hojna

Hi! New to the forum and have read a lot of threads but am now looking for advice. I turn 40 on April 5th 2024 and have started planning for a road trip to celebrate this.

It will be me (39F) and my mom (66F), coming from Sweden. My mom has bad knees/back so while we both love being in nature we will have to adjust to this and some places I will hike while she rests.

Fall 2015 we spent 5 weeks on the road in a loop from SF and visited: coastal California, Las Vegas, Capitol Reef (Route 12/24), Bryce, Moab, Durango, Telluride, Teton, Yellowstone, Hood River, coastal Oregon, Redwoods etc. We have also both separately travelled to Grand Canyon 10+ years ago.

I’ve just started planning but would love some input before going any further and ideally I would like to book flights/ some accommodation soon-ish so we can secure reservations inside some parks. Dates are not fixed except for ideally spending April 5th doing something… well special. Also travelling over Easter means I would save some vacation days, but if it is better to travel after we are willing to adjust.

That’s where I need you - to perhaps point out things that I should change or reconsider. Do you have (other) ideas for places to visit, routes to take, things to take into consideration? Should we do something completely different than this? I have tried taking weather in April into consideration but am aware that some places might be snowy/inaccesible. As you can see we have visited some of these places before but we did love the nature in Utah/AZ, just otherwordly, so would love to go back. I also think we would love to end the trip with a few days of just relaxing, perhaps with a pool and good food.

PLAN
28 mars Los Angeles->Palm Springs
29 mars Palm Springs
30 mars Palm Springs
31 mars Palm Springs-Joshua Tree
1 april Joshua Tree
2 april Joshua Tree->Sedona
3 april Sedona
4 april Sedona->Grand Canyon
5 april Grand Canyon
6 april Grand Canyon->Page
7 april Page
8 april Page->Monument Valley
9 april Monument Valley->Moab
10 april Moab
11 april Moab
12 april Moab->Capitol Reef Resort
13 april Capitol Reef
14 april Capitol Reef->Bryce Canyon
15 april Bryce Canyon
16 april Bryce Canyon->Zion
17 april Zion
18 april Zion
19 april Zion->Death Valley NP
20 april Death Valley NP->Mammoth Lake?
21 april Mammoth Lake?->Yosemite
22 april Yosemite
23 april Yosemite
24 april Yosemite->Sequoia?
25 april Sequoia?->Kings Canyon?
26 april Kings Canyon?->Santa Barbara
27 april Santa Barbara
28 april Santa Barbara
29 april Santa Barbara->Los Angeles/Home

janisj

Welcome to Fodors. Just very quick. right now. The California parts of your plan will need a re-think. At that time of year, one cannot get from the east side of the Sierra (Death Valley/Mammoth) across the mountains to the west side (Yosemite/Sequoia/KC and eventually on to Santa Barbara). No one knows what next winter's snow pack will be - probably not as heavy as this year's . . . this year they don't expect to open the mountain passes until mid to late June or maybe even early July. But the chance that Tioga Pass will be open by late April are slim to none. At that time of year one can only access both Seq/KC and Yosemite NP from the west.

PrairieHikerI

Yosemite also has groves of giant sequoia trees, so you don't have to go to Sequoia or King's Canyon national parks. Since you will be in Northeast Arizona you could check one or more of the following

Monument Valley Tribal Park. Stunning scenery in this iconic Western landscape. “This great valley boasts sandstone masterpieces that tower at heights of 400 to 1,000 feet, framed by scenic clouds casting shadows that graciously roam the desert floor. The angle of the sun accents these graceful formations, providing scenery that is simply spellbinding.” Stay or eat at the fabulous View Hotel with its wonderful views. Two hours west is famous Antelope Canyon.

Antelope Canyon. “A magnificent slot canyon just east of Page in Northern Arizona. With tall winding walls, it’s a monumental sandstone sculpture.” Guided tours required and cost $48 per person. Some say that the tour guides act like they are herding cattle.

Hopi Indian Reservation. The Hopi were largely peace-loving people who built agarian settlements of stone and adobe houses. Current day Hopi have retained much of the traditional culture and customs because of the isolation of the villages. The Hopi Cultural Center on the Second Mesa will teach you about Hopi culture and history and you can eat authentic Hopi cuisine. The Hopi are known for their pottery, Kachina dolls, wicker baskets and silver overlay jewelry. Old Oraibi is the oldest continously inhabited settlement in the US dating from around 900 AD. Because of its isolation, the village has retained many of its original features.

janisj

Never the less -- one can't get to Yosemite without going down and around through Bakersfield and north through the San Joaquin Valley and in to YNP from the west. So substituting the Mariposa Grove in YNP for Sequoia NP doesn't solve anything.

hojna

Thank you both for your reply.

Regarding Yosemite, I am aware that the Tioga pass most likely will be closed - hence question mark after Mammoth and Sequoia/Kings. We do really want to go to Yosemite even if we won’t ba able to experience all of the park. I was thinking that if the pass is closed we will go Death Valley->Bakersfield (or some other place, haven’t researched so much yet)->Yosemite from the west side. Then depending on conditions either visit Kings Canyon/Sequoia OR going out to the coast for the last ~5 days. I don’t know if this is a good plan or if we should skip this part? Originally I had a plan of going from Zion via route 50 to Lake Tahoe then Yosemite, but I swapped out Tahoe since I thought it will be better suited for a summer/fall visit…

I am all ears for other ideas regarding Yosemite/California.

As for Arizona, I have planned for The Wave (if we get a permit) on April 6, Antelope Canyon on April 7 and then one night at Monument Valley staying at the View on April 8. I will look into Hopi and the Arizona area some more to see if we should add days/places. I am still waiting on guide books to arrive in the mail

janisj

OK -- you definitely do want to visit Yosemite Valley -- the probem is getting there from Utah/Nevada/Mammoth. The back country/Tioga Pass WILL be closed. Not sure why Mammoth is on the plan - scenic area but simply doesn't fit with the rest.

IMO/IME a better/easier plan would be to visit Zion then Las Vegas, visit Death Valley from Vegas, and drop the car back in LV. Fly to FAT or SMF or SFO and collect a different car. Visit Yosemite Valley and the Monterey Peninsula, Big Sur and down the coast to Santa Barbara, end up in LA and fly out of LAX. I'd drop Mammoth and Sequoia / Kings Canyon (though I do love both) Mammoth to Yosemite Valley in April is a 400+ miles of predominantly ugly freeway. Squeezing in Seq/KC would add 100+ miles to that trek.

See Sequoias in Yosemite and coastal redwoods in Big Sur.

janisj

Meant to add -- don't get your heart set on the Wave -- permits seem to get harder to obtain every year.

hojna

Thanks again for input.

I have definitely struggled with making Yosemite work with the rest of our plan, and I understand it is out of the way. Especially having to enter from the west. I added Mammoth as a stop should we be able to go through Tioga, so will change that. I am at the point now where I have multiple plans to see what works best.

We have been to Vegas before and are not super keen on going there again, also not super keen on flying. I will look into this option but would rather find a route that will take us from DV to Yosemite, although I realise it will be quite boring.

As for Redwoods, we visited the Northern California coast and those parks in 2015 - we don’t necessarily have to visit/see big giant trees again even though they are majestic.

It sounds a bit as a luxury problem, but it’s sometimes difficult trying to find new things to see and new places to visit that are as great as where you have been before.

hojna

And yes I read that the permit for the Wave is near impossible but want to ”reserve” time should we get it, and if not find something else to do.

janisj

Getting to Yosemite isn't difficult as long as you come from the west side. I wasn't suggesting you stay in Vegas more than maybe one night. Mainly for a pit stop and good place to drop the rental car. If it was me I'd think seriously of flying from Vegas to SMF (Sacramento) visit the Gold Rush towns and Calaveras Big Trees State Park along/near Hwy 49, then drive down Hwy 49 to Mariposa and Hwy 140 into Yosemite (Currently Hwy 120 into the park is closed but 140 is an easier drive anyway). Then to the coast -- either to Carmel or down to Santa Barbara

hojna

Very grateful for your input, I will definitely look into this option further.

Any other aspects of our plan that needs reconsideration?

Gretchen

You could reverse your trip--even fly into San Francisco and do Yosemite. Can you fly into SFO and out of LAX?
End it relaxing in Palm Springs!!

janisj

OR maybe even really reverse things -- Phoenix is also a major hub so you might be able to get a flight home from there and from your itinerary it seems you didn't want any time IN Los Angeles.

Something like SFO > Yosemite > Sequoia > Santa Barbara > Palm Springs > Joshua Tree > Death Valley > Zion and the other Utah parks > finish up relaxing in Sedona > Fly home from PHX.

Just another option that ticks most of your boxes.

MikeS

If you are in the area you might be better off getting a guide to take you to White Pockets. You need to drive in some deep sand so you would need a guide with a 4X4. I don't use a guide so you need to research that on your own. White Pockets is in the Vermilion Cliffs National Monument close to where the Wave is but you don't need a permit. Unlike going to the Wave the White Pocket scenery is in a small area so there isn't any strenuous hiking to do.

White Pockets: https://michaelstump.smugmug.com/White-Pockets/

Gardyloo

Well I'm going to stick my neck out on this and address these sentences. Purely personal opinions, worth every krona you've paid for them.

I think for this itinerary to be successful you're going to need a lot of factors to fall into place, or put another way, you're going to need a fair amount of luck.

First, the Utah/Arizona parks. The issue here is high altitude, which means the possibility - maybe even probability - of freezing conditions in several of the national parks. With your mother's bad knees and back, do you really want her walking around paths that might be icy, even snow-covered? Because that's a real possibility in places like Bryce Canyon, even the Grand Canyon rim. Last month (April 2023) many days during the first half of the month saw temperatures well below freezing in several of the national parks you want to visit. Speaking personally, the last time I tried to visit Bryce Canyon (during April a few years ago) we got iced out. On a visit to Canyon de Chelly (a marvelous, evocative place) we got caught in a blizzard on the canyon rim. Will it happen to you? Who can say, but what if it does? That's a lot of driving for a sub-optimal outcome in my view.

Then there's Yosemite and the Sierra foothills. First, you'd need to get there, most likely via a pretty boring drive around the bottom of the Sierras then back up the California central valley. Had you done so last month, you would have encountered record flooding (including closure of the national park) following a record snowfall in the mountains. Yosemite, like many western national parks, is gorgeous around the calendar, but NOT IF YOU CAN'T SEE IT because of clouds, rain, fog or road closures. Again, will it happen to you?

Your dates would put you in Palm Springs before the Coachella music festival fills every hotel bed and campsite and parking lot in the valley, around 10 days after you leave, but you'll still have a lot of company in that part of California.

So, enough. Like I say, just my view, and hopefully I'm raising unnecessary alarms.

Do you have (other) ideas for places to visit, routes to take, things to take into consideration? Should we do something completely different than this?

Well, actually, yes. But it would depend on what appeals to you. After all, you're the ones flying halfway around the world, and it would be good to know where else in the US you've previously visited. But some "what if" ideas:

- Appalachian spring. Google Skyline Drive and Blue Ridge Parkway, Monticello, Charlottesville and Asheville. Natural beauty, history, architecture.. it can make for a fabulous week or two.

- Blues, jazz and the great river. Start in New Orleans and drive through bayou country, then up the Mississippi to Natchez, Vicksburg, and the Crossroads of the Blues. End in Memphis. Or do it in reverse. This is the US's musical heartland, with evocative landscapes, fabulous food, and, well, music and more music.

- Barrier Islands, Savannah and the Low Country. Visit two of the US's most beautiful cities in Savannah and Charleston, and explore the "low country" in South Carolina and the wonderful barrier islands off the coast of Georgia.

- California Mission Trail. Back on the west coast, explore the heritage (some good, a lot not so good) of the Spanish missions that extend from San Diego to north of San Francisco. This could easily be combined with time in the desert. Google the Carmel and Santa Barbara missions as well as San Juan Capistrano. Don't forget to stop at Point Lobos on your way north (or south.)

...and there are other places you might consider. You have most of a year to plan, so maybe let your imagination run free? Again, just some thoughts.

hojna

Ahh, frustrating that I’m only allowed 5 comments in 24 hrs 😅 Warning: long post ahead.

We could fly to SFO and out of LAX, but this seems to add at least $1000 in car rental costs with one-way-fees so I’m feeling cheap and thinking I’d rather do a loop. Flying out of Phoenix is unfortunately not an option for us it seems, LAX or SFO are the best options for travelling to/from Sweden as we are flying SAS (and their affiliates).

My thought process with having Yosemite more towards the end of the trip was that the weather would be better later in April, but perhaps it doesn’t make much of a difference? When I’m looking at driving from DV to Yosemite it seems we could do it in two days with an overnight stay somewhere in central California, before Fresno? I realise this is a really boring drive, but might be possible instead of changing things completely or adding one-way-fees etc. But I also realise I come across as unable to adapt to change

@Gardyloo:

Can’t thank you enough for your comment, it is worth a lot of kronas. What you say about the weather is a big concern for me and I do have to seriously factor this in. I guess I/We kind of fell in love with the area and the landscape and everything about this region in previous visit and I just sort of felt like it would be perfect to go back and explore the region further for this special occasion (and while my mom still has her health, at least enough to do a trip like this). However it is a lot of money to do this and it would be a shame to do it in less than ideal circumstances.

I think I also got caught up in the idea I hade to solidify the plans NOW and book it as to not risk securing reservations. But I think it is a great comment from you about taking the time to look at other options. I realise I also should look at options re:time. And I think I have to decide if the where to go might is more important than the when, or not. We are from the north of Sweden and what we feel is so special about the Southwest region is, among other things, how vastly different it is from anything we have seen before. And I personally feel like it is worth coming back to.

As for where we have been. Asides from what I mentioned in the OG post we have been to NY a few times, the California coast a couple of times, to Florida when I was a kid and in my 20s I travelled across US from LA to NY on a southern route through NM, Texas, Louisiana, Alabama etc. That was however an organised tour with quick stops in each place, but visited New Orleans and the bayou.

I will look more into your suggestions and see if any of this looks interesting. And as I mentioned above, if we do decide that the western area is for us - then maybe it is worth doing the trip another time of the year.

tomfuller

Check to see if you can fly to and rent a car from Las Vegas. Do the first part of your trip as a loop from Las Vegas and return the car. Fly from Las Vegas to Sacramento, Santa Barbara or maybe Fresno. Rent another car in California. From any of those 3 you can get to San Francisco or Los Angeles by train.

Michael

When in Page do Antelope Canyon (reservations necessary). Given your restrictions, it probably will be the only slot canyon that you will have the opportunity to see. As you can see from the photograph, the ground is flat and smooth.

Gretchen

I had not even considered you doing another part of the country as Gardyloo did BUT let me say that April in the southeast is absolutely a fairyland of flowers and tree blooms in addition to the food, history, music . It is so very different from the American West which is so beautiful in so many other ways. It could be something you may have never seen.
AND if you have never been to Washington DC you simply must. IMO our nation's capital is an under recommended destination for reasons I don't understand.
My son went to Moab a couple of weeks ago and snow was in the forecast.

Gardyloo

Even delaying your timing by a few weeks - into May - would make a huge difference in many areas. There will still be road closures in some of the highest elevation areas, but if you start in the south and work north, you can (probably) avoid the highest heat issues - which sadly appear to be getting earlier every year - while giving time for things farther north to thaw or dry out.

Coming later in the spring would also allow you - if interested - to expand your range of destinations. In the west, do some googling of Olympic National Park, the Columbia River Gorge and Hood River/Mount Hood region, and one of my favorite (and somewhat under-recognized) areas, the Wallowa Mountains in far northeastern Oregon. Don't be put off that not all of these are national parks; in the US we have a tiered system of parklands that include state parks, national scenic areas and national monuments, in addition to "conventional" national parks.

Do a google image search on the places on this map, for example. In late May into early June, this would be a stunning route, featuring some of the "old west" scenery you're (rightly) fond of, as well as a few more non-Swedish landscapes, such as stratovolcanoes and rivers that are 2 km wide. https://goo.gl/maps/WMLqK8jyY4LgqxvEA

That's just one example of places you might consider with only a minor adjustment in when you come.