Mavis

In preparation for fall trip to Paris found an interesting article in my files fr. 1990 European Travel & Life about eating etiquette in France. Would be interested in comments fr. those who've been/are there. Valid or not?<BR>- once seated at table, should never leave except in dire stress and never! announce where you are going if you have to go<BR>- be aware of le respect du pain - take only the amount of bread you are going to eat, if baguette put on table break, don't cut it, place bread on table not plate, never sop up sauce with it<BR>- don't talk too loudly at dinner table nor laugh loudly<BR>- eat everything w. knife and fork - includes chicken leg, asparagus, fruit<BR>- cutting salad is unforgivable, use knife to gently fold big leaves then spear w. fork<BR>- uncouth to blow on soup, should be sipped fr. end of spoon not side<BR>- cheese: Gruyere should be cut lengthwise, round cheeses cut in wedge, Roqueforts and all blue cheeses cut so person at end doesn't end up w. all the white (Roquefort always eaten mashed w. glob of butter)<BR>- hands always on or above table<BR>- always clean your plate - insult if you don't<BR>- napkin never folded after meal, but scrunched and left beside plate<BR>And two non-eating rules:<BR>- always add 'madame' or 'monsieur' to Bonjour<BR>- never call French ppl by first name on first meeting them<BR><BR>What do you think?

Sam

Was this the April 1 issue?

opinion

I'd say most of this was standard etiquette, not just French etiquette. Some injunctures to be taken with grain of salt, like 'cutting salad is unforgiveable.'

opinion

Oh, and the bit about cleaning the plate - it's an insult to the diner to make observations about what they did or did not eat, one is not supposed to notice, or at least pretend not to.

Mavis

Yes, Sam it was the April issue of European Travel & Life.

wellmannered

we do this at our house every day.

Capo

I think the two non-eating rules are generally good practice. <BR><BR>As far as the eating rules go, another good one to remember is: When food is set in front of you, never exclaim "You've GOT to be kidding!! You really don't EAT this stuff over here, do you?!!" Bad form.

Yes

Except for cleaning the plate, these are fairly universal. And I don't think anyone has a problem with a bit left - but don't forget that portions are generally smaller in Europe.<BR>One interesting note about American vs European table manners concerns the left hand (or whichever doesn't manipulate the fork). Americans are supposed to keep it in the lap. Europeans are taught to keep that hand on the table. They are said to wonder what Americans are doing with that hand under the table!<BR>

x

I don't think a people that allowed the neighbors to be taken--no, turned in their neighbors to be taken--by Nazi authorities have any right to comment on the table manners of others.

Americans

Well, if you must know, we're busy using that hand to feed the escargot to the dog.

Patrick

Several years ago I attended a Rotary Club luncheon in Avignon. The men in attendance were all business leaders of the community, so presumably pretty well bred. I was astounded when nearly every one of them broke up pieces of bread and sopped up the wonderful wine sauce from their plates. About half of them would drop a bitesized piece of bread into the sauce then use a fork to pick it up and eat it. The other half, simply mopped up the sauce with their bread (one bite at a time) and popped it into their mouths. <BR>I guess mopping up the sauce with bread is the only way to meet the requirement of leaving a clean plate!

xxx

What exactly is wrong with cutting salad?

carol

The Roquefort and butter rule sounds strange to me. Maybe it's regional (a rule promoted by Normand dairy farmers but not by Proven&ccedil;al olive grove owners).<BR><BR>There does seem to be a conflict between the clean-your-plate rule, and the don't-mop-with-bread rule. if something's got to go, it makes sense to get rid of the proscription against mopping (such a waste of bread and juices).<BR><BR>The French generally strike me as a particularly courteous lot. If only they'd adopt just one more etiquette rule at the table: Don't smoke in the presence of nonsmokers whom are also eating.<BR><BR>x: That's a vicious, ugly, deliberately divisive thing to say. Certain people may have done that, but "a people" did not.

factoid

Basically manners were invented to put others at ease. Looked at that way, the roquefort rule rules. Don't make the person at the end have the "left-overs." Using a knife on your salad implies that your host did not cut it up properly for serving.<BR>And, oh, the smoking! I'm with Carol! My party of four had an outrageously expensive dinner at Maxime's ruined by a cigar smoker at the next table. That should be the primo etiquette guideline!

Sue

I was curious about the do-not-cut salad rule. Since there was, or used to be, such a thing as a 'salad knife' according to Judith Martin, aka Miss Manners, seems this rule isn't universal. I've had caesar salads where if I didn't cut the lettuce, someone would need to perform the Heimlich (sp?) maneuvre (help, can't spell today) on me. :- )

jb

As long as your manners are modestly appropriate I can't imagine it being a big deal - nor can I imagine a French waiter watching to make sure you mix your roquefort with your butter! I am sure they have better things to do!

carol

I hate bad grammar. In my post above that "whom" was an accident. I meant to say "who." My fingers added the "m" without my permission--I had nothing to do with it.

Mavis

Your comments got me interested in the author of the magazine article - her name is Harriet Welty Rochefort and she is an American who now lives in France. She has an interesting website at www.hwelty.com/indexus.htm where she talks about differences between the French and Americans, the two books she's written, etc. Also looked as if there might be some good travel advice.

Wondering

Patrick - <BR><BR>What exactly did you mean when you said you expected these guys to be "well bred"?

xxx

He probably meant well brought up. tney're not livestock, after all.