itspat

More questions for our trip...

1. When should we buy our BritRail Flexipass? Can we easily buy at Heathrow after we've landed or can we somehow buy ahead of time and claim at the airport to save time? Is the queue usually long? We are not sure how much time we need to allow to have the passes delivered to our home in the US and don't want to risk not receiving them by end of month.

2. We are using the website http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/ to plan our journey. Our trips will include Heathrow to York, possibly York to Newcastle and Newcastle to Edinburgh (or just straight York to Edinburgh), skip a day to allow for Edinburgh+tour, Edinburgh to Liverpool, Liverpool to Ludlow, Ludlow to London. Can we use this site to simply plan the timings of the trains - can we just show up at the station with this pass and not worry about prebooking? What if a train is full? Can we ignore the prices for advance ticketing vs. anytime ticketing - does the pass cover any fare? Am I going about this the right way?

3. Is there a way to "add on" an extra day to a Flexipass? What are the options if you run a day short (either intentionally or due to a missed connection, etc.)

4, Using the same website above, I'm not sure I understand some of the connection times. For example, Heathrow to Paddington arrives at 1605, but 1605 is also listed as the time to catch the tube from Paddington to King's Cross. Arrive King's Cross at 1650, but that is also listed as the time the train leaves for York. How does this work logistically?

Thanks.

RM67

All these sites build in transfer times into the journey planner, so that doesn't sound right.

Can you cut and paste what you are seeing into here?

flanneruk

BritRail passes aren't sold in the UK. There may be some convoluted way of getting them by showing a passport or something, but it'll be far messier than buying them at home.

If a train;s full, you stand till the first stop, then fight for any newly vacated seats.

The convention with how National Rail displays Tube times is weird. Tubes don't have a timetable, so what you're seeing is just a way of communicating that:
- 45 mins is what airlines would call the legal minimum connection time between a platform at Paddington and a platform at KX, and
- you'll make it easily. It's three mins to the Circle Line platform, 12 mins to KX and tubes around 1600 are every 3-5 mins.

I always assume it's 25 mins from my train arriving at Paddington to sitting at my desk in the British Library next door to KX

flanneruk

PS: The only real case for BritRail passes is their utter flexibility.

It's almost certain that if your only plans are those indicated, over eight days it will be spectacularly cheaper to book it all in advance (and get the tube direct from LHR to KX rather than faffing about at Paddington) than to buy the pass.

The difference can be very substantial, and if you're worried about getting the pass on time, or having to pay even more for next-day couriering, you really ought to cost up advance booking.

janisj

>>BritRail Flexipass? Can we easily buy at Heathrow after we've landed or can we somehow buy ahead of time and claim at the airport to save time? <<

AFAIK you must buy it ahead of time and receive it in the mail at home. It isn't sold in the UK - it has nothing to do w/ 'British Rail' but is a train pass sold to overseas visitors by a commercial company.

. . . However our resident BritRail expert (the infamous PQ) hopefully will see your thread and have the straight skinny . . .

janisj

I was posting the same time as flanner -- and I agree w/ him that the BritRail pass likely won't save you any ££/$$. It does provide flexibility, but if you pre-book your longer distance journeys you'll save a lot buying point to point tickets.

itspat

This is what I'm seeing, as just one example. I hope it comes across properly:

Train 15:42 Heathrow Airport T5 [HWV] London Paddington [PAD] 16:05
Tube 16:05 London Paddington [PAD] London Kings Cross [KGX] 16:50
Train 16:50 London Kings Cross [KGX] York [YRK] 18:40

Any additional advice on some of the other tidbits I was inquiring on would be appreciated, too. Thanks!

itspat

Also posting at the same time as you all... thanks and we will consider pre-booking. Flexibility is nice but maybe we need to reprioritize.

itspat

Based on some of the "anytime" fares, the Flexipass at least with the information listed online seems like it'd save a TON of money... IF the pass allows you into any train anytime. Even with the "advance" fares (for example, 52.5 pounds from Heathrow to York is the cheapest right now)... that's about 80 dollars for one leg of a journey that will have about 5 legs. Maybe my brain is fried... what am I missing?

itspat

AND... IF we were to consider first class but didn't have reservations and found all the seats taken, can you seamlessly switch to standard class (or vice versa)?

sofarsogood

Rather than price a journey from Heathrow to York look at London Kings Cross to York and see what prices you find. The Heathrow Express into London Paddington is expensive. Taking the Tube from Heathrow to Kings Cross will be cheaper.

Tickets from Kings Cross to London on 1 Oct start at £13.

You just have to work out your route, do your sums and see how much you can save by buying advance tickets. A pass may be better - just depends if you can committ.

sofarsogood

<<Tickets from Kings Cross to London on 1 Oct start at £13.>>

should be "tickets from Kings Cross to York start from £13"

flanneruk

<i>"The Heathrow Express into London Paddington is expensive. "</i>

Not, users might think, if it's free with the BritRail pass. Of course you're paying a fortune for the pass, but...

<i> "Even with the "advance" fares (for example, 52.5 pounds from Heathrow to York is the cheapest right now).</i>
I doubt it. On a randomly chosen date of Sep 25, KX-York is £55 at 1650 if booked now, goes into the stratosphere at 1700 and 1730, then falls back to £48 at 1800 and £38 at 1819.

You're being financially killed by taking the Heathrow Express, and adding to your costs by travelling at the extreme peak. Get the tube, wait an hour or so and your costs collapse.

PalenQ

AFAIK you must buy it ahead of time and receive it in the mail at home. It isn't sold in the UK - it has nothing to do w/ 'British Rail' but is a train pass sold to overseas visitors by a commercial company.

. . . However our resident BritRail expert (the infamous PQ) hopefully will see your thread and have the straight skinny . . .>

flanner and janis have good takes - a BritRail Pass is cost-effective if cost is your bottom line only if training around incessantly like I am wont to do or you wish to have complete flexibility to just show up and hop on any train anytime as fully flexible fares can be dauntingly steep - otherwise for a handful of trips of less yes scour www.nationalrail.co.uk for what discounted and often train-specific fares you can come up with. And be flexible on travel times and even station as flanner points out in his latest post above. And again the pass simplies things, especially if arriving by air when you never really know when your plane will land - with a ass you just hop on the next Heathrow Express to Paddington and then the next train out.

You can buy a BritRail Pass last I knew at only one place in Britain - the BTA British Travel Authority in central London - not sure they still do sell them but always have.

BritRail Passes prices are set by and profits go to the consortium of individual British rail franchises that participate in the scheme - all of them to my knowledge so that commercial company is all the train franchises in the U K - called BritRail in North American - whose headquarters are actually in Quebec - ACP Rail has the BritRail franchise for North America to my knowledge.

You cannot add a day onto a flexipass or refund one that is not used. No facility for that here or there.

There are senior rates in first class if 60 and over I believe and if you have 3 to 9 people traveling together than the 3rd thru 9th passenger gets to pay only 50% of what the first two pay.

The Family Pass allows any kids under 16 to get a free pass to match the pass their parents buy.

Thus seniors, groups and families may find the efficacy of a BritRail Pass more than solo or couples traveling by themselves.

For lots of great info on British trains and passes check out these IMO fine sites - http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id11.html (any questions call this agent - Byron knows everything - I have used him for years for my passes - and www.seat61.com (click on this site's commercial link to RailEurope to get current pass prices - and www.ricksteves.com.

sofarsogood

Just another thought -

if you're going to Edinburgh (or Newcastle) why not fly straight from Heathrow then work your way south? That would be a more efficient use of your time.

PalenQ

Can we use this site to simply plan the timings of the trains - can we just show up at the station with this pass and not worry about prebooking? What if a train is full?

Beauty of a pass - just show up at a station and board the next train - no trains have reservation requirements so you can always board even if full and in a stop or two find seats being vacated be others - or simply wait for the next train - so so many trains.

itspat

That's what I love about this site... you help a usually level-headed traveler like myself find reason in a moment of insanity. Hadn't considered flying from Heathrow north and working our way south... makes sense.

How much time to allow clearing Heathrow from international flight and then catch flight to Edinburgh? Why is Virgin Atlantic so much cheaper than British Airways? What's the catch?

To your knowledge, does BritRail work for airport transfer from Edinburgh airport into the city? Or is it only Heathrow in London?

Thanks again.

janisj

>>Why is Virgin Atlantic so much cheaper than British Airways? What's the catch?<<

Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Sometimes Virgin is much pricier,

>>To your knowledge, does BritRail work for airport transfer from Edinburgh airport into the city? Or is it only Heathrow in London?<<

There is no train from EDI into the city, so no, the Britrail doesn't help there. But there is a very inexpensive airport coach into the city centre. In London -- the Britrail Pass covers trains from LHR, LGW, and STN.

>>How much time to allow clearing Heathrow from international flight and then catch flight to Edinburgh?<<

If you are changing terminals (which you likely will since you mention Virgin) I'd give it 3 to 4 hours. I've made it MUCH quicker than that - but w/ immigration, luggage, security - I'd rather have a couple of hours to kill in T5 (huge shopping mall, many restaurants) than miss my flight.

PalenQ

To your knowledge, does BritRail work for airport transfer from Edinburgh airport into the city?>

Well yes if you consider the Edinburgh Airport train station that is not right inside the terminals but stops on the periphery with a bus link to the airport - but unless you were traveling from say Inverness to Edinburgh the same day you wold never use a pass for a few quid ticket.

janisj

>>Well yes if you consider the Edinburgh Airport train station that is not right inside the terminals but stops on the periphery with a bus link to the airport - <<

PQ -- there is no train station at EDI - on the periphery or otherwise.