More over tourism in The Netherlands
Nov 9th, 2018, 10:48 AM
#1
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More over tourism in The Netherlands
Those that live in the mills of Kinderdijk.
https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2018/1...sitors-a-year/
https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2018/1...sitors-a-year/
Nov 9th, 2018, 11:49 PM
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When we were house hunting last year we looked at a house (not a mill) in Kinderdijk, but decided against it. The weight of toursim there was one of the reasons.
Some of the reasons for over tourism anywhere are probably cheap flights, increasing wealth and ability travel of people in countries like China and Instagram and its ilk. And a lack of imagination/herd mentatilty.
It would be nice to think that flying will get more expensive again soon, for the sake of the environment and the fiuture of the world, but so far I don't see that happening. The way things are going in a few years time there will be no Venice or Barcelona or Kinderdijk or Amsterdam or Great Barrier Reef, or Koh Samui for the tourists to overrun.
Some of the reasons for over tourism anywhere are probably cheap flights, increasing wealth and ability travel of people in countries like China and Instagram and its ilk. And a lack of imagination/herd mentatilty.
It would be nice to think that flying will get more expensive again soon, for the sake of the environment and the fiuture of the world, but so far I don't see that happening. The way things are going in a few years time there will be no Venice or Barcelona or Kinderdijk or Amsterdam or Great Barrier Reef, or Koh Samui for the tourists to overrun.
Nov 10th, 2018, 02:47 AM
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I’m getting more and more uncomfortable about this finger pointing at Chinese tourists.
The Mediterranean countries had 410 million tourists in 2016, by the far the most popular area in the world.
i haven’t got the figures but most of the increase over the past 20 years must have been driven by cheap low cost airlines. Then there are cruise ships.It now cheaper to fly to say Bordeaux from the U.K. than it is to bet the train from Manchester to London. Then there are cruise ships.
It’s really easy to avoid over tourism just select one of the tourist third tier beautiful European cities and enjoy vibrant local life without the cruise ships.
The Mediterranean countries had 410 million tourists in 2016, by the far the most popular area in the world.
i haven’t got the figures but most of the increase over the past 20 years must have been driven by cheap low cost airlines. Then there are cruise ships.It now cheaper to fly to say Bordeaux from the U.K. than it is to bet the train from Manchester to London. Then there are cruise ships.
It’s really easy to avoid over tourism just select one of the tourist third tier beautiful European cities and enjoy vibrant local life without the cruise ships.
Nov 10th, 2018, 03:12 AM
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I am not finger pointing. They are not the only ones responsible for it, but in the past Chines and South Asians could not afford to or were not allowed to travel, and now they can so of course they want to see the things everyone else does. Cheap flights within Europe and cheap transatlantic flights, along with social media are the main culprits.
There is a campaign now to get people to strip the geotag from their photos when they post them online, to try and reduce the pressure on vulnerable areas.Some places there are queues of people waiting to take their selfie and post, where a few years ago no-one had even heard of that place.
There is a campaign now to get people to strip the geotag from their photos when they post them online, to try and reduce the pressure on vulnerable areas.Some places there are queues of people waiting to take their selfie and post, where a few years ago no-one had even heard of that place.
Nov 10th, 2018, 05:13 AM
#7
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Chinese and South Asians don't come by tour bus? How do they go. Yes I red the article about folks living in such a national attraction complaining about crowds - just assumed it was tour buses or river cruises as hard to believe they mostly came on own?
Nov 10th, 2018, 07:39 AM
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https://www.kinderdijk.com/plan/dire...ress/tour-bus/
Article on tour buses flocking to Kinderdijk and in picture are some Chinese getting off.
Article on tour buses flocking to Kinderdijk and in picture are some Chinese getting off.
Nov 10th, 2018, 08:02 AM
#9
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PQ you really read what you want do you.
Again I will state there is no mention of tour buses.
You missed it here are the REAL concerns of those that live and work in the area.
That boat runs only on the Groote- of Achterwaterschap and not on the Nieuwe Mass/Lek
Don't follow the schaap.
Again I will state there is no mention of tour buses.
You missed it here are the REAL concerns of those that live and work in the area.
The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills.
The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills, spokesman Peter Paul Klapwijk told RTV Rijmond.
Read more at DutchNews.nl:The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills, spokesman Peter Paul Klapwijk told RTV Rijmond.
Read more at DutchNews.nl:The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills,
Read more at DutchNews.nl:The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills,
Read more at DutchNews.nl:
Read more at DutchNews.nl:The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills, spokesman Peter Paul Klapwijk told RTV Rijmond.
Read more at DutchNews.nl:The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills,
Read more at DutchNews.nl:The millers feel that they are not being involved in decisions made about the community and that many people don’t realise they actually live in the mills,
Read more at DutchNews.nl:
‘This is a world heritage site, not Disneyland, and it should not be altered to meet the needs of tourism,’ he said.
Last year for example, a new cruise boat started sailing past the mills and the opening times for the area were extended without informing the locals, the millers say.
Last year the millers called for a ban on drones in the area, arguing that on average a drone flies over their homes every three days.
Nov 10th, 2018, 10:40 AM
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Boat-bike tours and river cruises are big causes of crowds in Kinderdijk
Nov 10th, 2018, 03:48 PM
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If you follow the link to the article from RTV Rijnmond you also find the World Heritage Foundation contesting the "millers" argument that they had not been involved in the decision making. At their last four monthly meetings, no one showed up - says the Foundation.
I was also under the impression that the revenues from the fees collected by the World Heritage Foundation pay for the maintenance of the windmills - as they don't seem to be owned by the residents (I could be wrong, though).
This older article says that they had almost gone bankrupt even though there had been 300K visitors in 2015 - probably because the maintenance of the windmills and the canals is so expensive, I guess.
https://www.kinderdijk.com/latest-ne...e-successfull/
I was also under the impression that the revenues from the fees collected by the World Heritage Foundation pay for the maintenance of the windmills - as they don't seem to be owned by the residents (I could be wrong, though).
This older article says that they had almost gone bankrupt even though there had been 300K visitors in 2015 - probably because the maintenance of the windmills and the canals is so expensive, I guess.
https://www.kinderdijk.com/latest-ne...e-successfull/
Nov 10th, 2018, 08:39 PM
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I read the linked Rijnmond article: millers say SWEK uses its meetings just to announce their plans, not to involve inhabitants in decision making. The Waterschap still owns the mills. SWEK now wants to charge an entry fee and make the Middelkade a private road (a bad thing in my opinion). Why they almost went bankrupt is a bit of a mystery, but it's clear there is a tension between SWEK, whose main interest is high visitor numbers and the mill inhabitants, who are exposed to the fall-out of that. And that is classic overtourism.
Nov 10th, 2018, 08:43 PM
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In other overtourism news: there are plans to ban AirBnB and such from RLD, Kinkerbuurt and Haarlemmerbuurt and there is going to be a registration and permit scheme for all "BnB's". And the mayor wants to move prostitution out of the RLD to "somewhere else". Lots of political activity by inhabitants now, but as of yet, no response from city gov to issues with pollution by cruise ships and the crush of illegal canal tour boats.
Nov 10th, 2018, 09:58 PM
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Hmm.. the situation in Kinderdijk sounds a bit like a lose-lose situation.
Someone has to pay the bill: either the people who inhabit the windmills, or the tourists with their entrance fees, or the public body which owns the site.
The purpose of a world heritage site is, in my opinion, that as many people as possible can visit it. As long as it does not harm the site itself.
As far as I understand the issue, no one is claiming that the growing number of tourists is destructive for the integrity of the whole Kinderdijk site.
I still remember times when going on vacation was a "once-per-year" thing for us kids. It was not uncommon to have kids in class whose parents could not even afford that one 2 week vacation during summer break each year. Families who would go on vacation in summer and in winter were considered "rich".
Someone has to pay the bill: either the people who inhabit the windmills, or the tourists with their entrance fees, or the public body which owns the site.
The purpose of a world heritage site is, in my opinion, that as many people as possible can visit it. As long as it does not harm the site itself.
As far as I understand the issue, no one is claiming that the growing number of tourists is destructive for the integrity of the whole Kinderdijk site.
I still remember times when going on vacation was a "once-per-year" thing for us kids. It was not uncommon to have kids in class whose parents could not even afford that one 2 week vacation during summer break each year. Families who would go on vacation in summer and in winter were considered "rich".
Nov 10th, 2018, 11:22 PM
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[QUOTE=Cowboy1968;16823293]Hmm.. the situation in Kinderdijk sounds a bit like a lose-lose situation.
As far as I understand the issue, no one is claiming that the growing number of tourists is destructive for the integrity of the whole Kinderdijk site.
/QUOTE]
Why wouldn't it be?
If in your own home it's just your family climbing the stairs or even walking across the floor you put in one type of product. If you have stadium crowds you do something much different.
I bet we can all think of places where the stone stairs have had ruts worn in them from the traffic. If the traffic is worse today then those ruts will happen over years instead of centuries.
I think it's misplaced to blame cheap airfares. People are flying places because the local options (including the trains in the UK) are too expensive for many. The rise of long distance discount bus lines shows airfares aren't that cheap for many people. People are riding the buses for days to save lunch money.
As far as I understand the issue, no one is claiming that the growing number of tourists is destructive for the integrity of the whole Kinderdijk site.
/QUOTE]
Why wouldn't it be?
If in your own home it's just your family climbing the stairs or even walking across the floor you put in one type of product. If you have stadium crowds you do something much different.
I bet we can all think of places where the stone stairs have had ruts worn in them from the traffic. If the traffic is worse today then those ruts will happen over years instead of centuries.
I think it's misplaced to blame cheap airfares. People are flying places because the local options (including the trains in the UK) are too expensive for many. The rise of long distance discount bus lines shows airfares aren't that cheap for many people. People are riding the buses for days to save lunch money.
Nov 11th, 2018, 02:42 AM
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The area i live in could be added to the application list for a WHS. i personally think it will be a good thing as it will stop the stupid plans they have for the area, some are tourist related others are not. All would destroy some of the area, more than over tourism would do.
Nov 11th, 2018, 02:46 AM
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I think it's misplaced to blame cheap airfares. People are flying places because the local options (including the trains in the UK) are too expensive for many. The rise of long distance discount bus lines shows airfares aren't that cheap for many people. People are riding the buses for days to save lunch money.
Local media has something to do with this travel bug too, including forums like this1
Nov 11th, 2018, 04:44 AM
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[QUOTE=Traveler_Nick;16823304]
Simply because it never got mentioned.
IF the crowds caused material damage to the structures, I assume that this argument would be so important that especially the inhabitants of the mills would use it, wouldn't they.
IF the crowds caused material damage to the structures, I assume that this argument would be so important that especially the inhabitants of the mills would use it, wouldn't they.
Nov 11th, 2018, 08:20 AM
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OK I have sympathy for the millers but also since they chose to live in such a sight must put up with lots of tourists - but they should be involved in decision-making but also realize that many other peoples' jobs depend on taking folks to and thru the site. Seems whoever manages the sight has lapsed in involving residents in decision making - and the Holland Tourist Board should quit hyping the sight and cruise tourists banned? No easy choice there.
Nov 11th, 2018, 08:55 AM
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Hmm.. the situation in Kinderdijk sounds a bit like a lose-lose situation.
Someone has to pay the bill: either the people who inhabit the windmills, or the tourists with their entrance fees, or the public body which owns the site.
The purpose of a world heritage site is, in my opinion, that as many people as possible can visit it. As long as it does not harm the site itself.
As far as I understand the issue, no one is claiming that the growing number of tourists is destructive for the integrity of the whole Kinderdijk site.
I still remember times when going on vacation was a "once-per-year" thing for us kids. It was not uncommon to have kids in class whose parents could not even afford that one 2 week vacation during summer break each year. Families who would go on vacation in summer and in winter were considered "rich".
Someone has to pay the bill: either the people who inhabit the windmills, or the tourists with their entrance fees, or the public body which owns the site.
The purpose of a world heritage site is, in my opinion, that as many people as possible can visit it. As long as it does not harm the site itself.
As far as I understand the issue, no one is claiming that the growing number of tourists is destructive for the integrity of the whole Kinderdijk site.
I still remember times when going on vacation was a "once-per-year" thing for us kids. It was not uncommon to have kids in class whose parents could not even afford that one 2 week vacation during summer break each year. Families who would go on vacation in summer and in winter were considered "rich".
