Best Time for S.African Safari

Old Feb 18th, 2010, 10:40 PM
  #21  
 
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I requested 2 camps my TA had never been to. They were honest about it but were more than willing to make the reservation for me as requested. I don't understand why anyone would think this is inappropriate. TA's can't go everywhere but as long as they are truthful I just don't see the prob.

You all should have started a new thread to have this personal tiff and not done it on this post. It's not related at all to the OP. And TA's deserve to get paid. It's a service many of us rely on for "exotic" trips. I priced my last trip on my own and it would have been the same price without someone to call if there were any issues. I knew I wasn't getting taken. And the trip before that was very expensive, but it was perfect - I hope they were well compensated. And you're somehow blaming TA's for the rotten treatment of locals in Bots? That's absurd. I research my trips after TA recommendations. I think that's smart. It would never occur to me to trust a TA blindly but I know plenty of people who do. It's personal preference. Or have we lost free will now?

I like using a TA in the US. If they aren't paid fairly, soon we'll have to call a TA in India or Walmart to make arrangements for all of our travel. Of course I would like more transparency, but it can always be negotiated if that's the way the customer would prefer. It might look like I'm taking sides but this whole thread has become ridiculous and way too personal. All of you need to go have a beer together.
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 12:37 AM
  #22  
 
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"...Well if clients don't have the time or desire to look for the info provided on the web"

Sure, like, everything on the web is good accurate and reliable information . Like the travel site (not here) where everything gets 4-5 stars by reviewers who have never been anywhere else!!!

What other sources would you recommend?? The newspaper travel section that praises highly every thing?? Likewise travel magazines?? There are a couple of decent travel books on Africa, Fodors is one. I'm afraid that unless one has friends who are experienced safariers, the next best source is a TA. And I say that with some sadness because of experience. I have attempted to work with a couple of TAs on Kenya. But quickly dropped them, I knew enough to not believe their sales pitch.

IMHO, traveling to Africa for safari is a lot more involved and complicated than going to Europe. That is how I remember it when I looked into my first safari (2005).

skimmer2 - "So I think it's in his own interest to be polite in the future if challenged." I envy your ability to analyze people's behavior and how they will behave. May I come to you for marital advice?? (Ooops, too late!!)

Agree also with christabir - these personal attacks are driving away valuable posters here. I am in personal contact with two members who have given up. And I know of others that we rarely if ever hear from. Sad.

regards - tom
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 02:58 AM
  #23  
 
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Craig,

If you are only earning between 10% and 20% comission, then you are clearly being cheated. The minimum rate is around 25%, this rises depending on the amount of business you generate to the operator the highest level I have seen is 40%.

Hari,

As most of the TA's are not Botswanan, then I think quite a lot of the income going out of Botswana goes to them. Let's not forget that very few camps are owned and operated by Botswanans, not that your TA would tell you that.
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 03:00 AM
  #24  
 
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Hey Guys,

I do agree this has gotten off topic but there are a few specific questions for me so I need to address them:

From Johan:
"What do you do if someone asks your opinion about a lodge you haven't been to? Let's say Lebala for example?" We had someone ask specific and detailed questions about a few Kwando camps early last month. The client was working with Pam from our Ottawa, Canada office. I suggested Pam email HariS on his personal account for his opinion. Pam said HariS was very helpful and thorough in his response. I did not know who else to turn too for unbiased advice since HariS has been to the camps so many times. I trust this course of action is satisfactory?

From HariS:
"Why do people (or is it just clients of yours) find it diminishing value as above in your post?"
Most Americans that use our service have more money than time. They don't seem to want to stay more than 3 or 4 days in one place. Given there overall trip parameters, this is about what works best for them. I did have a client spend ten nights at Mombo Camp two years ago. The same client spent ten nights at one of the tiger reserves in India last year. These types of clients are rare as they have abundant time and money.

From HariS:
"then coming onto the various travel fora (forums) to check on the recommended choice? Why so, after all the trust associated with the exchange of the 100 emails and phone calls? .... i find this quite baffling......."
I am not aware of any of my clients ever posting one of our itineraries on Fodors or Trip Advisor to seek comments prior to making deposit. Perhaps this is true for someone that gets an Africa itinerary from a general purpose travel agent. Our consultations should answer most questions. The follow-up emails and phone calls usually have to do with flights, airline miles, seat assignments, tips, VISA, shots, cash machine location, etc. All these topics are covered in our paperwork but, for the same reason above (more money than time), people don't read it and prefer to hear it on the phone or ask in one topic/one question emails.

Happy Friday.

Craig Beal
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 03:21 AM
  #25  
 
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Surkamp - good point on the commission.

What I meant is that our contracted rates are typically 10%-20% below the published or rack rate of the lodges. I don't know of any situation where the amount is 25%. But, many lodges no longer publish their rates so the concept of commission is not always applicable. In the 40% situation you are talking about mark-up. If we wanted to, I am confident we could mark-up our net prices 40% and make the sale to the majority of our clients. The rest of the people would see through this and become very angry. So – we chose to sell safaris at sensible and reasonable prices.

Can’t comment on how much money leaves Botswana. I am pretty sure that most consumers know the lodges are not locally owned. F/E if you book &Beyond properties and you live in the USA you mail the check to Ft. Lauderdale, FL!

Craig Beal
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 06:37 AM
  #26  
 
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Craig,

The percentages I am quoting are published (but obviously not to the general public), as I said the increasing commissions offered are based on total revenue from the agent to the lodges concerned.

I am amazed that you can say that you may add a mark up to rack rates, that would be even more dishonest!

Juging from your responses to Hari I presume it is safe to assume that you prefer ric know nothing clients and that it is OK for them to destroy the costs of safari for everybody else.
It seems to me that your sales practice is that there is a mug born every minute, but I guess you are correct in asuming this!
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 06:50 AM
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OK
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 09:58 AM
  #28  
 
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Craig:
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Old Feb 19th, 2010, 03:08 PM
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Thanks for all the insightful questions and informative answers. It's been educational among other things.
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Old Feb 20th, 2010, 04:05 PM
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Craig: You have an office in Ottawa? What's the name of your company? I'm from Ottawa and I'd love to have a great TA here for Africa.
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Old Feb 20th, 2010, 04:58 PM
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Hi mcbg1,

Our consultant in Ottawa is Pam Buttner.
http://travelbeyond.com/about-us/pam-buttner

Pam is not really a travel agent in the traditional sense of the word. She is a safari consultant and her only travel expertise is Africa. If someone wanted to book airline tickets or a cruise or a trip to Mexico, she would have to refer you to someone in our other offices (Wisconsin and Minnesota). Pam does know a lot about London as she lived there for several years in previous careers.

This will come as a shock to Johan (joking) but Pam worked for Wilderness Safaris in Africa from 2007 to June 2009. She has also spent significant time traveling in Tanzania and South Africa and I just sent her to the Madikwe, Sabi Sands, and Botswana for six weeks in November and December 2008.

Pam would be happy to meet with you any time and her contact details are on our web site. She has been working out of an empty office in a dental clinic but just got a more permanent place on February 1. I can assure you she will not be charging you a 40% commission as suggested above!

Pam's real passion is the more adventurous and off the beaten path methods of travel in Africa.

Thanks for the interest.

Craig Beal
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