SCOTLAND - Itinerary, Lodging Help Please
 

Can anyone answer a few questions and help by looking over some possible itineraries?

- if you could visit Skye, Inverness or Loch Ness area, which would you chose and why?
- what activities/sights characterize these three different areas?
- how many nights stay in Glencoe is sufficient to enjoy the sites without rushing?
- how many nights in Edinburgh suffice for a good introduction to the city?

We have some possible itineraries - which looks best, and why?

- Glencoe 4 nights, Loch Ness/Inverness 4 nights, Edinburgh 2
- Glencoe 3 nights, Loch Ness/Inverness 4 nights, Edinburgh 3
- Glencoe 4 nights, Loch Ness/Inverness 3 nights, Edinburgh 3

Perhaps you can recommend a better combination of nights for these above areas?

Or - we could do the following:

- Glencoe 4 nights, Skye 4 nights, Edinburgh 2
- Glencoe 3 nights, Skye 4 nights, Edinburgh 3
- Glencoe 4 nights, Skye 3 nights, Edinburgh 3
- Glencoe 4 nights, Skye 2 nights, Mull 1 night, Edinburgh 3 nights

This is a choice of Loch Ness/Inverness versus Skye in the end - travelling as a family with young teens - the best accommodations for us are in Loch Ness/Inverness but we keep hearing wonderful things about Skye and how it is one of the nicest places in the country.

Which makes the best addition to a once in a lifetime trip to Scotland with 10 nights open? Skye or Loch Ness? And which itinerary looks the best (and why)?

Thanks!

What time of year are you travelling? I ask because if it's this year, and in next few months you'll need to consider the Tattoo in Edinburgh will affect accommodation. Here's the Tattoo site for dates: www.edintattoo.co.uk/tickets

Skye is stunning and of course you want to see Loch Ness. I'm guessing you're travelling by car? Why not go for option 2: Glencoe 4, Skye 3, Edinburgh 3. You'll cover all the things you want to see and still have time to relax on Skye. Map out a direction of travel and you'll find that other spots like Pitlochry, Aviemore, Oban, Loch Lomond, Falkirk (for the wheel) and Stirling will all show up on the routes to take.

OK -- what sorts of things are you doing. Are you into very serious hiking/climbing? If not you would need more than one day (or partial day) in Glencoe.

Inverness is not a place to stay over. There is a TON of things to do in the general area, but not IN Inverness. 2 to 4 days for the general area if you want to visit a distillery, Ft George, Cawdor Castle, Culloden, the dolphins in the Moray Firth, Urquhart Castle, etc. Loch Ness itself won't knock your socks off - but most people just 'must' see it so drive along it, visit Urquhart Castle and get out of Dodge. Compared to other lochs, it really is pretty run-of-the-mill .

It sort of looks like you made lists w/o knowing what there is to see/do in the various places.

Well, on our trip last year we stayed in Callendar, Skye and Loch Ness and passed through Glencoe.

Have a look:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...rip-report.cfm

I would have liked a little more time in Glencoe but not 3-4 days (and not at the expense of anything else we did, especially Skye).

We did Edinburgh on a previous trip:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...-with-kids.cfm

As janisj says, tell us a little more and we can help.

I can only address your question re: lodging and only in Edinburgh. We recently stayed here and we highly recommend it.

http://www.53frederickstreet.com

Inverness - bit of a dump really. Give it 30 mins. to buy groceries and head for the hills

Loch Ness - I would rate at about #1000 in the list of great Scottish lochs. Noting wrong with it - just ordinary in the context of Scotland.

Skye - astounding

Daylight - important to consider the time of year and how far north you are going. Daylight will range from about 7 hours a day to about 19 hours a day depending on these factors.

What do you plan to do in and around Glencoe? Numerous hikes?

Definitely Skye over Loch Ness/Inverness.

Sometimes you have to wonder if people ever read what they have written and try to figure out how they would answer a similar question about their own country.

What are your INTERESTS? Without knowing a bit about that, NO one can tell you if 4 days in Glencoe is too much or too little. The same applies to any other place you name.

I might spend all 10 days in Edinburgh and someone interested in hiking/climbing might spend all 10 in Glencoe. As asked your question is unanswerable.

All you can hope to get is what someone ELSE would do, not what YOU should do.

First time poster; cut them some slack.

tG_l, some personal views. First, if you're traveling with teens, can we assume this will be during the summer? Presumably this summer? If so, then the reason you're finding it easier to locate accommodations around Inverness is that it's simply not that attractive an area for the bulk of visitors. Loch Ness, as stated, is attractive enough, but compared to other lochs and inlets in the Scottish Highlands, it's pretty ordinary, legends and romantic notions aside. Inverness is a busy but not especially scenic town, somewhat overwhelmed with traffic.

Second, Edinburgh fills with visitors and doesn't empty until after the Edinburgh Festival (and attendant side festivals like the Fringe) at the end of August/first of September. Not a bad thing, but competition for space is intense and prices go up and stay there, so if you're mulling 2 vs. 3 vs. more nights, don't fiddle around - you may find your options get reduced as time passes.

The Glencoe vs. Skye options assume you'll have a car. Unless you're into climbing or long hikes, Glencoe itself won't have a lot to offer besides a bed after the first night. Oh, you can drive to some very scenic places within an hour or two of Glencoe, but that goes pretty much for anywhere in the Highlands. Skye, on the other hand, offers much more diversity in terms of scenery and culture - mountains, castles, the rugged west and north coasts, a smattering of true "Celtic Fringe" culture (spoken Gaelic here and there, for instance.) But again, while it's a big island, you might find yourselves getting itchy after 2 or 3 days.

We don’t know you, of course, but traveling with “young teens” presents its own challenges for many of us, specifically, what to do when the boredom factor sets in? Visiting the Scottish Highlands involves looking a lot at scenery – is that okay with your kids? (I know mine started zoning out right after the first majestic view down the glen.) Distillery tours aren’t going to be on the agenda, and unless they’re really interested in history, one or two battlefields or castles might do the trick.

Which is to say, the cities have a lot more in the way of distractions, things to do, etc., so if I were putting together a 10-day plan from scratch, I’d probably weigh it more heavily toward Edinburgh than to the Highlands, maybe 5/5.

For the Highlands bits, you could do a route like this - http://goo.gl/maps/4MCdA - stopping at Eileen Donan Castle near Dornie, then Skye, then returning via the ferry to Mallaig and the “Road to the Isles” back to Fort William and Glencoe, thence Edinburgh. This is a very scenic route with a good selection of sights and environments.

I’d also mention that there are a number of terrific day trips one can make from Edinburgh into the countryside – fishing villages in East Lothian or Fife, castles and ruined bits in the Borders, and so on. You could even do a (long, but feasible) day trip to Alnwick in Northumberland, if they’re Harry Potter fans (Alnwick Castle was used for numerous HP scenes.) So even if you’re spending more time in Edinburgh than you planned, you don’t have to spend it <i>in</i> Edinburgh.

Oops - My post should have said >>what sorts of things are you doing. Are you into very serious hiking/climbing? If not you would <u>not</u> need more than one day (or partial day) in Glencoe.<<

Thank you for advice, travel links, and for cutting us some slack on being new.
Gardyloo - thank you for your notes - and for considering the kids in your advice.

Travel in August, by car, 10 nights in Scotland
Tattoo tickets are in hand for last night in Scotland
Jacobite tickets are in hand for Glencoe portion (day trip - round)
No interest in distilleries, pubs, and tours
Scenery, mountains, coastal, castles, culture, wildlife
Activities - archery, clay pigeon (if allowed), mountain biking, market
Hiking - Ben Nevis, some hiking elsewhere - spectacular scenery/vista
Fishing if we are not rushed would be nice, fly fishing lesson would be perfect
Would be great to find a woollen mill or kilt maker
Strong interest in attending Highland Games - maybe Glenfinnan or Crieff

The kids will do maybe one good major hike and one or two minor hikes
They would love archery - interested in music and Scottish culture
Fans of James Bond (Mom is too) - kids like Skyfall especially

We will give Inverness and surrounding area a pass - no problem there
With exception of Loch Ness and the castle - but we must at least drive by to check it out.

1. Plan will be to enter Scotland via Glasgow - take A82 - see sights en route to Glencoe
2. Stay Glencoe, then move onto Skye, or Loch Ness area (for nicest lodging)
3. Consider working in a castle stay - one night (two if on Mull), in area during trip
4. Continue onto Edinburgh, taking in sights on route
5. Finish in Edinburgh with some sightseeing, the Tattoo
6. Leave Scotland - drive out to England along Hadrian's wall

One day in Glencoe will be used toward the Jacobite train.

There are bits in England at the beginning and end of this itinerary - already planned. The exception is a castle stay we had booked at Langley castle to sightsee along the wall. We will likely sacrifice this as staying there would reduce our time in Scotland to around 8 nights only.

Accommodations at the start and end of the trip are booked in Glencoe and Edinburgh with flexibility - it's the middle of the trip that is missing. Options available for the middle of the trip:

- very nice self-catering w/a full bed for everyone near Loch Ness with castle & activities nearby
- self-catering on Skye - two singles, a double - bedrooms not the best but nice, near Edible
- self-catering on Skye - near Staffin, or near Elgol, but not as nice overall as above
- inn on Skye near Sleat area - older room first two nights/switch to nicer room last two, cots
- possible 1-2 nights Glengorme castle (Mull) or Inverlochy 1 night as long as not too rushed

Our preference is to change accommodations less frequently, but if these castles are really worth the trouble and time for a night, we would visit them.

For Inverlochy castle, we could possible pay a visit by having lunch there or tea (or picnic)? Perhaps on the same days as our ride on the Jacobite which is mid-afternoon.

Isle of Eriska has availability but we are not sure what the attraction there would be (seems more for adults - spa, relaxation, more modern rooms, etc.).

Intinerary:

Glencoe - 3 to 4 night stay
Skye or Loch Ness area - 3 to 4 night stay
Edinburgh - 2 to 3 night stay

We could do 5 nights Skye or Loch Ness in self-catering but this would leave 3 Glencoe and only 2 in Edinburgh - plus 5 may be too much if the accommodation (and location) are not right.

With the castles it might be:

Glencoe - 4 nights very nice accommodations
Skye - hotel for 2 nights, older room
Mull - castle room for 1 night
Edinburgh - 3 nights

Glencoe - 4 nights again
Skye - 3 nights
Inverlochy - 1 night
Edinburgh - 2 nights

Glencoe - 4 nights
Skye - 2 nights
Mull - castle room 2 night
Inverlochy - castle room 2 night
Edinburgh - 2 nights

We would like to visit the following en route to Edinburgh from our "middle" stay:

- see Pitolchry
- stop at Wallace Monument and visit Antonine Wall
- visit Stirling for Falkirk Wheel, Castle and Bowness Motor Museum
- check out the Forth Rail Bridge

Indy-Dad - will visit your travel urls with interest (thank you). Also, checked Frederick Street and it is nice, but full (thank you for the recommendation). Looking at Nira Caledonia or Caledonia for Edinburgh (have space at both) - anyone familiar with these?

You can probably see why my first post was brief and general - hopefully the details here are helpful. Further replies would be great, and BTW, 10 nights in a city would kill us - we are already at 8 nights total for London ironically - fun in the city is good, but nature rules.

Just time for a quick comment- getting ready for the NBA draft. . . .

All that detail would have been helpful up front. The thread probably would have taken a different direction. You may have trouble finding Edinburgh accommodations this late date. Some of the nice places book up 6 months to a year in advance for festival/Tattoo time.

No problem - just didn't want to overload anyone, but since others asked for detail...

If you read through the post above you will see that we (thankfully) have accommodations for Edinburgh in hand. You are right - I don't think we would find anything there at this time.

Ah, so Glencoe is locked down.

I've not done Ben Nevis, but friends have. It seemed more of a slog than others. I interpreted that as not good effort/view ratio! Here's their post.

http://schetzelsintheuk.wordpress.co...and-adventure/

I'll reiterate, do check out the Walking Highlands site for very good info on walks around Glencoe.

http://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/

We really liked the Ben A'An walk we did but that's >1 hr from Glencoe. Probably closer to 2 hrs. I'm sure you can find something closer with some research.

http://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/lochlomond/ben-aan.shtml

I did like Urquhart Castle on Loch Ness but you could do that on your way back. Definitely do Skye instead of Loch Ness for your base.

I'm deducing that the type of accommodation is important. If possible, I'd focus on location more in Skye (if possible at this date). I'm biased but I wanted to be near the Trotternish Peninsula so Portree was a better fit for us.

Sligachan is often mentioned for a good central location.

Be aware that Skye is enormous, and things take awhile to get to. For example, we stayed at a great B&B by Neist Point, and went on a morning wildlife boat trip out of Elgol (which was awesome, and I bet your kids would love it!), which is all on the island, but it's 63 miles and 2 hours apart. We thought we might make it to another activity that day, but we couldn't really. This meant that we basically did one "thing" a day: one hike, or one boat trip, or one scenic drive, etc. We did manage to get two hikes in on one day (the Quairing and Old Man of Storr), but one was a very abbreviated jaunt.

It seems like you have a lot you want to see in the "middle" area... you should consider spending a night in the area. We stayed in Pitlochry and got an early start (8am) towards Edinburgh visiting Doune Castle, Stirling Castle, and the Wallace Monument on the way and didn't get into town until 7:30 at night. Towards the end, we definitely suffered from exhaustion and were dragging ourselves between scenery and artifacts. Since you have even more sites in the area, that's something to consider.

More time in Edinburgh is better than less time. Yes, it's a city, but it's awesome.

A gem of a comment Katiehab.

"Be aware that Skye is enormous"

I remember a cousin of mine (Scottish) telling me about a 3 week holiday with a motorhome she and her husband took around Scotland. During the conversation she told me that they 'had covered 900 miles in 3 weeks'. This as if it was a huge distance.

To them it was, since they rarely went more than 30 miles from home. Clearly a 63 mile drive in 2 hours is a meaningful journey to you Katie. While driving any distance is slower in Scotland due to the smaller/narrower and winding roads than in other countries perhaps, nevertheless, many people would not consider a 2 hour drive or 63 miles as being a meaningful distance. Compare it to people on a road trip in the USA who routinely expect to cover 5-800 miles in a day.

I'm not not 'having a go' Katie. I actually find it interesting how distances are seen differently in different places. Skye is a small island. The whole of Britain is only the 9th largest island. Skye is somewhere down around the 250th island by size. Hardly 'enormous'.

Everything is relative. I remember the school mums lining up to pick up their kids outside a small village school near where I lived at one time. All ten cars meant a 'traffic jam' every day there.

>>I'm not not 'having a go' Katie. <<

Sure you are - you have a go at folks in just about EVERY post. Do you always have to be so overbearing/condescending?

Skye IS large and seems larger since most roads are single track and slow.

The driving in the USA or OZ cannot be compared to anything in the UK.

It would appear to me that YOU are the one 'having a go' janisj.

You have no way of knowing what my intent is regarding something I write. I specifically wrote I am not 'having a go' in order to make my intent clear.

I find it interesting that someone considers Skye 'enormous', it's as simple as that. As I wrote, the differences in people's perceptions is always interesting.

I have been on Skye several times. I do not consider it large at all and certainly not enormous. Perceptions differ, that was my whole point. It makes the use of the adjective by katie, a gem for me as I said. A gem is a good thing, not a negative.

It added an interesting point of view to an otherwise mundane subject of 'how many days should I spend in X' thread.

OK - You have attacked people for posting 'mind numbing' trip reports, and think normal questions are just soooo very 'mundane'. Ok we get it - maybe you are just too sophisticated for Fodors . . .

The comment about staying somewhere en route to accomplish this is a good one - I appreciate the consideration as we don't want to give up seeing something the magnitude of Stirling Castle because we had to blitz through such a fantastic country.

If we go straight from Skye to Edinburgh, we will be trying to sightsee on route. Travelling with kids means there is no way we will be up at 5 or 6 am to start our drive. There are a few things we are contemplating for 10 nights to take the "rush" out of travelling.

- stay South end of Skye to cut down on travel and bring us closer to the ferry terminal
- skip Skye and move from Glencoe to Edinburgh (less rushed)
- make our base in Loch Ness (only because available accommodations are so nice)
- as an alternate, make our base in the Perthshire hills (again - accommodation very nice)

Our options would be non-existant if we had found the lodgings we were looking for on Skye. We have a few options on Skye - one hotel-style with cots/travel beds, two cottages - they are just not as nice as the options at Loch Ness and the Perthshire area as Skye is in high demand.

If we made our base in self-catering, Perthshire, the trip would take a different form:

- stay Glencoe 3/4 nights
- skip Skye and Islands - travel to Perth (could stay 3/4/5 nights in self-catering)
- from Perth to Edinburgh for 2/3 nights

If centred in Perth, we would check out:

- Highland Game dates in area
- see Pitolchry, visit Antonine Wall, stop at Wallace Monument
- visit Stirling for Falkirk Wheel, Castle and Bowness Motor Museum
- possibly castle route drive that includes "haunted" Glamis and other must-sees in the area
- check out river boats, lunch, and Forth Rail Bridge en route to Edinburgh

As noted, we are staying in Glencoe to start no matter what we do (3 or 4 nights). Edinburgh at the end (2 or 3 nights). There is still the option of taking one night in Fort William en route to Edinburgh to make things less rushed, but this would only allow us an earlier rather than a later start heading to the city. Otherwise, we would be here to enjoy the castle primarily.

Available accommodations are important - we like to have somewhere comfortable to hang out as a family at the end of each day (and in the mornings) plus if the weather is brutal, it is nice to have somewhere good to stay - we might spend a fair bit of time indoors.

As for Pitolchry - very popular (and a great suggestion as it looks wonderful) but it is very booked up unfortunately. Your plan would have worked well Katie. Indie_Dad - thank you for responding - will for sure visit walkhighlands and check out post on the slog up to Ben Nevis.

Just to put my Skye comments in perspective, I am from Maine, and originally from California. I have done the cross-the-US trip 6 times: twice in a car, four times in an RV. It used to take me an hour to get to work in LA every morning, and my house was 8 miles from my office. I agree that compared to that, Skye is not enormous, nor is it heavily populated, nor is it full of traffic. However, a four hour roundtrip to go what would look like not much distance on a map, is worth mentioning. It's less the "as the crow flies" distance, and more of the "everything is up one peninsula and down another" distance. Being a resident of Maine, which is in a similar situation, I should have known better I suppose, but I didn't really think of an island having peninsulas. I mention it here because the general "ahhh yes. It takes a long time" reaction we got to our surprise from the residents of Skye leads me to believe it is a common misconception.

travelGEEK: I loved Skye very very much, and we had a wonderful time and saw lots of beautiful things, including interesting wildlife, BUT we also loved Stirling and the Trossachs, and Blair Castle, and THOSE areas were very beautiful and had interesting wildlife. The best thing we did for ourselves was to not move around every single night... and that was traveling without children! I'm SURE whatever places you decide to stay, that you are going to have a wonderful time and see great things. Whatever you don't get to, you can see next time! ;)

Katiehab: No need to justify yourself. You aren't the first one Improvisor has patted on the head >><i>There, there little girl. That is sweet but you really need to get out more.</i><<

<i>Most</i> of us understood exactly what you meant ;)

travelGEEK_live: Don't stay in Ft William. It is a dump. Plus you will have already spent a few days in the area. If you want a break/stop over - look at near Callander or maybe Killin.

Callander is a great base for the Trossachs, Inchmahome, Stirling, Doune, Loch Lomomd, rivers/lochs/hikes, etc.

"I mention it here because the general "ahhh yes. It takes a long time" reaction we got to our surprise from the residents of Skye leads me to believe it is a common misconception."

Yes, that was my point katie, it is considered a long drive and an enormous island. Perception is everything.

Janisj, get over yourself. No doubt I am probably too sophisticated for Fodors, so what. Have you never heard of 'slumming'?

Here's a great bargain hotel in the Pitlochry area(Blair Atholl) to try in the spring or fall. They do special 5 nights for the price of 3 every year. http://www.athollarmshotel.co.uk/spe...s/seasonal.htm
Works out at 25 GBP per person per night. A bargain indeed. It's a true highland hotel, even Queen Victoria stopped her for tea back in the day and right across the road is the Duke of Atholl's castle. Did anyone know he has the right by royal degree to maintain a standing army. The only private standing army in the UK I believe.

It's about 20 minutes north of Pitlochry and there are great hiking trails along the river between the two or from Blair Atholl up Glen Tilt to Braemar if you're really ambitious. It's 28 miles, done it a few times.

Of course there is little point in going to the Pitlochry area if you do not spend enough time to visit the Pitlochry Festival Theatre. One of the finest small theatres I've encountered anywhere in the world.

For a meal I recommend Fern Cottage. The owner/chef Rifat is from Turkey while his wife Karen is Pitlochry born and bred. The menu is truly mediterranean thanks to Rifat.

For a stay in Pitlochry itself I suggest the Craigatin House. It has one of the best breakfasts in Scotland in my opinon. For starters, they know what brown/wheat bread is and not all eggs come hard.

At the Atholl Arms (linked above) I once asked for brown toast for breakfast and the young girl answered, 'all toast is brown'. Umm, Canadians say brown bread while Americans generally say wheat bread but I don't think anyone calls white bread toasted, brown toast.

Besides knowing how to cook an egg over easy they also serve apple pancakes with bacon and maple syrup. That must be a one of in Scotland, it's the only one I've ever found. Makes choosing bacon and eggs vs. pancakes a really hard choice.

A stop in Kilin can be fun for a family as you can rent canoes at the north end of the village. They call them 'Canadian' canoes but don't let that fool you they're Old Town canoes which of course Katie can probably tell everyone are from Maine her current home state.

You can do a nice little paddle down the river into Loch Tay. A couple of little islands in the mouth of the river make a nice picnic lunch spot. Don't forget to take your Swiss Army Knife to open the wine.

Callandar is a kitsch tourist town full of low quality hillwalking(hiking) clothes stores and tourist gee gaws. The exception is CCW (Caledonian Country Wear) which sells quality waking gear and has a cute little cafeteria upstairs which would be good for kids.

Another really nice spot to visit is Ballater which is on the Royal Deeside. Interesting to see a bakery among other shops displaying royal warrants. Ballater is known for its royal connections.

The place to stay there of course is the one and only world's smallest Hilton hotel, The Craigendarroch. The hotel is nothing special but it does convey bragging rights to having stayed in the smallest Hilton and as if that wasn't enough it also has the tallest living Xmas tree in the UK right outside the front door. It is a redwood that was planted by the original owner of the house I belive. The guy who invented marmalade.

improvisor - you have posted on about 20 threads in the week you've been registered here - and have attacked/slammed/scorned/mocked other posters on at least half of them. So are you here because you've been kicked off all those other forums you prefer?

The old saying is that 100 miles is a long distance for a Briton and 100 years is a long time for an American.

Tastes do differ. I've been to the Edinburgh Festival several times for opera, concerts and plays. I haven't been to a single Fringe event and would need a general anaesthetic to attend the Tattoo. My Scottish husband is exactly the same.

Anyway, to return to the OP.
Loch Ness and Ben Nevis have good publicity agents,as does Glencoe but I personally would go somewhere like Torridan http://www.visittorridon.co.uk/
you've got beautiful lochs, wildlife and mountains that are not the equivalent of the M1. Skye is not far. You might even see a golden eagle.
The only downside in August would be the midgies. You will certainly need insect repellent. Oddly enough, Skin so Soft from Avon works for many people.

Janisj, look in a mirror. You have posted on just about every thread I have replied to, to attack me.

I respond to threads as I see fit and leave it to the moderators to tell me if I am contravening some forum rule. I don't belive I have done so on any thread. Why don't you let the moderators do their job and not contravene their rules by making personal attacks on me?

I like that saying MissPrism, I've never heard it before. It makes the differences quite clear in a few words.

Skin so Soft is an interesting story. For decades, hikers/backpackers in N. America have used it for a mosquito repellant. Avon were very slow on the uptake as they never seemed to have figured out why it continued to be one of their best selling products for years. Finally, they caught on and guess what. They started selling Avon Mosquito Repellant (skin so soft). A bottle about 1/5th the size and 5 times the price of Skin so Soft. ;-)

Some more restaurant suggestions:

In Ediburgh if you get a hankering for a burger and fries the best I ever found was at Browns on George Street. For seafood, Fishers on Thistle Street. The ultimate for dinner in Edinburgh is of course The Witchery and it's also perhaps the ultimate as a place to stay the night.

The best fish and chips in all of the UK is to be found in Anstruther Fish Bar on the Fife coast. You'll find it easily, it's the place with the lineup outside every single day.

They won the UK's best award so many times they finally ask the judges to stop awarding it to them and let someone else have a chance. The original owners sold up about 10 years ago and the new owners spent a year in training before letting the old owners go. What did the old owners do with their million pounds they sold for? Retired to Spain where you guessed it, they opened a fish and chip shop.

On Skye the best place to stay and eat is the Kinloch Lodge. The restaurant is Michelin starred.

Finding a good steak anywhere in Europe can be a real challenge. The Balbirnie in Fife meets the challenge. You can also take a stroll in the grounds after to walk off the calories. Especially when the rhododendroms are in bloom which happens to be all year as different varies that bloom in different seasons were purposely planted to achieve that. I have visited in every month but have no reason to disbelieve them. No wonder it has won Scottish Wedding Hotel of the year in 7 out of the last 9 years.

No edit function on this forum huh?

Should be rhodo varieties not varies and should be I have not visited in every month, not have visited.

Have done some homework as Gardyloo's map presented another option. Part of our problem was getting to Skye and the Highlands while still having time to visit Stirling, Wallace Monument, Bo'Ness Motor Museum and Falkirk wheel. At first, we were starting in Glasgow, seeing the highlands and Skye, then going to to Edinburgh for this first Scotland trip. The long drive from Skye to Edinburgh along this route would leave little time for sightseeing, e.g. Stirling, etc.

Option 1 ("Gardyloo" Option):

Fly into Edinburgh Airport by 10:30 am - pick up car, start there. Stop off at the Falkirk Wheel, and Bo'Ness Museum, onto the Wallace Monument and then walk through Stirling Castle. Drive to Loch Lomond before checking into the Highlands. Visit Skye, and then see Eilean Donan, Loch Ness and then through Pitolchry, and over the Forth Bridge into Edinburgh.

Option 2 ("Perthshire" Option):

Fly into Glasgow Airport - pick up car, stop at Loch Lomond and drive onto our stay in the Highlands. Skip Skye, but visit Eilean Donan and Loch Ness (and maybe Fort Augustus) en route to nice cottage in the Perthshire Hills countryside. From there, visit Wallace Monument, Stirling, plus do a castle loop that includes Glamis, and check out some of the area's highland games. On route to Edinburgh, check out the Bo'Ness museum and Falkirk wheel, Forth Rail Bridge (?)

Option 3 ("Castle" Option):

Fly into Edinburgh airport, take "Gardyloo" plan to Loch Lomonde but then continue up the A82 and stay first night in Inverlochy Castle with activities on site. Next day check into Glencoe for the rest of our Highlands stay. From there, continue on either to Skye (Option 1) or Perthshire (2) for a stay, and then check into Edinburgh. On leaving Edinburgh, travel along Hadrian's Wall to Hexham and stay on the other side of the wall in an English castle for one night.

We were trying to arrange a castle option when we started planning this trip - even a stay for one night in a castle would be a huge deal. But we had trouble finding dates that would line up with the rest of our plans. If there are not too many stops on Itinerary 3, it might work. Adding one night overall to the itinerary (so 11 nights, not 10) would enable us to do this.

- Which is better? Starting Glasgow/ending Edinburgh or starting/ending Edinburgh?
- Which itinerary of these three works best and why?
- Which itinerary would you chose as part of your first ever (and possibly only) trip to Scotland?
- What do you think of the option of staying in Perthshire versus visiting Skye?
- Would it make more sense to go 3 Glencoe/4 Skye (or Perthshire) or 4 Glencoe/3 at the other?
- Doing the castles would mean dropping Edinburgh to two nights - any comments here?
- Any last comments on staying at a Lodge like Kinloch in Skye or a cottage in the North?

Would you spend a 3rd night Edinburgh at the expense of a castle stay or 4th night Skye?

We are concerned about the cottage on Skye as it is near a roadway - we cannot tell if not traffic is an issue on the north end of the island (for all we know, the lodges we have looked at might be just as close to the road). The road looks to be the A850 - will noise or privacy be concerns?

I'm not as savvy as some of you - I've made up itineraries on Google maps but how do I include them here for you? If you let me know I could post them here.

Once in Edinburgh, we are hoping to take in the Beginning of Time exhibit/museum, Camera Obscura, Edinburgh castle (canon sounding) and crown jewels, Elephant House (for lunch), Arthur's Seat, if time, Holyrood (is it worth it - there is some speculation...). Also writer's museum, and a few small shops. Evenings will mostly be a write-off. This is a lot so we realize we may have to pare the list down - any ideas for the must sees?

Travelgeek, are you arriving in Scotland after a long overnight flight? If so, jumping into a rental car is for anything but a very short drive is not advised. You'll be sleepy and jet-lagged. Spend some time in your arrival city.

On Skye, I wouldn't worry about noisy traffic at night on the road outside your cottage. The roads are very quiet, especially on the north end.

Re: Google maps. You can make the maps public and post their links. But I don't think that's necessary.

>>We are concerned about the cottage on Skye as it is near a roadway - we cannot tell if not traffic is an issue on the north end of the island (for all we know, the lodges we have looked at might be just as close to the road). The road looks to be the A850 - will noise or privacy be concerns?<<

Uh - No. You will laugh about having asked this once you have been there . . .

Okay - thank you for the note - good to know the roads are quiet.

Also thought - another option would be to take only two nights on Skye (this would give us 3 Glencoe, 2 Skye (but on the north end in a Lodge/Inn), then a Scotland castle night for 1 night, 3 nights in Edinburgh, and 1 night in a castle on the other side of the wall.

So many ways of doing this - we're a bit lost as to the best way to spend our time.

Anyone had a chance to think about the itineraries posted?

Is anyone able to comment on the itineraries or help with the questions noted?

Again, any reply would be great as we are booking transportation right away.

Adding the castle ets us moving around more in terms of overnighting, but we have never stayed in a castle - we are looking at Langley and Inverlochy so it would be good to know if they would be worth giving up a night or two somewhere else, like Skye, Glencoe, or Edinburgh.

Hey Mimar - BTW, we would already be in the UK but would just have to get up early to fly down to Edinburgh (or Glasgow). Good thinking though - it would never work after an overseas flight.

IMO - you need more rather than less time on Skye. It is a large island w/ slow (sometimes VERY slow) roads. It takes time just getting from place to place let alone all the fabulous walks/hikes/sites. You really don't have time to add to Skye - but I certainly wouldn't cut it any . . .

As for your new itinerary options . . .

#2 isn't great (bad actually) in that you are including Eilean Donan and Loch Ness but omitting Skye. Eilean Donan is merely a very pretty photo stop. The castle is not worth paying to go inside. And Loch Ness is about the 50th most attractive loch in all of Scotland (if that high)

#1 is OK - but just so you know one doesn't just 'walk through' Stirling Castle. It is a 2.5-3 hour stop.

#3 is pretty similar to #1 except you are now including northern England, which a whole different topic.

I have a hard time getting through all the other 'stuff' since you seem to be throwing lots of ideas against a wall and seeing what sticks. Don't over think so much.

One thing - in ANY case, you don't want to be driving immediately after getting off an overnight flight. So if you are flying in long haul you'll really want at least a day to decompress/recover from jet lag before heading out. That would most likely mean front loading Edinburgh (or Glasgow) and do it at the beginning car-less.

Thank you for replying janis -about overseas flights- we'll be in England a full week to start.

Originally, it was 16 nights England total/10 Scotland:

-5 nights London
-6 in Wiltshire
-to Scotland early am after check-out
-2 nights Lakes nights
- London for 3 nights before the trip home

So we have some "padding" on both ends of the trip to Scotland.

What we are thinking of doing now is trimming London to 4 nights at the beginning since we are going back at the end. By trimming a night there, we could add a night to our time in Scotland.

So this would give us 15 nights England, 11 nights Scotland (14 days/10 days). Comments?

We would arrive in Scotland a day earlier than planned - this is where the castle comes in, as the castle in the Highlands is open on that particular night (for now) so this would afford us a castle stay. Our existing lodgings are full that night so going straight there to begin the Scotland trip would not work (had we been able to do this, the extra night could have been added to Skye, or to Edinburgh, later on in the trip). Does this make sense? Tough to explain.

We are including N. England in our plans either way - when we leave Edinburgh, we will drive along the area of Hadrian's Wall so we can sightsee on the way to the Lakes - we hope to stop off at Vindolanda, Housesteads, and a few other places along the way - we will go through Carlisle, take our rest stop at the Lakes, then head to London to finish.

Another three nights would be great (add one to Skye, one to Edinburgh, and take the castle stay in Hexham for a night so we are not so rushed passing along Hadrian's Wall country) but the last part of the trip cannot be adjusted. Hope this adds some helpful info.

Any other comments? Knowing the area already, how would you stack the itinerary to create the best experience for a new traveller to the country seeing it for the first (and perhaps only) time? Also, any other responses to the questions in our post above?

Pressing questions right now are:

- do we add the extra night in Scotland at the expense of an extra night in London or Wiltshire? - do we start our Scotland trip in Glasgow and try to catch Stirling and nearby sites later?
- or do we start in Edinburgh, try to see Stirling and the sites listed above at the start?
- do we chose Skye or Perthshire countryside for our time in the middle
- how many nights each stop?

Good thing you replied janis - Eilean Donan sounds like the "end all" from what I have read, and a couple of the books I have read placed Loch Ness in Scotland's top 10 must-see experiences : )

Based on your recommendation, if we skip Skye completely, and use Perthshire to access Stirling and see some Highland Games, we would take a pass on Eilean Donan and make up for it by stopping at the castle on the shores of Loch Ness when passing by.

Another option exists, but I am not sure it is wise to give up the chance to visit Skye based on what we've heard, especially if we may never return, but here goes: Glencoe 3-4 night, Edinburgh 3-4 nights, with 1-2 castle visits at the beginning or middle, and 1 at the end.

>>Based on your recommendation, if we skip Skye completely, and use Perthshire to access Stirling and see some Highland Games, we would take a pass on Eilean Donan <<

Ok. I'm getting really confused here. (:| Where did I recommend skipping Skye? Eilean Donan is a very nice photo op - but going there or no has no bearing at all on whether one visits Skye.

Only you can decide if you'd rather go to Skye or not. It is fantastic - as are many other parts of Scotland.

Bookmarking. . .

Travel geek this is all very confusing, It seems you're getting bogged down in the minutiae but what's the bigger picture?

Tells us what's fixed and can't be changed, and the ONE itinerary YOU want to do so can get feedback on the practicalities of that. At the moment you're not getting the best response because its not clear what you want.

Oops - sorry about that Janis - poorly worded on my part.

I was referring to travelling to Eilean Donan without moving further on to explore Skye. What I should have said was that going all that way to see ED without carrying onto Skye may not be the best idea for us, so if we skipped Skye, we would skip ED as well - working today (Sunday) and a bit rushed so posts are not so clear.

Bookmarking...Enzian - I am not sure what this is about. Can anyone elaborate?

Sofarsogood - The ONE itinerary we would like has too many days - this is what makes it difficult. We fell into this trips looking at the travel books that suggested we could cover everything we are looking at in 7 nights/1week. The more we learned on our own, the more we appreciated that it would be crazy to try and do that.

Sofarsogood - thank you for the feedback - I will try to be more clear - have to finish work and rush off to a wedding so hope to reply again shortly.

>>Bookmarking...<<

Bookmarking is enzian's way to find the thread again.