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- - Rules of Italy (https://www.fodors.com/community/europe/rules-of-italy-495490/)

This was in a previous post entitled "Rookie Mistakes: Italy".
"Message: Would someone start a thread about rules of Italy, either formal or imformal. I didn't know you shouldn't touch the produce. I didn't know not to look through a stack of sweaters."

I will be in Italy in a few months and also didn't know about these rules. So I am doing as areinert asked in that post and starting a new thread asking for the rules of Italy.

Many grocery stores in Italy have a container with plastic gloves to wear when you pick up vegetables , fruits etc..,

Rule number 2. Sales people frown upon you if you mess around with the merchandises..
They will give you a look that kill:)

When you order a cappuccino or an expresso at the bar/coffee, you must first always pay first for it , then you bring the ticket to the barman, unless of course, you want to sit at a table, then the waiter will take your order.
It will cost you more for the luxury of being served.

Speaking of cappucino and espresso, never order "a latte" unless you like a glass of hot milk. "cafe latte" if you want espresso in it.

A basic one. When you want the bill at the end of a meal ask for it. Hints like, "that was wonderful" or "we're finished" won't get you the bill. You'll still be sitting there as they stack the tables and chairs if you don't ask for it.

I've never seen the plastic gloves, but I'm more used to the idea that you point and they'll pick it up for you.

Yes, the produce. You put on the plastic glove first before touching the produce.

When ordering, if you want to sit at a table you sit. The waiter will take your order. If you just want a cup of espresso or whatever and just want to stand while you have your drink you pay the cashier and take the ticket to the barman as Kismetchimera said. Note: You will pay more to sit at a table so do not think you are getting "ripped off" because you paid more for your drink while sitting at the table then the Italian paid who stood at the counter and had his drink. A commmon tourist mistake.

When going into a shop always approach the salesperson. Let them handle the merchandise unless they indicate you may.

Also, returns on merchandise is not going to happen in Italy as it does in the US. You buy it, it is yours. No going back to the hotel to try the sweater on and deciding you do not like it and so will return it. You are stuck with it.

When you sit down it is considered rude to have your feet in such a manner that the sole of your shoes can be seen by those sitting across from you. I notice that Oprah sits in such a way on her TV show. Considered rude in Italy.

Do not reach across people to shake hands with someone.

Do not use the word "ciao" to people unless they are family or close friends.

Italians (especially in the north) are more formal.

Most (not all) but lets say some hotels want you to turn your hotel room key into the desk anytime you leave the hotel. Then you retrive it when you return to the hotel.

Tipping is not like in the US. Use the search box on Fodors to read a lot of threads and post on this.

When you are dining, or even having a drink (at a table) the waiter will not bring you the check. They consider that rude. You are not being ignored. You ask for the check when you are ready to pay and leave the premises. The table is yours as long as you want. No rushing you out as in the US.

If you travel by train be sure to validate your train ticket at the little yellow box in the train station before getting on the train.

When writing a figure out such as $10.00 you will write $10,00.

The Italians use the comma where we use the period and visaversa (not with their language but with the math).

Will you be driving a rental car? If so keep in mind that the far left lane (if there is one) is for passing. It is not for constantly driving in. And if you do drive and a driver comes up behind you blinking his headlights it means he wants you to pull over to the slower lane so he can pass.

Getting drunk is not considered the thing to do in Italy. I do not mean to infere it is considered the thing to do in any country but I have seen so many tourist (especially younger ones in groups) drunk, yelling as they go down the street etc. Not a good thing.

And just in case you smoke. All in door smoking and ceased in Italy as of January 10th of this year. And evidently they are serious about it. Still find that hard to believe but at first that is the way it seems to be.

Smoking outside and in private homes of course is permitted or if any restaurant/cafe etc. has a totally enclosed room with proper air ventallation.

Am sure you know the dress codes for the Vatican and the churces.

OK, there has to be more, LOL. Anyone else who can contribute???

Ktyson, don't be alarmed or overwhelmed. In my opinion, and I have been to Italy so many times since the 1970's Italians are warm, hospitable, and well mannered. And they basically really like Americans. Most of them have had family that at one time or another have immigrated to America.

I think when most tourist feel rebuffed is when they just don't use perhaps a bit more of a formal manner approac as we have here in the US. And of course beautiful Italy is use to tourist so nothing shocks or surprises them. But a gentle manner, consideration etc. will take you a long way in making your trip very enjoyable.

And in spite of many saying "they don't speak English" don't kid yourself. They do understand enough to know when tourist are making unpleasant remarks about their country, food, service, shop, etc. Best to do the complaining in the privacy of your hotel room.

My husband and I had a code word if we were shopping and one decided the item wasn't of good quality or overpriced etc. We merely said to the other one quietly of course "KMart".

And do ask your hotel for suggestions, ideas, help, info etc. Most Italians are so proud of their country and really want you to have a wonderful trip. Don't forget, a big industry in Italy is tourism.

I am sure many others will post here.

Just go and have a beautiful and wonderful time. I still think the first trip to Italy is the most exciting of all! ((*))

There are at least two threads on this topic. Maybe we can find them.

The produce and the plastic gloves. This will be in shops and supermarkets. At the farmers market yes just point and the clerk will bag whatever you want like Patrick said. Sorry I did not explain that correctly. Unless you rent an apartment you probably won't ever be buying produce in a store.

cmt - two threads? Sometimes in this past 30 minutes Fordors has been acting up a bit. Nothing serious.

Do you know the title of the other thread? Or do you mean that ktyson posted the same thread twice? Take care.

On the subject of coffee ... Italians never order a cappuccino after about 11 am. Since so many tourists do ask for them in the afternoon or evening, they will serve you, but you will be considered a clueless tourist who doesn't know the Italian rules of coffee drinking. Espresso only for afternoon and evening is the Italian way.

Also, the way others have described that you pay for coffee is also often true in gelaterias -- you pay first for the size you want and then take the check to get your gelato.

LoveItaly: There were at least two or three threads, maybe more, that were mainly about Italian etiquette and customs that a tourist might or might not want to follow. I think they started out as something other than etiquette threads but they became that. They were not really recent, but not ancient either. They may be from 2004, and maybe were active during the spring or summer. They may have started out as threads on drinking tap water vs. bottle water and about whether one must drink wine, but they eneded up being about many other things. I wish I could remember the titles. This search function is so bad that even if I remember some key words, I will not necessarily turn up the threads.

cmt, I came onto Fodors early 2004 and I do remember what you are talking about but sure do not remember the thread. Bet it started out as one discussion and than vaulted into Italian life styles etc. Sure cannot think of what thread that was.

I would imagine there are a whole lot of other "rules" that we here in America do not know about in Italy no matter how much we think we do. Unless we are from Italy.

My SIL was born and raised in Italy. Sometimes I question him about this very subject but he is such a gentleman that he doesn't really answer my questions to much. He just says "oh, you know how to be in Italy mama". Dolce!

A funny thing I have noticed is that I have a lot of friends that are ethnic Italians born and raised here in California. They have less concern it seems to me about how to act in Italy than the posters here on Fodors. I think this is why I enjoy the posters on Fodors, they want to do the polite thing as well as getting the most enjoyment they can out of their vacation.

LoveItaly: I've been pondering some etiquette issues lately. (Yes, too much time on my hands this week, but it won't last.) I do think sometimes people get far too concerned about little niceties or about embarrassing themselves by failing to follow the local custom re something like the procedure for ordering meals or the usage of utensils. Yet, do the same people sometimes fail to show concern for the really big things that are a matter of basic decency and kindness, and not just little technical social customs? Example of what I consider a big thing: doing something, anything, when a friend or co-worker or neighbor has a death in the family. Doing nothing, to me, is unforgivable, and not just a little breach of etiquette. Yet I have a feeling sometimes that the people who fret over committing a little faux pas that might earn a dirty look from a waiter might sometimes be the ones who neglect to act with very basic, and traditional, kindness and decency in these more important situations.

(What brought this on?)

You know, I'd always heard that rule about cappucino being for mornings only. Well, two weeks ago I was visiting an Italian friend in Torino and we went to a caffe in the afternoon. Guess what he ordered? Yep, a cappucino. So, I mentioned the "rule" and he said 1) People do mostly drink cappucino in the morning, but he'd never learned that there was some kind of rigid rule about it; and 2) He didn't really care, because he wanted a cappucino. Maybe there's a lesson in there, somewhere.

Are there similar etiquette or customs regarding tea or chocolate? Any such thing as herbal (no caffeine) tea, or would I be considered just completely bizarre for asking?

Hello!

Don't forget - don't ask for parmesan to be sprinkled on anything involving seafood....they won't do it (no matter how much you beg) :)

Melodie

cmt, your post is quite interesting to me because I have often thought the same thing.

I responded to ktyson question of course because ktyson sincerely wanted to know. And as you know each country has their customs that may differ from another area or country.

But in answer to your question. I am not sure it is etiquette but it is human empathy and kindness you are referring to. And I think that transcends all cultrual differences.

For example, when I lost my DH, a week later after the family had gone home the cleaning service I had (four beautiful women from the Philippines) arrived at my door. With flowers, with a bottle of wine. And they insisted that I would go take a nap after they changed the bedding. And they would clean the house as a "gift" to me. And one of them went in and drew me a hot bubble bath. And then when I crawled into bed they all stood my my bed and said a prayer. And then gently and quietly cleaned my house and would not let me pay a penny. To this day this brings tears to my eyes.

I know have a neighbor who is a retired waitress. High school graduate buy not overly educated. Sometimes even has a hard time pronouncing words properly (not often but occassionally). She has the most beautiful three children (as a divorced mom she raised them on her own) and wonderful special grandchildren. This neighbor is like an angel. I got ill this spring, food poisoning or virus we will never know. She came over and took care of me until my daughter (who was not home when she got the call) came over and I was taken to emergency.

This dear neighbor brings me over homemade donuts, stew, etc. We share a pot of coffee and discuss our childhoods, our family etc. She is so full of love and care and yet smart as a whip in her own way.

Yes cmt you are in my opinion (and I do not feel humble about this opinion) are correct that some people are so worried about the little mistakes they may make and who they may annoy but at the same time do not think of the big picture.

I think, but maybe I did not do a proper job, that is what I was really trying to say about anyone travelling to another area.

Consideration, politness etc. is noticed by everyone.

And when people reach out to each other in time of need (or even when there is not a need but just out of care) how much better the world would be.

My dear, having a bit of time on ones hands is IMHO a good thing. I always need that from time to time and actually took it today as I had some stress this week.

Maybe part of the problem in our society
today is that none of us have enough "time on our hands". To think about the most important aspects of life as you obviously did today. We all need more quiet time, to reflect on the past, to learn from it and to hopefully make tomorrow better by our actions. Maybe in doing so we can inspire others to do so also? I don't know, but I sure hope so.

I sure wish you a beautiful weekend ((*))

When you purchase produce in a market you weigh it yourself in the produce section and then press a button showing what item it is and a slip of glued paper comes out which you stick on the bag. It states what the item is and the weight.

You bag your own groceries and pay a few cents for the bag.

If you order from a bar you cannot take your drink and sit at a table. If you are going to sit at a table you must order from that table.

In a bakery the same theory applies as at the bar, you choose, pay and then pick it up.

If you forget to stamp your bus ticket at the door you will get fined if the agent boards the bus and checks tickets. You will have to pay the fine on the spot.

I was interested in the comment about American ethnic Italians. I have been going to Italy for many years and the only two cases of real unpleasantness I've seen have involved people from that group. The first was a man who got very angry when a shop refused an obsolete banknote. He reduced the assistant to tears and was chased from the shop.
The other involved an elderly man who was having a dreadful row with officials on Lake Garda. He had bought the wrong ticket and insisted that they were ripping him off. We talked to his wife who was getting very upset. She said that he was originally from Naples and that people were refusing to understand his Italian. I think that his combination of American and southern Italian may not have been an advantage either.
What was rather amusing was the attitude to his wife. At one point the old boy stormed off the boat to check with officials on the shore. The men on the boat kept coming up to her, patting her shoulder and promising that her husband would return and that they wouldn't go without him. She, poor soul spoke no Italian so I had to translate.
When the silly old ??? finally returned, one of the boatmen pattered the wife on the shoulder and told her that she had his deepest sympathy. Nobody translated that bit;-)

>Are there similar etiquette or customs regarding tea or chocolate?

You may drink, coffee, tea, chocolate or whatever any time of day.

>Any such thing as herbal (no caffeine) tea, or would I be considered just completely bizarre for asking?<

We found decaffinated coffee (day cafay) at all coffee shops, but no decaff tea.

There were some places that served herbal tea.

Another "rule"; when you walk into a shop, etc say "Buon giorno" or "Buona sera" as appropriate.

Ira,

Your post reminded me that when you leave a shop, it's also considered polite to say, "Good-by", or "Arrividerci" (depending on the language you were using).