Just home from 8 days in Paris--Pickpockets threat--Rude French people
 

We just came home from 8 days in Paris. While the city is beautiful, gorgeous monuments, cathedrals, gardens, and museums are fabulous, our trip was sadly interrupted by pick pockets twice. My husband and I were very careful to leave passports, credit cards, driver licenses and large cash amounts in our hidden money belts, and everything was perfectly safe there. But the problem is, I placed my iPhone 5 in my coat pocket for just a second and was distracted with the ticket slot in the metro near the Arc de Triumphe. Obviously, a thief was watching and as soon as I passed through the revolving gate, I felt a hand in my coat pocket and a large man ran away with my iPhone. The second time, my husband had his wallet in his front pants pocket (he does wear loose pants) and he never even knew when the wallet was taken with about a hundred Euros. Even though we loved our hotel, the food, the tours, the cathedrals, museums, we found the people very rude. Often, French people cut in lines, and the restaurant waiters and waitresses are very cold and even rude. Once while standing in line at at the Eiffel Tower, a beautiful young, very pregnant woman rudely told my husband to "Wait and step back!" While she proceed to get 2 tickets to the top of the tower for herself and her husband. I thought, "Wow, this is a baby's mother! what kind of example will she set for her child?" I realize Paris is a very large city, and maybe it is just the large city people everywhere, but we found French people very cold and rude. The streets are very crowded and we never did really feel safe.We were sure glad to get home to Texas. (My husband and I are in our late sixties and probably look older than most tourists, but I wonder if that made us easy targets for pickpockets and people cutting in lines)

I had the exact opposite. My husband and I found the French extremely kind and helpful. We saw many pickpockets/scammers in Paris, but nobody bothered us for more than a few seconds. Those that tried we just said "No" and walked away. I am sorry that you had things stolen, but they watch your every move- always zip, button and conceal-no matter what- And TRY and look like you know what you are doing and where you are going. I hope you'd be willing to give Paris another chance! I can't wait to go back.

Sorry to hear of your experiences. We recently spent over 2 months in Paris and never experienced any of the issues you did. It is a shame that they happen. We found that cultural differences certainly exist, but on a person to person basis, people were as friendly and helpful as anywhere in the States if not more so.
We were staying in a non touristy area among the working class from all parts of the world. But I don't think that made much of a difference as we felt the Parisians we met in the tourist areas were just as friendly.
We too are in our 60s and never felt unsafe; perhaps our conclusions about Paris are based upon our own cultural differences that exist in the States, rather than the cultural differences that exist between two countries? Just a thought.

I've been to Paris four times (most recently last month), and I've never felt unsafe. To be honest, I am often carrying thousands of dollars worth of camera equipment with me (not to mention my wallet) when I'm traveling so I guess I've gotten used to paying extremely close attention to my possessions. On the Metro, I keep my hand near my wallet pocket; sometimes I do it after I get back to the US, too, when I'm on a train or something, out of habit. Anyway, no one's successfully tried to pickpocket me (to my knowledge). It's true that I'm a tall, fairly big guy - maybe potential thieves would rather try to rip off someone smaller.

Paris is a big city, and people in big cities do tend to seem rude and abrupt sometimes to people not used to big cities. (Ever been to New York City?) I feel self-conscious when I'm in Europe because I don't speak any language besides English, so I tend to give leeway to the locals when I interact with them in English and the very few local words I know - and smile, that seems to help. I really haven't encountered too many rude people. But, most of the people I encounter in Europe are in the tourist industry or in public transit (train station agents, etc.) and I don't really expect them to be more than polite as they do their jobs.

So, I'm sorry you were pickpocketed and robbed and met rude Parisians, but I have had very different experiences on my visits to Paris. I think it's a lovely city and would recommend it to anyone.

I do think if you visit smaller towns say up in Normandy, you would have a very different experience.

I am sorry you got stuff stolen.. I do think being older and distracted put you at a disadvantage.. having your phone in your hands for people to see, then putting in your pocket , well of course any pickpocket watching saw you .. just so you know it would happen to a local too, they are not just picking on tourists.. Still it sucks to lose your things. I never travel with gadgets myself as I know I would be distracted if I had to worry about them.

I however do not feel unsafe in Paris and I have visited solo as a middle aged woman, and have visited alone with my children, perhaps its your age and the feeling of everything being different that made you feel unsafe.. remember pickpockets as a rule operate under stealth, they are not mugging you or shooting, you, , something that does happen in Texas a lot more then France dear,, and frankly, a lot more then in Canada.. I feel less safe in States when I visit.

As for coldness, I really think you expected it to be like home, you probably didn't follow the social cues.. and also , they simply not like you are used to,, its not normal there to be smiling and acting like the waiter is your best friend, its not coldness, its polite formality, but I can see how you may perceive it differently.. It is a shame that you cannot accept other nationalities as being different and just decide to label them as bad and rude.. says a bit more about you then them.

I'm reading "The Sweet Life in Paris" - a memoir by American food blogger David Lebovitz - and happen to be in the chapter "Lines are for other People." The gist of it is ...yes, Parisians cut lines. But as he so succinctly points out "I wonder why when we travel outside the United States we expect people to behave like Americans -- even in their own country."

My cousin had her iPhone picked from her coat pocket in Paris about 2 weeks ago. Two young women approached her with a clipboard holding (apparently) some sort of petition. As one held up the clipboard close to my cousin's body, chattering away in French, the other was lifting the iPhone out of her pocket. When they "realized" my cousin doesn't speak French, they quickly said "Pardonnez-moi" and moved on (even more quickly) before cousin realized her phone was gone.

What is a line (or a queue)? What Americans consider as a queue may contain too much separation and seen as a break in the queue to the French and others. In the US, even if I step back 2 meters away from the end of the queue, people often start queuing up behind me and I have to tell them I am not in the queue. In Tokyo, I would need to be practically breathing on the neck of person in front to show I am in the queue. It was possible that there was a cutting of line for OP even using the Paris behavior. I think one take away from visiting foreign countries is to be amused that what we have held as given is not so solid as we have thought in other cultures.

Greg that is funny you mention that, here in Canada we are obsessively polite liner ups, I was standing at least 10 feet from entrance to fitting rooms in a store waiting for my daughter last week. People kept lining up behind me.. or asking me if I was in line before they would walk in front of me to entrance. I was 10-12 feet away for goodness sake,.lol I was just trying to stay close enough for dd to pop her head out and be able to call me over , but I had to keep moving farther away ...

In France, normally, when you see a pregnant woman in a line, you let her go first. She may even hold a special "carte de priorité" giving her the right to skip the line (and the right to seat in the metro or in the bus). The beutiful pregnant woman you mention probably thought that your husband was very rude.

She may have thought that she had priority, but there's no excuse for rudeness on her part either. The pickpockets are an unfortunate part of life in most big cities and they tend to gravitate to crowded touristy places.

However, I lived in Paris for a year in the 60's and found that unless you knew them , Parisians do tend to be abrupt as they go about their business. Nothing's changed then.

I was taken aback the first time a pregnant woman cut in line at IKEA, never mind she was pushing a cart with a good 100 kilos of building supplies.

I thought a "pardonnez-moi" would not have been amiss but just got a shove and a glare.

It's the right thing to do, particularly giving up bus or metro seats, but common courtesy extends both ways.

I am in your age group, been to Paris twice alone & did not experience any pickpockets or scams. Out of curiosity, did you address shopkeepers, restaurant personnel, etc. with Bonjour, merci, etc.? French folks are much more amenable when small common curtesies are observed.

Sorry you didn't have a good time. You ran into a cultural clash.

The French are much more polite and much less "friendly" than Americans. People in Texas are generally gracious and friendly, and the ladies smile a lot. In France, people rarely smile on the street or in shops and are usually quite formal when serving you. That is why you always greet the staff in a restaurant or shop when you come in and why you always say good bye, good day, whatever, when you leave. It is polite.

Particularly at lunch, the waiter will pretty well expect you to have made up your mind before you sit down, one of the reasons why they post menu boards outside. He (they are about 80% men) will not have time to explain the dishes to you because one waiter will handle two to three times as many tables as he would in the US. If you violated any of these rules, they will think YOU were rude. Neither of you meant to be rude, but you have different customs and expectations.

Cell phone theft is now 50% of all theft in San Francisco, and cell phone thefts are up 40% in New York City in the last year (PC World). Boston has seen a number of cell phone and tablet muggings near the universities and hospitals this spring. I live in a resort and could steal 10 phones and tablets a day during the season if I weren't an honest person. The easiest is kids who leave them visible in the mesh outer pockets of their back packs, but plenty of people leave them on the table in restaurants and even on the seats of unlocked cars with the windows down. Apparently they think because it is picturesque and they are on vacation, no one will steal their stuff.

The Metro near the Arc de Triomphe is Metro Line 1, which is famous for pickpockets. We have written about it often on here. You are not the first person whom the thief has seen dropping something valuable, whether a camera or a phone or a wallet in her/his pocket. He was ready, you weren't, partly because you were anxious about using a means of transportation that you are unlikely to have at home in Texas, but mostly because this is what he does for a living. My very first mobile phone was stolen from my pocket on the MBTA Red Line in Boston because I made the mistake of letting the lanyard hang out so I could retrieve it more easily. Well, someone else also retrieved it easily, and I never saw it again.

We are at least your age and just got back from Paris without anything happening to us that was in any way negative. Give it another chance! But learn more about how to have a good experience before you go. I just learned this trip that people in shops don't want you to put your money into their hands. They want you to put the money in a little tray, and they will put your change there. That is very different from the US where most store clerks would be impatient with you if they had to pick up the money. So what is good manners in one place is not in another. But it is their country, and we have to do it their way. It is interesting to learn about the differences, and it keeps us young at heart even when we are taking Advil twice a day for the aching joints!

Rhea asks a very good question. Did you address those personnel politely? I found when I did I was also treated politely in return...I travel solo and love big cities such as Paris since single travelers are accepted better than in rural or smaller towns.

I agree with the above posters about the safety and politeness of the French. If you are annoyed by people cutting in line then never go to Italy as the Italians are worse than the French. They ignore all lines and sidle into the middle of the line. I was watching this one time in a museum line and decided to adapt to their culture and do the same.

I never found the streets crowded in Paris. There are certain popular tourist areas where there are lots of people but they are tourists, like yourself.

I bet you didn't see people driving around with guns in Paris as you might in Texas. That would certainly frighten me.

^^^I bet you didn't see people driving around with guns in Paris as you might in Texas. That would certainly frighten me.^^^

Wonderful line!

A solo trip to Paris for me, in my 50's. I encountered what I thought cold and abrupt behavior from a counter lady at a pastry shop. The second time she saw me she was as friendly as could be! Was I enjoying Paris? How long was I staying?
I rhink they think since you're only a moment in their busy lives ... if they are working ... they is no need for false feeling. Now, a second time? They may make you a regular AND therefore part of their lives.
As to the queues... my first time to Paris with a friend. She butted in line at a sandwich shop. All the people were quietly in line waiting their turn.. boy did they give her what for. I grabbed her and placed her beside me at the back of the line. I remember hissing, what are you doing? You wouldn't do that back home would you? Noooo...sorry.

It's all relative. I am originally from New York. I find the people in Paris friendly. I live in Massachusetts now. When my daughter was stuck in Texas overnight because of flight delays she told me people there are much nicer than we are. She was shocked.

I hear you AbileneGran. I've been going to Paris every year for at least twenty years but I've encountered one pickpocket too many- twice in three days last year. I always say Bonjour, Merci and au revoir.
I love the city so much I'll probably be back but not this year. And that pregnant lady was just rude!

I'm so sorry that what should have been a wonderful experience had so many negatives. I wish you had found Fodor's before your trip rather than after it.

As a first time visitor most of the sights that interested you were likely where all the other tourists wanted to be also, putting you in the thick of the crowds. That was our first time experience when we went to Venice, so we went back a second time purposely avoiding the places that would be crowded. It makes such a difference when you can take yourself away from crowds for even part of the day when traveling in "high tourist season".

On one of our first trips to Paris, someone tried to reach into my husband's front pants pocket while he was waiting to enter the metro. It certainly was disturbing and since my husband still insists on keeping his wallet in his pants pocket, I now velcro closed one pocket in each of his travel pants for his wallet. He won't change a "bad habit" so I've had to do what gives me peace of mind when we visit a large city. It works for us and it is something I learned after a negative travel experience.

Please come back to Fodors and do a search before you take another trip to Europe. There is so much helpful information here to make anyone's travels rewarding rather than a disappointment. Deborah

I think you'll find that Europeans tend to "ignore" lines a great deal more than people in the US.

And you can do a billion searches here and you'll find a lot of stories about pickpockets and just as many from people who said that they were never pickpocketed so I am not certain how much those stories really help other than to make people aware that the practice does go on.

I do think that there are different customs and conventions in Europe when it comes to lining up. Americans most definitely take queueing up very seriously, whereas even in the most orderly European nations it's more of a lawless system of pushing forward. I always found that fascinating and have met many Americans who get quite frustrated by it.

What is wrong with driving around with a gun in your car?

And what is wrong with Texas?

If this nice lady had a gun in her purse that iPhone thief wouldn't have gotten very far if she shot at him.

I am all for Texas justice. You want to steal my wallet? Here is a bullet for you.

As for rude Parisians, I would probably be rude, too, if I had to deal with tourists speaking English at me all day without even trying to speak a little French.

Imagine what waiters have to go through when American tourists only speak English and don't know anything about food, asking for nachos or chicken wings.


You have to take the good with the bad.




Thin, gun owner

"I think you'll find that Europeans tend to "ignore" lines a great deal more than people in the US."

Southern Europeans maybe (in fact you can just about identify the country by how much they break the queue), but Northern Europeans never, try that in the UK and "if looks would kill". :-)

sorry to hear about your troubles in the city of lights. as others have pointed out Paris is a huge, busy place that can seem charming one minute and cold as a drunk beggar another. it seems like you heeded some advice by keeping valuables in the moneybelt where they stayed safe. unfortunately one can only take so much precaution and theives eventually compromise the soft targets. An iPhone/iPad and wallet are two of the most sought after items they are looking for. baggy or loose pants are a golden invitation for being robbed. There were times in Paris where i felt like my personal space was being violated. to deflect this i would immediately stand with my back to a wall and look directly at the person i felt was after something. As for the people i found Parisiens very polite and accomodating. I took it upon myself to learn some rudamentary French and i think this went a long way. my attempt at chit chat with cafe workers,hotel clerks, & ticket salesman was well received with smiles. A few locals assisted us with directions and information too. It's too bad that you had a different experience because i think it vindicates a naive American perception that "the French are rude" held by people that rarely travel outside the US if ever. I wonder if you'd be receptive to a repeat visit some time or if this was a bust that put too bad a taste in your mouths?

Except in ski lift lines. On the slopes, the northern Europeans, including the British, are just as bad as the southern Europeans.

Seems like the OP had a simple case of culture shock. Many travelers return to Paris again and again and again and never manage to find any rude people there except maybe for other travelers.
Personally, I am another who has never felt unsafe in Paris, even though I am a solo traveler. However, without going into nasty details, the one time I was in Texas, I felt very unsafe indeed.

Weisser, you must be going to the wrong ski-slopes :-) there queues? not where I go.

>>>
As for rude Parisians, I would probably be rude, too, if I had to deal with tourists speaking English at me all day without even trying to speak a little French.
<<<

Would you shoot them too Thin? LOL

As one or two posters above have indicated, the iphone "hits" are directed at both locals and tourists. One of the reasons Metro stops are targeted is that people, no matter what their country of origin, take out their phones there to check messages, consult maps, etc upon entering or leaving the station.

Think about it: a few moments watching at a station can earn the thief quite a bit of cash in a day.

As to culture...
The observation that there are so many regional differences in the US in manners is well taken. I always think of Parisians (who are different in so many ways from the rest of the French), as the French version of New Yorkers, especially since their city is also "invaded" by country-bumpkin FRENCH tourists as well as international tourists.

I remember my typically fast-walking New Yorker daughter becoming angry trying to get to work uptown when her path would be blocked by a horde of very sweet but very slow moving MidWest tourists.

And not every Paris waiter is the same in attitude, just as no NY waiter is the same in attitude. I'd say the, "Hi, my name is Robert, and I am delighted to be your server tonight" is probably rare in Paris, but you certainly can find the same supercilious waiters, the same "mom" type cafe workers, and the same efficient, pragmatic and abrupt waiters throughout the city.

I am not from NY and quite frankly, the city gets to me after a few days because it can be overwhelming to the senses (Paris is actually easier for me). But the same random acts of kindness I have experienced in New York I also have experienced in supposedly "cold" Paris. When I left my purse with passport on a Metro train and ran to the desk for help, the so-called "unfriendly" French desk clerk moved heaven and earth to get it back for me. My younger daughter used her last dime to find her friend in a sketchy Paris neighborhood, and the taxi driver GAVE her money because he was so worried about her.

So I feel bad that your experience was so negative.

I too had a poor experience in paris nearly 10 years ago with my daughter and granddaughter. Rude people, aggressive 3rd world beggars and a general feeling of not being welcome. The city itself is lovely but we were so soured that we haven't returned since then. It sounds like not much has changed for the better so we made the right decision to avoid Paris.

Not sure what to say... We go to Paris twice a year... And every trip we comment that no one in Europe treats us as well as the French. That said, I study French passionately. And even tho I am not great, my efforts get us bonus points.

Queuing... Whatever. I live in Budapest and each day getting on the tram is like a reenactment of the fall of Saigon. But the Hungarians are very nice to us. So I forgive them their queuing indiscretions.

"I am all for Texas justice. You want to steal my wallet? Here is a bullet for you."

Wow! Physical violence for a property theft...that's uncivilized.

"Paris is a big city, and people in big cities do tend to seem rude and abrupt sometimes to people not used to big cities. (Ever been to New York City?)"

Being direct is not rude. New Yorkers are direct.

"I remember my typically fast-walking New Yorker daughter becoming angry trying to get to work uptown when her path would be blocked by a horde of very sweet but very slow moving MidWest tourists."

We New York natives understand hordes of tourists...who wouldn't want to visit the greatest city in the world!? Were lucky to live here and understand their awe :)

Is it the case the pregnant women have the right to move to the front of the queue? Just want to know so I can avoid any problems.

My wife and I have been to Paris six times and are going back again next year. The behavior you experienced can certainly ruin a trip, but please don't condemn the whole city or country based on your trip. We have found speaking just a few words of French will open a lot of doors and change the native's attitude toward you in a hurry. There is and always will be petty crime in Europe. As long as there are tourists with lots of money and thieves who want it, there will be the type of crime you experienced. The trick is to not make it easy for the thieves by placing a phone, wallet or purse where it can be easily taken.About eight years ago I read several articles about pickpockets in Paris, especially Gypsies (since I usually plan our trips at least a year in advance, I have a lot of time to read).The article described one method during which two young gypsy girls rush you and distract you. One gets right in your face and the other picks your pocket while you're distracted. A month or so after I read the article, we were off to Paris. The first day there my wife was a little tired from the long flight and decided to take a nap. I was too excited to be back in Paris so I went for a walk while she slept. A couple of blocks from the Louvre two young girls rushed me, the older one yelling Mon Papa, Mon Papa, Mon Papa. Since I thought it unlikely that I was her Papa and because I remembered the article, I immediately started screaming back at them with every cuss word I could think of. This initially worked and they backed off. Unfortunately, they were undeterred. In the next block they came back with the Mon Papa, Mon Papa. I turned around and screamed at them again. This time I think they figured that I was crazy and might be dangerous so they went off in search of an easier mark. That was the trip that I first started taking naps with my wife in Paris. Actually, I don't want to scare people out of coming to Paris. But do take precautions. I travel with my passport and most of my euros in a money belt. I carry my phone in a zippered pocket. Even with those safeguards, I am certainly not fooling myself into thinking I couldn't be a victim. If your situation occurred to me, I would probably think I am an idiot, but I would still love Paris.

I have visited Paris several times, and with very few exceptions I have found the Parisians to be very nice. I do make an effort to speak French, and remember to greet people and thank them when I leave. They are decidedly nicer on our repeat visits to their restaurants or shops, but that is not very different from home in the USA.

Our last visit was two years ago, and no one tried to steal from us. A young man pushing a baby carriage stopped us in the Marais last trip. Once I realized that he wanted money, I suddenly did not "compris" what he was saying...and we walked away.

There was a true "nut case" in the tax refund office on the Champs Elysees in the Starbucks building, but he was almost amusing. He reminded us of a Seinfeld show.

We try to be careful about our belongings, which may have helped. We're returning this summer, and this time will be more watchful with iPhones and avoid people with petitions. I hope the OP will give Paris another chance. It is such a wonderful city.

I find the French to be very gracious, if formal. From the OPs description of the events at the Eiffel Tower, I infer that the couple did not arrive at the window and place their order chop-chop, but rather arrived at the window and for the first time looked at the pricing options. I really don't see how someone could say "stand back" otherwise, since the order would have already been placed immediately on arrival at the window.

As for the pickpockets, I've avoided them so far. I've always wanted to rig a booby-trapped wallet by placing razor blades at the edges of a woman's wallet so that anyone who grabs it would get a nasty cut. Then ride the subway with her purse partially open and see what happens. I've read online of a few people doing this, and it's reportedly great fun.

Is it the case the pregnant women have the right to move to the front of the queue? Just want to know so I can avoid any problems.

Even if she does not have the "right" i.e. does not hold a "carte de priorité" and wave it into your face, it is common courtesy to let a pregnant woman jump the queue or to give her your seat in the metro or the bus. Don't you do it at home?

The theft of iPhones in New York City is so common that it has gotten named. It's called Apple Picking.

Living in New York and having traveled around, my wife and I had 3.5 pickpocketing episodes: My wife's wallet from her purse in NYC, her home town, my wallet on the Metro in Paris (got it back by yelling "PickPocket" and pointing at the guy who removed the cash and dropped the wallet), a foiled attempt in the Metro (I kept my hand on my wallet in the pocket and resisted the shoves without grabbing the pole), and a half attempt on a Rome bus by keeping my hand in my pocket while the big lady barged out of the bus and the little old lady found that my daybag has a jammed zipper.

It isn't Paris, it's cities.