would you if you could, move to the US
 

If so, why:? If not, why not?

This really the european thread and we had this all out last year. Majority was no but issues raised included gun crime, poor publicity/marketing of US, poor quality of life, religious biggotry etc etc

I wonder how long this one'll last before it's taken down.

No: can't see any advantage, and loads of downside (crime: health system: no decent radio: ghastly weather)

BUT: I'd really, really like to spend a few long "holidays": doing what I do normally, only based in Cape Cod, or Washington State, for 3-6 months. It's irritating I can only do 3 months at a time - and also that it's technically a breach of immigration rules. As it, technically, would be for a US competitor to do the same thing here. Likelihood of either of us being found out is low: but a REAL pain if you do get caught.

It'd be nice if the rich world's governments adjusted their immigration rules to the reality of modern teleworking.

I have recently been speaking to my starter wife who did move to America after we split and has lived there for 18 years.

She is coming back to england as she can't be doing with America anymore.

I don't think I'd last 18 years. In fact I doubt I'd manage 18 days.

The problem for us Brits is we tend to think of America as a bit of Europe that talks funny and has strange shoes. It's not. It's a very alien place indeed.

So no, I wouldn't move there for all the gold I could eat.

I suspect a lot might depend on WHERE in the US someone wanted to move.

For many people here, the assertion that gun crime and poor quality of life are negative factors in their communities would be laughable at the very least.

It wouold be akin to thinking that every place in the United Kingdom is as expensive to live in and as traffic-congested as London.

Nope.

Car culture. When I was last living in England I didn't have a car because it would have been an inconvenience. Walk to the pub, take a bus to see friends, walk to the train station to get to work.

Visiting a friend in Phoenix we drove to the mall, drove to the restaurant, drove here, drove there.

I asked my friend when was the last time he simply bumped into someone he new. "Never" was the reply.

Unimaginable. I pass my life on my Caribbean rock saying hello to people I know.

We did have a murder in our Maryland community 4 or 5 years ago. But it was not with a gun--a woman ran over her husband with her pickup truck several times.

Move from my beloved London? No way. I would miss the interesting characters and all the bits I have yet to discover. Thankfully, my definition of chic is "small but perfectly formed". I don't aspire to the 3 car garage, in-ground pool, manicured lawn, shopping mall lifestyle. I know that this "dream" has been exported to Britain but I'm fairly well insulated from that in the City State of London. I would also be too far away from mainland Europe, which is full of infinite discoveries and culture, which is what really turns my crank.

I'd happily work there for a couple of years (like Flanneur, I'm a fan of Cape Cod, but bugger all chance of getting a medical research post there, I would imagine), but wouldn't want to settle permanantly. My entire working career has been with various US companies who have treated staff generally very well.

I'd miss a proper holiday allowance (13 days?? - yikes!!!), marmite, torrential rain (yes, I actually like the rain!), the British media/press, proper cars, and most of all being able to flit to Europe for a weekend on a whim.

I'd be uncomfortable with the lack of nationalised healthcare - even if it didn't affect me.

PS Hope that doesn't sound unduly negative - I have visited and liked the US - just doubt that I would want to leave Europe for ever.

No. I prefer living in a region with 2000 years of history instead of 250. I prefer living in a country that does not have soldiers fighting in Iraq. I prefer a good public transport network to an entirely car-oriented culture.

I did thirty-six years ago as a little and I am so grateful and thankful that our family were able to move to America.

I love America!

Please carry on.

Where did you move from?

We thought about it, but decided against it. OH had a job to go to, with NASA, in Pasadena.
In the end we decided we like visiting the US but couldn't live with things like the car culture, and just being so far away from our families. So we settled on a job in the Netherlands instead.
I too would love to spend a long period of time just travelling in the US. If we are able to (financially) when he retires we may even look into it - getting a visa maybe so we can stay longer than 90 days, but 90 days would be fine too.
I love the US and Americans. I have never met such genuinely friendly and hospitable people elsewhere, but I don't think I could live there.

Why? do you have a house you are trying to sell?

Seriously, yes: we would consider it and have periodically. DH and I have lived in a number of countries besides our home and native land and would ONLY consider as a permanent alternative the USA.

However, a bit like the UK gang above, 'my' America is a very New England kind of place. If we were going to move to the USA, it would likely be Maine or Vermont.

How funny..especially the part about "ghastly" weather. I'm from Southern California...Pasadena...and I have no problem with having sunshine almost every day of the year...and then there's Hawaii...how ghastly is it to have gorgeous weather? Plus, we can go to the beach, and enjoy great weather, on the same day that we go skiing... as there's such variety here. I haven't found that kind of variety anywhere else. Plus, there are plenty of other places,here in the U.S., that have nice weather,too. It's a big country!
Happy Travels!

Guenmai, I think the ghastly weather was meant as a joke.

Quokka, your statement that you prefer to live in country that doesn't have soldiers fighting in Iraq sounds rather strong to Americans who would immediately think of comparing that to the SS Nazi history. However I do appreciate that you are actually being very sincere about it, just as we would about Germany's past.

"How ghastly is it to have gorgeous weather?"

Very.

It's bizarre how the citizens of a state that's mostly an earthquake zone, where it's impossible for fair-skinned people to go out without risking skin cancer, that gets forest fires, volcanoes and practically every kind of insupportable natural event except plagues of locusts can delude themselves about how wonderful their climate is.

Like North Koreans telling each other about their fabulous economy.

sorry, a little girl

Asia.

I think there's a potentially profitable line of business for Fodors - brokering life exchanges. Euros can see if life is all red convertible Mustangs and Route 66s, and Muricans can go smell the quaint and munch baguettes while waiting for the dole check to come. Fido and fluffy stay put; you don't need to change email accounts. There's Bovril at the Piggly Wiggly and Smart Pockets at... well, somewhere.

Sign me up.

No, even though my wife has family there. Canada, yes, certain other European countries, yes. My wife and I discussed recently where we might want to move to as we are retiring soon, and we both homed in on Canada.

The USA is a place to go and visit and then come home from. The first time (of many) I went there a colleague told me to treat it like a foreign country where I could speak the language. Good advice.

I think people get carried away with the emotion of a good holiday and think a new country will be like that all the time.

And both the lack of the Daily Telegraph and the abysmal TV are major deterrents.

<i>religious biggotry</i>

I would say that religious tolerance in the US (including tolerance of the outwardly religious) is at least as high in the US as in Europe. That may not be saying much, though...

<i>gun crime</i>

I am constantly amazed at how often this is mentioned. I have never known anyone who was the victim of gun crime. I have never known anyone that has ever known anyone who was the victim of a gun crime. Even were you to live in an area with a high incidence of gun crime, your likelihood of being a victim is exceedingly low. Worrying about it strikes me as a bit irrational.

<i>It would be akin to thinking that every place in the United Kingdom is as expensive to live in and as traffic-congested as London.</i>

Exactly. I grew up in a town were serious crime simply did not exist. We left our home unlocked for 7 years. Our idea of vigilance was putting the car keys in the ashtray, rather than leaving them in the ignition.

<i>entirely car-oriented culture.</i>

This isn't entirely true. One can get by quite well without a car in several major US cities, including Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Chicago, DC, and San Francisco. And many other cities are less car-dependent than one would think.

<i>I'm a fan of Cape Cod, but bugger all chance of getting a medical research post there, I would imagine</i>

Well, it would be a commute, but medical research posts go begging in Boston, Cambridge, and (to a lesser extent) Providence. Or do as many Bostonians do and spend your summer weekends at the Cape or in Southern Maine or in the Berkshires. The proximity to such places is part of the appeal of living in Boston.

<i>I prefer living in a region with 2000 years of history instead of 250.</i>

I know some Native American scholars that would take issue with that statement. It may not be the history you are interested in, but it is history nonetheless.


All of that aside, like I stated on the &quot;would you move to Europe&quot; thread, it would likely be more of a hassle and expense than we imagine when it is just a pie-in-the-sky fantasy. And there is the issue that home is home, and the pool of people willing to move, even for a short period is exceedingly small. It simply isn't for everyone.

My kids enjoy a freedom in Switzerland that seems to have fazed out in the US. They walk to school, play in the neighborhood streets for hours, parents know each other and schools are still well-functioning. For after school activities, my kids walk to their locations.

If I had enough money, I could move back to be with my brothers and sisters but I wouldn't want to do it to my kids.

The daughter of our next door neighbor here in Maidenhead has lived in the U.S. for a few years. She and her husband love it. Our neighbor three doors down dreams of moving to the U.S., spends most of his vacations there, and will probably retire there. The people who live five doors down are about to put their house up for sale so they can retire in the U.S.

Schuler, my niece walks to school, plays with her friends outside for hours, walks to most of her activities, her school is fantastic, and her parents are well acquainted with the parents of her friends. So the life you have described has NOT been phased out, not where she lives and not in many other places as well.

only to New York ( love the art scene) , and only if I had tons of money ( the place has so much to offer, but like most big cities ie. Paris or London, to enjoy it all is very costly. Good health coverage
in US must cost a mint.

As the others suggested on the Europe thread, I would for a while. Also a half-half time split would be nice (for a while - don´t know how long). But I don´t think a complete move to the USA would be on the books for me. One emigration per lifetime is enough.

&quot;I would say that religious tolerance in the US (including tolerance of the outwardly religious) is at least as high in the US as in Europe. That may not be saying much, though...&quot;


I think the intolerance (in small towns) would be more towards people who were not religious.

&quot; I know some Native American scholars that would take issue with that statement. It may not be the history you are interested in, but it is history nonetheless.&quot;

I bit of a crock!
I am yet to hear an American politician, news commentator or an ordinary person expressing their
interest or pride pride in the native America history as &quot; the history of the US&quot;.

I would be unhappy in a country where I would only be one injury or infection away from bankruptcy. I don't know how the average septic lives like this.

I think I'd get mighty pissed off with the weather too. It seems to me that America is either too hot or too cold with very little in the middle.

&quot;&quot; I know some Native American scholars that would take issue with that statement. It may not be the history you are interested in, but it is history nonetheless.&quot;

I was pondering that.

If you take archeology as history, there is no much in it. Modern humans turned up in both Europe and America in and around 40,000 years ago.

Sadly, most of the ancient Europeans and the pre Columbian Indians didn't write much down.

For fun, here are some things that I enjoy about living in the US.

1. Water: Public drinking fountains in most locations, all the free water at restaraunts you want.

2. Public restrooms: Lots and lots of restrooms, most are even free and also have toilet seats.

3. Handicap accessibility: So much, it can almost seem extreme, but it's appreciated by those who need it.

4. Crime, personally in the US, I have never experienced any crime, my only experience with crime happened 3 weeks ago in Italy.

4. Friendly people: I really believe Americans are friendly. Sometimes saying Thank You can be an all day event, with the Thank you exchanges.

5. Volunteerism: Everybody wants to help others.

6. Low prices: Really a good value for those visiting from other countries and for other Americans.

Yes but archaeology isn't really history, as some of us mean it.

If I go to the Christmas midnight service at the Anglican church next door, I'm attending almost the exact same service - give or take the odd change in language or doctrinal tweak - as occupants of my house's site have attended in that church practically every Christmas Eve for the past 900 years.

If I drive to Florence, I'm following the route taken by the wool those occupants sold to Prato merchants to pay for the church, and its endless subsequent tartings-up.

If I research the emperors who originally caused the road at the end of the street to be built, I see they laid down maximum prices that could be charged for cloaks made from that wool.

There's a world of difference between being part of a permanent flow of history and observing someone else's.

I agree with Flanneur on this.

I lived my childhood years in a house the predates the mayflower.

I went to a school that was built in 1387 and still has many of the original buildings.

I got married and bought a house that was built in 1650.

I am typing this in an office which is on a roman road and near the longest georgian frontage in the world.

I'd miss all that.

As a first born American citizen and still having strong ties to the European community, I would be most happy having a home in the U.S. and Europe. Having grandparents and a mother who moved to America in the 1950's and more recently, a father who moved to America from Germany in 2000, I see no issues with them disliking the U.S. If anything, I travel to Europe more often than they do. They have adjusted quite well to the American way of life. Just as I would if I moved to Europe. It's not the country, it's who you are that defines how well you adapt/adjust to a new way of life.

Cholmondley_Warner -
&quot;I think I'd get mighty pissed off with the weather too. It seems to me that America is either too hot or too cold with very little in the middle.&quot;

Be sure to visit California... The weather is marvelous and lacks the humidity that you'd find in several parts of Europe.

Born and raised a Yankee, I now live in a large southern city in, of course, the USA. I have lived in Europe, and the UK in the 70's and 80's, and loved every minute of it. My son was raised there, and received a much better primary education then he would have here in the US. So much better, that when we moved back here, the school did not know what to do with him. He had to take the usual history classes, US, Texas State, in order to graduate, but that was it, and he was off to college. Our experiences living overseas are priceless, and I am fortunate to be able to visit Europe &amp; the UK several times a year for business and leisure. However, home....will always be here in the US. I love my homeland as much as you all love yours, and that is how it should be.

As for crime, It's all relative...I just don't go into areas that are suspect....even when I am visiting your lovely countries. It's been posted here many times.....most tourists would not have a reason to go to an unsafe area....it's the same here. Unless you are lost, you would not be in a bad area.

As far as driving goes, I can't complain. I live 2 miles from my office, and tend to walk or bike to most places. Our mass transit system is, admittedly, terrible. Thankfully, I do not have to use it.

I'm not a fan of your healthcare system. When I was younger, it was ok, but I find, as I get older, I prefer to have access to whatever care I need, at my convenience, and I don't mind paying for this. I am lucky to live in a city with some of the finest hospitals and doctors in the world.

The world would be an awful place if everything was the same. That's the nice thing about traveling.....we get to visit wonderful places for a short time, and then we get to come home...it truly is where the heart is.

I think for many of us, there is good and bad to living anywhere, and often the grass is greener somewhere else unless we have had a chance to truly experience a culture for a long time.

A few personal anecdotes here to illustrate what I mean. We live in the north central US in Minneapolis (the city itself, not the suburbs) which in many polls is considered overall one of the best places in the US to live (other than the winters that is).

My DIL came to Minneapolis from Lithuania (now part of the EU) three years ago, and her mother is here for 6 weeks on her first visit to the US. The MIL is extremely impressed with the US so far, and the visit has been primarily just seeing how people live every day rather than hit and run sightseeing. She is having a great time biking all over our city; enjoying the lakes and parks; and discovering the shopping opportunities like great sales, discount stores etc. However, even though we live in the city, for the most part during her visit, when she is on her own, she is pretty limited to the bike and walking because our city's public transportation system stinks whereas most European destinations have excellent public transportation. So, I agree that the US is way too car dependent.

She and I were out yesterday for a picnic when a group came in from a senior living center. She watched all of this with great interest and envy, was very impressed, and said there is nothing like this for seniors in Lithuania.

On the other hand, my son and DIL are comparing the much more family friendly social policies of Lithuania--nearly 2 years of paid leave for new mothers--compared to the miserly 12 weeks of unpaid FMLA here in the US. Daycare there is very, very, very cheap compared to what it costs in the US. I just watched &quot;Sicko&quot; and it reconfirmed many of my thoughts about the many problems with the US healthcare system which needs to be completely revised.

Is there someplace in the world that has the best of everything? Let me know.

(By the way, to those who are terrified by the gun crime in the US, most, but not all of it, is perpetrated within smaller social groups who live extremely high risk life styles in certain neighborhoods. I am all in favor of gun control laws and would like to see ownership laws significantly tightened, but also realize that random gun violence among strangers statistically is rather uncommon.)

The U.S. is the melting pot of the world... everyone moves here or knows of a family member or friend who has relocated at some time or another. People from around the world come here for education, to follow their dreams, economic growth, freedom, and the list could go on. Sure, they may return to Europe after so many years, but is it really because of our crime, religious persecutions, government spending, shopping malls, storage facilities, fenced yards, big cars, ghastly weather, or is simply because they miss their homeland, family, dear friends or hearing their native language? Personally, my fear of being a victim of crime is the same in San Francisco, Hollywood, Chicago, New York OR Paris, Strasbourg, Frankfurt, Rome, Milan, etc... It's not one specific country or city... And the U.S. has a house of worship for anyone and everyone. We love religion so much, just about anyone can set up a church within their own home. There's really no need to worry about being Muslim, Catholic, Christian, Morman, Jehovah Witness or what have you when you move to the U.S. It's the land of opportunity and there are options and plenty of them. Don't be too quick to judge. Our country is still learning and still growing.

I live in both places. I know very well that living in a place and being a tourist in a place are two TOTALLY different things. Julius is right the grass is often greener, but - it's often browner too.

<i>I think the intolerance (in small towns) would be more towards people who were not religious.</i>

As someone who has lived in small town America, I would disagree. Certainly no more intolerance than what I hear from my European (not that they are some sort of raving bigots). Perhaps a bit of preachy-ness in the bible belt, but nothing too bad. And let us not minimize the fact that most European nations long ago ceased to have anything approaching the religious diversity of the US. It is one thing to proclaim tolerance when everyone is just like you and quite another to practice it when you are faced with the reality of the other. I think that is the challenge you are seeing face many European countries as they deal with recent Islamic immigration.

<i>I am yet to hear an American politician, news commentator or an ordinary person expressing their
interest or pride pride in the native America history as &quot; the history of the US&quot;.</i>

Then you need to meet more Americans. When I lived in Oklahoma, there was intense pride in the Native American heritage and it was the focus of much of my primary school history. Places like New Mexico and Hawaii are similarly proud. Yes, there is the story of the Mayflower, but lately it has been accented by an increased recognition of the story of the Native Americans. Some dismiss it as political correctness, but I think that is their failing and that there are plenty of ordinary people with an interest in the story.

As for politicians, it is a rare politician, American or European that uses history as anything more than a cynical political tool. I wouldn't put too much stock in them.

<i>There's a world of difference between being part of a permanent flow of history and observing someone else's. </i>

I think that, given how much of history is the history of exploration and adventure, that you might be confusing looking at the relics of the past with being part of the &quot;permanent flow&quot; of history.

Me, too. I came from England 29 years ago (I was 10) with my English mother and American father to live in the USA. I have never left except to go on holiday.

I would NEVER return to England to live. I would have the shivers all day long looking at those horrid British teeth. :)

PS
You can buy Marmite, Cadbury, Walker's biscuits, F/M jam, etc. in US grocery stores.

Thingorjus

I am sitting in my lanai looking at the beautiful Pacific Ocean, the island of Molokai, Koko Head, and Diamond Head Crater, the sun is shining brightly now. Earlier there was a beautiful rainbow, there is a cool breeze and I can smell the flowers from my garden.

Ghastly, just ghastly.