LIGURIAN COAST..Camogli or SML or ?? Best base and general advice sought!
 

I've just returned from a thrilling week in Amalfi and Naples and am already planning a possible return to Italy in the fall. I last caught a glimpse of this coast while hitchhiking through Europe in the 70s, so this might be the time to explore further. A quick glance at the Cadogan guide, and a reading of reports here has pointed me in the direction of either Camogli or Sta. Margherita Ligure.

1. Which of these would make the best base for a trip of about 6 days in mid-to-late September? Or should we consider any other town?

We are looking for:

Easy day trips, preferably without a car; great eating with a choice of restaurants within walking distance; good walking; swimming in the sea...more or less the same general plan as we followed in Amalfi.

2. I would love to hear hotel recommendations in both of these towns: upscale but not of the 5-star GL category.

3. Can anyone offer comparisons (or general thoughts) between of the Ligurian coast and the Amalfi coast?

4. How late in the season can I count on sea swimming on this coast?

Also, we might like to either begin or end the week with a night or two in Genoa, since we would probab ly arrive here by air from the US. I have not been to this city before.

5. Thoughts on Genoa?? Best areas in which to stay? The Trenino di Casella (the oldest working electric locomotive in Italy) ?

http://www.ferroviagenovacasella.it/

Many thanks. I promise a food-filled report if this trip comes to pass!

I love Camogli and Cenobio dei dogi is a good hotel.

Thanks..I have put that hotel on my list of places to contact. Are there two buildings in the hotel..new and old and if so, which has the better rooms?

Just to provide more details: we would have one full week bracketed by two weekends. I am also interested in knowing the best way to reach this region from NYC:
I know I can connect and fly into Genoa, but there would also be the option of a direct flight into Milan or Pisa. What would the access be like from either of these cities to the coast?

Is there a fabulous B&B or small hotel in inland Liguria that we might include (one with easy access to our coastal base)?

My preference would be to be based out of SML rather than Camogli. We spent a week there and used the train to go to Camogli, Genoa, Cinque Terre, etc. Also took small ferries to Portofino then San Frutosso and Camogli. Walked twice to Portofino which was an easy way to get there and back...about an hour.

We rented a small house about 5 minute walk from the center. It was quite convenient. Two bedrooms and one bath and an outside garden sitting area which we used extensively.

We found an abundance of good restaurants in SML (all of Italy actually) as well as Camogli and CT. Should be a nice time for you in that area.

Ron, can you give me some idea of why you would choose SML? Is SML a larger town with more things to do and more restaurants?

Would the day trip possibilities be easier in one or the other of these two towns? Many thanks!!

Hi, I was at SML last October and followed MaureenB's report of that area pretty much to a T. My report is floating around somewhere, I forgot what I titled it. I loved SML, there are some great restaurants there and the train station is right in town for jaunts.

(I haven't been to Camogli)

Sea Urchin: I can't thank you enough for all of your help, first on Amalfi/Naples and now with this. I came home with such great raves about our recent trip that two friends want me to accompany them on another trip to the Italian coast in the fall. (I can't complain!!) I will take another look at Maureen's report, and try to find yours. If you happen to find the link for yours, post it here if you remember. Many many thanks!!

You are welcome! I found the report, it doesn't get to SML until the post sometime in November.

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=35086903

I would choose Santa Margherita Ligure over Camogli as a base, although I love both places. SML is larger and thus offers more dining choices which is important to us.
There is good train access as well.
We swam in the sea in late September and it was warm.

Another vote for SML. I just returned on April 29 (solo) from Nice and SML. I just love it! This was my restful and fun trip.

Would any of you who know the area be able to offer a general picture of both towns..is SML larger than Camogli? Is either of them a town that has a life outside tourism? Can you rent chairs on the beach in both places? I liked Amalfi better than Positano, if that is of any help.. What would be the pros and cons of each place??

Hi again eks!

We did not visit Camogli, but stayed 3 nts in SML in 2000 at Hotel Laurin. It sounds like you would prefer something nicer, but we were very happy with the hotel and the location. Large, private terrace overlooking the marina, no traffic noise from main street at night. Marginal breakfast.

We spent one day hiking the CT (mid-May). Train from SML to Riomaggiore took about 1 hr, lots of tunnels. Stopped for a long and fabulous lunch at Corniglia - WOW. Boats between towns did not run to all towns every day at that time of year. We had to train back.

Continued on to Vernazza where we pooped out, had gellato and trained back. As mentioned, station in SML is very convenient to town and beach.

Another day we took the earliest boat over to Portofino, wandered and window shopped, then parked ourselves for a long lunch with lots and lots of vino!

Would have loved one more day, but couldn't change reservations at our next destination.

We liked SML on it's own because:

real town, although an Italian beach resort town, nothing like Positano! Local residents strolled and visited in the oceanside park for the passagiata (SP?). Church bells ring for mass. Definitely not overrun with tourists.

No beaches - sunbathers were on the relatively flat, black rocks seaside

We had a wonderful dinner at La Cambusa with ocean views. Might not be up to your standards though

IMO: Amalfi Coast (Sept) overrun with tourists - vast majority Brits.

Ligurian Coast - not overrun (May), except for the CT trails which were overrun with everyone, especially Americans.

Hope this helps!

Dayle that is a great help! Were there rental lounges on the rocky beach at SML? If people were swimming, how did they access the beach??

Eks,

I didn't see any lounge chairs at the ocean and I didn't see anyone swimming except along the CT trail. Even there, they were just diving in off the rocks, no sand except a little at some of the 5 towns - Vernazza and Riomaggiore. Corniglia is up on the cliffs.

It's a resort town, so maybe other areas of town that we didn't see had a beach? Anyone?

That's why we liked our large terrace - lounge charis there!

It looks as if SML is getting the votes here. Because I can get a direct flight to Pisa, I wonder about flying to Pisa and flying home from Genoa after a few days in that city. What would be the transport options from Pisa airport to SML, or to Camogli?

I looked at photos and have seen rows of umbrellas on the SML beach..when you all say that there are rocks, do you mean that the beach is rocky or that there is no access to the water because of huge rocks that are difficult to cross? (We want to swim in the sea on this trip) Is there a beach at Camogli?


Has anyone stayed in Camogli? There is at least one hotel in Camogli that looks lovely..but if the town is tiny and has only a couple of restaurants, it might not be ideal for us..

Hi ek,

We have stayed in Camogli several times, but, no more than two nights each time. We've never been to SML, so can't compare. Camogli is very sweet and very small. Hotel Cenobio dei Dogi, where we have stayed, is very nice, likely the nicest in the town. It is hard to beat their terrace at sunset. There is a beach, lots of pebbles, no sand to speak of, but people have been swimming when we've been there in late October.

The restaurants have been disappointing..not many, and some are closed for the season depending on when you plan to be there...late September should still find many of them open.

That said, it is a lovely little town, calm and inviting...almost no tourists.

Traviata, that is the hotel I was looking at in Camogli. But since we have almost a week, and based on what I am reading here, I am leaning toward SML which appears to be larger and therefore would have bigger choice of places to eat. I still would like more information on the swimming possibilites in SML, and also on recommended hotels; a swimming pool would be a huge plus.

From either place, we would probably take a day trip to the Cinque Terre, although the CT is probably jammed with tourists even in late September..

And also, on the possibility of traveling to SML (or Camogli) from Pisa airport, which would allow us to take a direct flight from the US. (We would then fly home from Genoa)..

Would anyone like to share hotel ideas in SML? Or more information..

There is a small area for swimming and sunbathing. It is across the street from the main city center. Everything is walkable in SML. The train station is at the top of a hill. I have no problem walking with luggage down or back up.

It is an easy train ride to the Cinque Terre. I highly recommend taking the ferry from Monterosso to the villages. It is the most amazing views, especially if you don't intend to walk the paths to the villages.

I have never flown into Pisa, but I am considering that for my next trip to Italy. You will need to change trains at Pisa, then you will be direct to SML. It is about 2-3 hours by train.

Camogli is about 7 minutes by train or you can take the bus. You can also take a ferry to Portofino and I believe also to Camogli.

The hotel I stay at is not located on the water. I have been staying at Hotel Jolanda for several years. It is about 2 short blocks from the water. Hotel Lauren is located across the street from the water, if you want a view, mainly of the harbor.

Many thanks! Scatcat, did you mean that if we fly into Pisa we would have to change trains at La Spezia?


I am now looking at various hotels, including the Tiguillo et de Milan and also the Grand Hotel Miramare in SML. In Camogli, the Cenobbio dei Dogi looks as if it is right out of a film set Prices do, however, seem higher here than on the Amalfi Coast!

My next question (please bear with me: I promise a report when I return!) is:

If you do not stay at a hotel on the beach, I am assuming that one can rent beach chairs from a concession. Is this correct?

Traviata: We would travel in late September so I expect restaurants would be open. Is there a decent choice of places in Camogli or just 2-3 restaurants?

Once I get a list of a few hotels, I will present them to my friends so that they can decide...

We stayed three nights in SML with day trips to the Cinque Terre and Portofino. Would have liked to have gone to Camogli. We liked SML a lot as a base--very pretty with an easy, relaxed ambience, not overly fancy but not at all tacky. Highly recommend hiking some of the Cinque Terre. We took the train to Riomaggiore, hiked to Vernazza with a lunch stop in Corniglia, and then took the train back to SML. There's a bus in Corniglia that will save you trekking up the spiral staircase. I was very glad we took this option as the hike from Corniglia to Vernazza, while spectacular, has a good bit of up and down on uneven stone staircases and was a fairly strenuous last leg for me (no problem at all for my boys).

eks, we've stayed in both--at the Miramare in SML and at Cenobio dei Doge in Camogli. SML is larger, 10,333 than Camogli 5764, and therefore has more activity and more restaurants, etc. I prefer Camogli and count it as one of my 6 or 7 favorite destinations in Europe. It feels like a real fishing village--and it is. the fishermen still clean their nets and the cats play under the boats on the shore. We've never stayed longer than 3 nights, but had not problems finding good foot. Rosa's up the hill has wonderful fish and a tree growing right in the middle of the restaurant. The Cenobio itself has decent food, but the dining room is just too large to be intimate and charming. We've eaten a couple of times near the fishing harbor and enjoyed that as well. I don't remember any SML restaurant particularly but the Michelin red guide lists 5 with two spoons and forks and one with one. It sort of comes down to opportunity and convenience vs. setting and charm (not to imply that SML is lacking in the latter, just doesn't have as much IMO) The Cenobio dei Doge has its own pebbly beach from which you can swim, kayak, float about on air mattresses, etc. as well as a beautiful pool with fantastic views. That said, the info you're getting about convenience of SML to transportation options, etc. for a 6 day stay could be an important factor. You probably can't go wrong with either choice. Sometimes, however, even with that being the case, it's a tough decision. Whichever. Enjoy.

Julie I value your opinion, and also know that that food is a big interest of yours! It IS really difficult to decide and hopefully the decision will not be made for us by some hotels being filled during our dates!

One more thing that is confusing me..I read that SML is very convenient for day trips, but is Camogli not equally convenient? If this is the case, and if we can find rooms at the Cenobio, I may recommend to my friends that we book there, as it really sounds like a dream hotel. Are there any rooms that you recommend?

You take the train from the airport, then change at the Pisa Central station. Check out schedules on bahn.de. I've never seen a kiosk that rents beach chairs.. keep in mind-this is a small beach area. It actually is close to the harbor.

Link to MaureenB's Santa Margherta Ligure post:
SML/CT/Portofino-- http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34817303

ek,

The best meal in Camogli was in a tiny place in one of the alleys that the hotel sent us to...sorry, can't recall the name, but if you stay at Cenobio, they will guide you. For us, the food in Camogli was not a highlight...maybe because we found ourselves there in October and places had closed for the season. I know from your posts that you love good, authentic, local food...if you find any, please let us know for our next trip!

We did not need a car in Santa Margherita Ligure. We went on the train down to the Cinque Terre and used the local bus to go to Portofino, where parking is impossible. We were glad we stayed in SML rather than P. It is larger and has more reasonable restaurants.

We stayed at the lovely Hotel Continental on the 1st floor, room with a wonderful terrace, which we took full advantage of. It is right on the water, with lovely gardens. Rooms on higher floors have small balconies. Ask for a renonvated room facing the water. The marble bathroom was very nice and the room had an incredible wood paneled dressing/storage/closet area.

The train station is near the hotel, no noise problem though, and it was a 5 min. walk to the center of town and a public beach.

We tried to drive around Genoa, a large industrial town, on our way to Milan, but got off-track even with our GPS, ending up in the middle of Genoa. Traffic was an absolute nightmare...took us forever to get out of there. I don't recomment driving in Genoa.

We've also done the Amalfi coast, using Sorrento as our base. Loved it, as well as the Italian Rivera. We've been to Italy several times and have decided you can't go wrong, no matter where you go. Every place we've been has been fantastic.

Thanks, Tish. We do not plan to have a car. I actually remember being stuck in a monstrous traffic jam all those years ago when we were hitchhiking and had to pass through Genoa to get from Ventimiglia to Siena, of all places. (Those days are long past--the hitchhiking, not the traffic jams!)

But am I understanding correctly that day trips by train are easy to do from both SML and from Camogli? It appears that both of these towns have their fans and that there is no "better" place. It may come down to choosing the nicest hotel. We do want to swim in the sea and it sounds as if this is easier to do in Camogli than in SML, which does not appear to have much of a beach.

I did a quick check on a hotel website and it looks as if there is availability at the Cenobio dei Doge. Since the towns are so close, wouldn't it be easy to have dinner in SML, for example, even if we were staying in Camogli? (Returning by train or bus??)

It will be very easy to go from Camogli to SML by train. I checked the schedule and it is only 5 minutes between the two. Last train from SML-Camogli is 12:30 AM.. Looks like they run about every thirty minutes or so.

I had some very good gelato in Camogli last May. It is located on the sea side, but I don't remember where. It was the best dark chocolate ever! It wasn't open when I went there in April.

Regarding the Pisa airport...I've flown into there twice. It's a very small airport and therefore, very easy to get in and out of, without the hordes of tourists you encounter at the larger airports.

I've heard Camogli referred to as "the poor man's Portofino" and it has some similarities though we found it far less touristy and much more authentic. It's been a few years since we last stayed in Cennobio dei Dogi so I would hope that someone who has been there in the last year or two would respond. It's a large hotel, especially for the town. 101 rooms. The ones we liked best were those opening directly onto the pool, so we could just change in our rooms and hop out into the pool. Unfortunately I do not have the numbers at hand but they may have been 52 or thereabouts. They were probably junior suites so they could be pretty pricey with the current exchange rate. The hotel, having been a summer residence of the Doges of Genoa, has its own chapel, a bar with a glass window giving onto the pool so you can see folks swimming underwater, high ceilings in the public rooms and in some of the guest rooms. Lots of chaise lounges surrounding the pool. It's a resort hotel at one end of town with the length of the town along the beach spread out at its feet.

I just remembered another reason Camogli and the area around the Dei Dogi seems less touristy. The elevated road along the beach is essentially a pedestrian street, so there is little/no traffic congestion or noise.

We had a rental car and mostly drove from place to place--that we didn't go by boat--so I'm unable to comment on the rail transportation issues. We did take boats to Portofino (the only way to go) and to San Fructosa, the little monastery along the coast and to SML. I expect you can take them to considerably more destinations as well.

Just found another restaurant reference--Porto Prego by fish harbor. my notes call my Ligurian fish there as the best I'd had in Italy on that trip. We also ate at Casmona, up steps from the main street over the beach and enjoyed the fish there, but my Michelin guide now shows that to be a hotel "senza rist" so they must have closed their restaurant. So, a word of caution about all my fond memories of Camogli--they are a bit dated. I hope someone else can add some more recent info.

Portofino is very picturesque and has some excellent, upscale shopping (think the best of South Coast Plaza by the sea), but also felt a bit as though it had been embalmed.

Julie: Less touristy and more authentic sounds great to me! I had been concerned about having only one or two restaurant choices in Camogli but with Scatcat's helpful information about the trains to SML and elsewhere, Camogli is now the front runner! Unfortunately, unlike some hotels in the area, the Cenobio does not lower their rates at the end of September, but we will save by not having a car..

I know Portofino is really beautiful but it sounds as if it is just a glitzy tourist town, albeit one with beautiful architecture.

Has anyone here visited the village of Varese Ligure? The inland villages of Liguria are reported to be lovely, based on my brief readings about the area..

ek,

We loved Portovenere....the town center is a UNESCO World Heritage Site....very recommended if you have the time to get there.

I have been to SML a few times and it is a bit noisy due to lots of Vespa traffic...My parents loved the Hotel Continental and I stayed a the Hotel Conte Verde on my trip which was decent - not amazing.

I love this area of Italy and we have considered going to Comogli for a few nights on our next trip (2009??). There are more food choices in SML and more shopping, but the quiet feel of Camogli appeals to us more. We can visit SML or Portofino as needed.

When I first visited SML in the late 90's there were very few tourists compared with Portofino just down the road. You couldn't even find a T-Shirt in ANY of the stores in SML (airlines lost my luggage!) where Portofino had them in every store!

Hi ek

We stayed in Camogli at the Cenobio in the summer of 2004. It really feels like a a small Italian fishing village because that's what it is!

Lots of locals out after dinner walking, having gelato and kids playing soccer in the little town squares.

Cenobio has their own beach, pebbly though, bring your water socks and you'll be fine. the pool is great also.

Someone earlier in this thread mentioned eating at restaurant Rosa up at the top of town, don't miss it. The other restaurants are just ok as well.

SML is just one train stop away, there is also a bus to Portofino that goes from the station thru SML to Portofino. Have a Bellini at the Hotel Splendido in Portofino.

Know that the train takes about 1 hour to the CT. The first CT town has a sandy beach with chair rental.

Portovenere is not to be missed.

Have a great trip.

Thanks, everyone, for being so generous with your help and with your time. Lewis, when you say that the other restaurants are just ok as well, do you mean that this is the only really good place to eat (Rosa) in Camogli? I love the way the village sounds..just hoping to have some choice of places to eat, etc. I am not interested in fancy restaurants, just places serving great local food. Atmosphere is not important as long as the food is great!

The other restaurants, on the "boardwalk" that goes thru town along the beach are fine. Mostly seafood restaurants as you would imagine. I don't remember them as being great, just good.

There is one seafood restaurant that 'hangs' over the beach on stilts (can't remember the name)that was good, they had homemade limoncello which was powerful!
The Restaurant Rosa at the top of town was the best.

Better restaurants in SML.
Have fun.

Thanks for the clarification, Lewis. Each time I think I have decided, I read something that makes me question that decision! As Julie wrote, it comes down to "opportunity and convenience vs setting and charm."


Since we will be staying for so many days, I am probably giving this more thought than necessary!

Camogli is a picturesque beach town. Almost the whole waterfront is beach. It fills with Italian sunbathers on summer weekends.

We spent 5 nights at the Hotel Casmona, in a wonderful room with a large terrace overlooking the town and the beach (and shaded by the only tree on the town frontage). This is a moderate hotel, but that sure was a great room.

The train leaves from the middle of town - steps from the Casmona -- and you can go north to Genoa as well as south to Santa Margherita Ligure/Portofino and the Cinque Terre. There are also boats along this route in high summer; don't know about September. But if so, check out the hamlet of San Fruttoso.

Camogli and this hotel is one of the few places I can remember where the reality was better than the photos.

But it certainly does have fewer restaurants than SML, so it may depend on how important food is to you.