I was in Lecce in january - took a night train there from Rome - nice town but not a whole lot to do - really neat old town with wonderful architecture but nice little day trips like to the city near Bari with all those weird houses - can't think of name - but you can take a train from Bari there (a non Trenitalia train) - and Bari is a great shopping mecca for the region. Brindisi is surprisingly a very pleasant town and Taranto, well, the area around the train station is dismal and slummy but the old town sticking out into the sea is worth the trek

all easy train rides from Lecce

If you look up the transit time, the shortest trip from Lecce to Assisi is 9:35 with 2 changes. For me, that is just a miserable day.

It will take 3:30 to get from Assisi to Siena, and at least 4:30 hours to get from Siena to Venice.

If you really want to take the train, I would contemplace taking a direct (no changes) train to Bologna (7 1/2 hours), spend a 2 nights there, 2 nights in Verona, 3 nights Venice and go directly to Salzburg from there (or just spend 5 nights in Venice).

Both Assisi and Siena are on secondary train lines, so it makes getting to or leaving from either very time consuming.

PalenQ - I should be more specific. I am going to be in Otranto, I take the train to Lecce and then the school provides transportation for me from the station to my apartment in town.

The little town with the funny buildings is Alberobello - the buildings are called trulli. I plan to go for a day or so on the weekend while at the school.

If you were going to be headed to Asissi what direction would you go in and what town would you choose to spend the night in?

lovisa - thank you for the feedback again and the suggestions. I appreciate all your time on my trip :-).

I am planning on staying someplace between Lecce and Assisi... for one night. That in and of itself is a bit miserable.

I thought of renting a car in Lecce but am scared to drive alone with just dd and I. I thought I could keep it from Lecce to Venice and turn it in there...

I haven't been to either place, but if you want to train up the Adriatic Coast to Assisi, then I would think Pescara or Ancona would make the most logical stopping places.

I would not encourage you to rent a car. Driving in Italy can be pretty stressful because the driving style is extremely aggressive. Everybody tailgates. And when you get somewhere, it can be difficult to find a place to park. I think it would only add to your stress level.

I encourage you to read Bob the Navigator's notes on European Trip Planning on the Slow Travel site:
http://www.slowtrav.com/europe/bob_planning.htm

I love Bob's website and often read Slowtravel (yes, I know I am not exactly traveling slowly!)

I figured as much with the car and did not want to add stress. I really wanted to see those two towns though - Saint Francis of Assisi is intriguing to me. And having been (and loved) Florence I wanted to see Siena on this trip.

I was hoping after 14 plus days in one town we would be ready for a little more movement and then slow it down a bit with 3 nights in Salzburg, 4 in Munich and 3 in London.

Why Hotel Auersperg?

Because it is near yet far enough from the main drag. We can go to the Old Town by a mere 10-minute walk and if the tourists and activities become too much, we can retreat to this sanctuary easily. I also like the brightness (I hate dark hotel rooms!!) and the clean look of their rooms, but most of all, I have heard and read about the staff - efficient, friendly and will go out of their way to help!!

Joy thank you! That sounds exactly up my alley.

I always have to ask as what works for one might not for another.

I will inquire.

I have realized I can stay for free at BestWesterns as well and have read they are far different in Europe then here - so I am checking into those options as well.

There's a Best Western right smack in the middle of the Old Town - Hotel Elefant. Actually it was a tossed up between Elefant and Auersperg for us. The location and convenience of Elefant is unbeatable.... my only concern was possible noise factor, which may or may not be an issue after all.

Good Luck!

hummm..noise factor is a factor. Both dd and I are light sleepers.

I did look it up and I can use points that that location. I can transfer from my Amex over the Bestwestern I think I will go for it. Very reasonable point useage.

If you have any Best Western points left, some years ago we stayed at Best Western Hotel Bisanzio in Venice, and liked it a lot.

You might be able to use BW points in Verona as well.

I have plenty of Amex points I can transfer...

Thanks for all the feedback. I have added a night to Siena and took off Verona. Another time. This limits the one night stays to some place in the Marches area on the 18 and Assisi on the 19.

Dawn:

In Venice, you might want to try the Best Western Ala. Very good location, too.

Thank you weekender - I will look into it.

More revision.

I have opted to spend 3 nights in Salzburg (was doing that before) train to Munich - spend 3 nights there, and then fly (gulp) to London and spend 4 nights instead of 3. We will arrive in London on Oct. 31 and leave back for the states on states on Election day. November 4. Oh boy.

I changed our hotel in Salzburg to Hotel Auersperg, taking Joy's advice.

Still deciding for London, I have to wait for points from Amex to post and then will see what is still available with starwood, hilton, bestwestern.

Thanks again to everyone!

Okay - I have realized part of the frustration with this trip is the school being located where it is.

I have decided to do a private tutor through a school for one week in Rome starting on Oct. 6 for 5 days - move onto Florence the following week for a private tutor situation.

I think that this will really change the trip for the better...

I agree -Otranto is pretty inconvenient for getting anywhere.

But you might want to consider a tutor/school situation in Siena, Verona, Venice or Lucca instead of Rome and Florence if you want to be in a smaller place.

lovisa - yes, that is what I want.. I prefer non cities.

Dd loved Rome so I can "suffer" (hardly) there for 7 nights. Perhaps a week in Rome and then Siena or the like. I will see what I can come up with.

Most of of the schools offer the option to do a private tutor for the week -

Since you are no longer locked in to your time in Otranto, maybe you want to completely re-think the itinerary to spend less time travelling and do the Northern part when the weather is better - start in the Netherlands, train to Germany, Austria, then Italy, and fly back from Italy to London.

You could do your tutoring in the 2nd and 3rd week or over 4th week in October. The only real problem I see about redoing your existing itinerary is that it is Oktoberfest from September 20 through October 5th, and you'll never get into a hotel in Munich at that time if you don't already have reservations.

lovisa - I was orginally going to go to Munich during the first part and saw it was Octoberfest. I have zero desire to be there during that time.

Okay - perhaps we are onto something now...

The first part of our trip remains the same - I have flights out of Baden Baden and we are flying to Rome on Oct. 4.

Oct 4 Rome

Oct 5 train to Florence

Oct 5 - Oct 11 Florence - rented apartment through Perfect Italy one week classes 10-12 two on one tutor. The rest of the day left to explore.

Oct 11 - ???

Oct 12 - 18 Lucca - two on one classes 10 - 12 - rented apartment

Oct 18 - Oct 25 ???

Oct 25 train to Salzburg
Oct 25 - Oct 28 Salzburg
Oct 28 - Oct 31 Munich
Oct 31 - November 4 London

Okay - so here is the latest question - where to go October 18- Oct 25

We want to stay in Italy - and continue to practice our Italian.

I would like to stay some place where I can meet up with dh who hopefully will be joining us for that week.

I was toying with training up to Milan and meeting dh there - and headed to the Lake Como area but have read mixed reviews of that time of year there?

Spending 3 nights there and then taking a train to Venice for 4 nights...

Any thoughts?

Dawn: You could easily just do a day trip from Milan to Varenna/Bellagio on Lake Como.

weekender - I do not think I want to stay IN Milan at all - nothing about it appeals to my senses...

Either a week at Saena Iulia in Siena:
http://www.saenaiulia.it/italian-lan...cany-italy.php

or Il Sasso in Montepulciano:
http://www.ilsasso.com/eng/index.php

They both offer other activities such as cooking, art, etc.

Ryan Air has some cheap flights (about 140€ for your dates r/t for two) from Pisa to Trapani, Sicily. There are several language schools there if you want to spend a week somewhere warmer.
http://www.solemar-sicilia.it/

I thought a lot about about Sicily think you might be onto something.

Dh is from there and might enjoy spending a week there with us.

I have not booked his flights as of yet - waiting till I really nail this down.

I was concered about going to Sicily alone with dd as I have read different things about the saftey.

"Milan ... nothing about it appeals to my senses." Uh. The Sound of Music Tour in Salzburg but not the Last Supper in Milan? Oh, well. Your trip.

Jean - I understand and yes thankfully there is plenty to appeal to many in Europe :-)

Oct 18 - Oct 25: Apartment in Venice!

DH can fly into VCE. On the 24th all go to Milan for dh departure on the 25th. You and dd continue on to Salzburg. This breaks up your long train ride.

-------------------------------------

Oct 11th: Go on to Lucca rather than do a one nighter somewhere else.

JeanneB - I have heard mixed reviews on a week in Venice - you think that is not too much time? I had thought to do exactly that. Keeps it simple and limits the constant moving.

I have not found an apartment in Lucca yet so I will see if I can get it to check in on that Sat.

Was not sure if we would want to do a quick one nighter someplace...

Oh, what I would give for a whole week in Venice! I can't imagine what could be wrong with it. You'd have time to visit the islands and really explore so many of the places I've never made it to.

The weather should be lovely when you're there. We arrived in Italy on Nov 1 last year and had nice sunny days. You might want to look into the Acqua Alta in October. (Not to discourage you. I've always thought it sounded like fun.)

-------------------------

Re: the one-nighter.
Maybe I'm reading it wrong. You leave the Florence apartment on the 11th (after class?), then have to be in Lucca on the 12th for a class beginning at 10am?

It would also help to know how much luggage the two of you will have.

Doesn't the language school arrange housing? Most I've looked at give you a choice of hotels, apartments, or home stays.

Have you searched for trip reports for Lucca? I remember someone posting one a year or two ago where they stayed in an apartment for a couple of weeks.

Yes, they can arrange housing. I am a little anal and am also looking on my own. I have heard mixed reviews. I did like the housing from the school in Sicily and am leaning towards that idea.

We are traveling with two 22 inch suitcases.

I cannot live through what I did last time we went to Europe. See: too much luggage. Most of us that do it - only do it once.

I have a bad back and dd is only 11 - I cannot travel heavy. It is what it is.

Oh and yes, I have searched a few times for Lucca on the board and come up with a few options. One place that gets high reviews here and on Slowtravel has not responded to many emails.

Mom - You gave up on Otranto because of logistical difficulties.

If you decide to go to Sicily from Lucca, and then to Salzburg, I think you're getting yourself in the same difficulty.

How about some combination of Parma, Bologna, Verona, Vicenza (study the architecture of Palladio), Venice or Bolzano for your uncommitted week? These all take you in the right direction. Going to/from Sicily will kill two days, and not be very easy.

I think I have decided to just put myself in a straight jacket.

The entire thing is starting to give me hives.

I have decided to completely pull back. I am too worried about being ambitous with my eleven year old daughter who gets sick very easily, is recovering from a serious foot surgery (and for all reasons this will be 6 months post op so all should be well enough for her to get around but not too ambitious).

I will be armed with meds from her Dr. here - but still - I think I am crazy to think that she can pull off what I had in mind and ENJOY it in the process.

So with that in mind here is what the current (what is this the 20th plan???) deal is:

The beginning of the trip remains the same minus the orginal idea to train to Bruge the night we arrive. (gee that was a bad idea).

September 25 - Depart LAX
September 26 arrive LHR 2:40 pm
Staying at the Wardolf on points
Euro Star at 10:00 am
September 27, 28 Brugge

We are staying here:www.huyzehertsberge.be

September 29 Haarlem - Ann Frank house
September 30 Haarlem

Staying here in Haarlem - I know that most would have stayed in AMS but after a lot of thought/reading I have opted to stay in Haarlem:
http://www.stempelsinhaarlem.nl/index.php?lang=en

It is 215.00 E total for the two nights.

October 1 we will leave for Baden Baden - stopping in Cologne for a few hours and then onto Baden Baden where we will stay:

October 1, 2, 3, departing on the 4th.

We will not arrive till early evening on the 1.

We are going to go to the more modest of the two baths, perhaps train to Strasbourg and just enjoy.

We are staying at http://www.hotel-am-markt-baden.de/ for 80 Euros a night including breakfast.

We fly to Rome on October 4 on Ryan air from Baden Baden.

Oct. 4-5 Rome
Hotel Aberdeen (thank you on this board for the recommendation)

Oct 5 - 18 Florence - language school 2 hours a day during the week for two weeks. Two on one lessons 10 - 12.

Apartment through Peferct Italy

Oct 18 - Oct 28????

I really am torn at this point on what to fill in here.

Part of me would like to train to Venice spend time there, continue as planned to Salzburg and Munich and spend time there..and then onto London.

I am really still unsure. Sort of all over the map.

I have thought about training through France and down to Spain then catching a flight to London... I have to decide.

Oct. 28 - November 4 I have decided to spend the week in London renting a flat.

So right now 3 weeks are planned to be in apartments - to limit the moving about.

The first week is "moving" a lot to me - but hopefully there is enough rest built in.

We are traveling with two 21 or 22 inch suitcases. I have to double check on the size and a carry on type bag each.

The packing has been concerned due to the weather changes over the time period we are there.

So that is the latest.

At some point - it will all be settled... maybe on Sept. 25 when we leave??

Thanks again one and all for the great feedback and the constant paitence you have shown me.

Is DH still joining you on the 18th?

The former von Trapp family home outside Salzburg will open as a hotel in July 2008. The home was purchased after WWII by a missionary order. The developers of "Villa Trapp" are making no alterations other than painting and rewiring.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24599913/#story

Regarding dh - it is up in the air. He may or may not. I cannot plan the trip around his schedule. There
are a few work things that might not make it able for him to join us.

I am very stressed about being away from him for 5 weeks - I realize it is not that long, but we have never been apart for that length of time and I will miss him.

I am trying to not let anxiety over take this trip. I just had lunch with my cousin and she has traveled a lot without her spouse and he was at lunch too and they kept assuring me it would be fine.

I am a nervous nelly anyway - and just work on it not "ruling" my life.