Onne - Many thanks for your input on Timbavati and camps. My camp experience there very limited. As you say the Timbavati is shared by several camps. (Ngala, except Ngala I believe does not share Timbavati traversing). Likewise agree the Timbavati is more open bush and game less concentrated than Sabi Sand. But I would say game, including leopards, just as "friendly" in both reserves.

When I'm in Timbavati I notice very closely the other camp game drive vehicles and how many guests are in it. Some of them they fill to max, like 9-10 guests. Too many for me. But could be the guests are one big family and want it that way. Also I'm into photography, at Kings Camp there are two lead guides, Patrick and Morne that are also very much into photography. A guide that is not often doesn't understand why you want him to move the vehicle 3 feet.

I've been tempted by Motswari but it is at the very north end of the Timbavati. One afternoon from Kings Camp we drove up to it for lions and it seemed like a long drive. Which I would not care for if most Motswari game drive goes down to central Timbavati. (Did that one safari at Ngala Lodge when every game drive went way south into &Beyond territory).

Thanks again, and your thoughts on all this?

regards - tom
ps - for anyone wondering about these Timbavati camps locations and other Sabi Sand camp locations, here is a simple map. http://tinyurl.com/y97s4dl

Hi Tom, I'm also a keen photographer and I must say for photography I tend to prefer the Sabi Sand, even though the bush is more dense. Sometimes the animals in the Timbavati are relaxed but too often they don't allow you to come close, especially leopards (which of course the Sabi Sand is famous for).

On a photographic safari the best is to pay a bit extra and book a private safari vehicle just for yourselves, so that other guests are not inconvenienced if you want to sit at the same sighting for an hour or longer. The vehicles you saw with up to 9 or 10 people on it are probably from budget lodges, which cost between $200 and $400 per person. Good value for money, but yes you may end up being on a full vehicle with 9 other guests.

One thing about the Timbavati is that they only allow 2 vehicles per sighting, while the Sabi Sand allows 3. So even though there are fewer lodges and fewer vehicles, we have still sometimes had to wait for one vehicle to move off a prime sighting before we could move in.

"Or fly/drive Sabi Sand to Phinda taking all day and staying over night outside of Phinda then going in next day."

Tom: when you do that (from wherever) do you go in for the pm drive or get up in the middle of the night to arrive, check in & set off on am drive?

Onne - I have been tempted to book private vehicle, maybe next time. The decision has been how to spend my budget, that is, 10 nights on safari with a private vehicle or for same $$$ 15 nights sharing. Since as you said above you can have "quiet" days of game viewing than I've been thinking that more time gives more opportunity for good viewing.

Also, about setting at sighting for long as you wish, possible at some sightings, yes. But at popular sighting such as a lion buffalo kill even with your private vehicle you are still required to rotate off for sharing, right? And as I said I think on another recent thread, if it is photography you want, then having a guide who is a good photographer is most important. A guide that thinks any picture is a good picture is no fun to work with.

SBW- Usually miss the morning game drive when arriving at a camp. For example after staying at Kruger camp Letaba at early morning we drive out of Kruger and into Kings Camp arriving about 12 noon. However, however, some camps are close enough that you can transfer after the morning game drive arriving at new camp in time for lunch (important :) ) and the afternoon game drive. This I did last Sep when transferring (charter flight) from Kings Camp to Kirkmans Kamp. The Fed Air charter flight ($300) took only about 20 mins even with stopping at another safari camp pickup.

regards - tom

Yes those are good points, but we have found serious photographers might even want to stay with a herd of impalas if the light is right and they are interacting nicely, or whatever, to the frustration of other guests who want to move on and find the Big 5. On our top end photographic safaris we always ensure a private vehicle, as well as a professional photographer as host who can give the guide/driver instructions about vehicle movements, etc. That does push up the cost though.
It's true what you say about still having to share sightings with other vehicles and rotate. On occasion we have also found some high profile photographer or royalty who simply insists on staying with the sighting, everyone else has to rotate but his vehicle stays. This can have other guests very unhappy but some lodges would do this for high profile return guests. (Once a year, a certain Arabian royal family books out most of the Timbavati and hogs all the sightings - if you are unlucky enough to be at one of the other available lodges during this time, your game viewing is very restricted). In my view, to avoid too much rotation and sharing of sightings with other vehicles, it is best to choose a lodge that has their own exclusive traversing and no vehicle pressure, like Londolozi or Lion Sands or Singita. Londolozi for example also has a fancy vehicle, specially kitted out for photographers (4 swivel seats, night vision binoculars, etc). But the use of the vehicle costs over $1000 per day, on top of your nightly rate.
Onne

My two cents' worth... Once you've had a private vehicle, it is v-e-r-y difficult to go back to sharing a vehicle with other guests. We are usually only two or three on our safari's, and having a vehicle for yourself is bliss. We have a serious photographer with us who really appreciates the luxury of extra time at certain sighting because we don't have to consider other guests. I have to add though, that all of these have been specialist safari's which adds a whole new dimension to your safari experience.

Kind regards

living4safari, agree :)

I do understand about being around "just impala" when the light is wonderful and also asking the guide to move the vehicle two feet back. I likely will do a private vehicle next time at Kings Camp. I know the two guide photographers there and both are a joy to be with. And Kings Camp rate for a private vehicle is reasonable, around $250 per day I think.

It is though sometimes fun to be on game drive with real first timers. Their amazement at being so close to lions and elephants - with no bars between- is fun. Also like to see them when they ask how many game drives I've been on and I reply about 200 :) And clue them in about Amarula with their morning hot chocolate :)

Anyway, all it takes is money, huh. (I've got the time :) ).
Someday I'd love to take one of Andy B's photo safaris and then spend another two weeks on safari after it. And also fly over on business class, and . . . .

regards - tom

I've seen reference to Amarula -- is it like Amaretto? (I will certainly be one of the agog first timers in the vehicle, & possibly a little tipsy too?)

Amarula made with African Marula tree fruit fermented, sugar, cream. Similar to Bailey's Irish Cream. Amarula great in hot chocolate, coffee, over ice cream or simply over ice.

Five years later I remember well bits of my very first safari game drive, camp Nsefu Zambia. Afternoon drive, small lion pride with one tiny cub, still one of my fav photos of lion cub - http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/...6a91c8ca6g.jpg
Later just after dark our vehicle stopped on dirt road and guide said - the pride is walking towards us along the road. They did, right next to the vehicle, looking up at us!!! Yes indeed, agog!!!

regards - tom

$250 for a private vehicle per day is a bargain. Many lodges charge twice that or more.

Mike

I am currently really into Amarula smoothies - just add ice and blend!

Luckily most liquor stores around here carry Amarula. Yum.

To those taht are concerned about the chalets at Ngala, you need not worry. I have just returned and had a great time - trip report to follow but I thought it was excellent vlaue for money.

Phil

Are there cheaper flights now from Sabi Sands to Phinda...7 years later?
PS Enjoyed our stay at kirkman's and Ngala lodge chalets 3 years ago