I'm going to buck the tide a bit and say that there is nothing good about being overdressed for an event or place. It makes one look like a tourist, or a fogie, or both. Some of the advice being given on another thread about dressing for certain cafes in SF will, if taken, result in the OP's looking like a rube who doesn't get out much.
Sorry to sound harsh, but part of dressing well is dressing for the times.

NewbE, how is that bucking the tide here? I've seen several people express the same thing even giving examples, but I haven't seen anyone say it is good to OVERDRESS for an event.

If you are talking about someone wearing a coat and tie in a nice restaurant where it really isn't necessary and many don't, surely you don't call that "overdressing". If people look at a businessman who happened to meet his wife for a nice dinner still wearing a business suit in a nice restaurant (or even in a sports bar for that matter) and people take him for a "rube" then those people have a much worse problem than those bothered by sloppy dress in a nice restaurant.
Now if you're talking about evening gown and tuxes in a neighborhood restaurant, that's another matter.

Or are you saying a businessman SHOULD go home and get more casual before going out to a plain but nice restaurant, but it's fine for a painter or a mechanic to go to dinner there in his work clothes?

OK, forget about the tide, I'm not bucking anything. Perhaps what I should be saying is that it's pointless to generalize.

I really dislike dressing up. I'm 55 and plan on never putting on another pair of panty hose. Ever.

I do have a couple of skirts that I wear on the rare occasion I find myself in a city and heading out to a 'nice' restaurant.

I don't own any dress shoes with toes. I guess I think nice sandals are ok where I go.

I live in a college town, vacation in places like Key West, where shorts and t-shirts aren't frowned on, even in the nicesr restaurants.

And will retire in a couple years to Belize, where the mottos is 'No shirt, no shoes, no problem'.

Works for me.

Even though I like casual clothing, I do think that we have gotten carried away with dressing down. People these days go to funerals, weddings, job interviews, work and nice restaraunts looking like total slobs. Making the effort to dress up a little more for certain events shows respect. It would be nice if people dressed up more for these occasions and it would be a nice change of pace from all of the flip flops and ball caps I see. Boring.

"Well I'm not quite 40, but I find myself dressing better as I get older."

It's called maturing. Once upon a time this was considered a good thing. Now apparently it's considered acceptable for people in their 40s and 50s to dress like (badly dressed) teenagers.

"no shirt, no shoes, no problem".

Good for you. But if I sat next to this in a restaurant it WOULD be a problem for me:

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/...AtComputer.jpg

Ewwwwwwwwwwwwww! Patrick! that picture is GROSS! :-&

I need some bleach eyewash STAT. I also need some meds to rid that image out of my brain, and some anti-emetic as I'm throwing up all over my keyboard! I think I may have nightmares tonight....

10am PST, too early to take a peek at Patrick's link-sounds like I'd be sorry anyway.

JeanH, I'm with you..open toe sandals/shoes are a way of life these days, and pantyhose? You mean that barbaric form of isometric exercise (putting them on) is still around?

Neo,
Isn't that a picture of one of our infamous east coast posters?

Where do you ever find this priceless stuff - ROFL

I thought it WAS Patrick...?! lol

It may be the proud owner of the (self proclaimed) 50" waist.

Gross picture!! Funny though. Some things are just meant to be covered up......

The Roman Catholic Church in America has a terrible problem in dressing down. Some people come to church dressed in the same clothes that they'd mow the lawn in or lounge on the back deck. I've seen young ladies go up for Communion with exposed belly buttons and upper buttocks and well-exposed upper breasts. I actually ushered with a guy who often came to church with blue jeans with paint all over them.

As for restaurants, men shouldn't be wearing hats inside. Big turnoff.

Now I'm really insulted. How could anyone think that picture was me? It doesn't look anything like me. I have gray hair!

LOL Patrick, that was uhm gross!

GeorgeW, the worse dressed person I believe I ever saw was at Mass. He was sitting in one of the back pews and so was in the communion line for quite awhile. He was about the size of the fellow in the photo Patrick posted. He had on a pair of overalls (is that the right word..the bib attached to the pants), no shirt and the pants were cut off to just about an inch below his underpants (assuming he wore underpants of course). Oh, he wore white atheletic shoes with brown socks that came up to the calves of his legs. I can only assume the poor man had a mental problem.

Personally I have always loved clothes and do wish that people dressed up more then they have these last years. But all I ask is "just cover up your body" so to speak, lol.

Gosh, it would never occur to me to care one way or the other what other people in a restaurant are wearing.

This is a very interesting thread--enjoyed reading the whole thing!

Here are a few thoughts/reactions/opinions in no particular order:

Many people equate dressing down with being a slob, which frankly doesn't make sense to me. One can be "dressed down" and stil look very sharp, neat, whatever, and the opposite is true too: people who are "dressed up" but don't look put together.

Somewhere in early childhood, it must have gotten established in people's minds that a "skirt" was dressier than "pants." But really, you have to take into account fabric, accessories, footwear, the whole picture, in determining who is "dressier"--the woman in the wrinkled cotton skirt with her slip showing, a spot on her ill-fitting blouse, and scuffed shoes, or the one in the beautiful jacket, tailored dress jeans, and great shoes?

Once at Tru, a place that requires jacket and tie for men, a man in my party was made to put his jacket back on despite the heat. That was my last visit to Tru!!!

I had no idea people were so obsessed about seeing other people's toes! I mean, what is wrong with open shoes, sandals, etc., with a nice pedicure? And have these people ever tried to buy evening shoes that were NOT strappy, sandal-y things??

A number of people said they relaxed their dress standard when traveling, but how is that OK? Maybe everyone they see that they consider underdressed has equally compelling reasons? And why are cotton pants per se better than jeans?

Finally, Miss Manners herself defines asparagus as a finger food!

Must just be me as I read these posts but I would rather be slightly overdressed than underdressed for an event. Guess I am the odd one here.

I work for a small private golf club in Southeast Florida where dinner is served only three nights a week during the season with Friday being the only non-casual night.

We used to require the men to where jacket and tie but in recent years it has been only jacket required. Some of the older members wish it was still jacket and tie but then that would mean the majority would not come to dinner on Friday because they do not want to wear tie also - hence just jackets.

The dress code also includes no tank tops, short shorts, no hats or ball caps for men in the dining areas and especially no denim, no matter how expensive. Some of our new younger members have a problem with this. Thus the problem with the older and younger members in a private club. Times have changed but we still have our dress codes. Whenever my college age daughter is in town I tell her to bring something that to wear that is country club suitable just in case I have to go into the club for some reason. As employees we have to follow the dress code also.

I personally think it is more uncertain for a man as to what to wear to a nice restaurant sometimes. Is a jacket enough or a jacket and tie requried? Living here in sunny Florida it can present a problem sometimes.

In Europe, we Europeans easily spot American tourists because they are so poorly dressed (especially the shoes!).

On the European forum, the vast majority of American posters stubbornly insist in dressing like crap. And if we give advice that they might be treated in a bad way because their attire is not proper, they immediately cry "fashion police!".

"In Europe, we Europeans easily spot American tourists because they are so poorly dressed (especially the shoes!)."

Got news for ya, I've seen plenty of european tourists here who are dressed sloppily. Obviously, tourists aren't going to be dressed as nicely because they're living out of a suitcase and on the road. -A big duh.

"On the European forum, the vast majority of American posters stubbornly insist in dressing like crap. And if we give advice that they might be treated in a bad way because their attire is not proper, they immediately cry "fashion police!". "

Pompous really, really european alert, get the barf bag!!!What's dressing like crap? Not dressing "european" whatever that is? Please, you're in no position to lecture anyone on fashion.

I live in NY and Europeans are so easy to spot. They wear heavy woolen socks with sandals. Many have on knee length pants in the middle of winter. Their whole life is in their rucksack.

They have guidebooks in German, Dutch, French, Spanish, and English.

They spend ridiculous sums on comsumer goods that even Americans don't wanrt any more.

They speak polite broken English.

I have noticed the Dutch, I think they are Dutch, don't have lips. Is that some sort of concession to the EU?

They walk down the street without any regard for anyone else.

You Europeans are so quaint.

"In Europe, we Europeans easily spot American tourists because they are so poorly dressed (especially the shoes!)."

Amusing to see a German negatively stereotyping the way Americans dress.

In Bourges, we decided not to eat in our hotel restaurant (considered one of the best in the city) because we didn't feel like dressing up for dinner. Yet when we walked through the dining room that evening, we passed by a table of German men, all dressed in shorts, socks with sandals, and sleeveless "wife beater" tank tops.

In Angers, there was a sign at the cathedral warning that you wouldn't be admitted without a shirt. I asked one of the guides: Who on earth would try to go shirtless into a cathedral??!? The Germans, she said.

You ARE what you wear, I believe.

You ARE what you wear, I believe.


So if wear edible underwear, you are what you eat AND what you wear.

Very economical, I'd say.

Auduchamp, now I'm totally confused by your last post. So does that mean you are brief or you are a boxer? Either one sort of surprises me.

Or maybe it just means that you're an athletic supporter?
:D

Auduchamp, now I'm totally confused by your last post. So does that mean you are brief or you are a boxer? Either one sort of surprises me.

Or maybe it just means that you're an athletic supporter?

At least I am brief.

If you are female and have truly nice feet, sandals are not offensive. I don't even care what kind of sandals. If you have pretty feet, you can wear flip flops... just don't drag or make a lot of noise when you walk!

Who should NEVER show their feet?
People who have:
Yukky toe fungus (even grosser when covered in polish)
Peeling or half worn off polish
Bunions
Dry cracking skin
Hammer toes

***

I am preparing for a trip to London. All my clothes for the trip are new, as are my shoes.
I will have 3 work outfits (business casual) for work and the rest of the time I will be wearing cargo pants (no pockets besides the regular) Life is Good cotton Tees, a North Face pull over windbreaker, Keen hikers and Woolrich hybrid shoes that look kind of like green canvas Mary Janes.
No doubt I will still be underdressed, even for just walking around. So be it... I don't care.

This has to be one of the funniest posts I have seen: a toe nail nazi, an athletic brief, and an edible underwear eater! LOL

<i>and the rest of the time I will be wearing cargo pants (no pockets besides the regular)</i>

So what makes them cargo pants? (just curious)

Boston is very casual. I do dress for theater, synphony and certain parties and the top restaurants but I will wear nice fitting jeans to bistros with a nice top or my Chanel jacket (filene's basement), a good handbag, and that can sometimes look dressier than what others might wear.
I don't care what others wear if they are well behaved and happy.
Often at top restos you see couples looking around and seemed bored and not into eachother's company.

DM... they are capri length, baggy and that same material. The pockets are oversized and on the outside but since they dont have all those giant bulging pockets like my husbands, I almost dont categorize them as 'cargo'. Just comfy.
If I iron them I can wear with a sweater and they are dressier. I rarely iron them :)

A wedding or other event that was issued via an invitation is not an excuse for a free meal. This means that you show up on time, be polite, and dress the way the host and hostess request.

If you find this offense, send your sincere regrets.

I once went to a formal wedding in Maui, Bride and bridesmaids beautifully dressed, groom and groomsmen dressed in white tie and tails. Groom and groomsmen all wearing matching black flip flops...easy to know why...Luau Feet. Too wide for any regular shoes.

&quot;I have been to many weddings and funerals lately where many attendees look like they are going to work on their lawn or cars.&quot;

I agree, horrible, tacky and thoughtless.

Personally, everyone is entitled to their thing. However I have a limit. If it's a wedding, funeral,
workplace, or if I am paying well over 100 dollars (per person!) for a meal I do <b>NOT </b>.....

1. want to see your man's hairly armpits (or women's)(I can barely stand my husbands.)

2. want to spot your (ahem) &quot;crack&quot;, no matter how fabulous your life is and how much bling you have on or how hot of a bod you have. (I can barely stand my husband's.)

3. Want to see any undergarments
(I can barely stand my own
Playtex 18 hour bras)

4. Want to guess where your lower body ends and where your knees start because the crotch on your Dickie brand shorts is 3 ft long.
(I really prefer not to know anyway)

5. Want to feel grossed out seeing the multitude of tatoos and delicate areas adorned by piercings some of which should only be revealed to significant others in the privacy of the budoir, or at Snookies on Amateur Night Thursday (happy hour drinks 2 4 1 after 4 pm)

6. I am not interested in how prominent your um.....nipples are and would prefer you use those cover up adhesive thingies if you insist on going braless in an expensive retaurant with string air conditioning. =-O
(DH does not agree with me on this last one)

ams

ams, now that I've finished laughing about your descriptions~what you are describing isn't &quot;dressing casually&quot; it's being sloppy. There are times to dress casually and times to dress up~weddings, funerals and upscale restaurants are no place to display body art, underwear, or excessive flesh.....

ams

Can we say &quot;Nail on the head&quot;. That post was perfect.

I am sick to death of the slobby attire and careless hygiene exhibited nearly everywhere these days.

What especially galls me is when I spend over a $100 a ticket to some fantastic concert and the person performing comes out in a ratty tee shirt and ripped jeans and barefoot, hair all askew and looks like 'ten miles of bad road' as my mother used to say.

Have some decency and manners I say! Can these morons make more of an effort to be presentable? It is such a slam to your audience that you can't even bother to try and look presentable before taking a cool half a million to perform at Key Arena or the Paladium? I'm sick to death of sloppy performers. When I think of those that have actually worn nice clothes (Maroon 5, Tony Bennett, Dave Matthews Band, Tracy Chapman) it makes me smile. When I remember the slobs who gladly took my money and looked like hell on stage, it pisses me off.

Where has the class gone?

I have to tell a funny story, and I am not joking. This is a true story. 2 years ago my husband and I went on a cruise. As you probably already know cruises have formal night. Also attire for the main dining room is no jeans or shorts. Well my husband and I were seated at a table for 8 people. One of the other couples at the table wore khakis and t-shirts advertising various cigarette and alcohol brands each evening. My husband and I and the other 2 couples at the table were curious about what the t-shirt wearing couple was going to wear on formal night. Well, I hope your ready for this one. On formal night they got out their best attire and wore matching t-shirts that said &quot;Old Navy&quot;.