I found the camps in SA to be pretty over the top, expense wise and for the same amount for 3 days, we could do a package including CPT, Chobe and Vic Falls for 6 nights/6 days...in that case, would you think that would be worth while? Our priority is seeing the wonderful game and are hoping to have a relatively exclusive experience.
May 21st, 2006, 05:08 AM
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Hello. We went to Zambia last year and Botswana 5 years ago. Both were great. There is a lot of wildlife in both places so I do not think you can make a bad choice.
That said, with your budget, Zambia is much more affordable. However, in 2007, you may find that the $400 pppn is a little low there. Luangwa river lodge is 450 THIS year -- there may be a price increase next year.
We stayed at Kaingo and it's bush camp Mwamba and absolutely loved it. They have excellent guides. We went in October when it was extremely hot -- July would be more comfortable. The hippo hide puts you within 10-15 feet of lots of hippos. The elephant hide is in a tree and -- we did not do it at that time -- but I understand that sometimes people spend the night up there which I think would be a wonderful experience.
The camps were redone last year and were very comfortable. We had elephants come through both of them and even got to observe one nursing.
Not much is written about Kaingo and Mwamba on this site which is really unfortunate because they are in a great area of the park where there is not a lot of other traffic. We had 2 7 week old lion cubs that we were able to watch or hours. Also saw leopard here.
Tafika is in a similar area of the park but on the other side of the river. I have heard it is a very nice camp but it is more expensive that Kaingo -- or at least it was last year by around 100 pppn.
Last year we received a discount by staying 6 nights divided between Kaingo and Mwamba. Mwamba is a bush camp -- the camp is set up so that every year it can be broken down within 2 days with no sign left that man had been there -- except for the septic tanks. There is electricity and flush toilets there -- electricity is solar.
Luangwa River lodge is the nicest camp we were in -- it is outside the park but just a quick boat ride across it. There is main electricity which means fans in the rooms. It is a truly beautiful place and everyone who tells you how wonderful it is is right. You cannot go wrong staying here.
We stayed at the Kasaka River Lodge and the managers there are truly special. It was difficult for us as we were the only people there that were not part of a large group. They really went out of their way to make our time enjoyable and we really appreciated them. If you are interested in Tiger fishing, this is a good place to stay. But if you want to go on safari, I would look at Chiawa, Sausage Tree and Old Mondoro in the park itself as it takes 45 minutes or so to get to the park whereas if you stay in the park you are there when you start. These camps have good reviews on this board but I have never been. They are more expensive than Kasaka and may be out of your budget -- Kasaka was 285 pppn last year vs over 400 pppn for the others.
In Zambia, if you stay at a camp outside the park, you must be out of the park at 8 pm. If you stay ata a camp inside the park, you are supposed to be off safari by 8 pm. But if there is something great going on, you can probably be a little late getting back inside the camp than if you have to leave the park as the gates close at 8.
Just remember you can always come back to Africa -- whatever choice you make will be great.
That said, with your budget, Zambia is much more affordable. However, in 2007, you may find that the $400 pppn is a little low there. Luangwa river lodge is 450 THIS year -- there may be a price increase next year.
We stayed at Kaingo and it's bush camp Mwamba and absolutely loved it. They have excellent guides. We went in October when it was extremely hot -- July would be more comfortable. The hippo hide puts you within 10-15 feet of lots of hippos. The elephant hide is in a tree and -- we did not do it at that time -- but I understand that sometimes people spend the night up there which I think would be a wonderful experience.
The camps were redone last year and were very comfortable. We had elephants come through both of them and even got to observe one nursing.
Not much is written about Kaingo and Mwamba on this site which is really unfortunate because they are in a great area of the park where there is not a lot of other traffic. We had 2 7 week old lion cubs that we were able to watch or hours. Also saw leopard here.
Tafika is in a similar area of the park but on the other side of the river. I have heard it is a very nice camp but it is more expensive that Kaingo -- or at least it was last year by around 100 pppn.
Last year we received a discount by staying 6 nights divided between Kaingo and Mwamba. Mwamba is a bush camp -- the camp is set up so that every year it can be broken down within 2 days with no sign left that man had been there -- except for the septic tanks. There is electricity and flush toilets there -- electricity is solar.
Luangwa River lodge is the nicest camp we were in -- it is outside the park but just a quick boat ride across it. There is main electricity which means fans in the rooms. It is a truly beautiful place and everyone who tells you how wonderful it is is right. You cannot go wrong staying here.
We stayed at the Kasaka River Lodge and the managers there are truly special. It was difficult for us as we were the only people there that were not part of a large group. They really went out of their way to make our time enjoyable and we really appreciated them. If you are interested in Tiger fishing, this is a good place to stay. But if you want to go on safari, I would look at Chiawa, Sausage Tree and Old Mondoro in the park itself as it takes 45 minutes or so to get to the park whereas if you stay in the park you are there when you start. These camps have good reviews on this board but I have never been. They are more expensive than Kasaka and may be out of your budget -- Kasaka was 285 pppn last year vs over 400 pppn for the others.
In Zambia, if you stay at a camp outside the park, you must be out of the park at 8 pm. If you stay ata a camp inside the park, you are supposed to be off safari by 8 pm. But if there is something great going on, you can probably be a little late getting back inside the camp than if you have to leave the park as the gates close at 8.
Just remember you can always come back to Africa -- whatever choice you make will be great.
May 21st, 2006, 06:09 PM
#31
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we are returning! this will be our 2nd trip in 18 months. i'm sure many more to come. it's jsut this one is a very round birthday, and is more important that a regular vacation. time-wise, we are a little flexible. probably 2-3 weeks. most likely 2 weeks for safari/victoria falls and then a few days in Cape Town, if we decide to do it.
May 22nd, 2006, 03:36 PM
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Hi Travelgal,
Not sure which camps you've been looking at, but there is a huge range of options price-wise in SA. I've found that accommodation in SA offers great value for money, particularly compared to the US or Europe. A good agent should be able to recommend some moderately priced options for your safari in SA.
If you go to Botswana, it would be a shame to limit yourself to Chobe -- Chobe is nice, but to miss out the Delta would be a terrible shame.
Cheers,
Julian
Not sure which camps you've been looking at, but there is a huge range of options price-wise in SA. I've found that accommodation in SA offers great value for money, particularly compared to the US or Europe. A good agent should be able to recommend some moderately priced options for your safari in SA.
If you go to Botswana, it would be a shame to limit yourself to Chobe -- Chobe is nice, but to miss out the Delta would be a terrible shame.
Cheers,
Julian
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