IMDoneehere, I also went to public school in the US.

At ours they also taught us that the contraction form of "it is" is "it's" not "its". However when you're talking about a plural noun --like chairs -- you'd actually say "they're" not even "it's".

>>We also have special chairs for Yanks, its called extra wide, next we'll be incorprating some sort of soundproofing<<

We have a special section for Brits. It's called extra-cheap.

Good point made above, about tipping on the full amount, before a discount is given, if it's Happy Hour or you're using a coupon.

So if you have a Two-fer coupon, tip on the price as if you paid for the two items, not just for one. If that makes sense.

Example: Buy one/get one plate of spaghetti, normally $12.95 each.
You get two plates of spaghetti at just $12.95 for both.
So tip on $12.95 x 2, even though you're only charged for the one.

Because the server does as much work to provide the Two-fer meal, and shouldn't get dinged on the tip because there's a coupon involved.

Tab: I agree about the 2 for 1. How would one know what the normal price would be in non-happy hour? If they advertise "all beers $2," would I ask the server at the bar, "How much is my beer when it's not happy hour?"

"How much is my beer when it's not happy hour?"

And you wonder why United label it absurd.

<i>If they advertise "all beers $2," would I ask the server at the bar, "How much is my beer when it's not happy hour?"</i>

Well that is easy. At the bar you tip $1 per beer and $2 per mixed drink. Price is irrelevant.

Or just go to Massachusetts, where you can't discount alcohol.

Or when in doubt, don't be a cheap bastard, throw in a few extra bucks. I agree with Tab's and tg's advice, but there's no need to hide behind the hideous complexity of it all to justify not tipping properly. It's not actually that hard.

<i>> "How much is my beer when it's not happy hour?"</i>

In my extensive, in-the-field study of this situation, the regular price is displayed on a visible menu or board, so is known at the time you place your order.

However, the research is ongoing.

<if the service is bad... say 5%>


I would never tip 5%. But I would tip -0- if service was truly horrible.

<At ours they also taught us that the contraction form of "it is" is "it's" not "its". However when you're talking about a plural noun --like chairs -- you'd actually say "they're" not even "it's".>


Looks like somebody upset the ol' hall monitor again. Its incredible how Picky and Annoying this guy can be.

Sorry, Cyber, I'm not going to play. Recess is over.

If the service is so poor as to warrant no tip at all, you should have a word with the manager. I have never had service bad enough to justify a 5% tip, let alone no tip.

To lighten up a bit, here's one of my favorite threads on tipping:
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...-the-pilot.cfm

tg: >>Well that is easy. At the bar you tip $1 per beer and $2 per mixed drink. Price is irrelevant.<<

OK, then. In true Fodors fashion, I will have to choose from contradictory information. Though I like your solution way better than researching the non-happy-hour price. (However, sometimes keeping track of the number we've had can be more challenging.)

New: >> I have never had service bad enough to justify a 5% tip, let alone no tip.<<

Consider your self lucky, or very tolerant. Ever had a server "disappear" for a half hour -- and reek of smoke when she finally returns? Or how about one who delivers a bowl of dipping olive oil that was already used by a neighboring table? Yes, I complained to the manager. No, I did not leave a tip.

I would never leave a 5% tip or even a 10% one. If the service is so bad that the waitperson deserves that little I would speak to the manager and get a different server.

And yes, I have done this twice. Once the waiter - at 8 pm - was obviously completely drunk, couldn't keep order straight after several repetitions and was literally throwing the plates on the table, splashing sauces all over the tablecloth.

And the other time at brunch (not breakfast) - when the waitress brought coffee (unasked) to the table when we sat down. We explained we didn't want coffee at all - and certainly not before the meal, but she refused to remove it - saying she knew we would want it eventually (presumably ice cold more than an hour later) and then began to argue with us because we wanted to order our drink while we looked at the menu. She insisted she could only bring everything to the table (pre-meal drink, main course and dessert) all at the same time. This was a place we had brunch often and she was new - and too weird!.

Like nyt, we had a drunk waitress once, but apart from slurring her words entertainingly, she did a fine job--it was a casual place, so not much was asked of her. She got her full tip. (It was lunch, btw--she either got an early start, or was continuing on from the night before.)

nyt, that second story is too weird, I agree!

vincenzo, I agree with you, for what it's worth, for those infractions I would have done the same as you.

The only people that want to do away with tipping are people who are not restaurant employees.

You can't pay them enough hourly to make up for their tips.

Even breakfast joint waiters walk with $150 a shift.
__________________________________________________ ________

I thought this was a really interesting observation that is so often lacking in the ongoing discussion about tipping.

<We do 15%.....that's enough! >
No, it's not.

I just this week attended a lunch, 22 people in all. The gratuity was automatically added to the tab, as is customary for large groups (and I would happily accept it being done so for individuals, as well, to put this question to an end once and for all.)

The amount was 15 per cent. I'm not going to get into discussions about what 'should' be the case, especially since I'm in Canada not the US, but no matter what country or city you're in, you should expect restaurants to know their own policy. So ask the restaurant at the time of reservation or before sitting down, what is their automatic tipping policy for large groups. If what you tip as an individual matches that policy, you can't be too out of line, no matter what you read in some magazine or on some messageboard. The business is the source, always take advice directly from the source wherever possible.

"You can't pay them enough hourly to make up for their tips."

Since money is fungible, I cannot possibly see how that could be the case.

Example: If I serve on average six tables for two twice in an evening, that's twenty four place sittings in all. Assume that each person orders $50 worth of food on average, that's $1200 worth of business. We shall take 20 per cent as the norm to avoid argument. That's $240. Again, just an example.

Okay, now for the hours. We shall assume service begins at 6 and ends at 9:30, and I have to show up for the shift an hour in advance and stay half an hour after the public closure (again, just an example.) That's 5 hours of work total per day for $240 total per day is $48 an hour. Again, the absolute numbers may vary, but the system of computation will not.

What will need to be done of course is to take a sufficiently large sample to get averages that meaningfully represent the typical working day and revenue for a given restaurant. The owner may choose to do a mininum wage plus allocate a percentage of the total business done per week, but it is still possible for the owner to control this business of remuneration. If one can compute how many grams of steak to serve and the price at which one must sell that steak to make a profit, I am not buying any baloney, no pun intended, that that same party cannot compute fair wage/remuneration.

To figure this out I would need a slide rule, a guru, and a divining rod.

HTtY