I thought the definition of Southern state was determined by which side they took during the Civil War. Texas joined the Confederacy. Kansas oddly joined both sides. Florida was a slave-holding state and also Confederacy.

amatters, you will fit right in. Southerners love people who stir the pot. Nothing like a strong brew to set the pace.

Might there be TWO definitions of a Southern state? One(for most of us) would be "the Southern States" are those located in the "Southern" portion of the United States and Two the "Southern" definition of "Southern States" which is determined by which side they took during the Civil War. While in school in San Antonio, I don't recall any mention of Texas' part in the Civil War, but I sure know alot about the Alamo!! (there's no basement!) ; )

Re racial tensions, I would have to say definitely not in the larger cities - like Charleston - but still does exist in some of the small towns. But no one is likely to do anything more than just look and not say a word. (At least not to anyone they consider of a sufficient curiosity factor!)

In many cases, it's just that you are "not from around here are you?" I got the same thing in NYC many times traveling on business. (Not many ladies in pastel suits with big hair in the Big Apple, I guess!)

Back in the early 80's, I reposessed cars for a bank, and one of my coworkers was black. I am blonde and white. He and I would occasionally go to pop a car together and when we stopped for lunch, we got a lot of looks, but no one ever said anything to us. Maybe it was because we were both wearing suits (try creeping through a soybean field in suede heels to gain the "element of surprise") and we looked like co-workers, I don't know.

I really think the South has gotten a lot more progressive about many things, but there are still some things imho that will NEVER change:

The fact that Old Money and Breeding are the most important things in the world, and that most will never truly be able to forget and forgive for The War Between the States.

(Usually new money people can look forward to being accepted socially after they have given a sufficient number of kick a$$ parties at which all stops were pulled and no expense was spared.)

"Southerners love people who stir the pot".

In a way, but always, always done with impeccable manners! :D That's the cardinal rule and what separates a true Southerner from the chaff. ROFLMAO

What a neat discussion. I read this in one sitting last night and got such a kick out of it. As a Yankee who moved south and married someone from Mississippi I have a slew of stories too. My poor mother-in-law wondered how and where she went so badly wrong. Both her boys married girls from Massachusetts towns less than 50 miles from each other.

Re accents...when my husband went to Newport for OCS he totally eliminated his accent because he said no one could understand him. It was/is gone, completely erased. We met while he was still in the Navy and we both lived in Va Beach--this was after the accent erasure. It was months before I met his family for the first time, and I could hardly believe he'd grown up in the same household. It was incredible.

Oddly, his brother who lived and worked in Australia for about a decade and England for another decade after that, still has every bit as much of his southern accent today as he did when he was a boy.

amatters, you will love Charleston. What a great city! I'll wager you even pick up a little of an accent yourself. It's easy to slip into it!

why, scarlet, you'll have to be called on the carpet for all that begging! Everybody knows FL has them pesty yankees too ... and for the uninitiated, you gotta be bred and born in the South to be Southern ... living near red necks doesn't confer citizenship. Now, you have a good day, you heah, and relax with a nice cool glass of sweettea. You want some mint with that?

Oh, but Scarlett is a Southerner through and through, and like the genteel lady a Southern lady <i>always</i> is, knows just the way to say &quot;Bless your heart&quot; and have you understand precisely what she means. :)

LOL, LOL, Oh, but OO, Scarlet a southerner? Frankly I don't give a damn, but transplanted, like them other pesky and pesty yankees down FL way. Now, that doesn't make her a bad person ... it just makes her non-southern. It's an exclusive club, you gotta be born into it. Enuff said! C'est fini!

Charleston is a fantastic place. I lived there for a couple of years and grew up spending a majority of my summer there each year. In fact, I loved it so much, I got married there. If we ever get the chance, hubby and I are packing our bags and moving there.

I am from Augusta, GA originally and now live in Atlanta. Most of my relatives from South Georgia (Broxton, Fitzgerald, Albany etc) so I am 100% southern. I love the south. Having said that though, I find it interesting that northerners are so concerned about moving to the south and not being accepted. Especially since I had three friends move to the north/NE area (Maine, Vermont and Pennyslvania) and only the one who moved to PA said that she felt welcome. The other two said it took forever to get people to accept them at all and they were originally excited about their move. The one from Maine is moving back after 4 years as soon as she can because she still has not felt real welcome. The one from Vermont has managed to establish herself.

I do know that when my boss, who is Canadian), first found out he was being relocated to Atlanta, he said he was nervous because he heard the south did not like Yankees. A friend had to inform him that he was not considered a true Yankee since he was a Canadian. He told me that most of his Canadian friends think of that we southern Americans consider them Yankees and hate them too. Makes me laugh. I told him no, but he we do think they talk funny.

My husband use to teach at a middle school in the City of Atlanta and he had mostly hispanic students. He does not speak &quot;redneck&quot; but he is very southern. His students use to make fun of him all the time and would tell him that they did not speak &quot;his english&quot;.

I'm a borderline Southerner. I was born in southern California, childhood in southern New Mexico, adolescence in Florida. I commuted to NY for a year and a half, and lived in DC for the same amount of time. And I still spend a lot of work time up nawth'.

It is soooo easy to slip into a southern drawl, the hard thing is to slip out of it. My New Mexico/Texas twang has been difficult for me to kick, it's a nasal thing. My cousin makes fun of me when he hears it, usually after a couple of glasses of wine.

Hello, TG, also happy you're fine along with the other area denizens.

Tandoori Girl,
I am a Borderline something LOL as are a few others on these boards, I see :D
Who would have ever thought that Poor Scarletts pedigree would be called into doubt? By a man wearing a Tuxedo!!
Well, as my mama taught me, if you have nothing nice to say, just smile :D
So you all have a nice day and enjoy the sunshine.

Rednecks? Hmmmm, as far as I've seen they're pretty national. Lord, bless your heart, you don't need to be bred in the South for that one, nor is it a prerequisite to have a southern drawl.
It's just a matter of perspective.

I never said that. I was just pointing out that there is a difference in redneck speak and a southern drawl. Some people (often television) confuses the two. Nothing infuriates me more than hearing an actor or actress try to speak southern. It comes off very affected and they rarely get it right.

True Southern ladies eschew vulgarity, LOL, and avoid saccharin at every opportunity, offering true sugar, not artificial sweetener.

Actually, Scarlett, I was referring to the REAL border. Like the one in El Paso/Juarez and Tijuana. Seems like I'm a real fish outta water in most places.

Hey! Is that Blacktie mascarading as Formal Attire? Let's get to the ROOTS of the amatters!

There are so many &quot;others&quot; in Florida the real guys aren't the indigenous ones anymore. It's the transplants that fit in, not the bloodlines.

Yankees are like kids. They should be seen and not heard. But it's hard to keep a good Yankee down (a few decibels).

ANYBODY HEAR ME?

It wasn't directed at you beachdreams. ;)
But along the line of accents, my favorite is creole. Can be hard to understand depending on how Cajun the person is.

LOL, TG, you are a card! Glad you're doing well in your usual peppery manner. Take care.

I generally dislike such discussions because they invite both sweeping generalizations and regional slurs or put-downs.

But to be honest, as a Yankee &quot;displaced&quot; to the South for a total of 27 years (13 in Virginia, 14 in NC interrupted by 8 in Chicago), I will say I now feel &quot;bi-cultural&quot; with one foot in each culture and a better understanding of what North and South see and don't see about each other. In the interests of full disclosure, I don't think I'll ever be anything but a Yankee/New Englander at heart, just the way a Tar Heel displaced (in adulthood) to Mass. or NH will always have a Southern bell inside. But even so, there's a very good chance we'll retire here rather than going back to the frigid, expensive, and overpopulated North!

I miss the directness and attention to efficiency of the North. I dislike the impatience and the congestion of the North. I like the gentle seasons and the usually open ease of social interaction of the South. I dislike the subterfuges, and slow and sometimes careless completion of tasks; and -- above all -- I'm really sick of the gusto for hating the North.

I've also had to acknowledge that some of my observations come from the difference between urban and rural, such that I find the Southern insularity and the &quot;we don't care how they do it anywhere else&quot; attitudes narrow and approaching bigotry but based more in rurality than regionality. However, it seems to extend to attitudes toward education, which has put the region behind rather noticeably. But the narrowness of the Northeast, in particular, the ignorance and condescension regarding the world west of the Hudson and south of the Potomac, is hard to take, especially when you see that bias reflected in the media. And of course, the big cities of the North have a whole different set of problems with education.

As to amatters' questions about friendliness: it's just an impression, but &quot;friendliness&quot; differs in quality as a matter of how many you have, how intimate you are, and what you consider the &quot;rights and privileges&quot; of friends. Northern WOMEN (can't speak for men at all) have fewer but closer, more fiercely loyal friends. Southern women have more friends (with a couple of true &quot;intimates&quot;) with, shall we say, a different standard of loyalty for the larger group. Again -- just an impression.

And as for a tip for readjustment: Figure the first year will be tough -- you'll be confused by what stores do what, what you can't find there that you could &quot;up North,&quot; and of course, it takes a while to find a support system and friends. But when spring comes in later Feb., you'll celebrate.

Eventually, you'll find what Charleston has to uniquely offer, and make some friends. You may never, however, think that what Charleston has to offer is better than what any place else on earth has to offer -- that's reserved for the born-and-bred natives. But after 5-7 years or more, you may come to enjoy it enough to doubt whether you could happily move back north again. So, bottom line: keep your mind open, expect some bumps, and give it time.

So Cassandra, from reading your post, you generally dislike the south but put up with it's peculiarities?

Wish I was moving to Charleston

Cassandra, some would say NC and VA aren't actually true South, and your time in Chi town harding improves your status for making observations about the South. This club is more exclusive than one might imagine. You can see there are all sorts of foreign interlopers down in FL trying to pass themselves off as members. We caught the pesty wanabees at the door and turned them out good and proper. LOL, :&gt;, have a good day.

I received this as an email a couple years ago. It's in a Word document now, so there will by a few weird ? in it.


Southern Test

Score 3 points per correct answer. You're given 1 point to start. Answers follow below.

1. How many Vienna Sausages are in a can?
2. What was the number and color of Richard Petty's cars?
3. Bill Dance is good at what?
4. What university does Bill Dance root for?
5. Where did Herschel Walker play (college) football?
6. After boiling peanuts for an hour you have what?
7. In cubic inches, how big is the smallest 1966 GM small block V8?
8. A Cajun is likely to speak what furrin' language?
9. What is a chigger?
10. What is scrapple?
11. Where is &quot;The Redneck Riviera?&quot;
12. What's that fuzzy stuff hanging off the oak trees?
13. What follows logically? Johnson, Mercury,
14. What's the common name for a bowfin?
15. If you mated a heifer and a steer, what would you get?
16. Who sang &quot;Your Cheatin' Heart?&quot;
17. What are grits made out of?
18. Who was nicknamed &quot;The Bear?&quot;
19. Why is the Blue Ridge blue?
20. What did The Baldwin Sisters make?
21. Who was Andy Taylor's love interest?
22. What are the radio station call letters that carries &quot;The Grand Ol' Opry?&quot;
23. Where would you find Vidalia County?
24. What sport requires 3 legs and a rope?
25. What instrument did Bill Monroe play? (typically)
26. How many strings on a banjo? (two possible answers)
27. When you argue with a fool, what is he doing?
28. What is a scuppernong?
29. Do you want the goats to get into the kudzu?
30. Why do you want to eat &quot;high on the hog?&quot;
31. What color is a John Deere?
32. What do you call the offspring of a mule?


Aintsers:

1. 7
2. 43, red and blue
3. Fishin'
4. University of Tennessee
5. University of Georgia
6. Hard peanuts
7. 283
8. French
9. A red bug (small parasite)
10. A sausage-like loaf made out of pig parts
11. Panama City, FL
12. Spanish moss
13. Evinrude
14. Mudfish
15. Nothing. A steer has been castrated.
16. Hank Williams
17. Corn
18. Paul Bryant
19. Because of the pollen
20. &quot;The Recipe&quot;
21. Helen
22. WSM
23. Georgia
24. Calf roping
25. Mandolin
26. 3 or 5
27. The same thing
28. A wild grape
29. Yes
30. Because that's where the better cuts of meat are. Rich folks live high on the hog.
31. Green
32. Mules are generally sterile.

FormalAttire said: &quot;some would say NC and VA aren't actually true South&quot;

Say what?!? Loosen the bowtie, the blood needs to circulate.

My stepdaughter and her husband (from NJ) lived down there for about two years and absolutely loved it. She was about 24/25 when they lived there and there was plenty to do for someone her age. They only moved back due to his job, otherwise I think they would have stayed longer.
My husband and I visited the city several times and it's a great place. They have great food in the South (but it's true you won't get NY style pizza or bagels, but you won't miss it all that much since there are so many other great things they have).
It will be a great experience for you no matter what. ENJOY!

wow i have alot to learn i got about 2 right on the test. :)

&quot;True Southern ladies....avoid saccharin at every opportunity, offering true sugar, not artificial sweetener&quot;. Wrong wrong wrong blacktie, sigh, AGAIN!! :D Wrong in both senses of course, but clever, I will grant you that. And NC not being in the South? tsk tsk How silly.

Now, I do know where MsScarlett was born and she's a belle all right. I should add too that one can be born in the south and bred there as well, but if the breeding doesn't stick, as it unfortunately does not on occasion, then that person no longer qualifies as a Southern gentleman...or woman...as the case may be, and I think that's essentially what we are discussing here, n'est pas?

In a way, I think the test is for men. I don't know about motors, fishing, football, or tractors. But since this is a travel board, I hope you know the Redneck Riveria.

Doesn't the Redneck Riviera cover a broader area. I always thought it was Gulf Shores, AL. Destin is where all the rich folks went.

Regarding Texas and the South, the eastern portion is very Southern. I would put Tyler up against Natchez any day of the week.

I find it odd that someone from San Antonio would not have learned about the civil. A major high school is named after Robert E. Lee. He resided at one of the hotels there during the Mexican border skirmishes. There is a semi-famous drawing of a Union General surrendering in San Antonio. The state government still offers Confederate Heroes day as an optional official holiday. hmmmmm.

My favorite Southern man was Tennessee Williams. He could turn a phrase or two.

Second fave: Truman Capote

Ncgirl, do you grade on a bell(e) curve? :) Yikes!

Great southern reads:

Eudora Welty, William Faulkiner, Thomas Wolfe, Flannery O'Connor, Walker Percy.

Just to keep it travel related, I was flying many years ago from Denver to Albuquerque when someone had the very sad misfortune of dying (heart attack I think) mid flight. I was reading As I Lay Dying.

Ok you caught me...only went to elementary school in San Antonio, high school in Michigan, and guess I wasn't paying attention when they were teaching about the Civil War, still caught up Remembering the Alamo, trying to decide what side I wanted to root for.

Well, LOL (really), now we know somebody slept thru geography (you'd know about the bell)! Last Hint: it's gotta be EST or CST to have any chance of qualifying southern. C'est fini for me, :&gt;.

Blacktie says, &quot;C'est fini for me&quot;

I don't suppose we can expect that to last, can we?

&quot;You can see there are all sorts of foreign interlopers down in FL trying to pass themselves off as members. We caught the pesty wanabees at the door and turned them out good and proper&quot;

I find this insulting to anyone , not just to myself and my husband.
Someone living in DC can hardly use &quot;we&quot; when speaking of Southerners, can they? Or maybe his geography lessons were a failure?

Too bad, this thread was lighthearted until some it an excuse to be rude.

Y'all are leaving Pat Conroy and Anne Rivers Siddons off that list of great southern writers.

We are thrilled some read the truly great southern gothics, Tandoori, obxgirl, goTravel. That's clearly why people need to delve into a region's literary culture, in order to begin to know it. You're setting a great example of that. On that issue, is anyone familiar with &quot;full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.&quot; Wm. Faulkner could surely sum up!

From Light in August (travel and southern related):

&quot;My, my. A body does get around. Here we aint been coming from Alabama but two months, and now it's already Tennessee.&quot;

Oops. Just realized I'm quoting from copyrighted material. Must stop that....must stop that...

There are some good present-day Southern authors as well. Doug Marlette's &quot;The Bridge&quot;, T.R. Pearson's &quot;A Short History of a Small Place&quot;, and Clyde Edgerton's &quot;Rainey&quot; and &quot;Walk Across Egypt&quot;. All are set in NC. Pearson's book is especially good.