How about a budget forum - anyone interested?
 

Hello forum friends - <BR> <BR>I frequent the USA/Canada Forum regularly and am currently nursing a thread with the above title. It's been suggested that this forum may benefit from the same idea. Simply put, many of us enjoy love to travel but by necessity or choice must seek "real" bargains in accomodations and dining - something beyond the hostel category but much less expensive than many of the suggestions written about by contributors. If you support this idea, PLEASE post a reply to this and encourage others to do so. If enough positive responses are posted, this will be presented to the Fodor's editors in hopes that they'll establish additional forum section(s). Thanks!!!

See my topics "20 days 20 cities and lose 20 Lbs in European tour". It is definitely a budget tour with a plus!!!

Thanks Otto - <BR>I'll look it up (could definitely stand to lose the 20lbs and I love to travel!). All others reading this, please lend your support to the concept. Thanks!!

Dear Owen, <BR> <BR>Excellent idea! I hope it works. I'm preparing my first (long-awaited) trip to Europe well in advance, but find it very difficult to understand the rates of the hotels, for instance. What they call "hotel" (in England, especially) is not necessarily my idea of a hotel. Hotels seem to be incredibly expensive in the UK, so I'll probably have to choose a guest-house, an inn, or whatever. A hotel, as far as I'm concerned, has rooms with toilets inside, which isn't true in the case of many hotels in London. It took me some time to understand what "en-suite facilities" stand for. Hotels there mean you're entitled to a room with one or more beds and no w.c./shower/wash basin. Or maybe I'm wrong? Also, I'll be a traveller on a tight budget, so it would be extremely useful if we could have an overall idea of costs of tickets to museums/cinemas/theatres/musicals/etc. I can hardly wait till July 99. I'll have the time of my life! If you're about to leave, Have a Nice Travel, Enjoy Yourself!!!

Owen I agree with you totally. We are a family of four who love to travel but are short of available cash. As the kids are teenagers we have to pay for them as adults. We have planned our own itinery this year and have tried to do it on the cheap but still by staying at nice hotels. I would welcome any info on budget accommodation/fares etc. It would mean that we could travel a lot more.

I'm not sure how useful this info. may be for the majority of people who watch this forum, but if you are able to spend some time in Europe there is something called the Eurobus. This service basically has a route that stops at various different locations. The passenger is able to hop on and off all over Europe once the initial ticket is purchased. I have NEVER done this myself but I have always thought it would be a neat and affordable way to travel. For the lady traveling to the UK I believe there is a similar bus service there (separate from the Eurobus since it is an island). Okay, that's my two cents. :) <BR>

<BR>One way to save is to skip the private bathroom, which Europeans have trouble understanding Americans' fixation with. In a college dorm (old fashioned) it was acceptable to walk down the hall, and we really don't need to bathe every day. I've managed to find nice small pensione-type hotels with affordable rooms. Let's Go books specialize in these, but are not well researched and we found some listed facilities which were not acceptable (dirty, in bad neighborhoods, sagging beds). It would be a real service to all of us who want to go as far as we can with our money (and who use lodgings just to sleep and change clothes because we want to be out experiencing the area) if Fodor's would research and list more budget accommodations. I thought they had taken over Berkeley Guides and were publishing budget travel info under that title, but I haven't seen any lately. Putting everything in the standard gold books would be more helpful anyway. <BR> In short, I endorse your suggestion of more budget-type listings by Fodors.

Carol - <BR>Just to clarify the original posting: the hope is to have a forum just like this one but targeted specifically at budget travelers. I agree, however, that it would also be nice if Fodor's added more budget accomodations to their publications.

I agree that Fodors needs to add more budget listings to its guidebooks for accommodation. Most of the world's travellers are not aiming for four or five star. For those of us from countries with weak currencies, like most asian and pacific countries at present, it has to be a budget hotel or we can't go. For those who can't wait long enough for Fodor's to get the message that budget travellers come from all walks of life, not just young backpacking students, try Lonely Planet and Rough Guides. The cost of buying two or three of the current guides will be paid back quickly if you only get one night's accommodation at a good price. And never, ever, book accoomodation through a travel agent. They don't know what budget means.

Further to my earlier posting I thought that the travellers that are reading this bulletin might be interested in budget accommodation in Europe. There are some very cheap budget accommodation chains that I have heard are very good - we are planning to try a couple on our holiday in a couple of days time - will post back results when I get home. Anyway there are five chains that I know of - Formule 1 who have hotels in lots of different contries. They have a tv, telephone and alarm clock in each room plus washing facilities but don't have a loo or shower but are really cheap - something like £14 per room which holds up to three people. Slightly more expensive is Etap Hotels which do have showers/wc in the room. In France there are also Villages Hotel chain - again about £15 for room (up to three people) and Mister Bed are also in France. Some of the hotels have family rooms for four people. They are all sited near motorways but have good sound proofing - so I am told. It is obviously a budget way to travel and may not suit everyone but even if it extends your holiday by a few days it is probably worth it. E-mail me if you want any further info. (I shall be away from Wednesday though!).

AMEN to all the above. <BR>At 10 South African Rands to the British Pound who can afford to stay in more than 2 star hotels, and that goes for most currencies! <BR>Hope we get a good buget forumn soon.

You know, I think that no matter how rich I could possibly be I would always travel on a budget. I LOVE not knowing where I'm going to sleep every night, I like leaving make-up and blow-dryers at home, and I don't mind washing my undies in the sink! And I know if I stayed in fancy, Americanized hotels, I would not see nearly as much, not meet a single soul, and not see even a bit of the real nitty-gritty of a place.... and that's what it's all about, yes? <BR> <BR>This budget forum is an excellent idea. Go with it. I've been wondering why I like this Europe forum so much when I've never liked Fodor guidebooks, and wouldn't take one to Europe with me if someone paid me. A budget forum would make it all make sense!

Thanks for the outpouring of support folks! I originally posted this idea in the USA/Canada Forum that I frequent but have had a larger volume of response here. Please visit the other forum and reply to the other posting as well. I suspect many of our traveling friends who live outside the US (and within it!) aren't aware what excellent bargains are available to travelers in the US - let's uncover the opportunities and share them!

I agree with Zen about staying at less expensive places. On our last trip to Europe, I made the mistake of using a travel agent to book hotels for us for a couple of places. Of course she picked an American chain! She booked us into a hotel in Heidelburg for the weekend (Holiday Inn I think) that was way out by the train station). We had to take a taxi into the city. We were picking up a car on the following Monday. It was like staying in New York! I only saw European business men and traveling American tourists. The same happened in Munich (only it was Best Western). This was partly my fault. I should have been checking on what she was reserving. By the time I realized what she was doing, it was too late to change. I had to tell her about the Air-train pass that was available in France and also assure her that you didn't have to get a car at an airport! I have found small little places with or without a bathroom much more fun and European!

There are other website (aside from Fodors) that I used when looking for cheap accomodations. For instance, in Paris, I went to the site called paris.org and they have a listing of 1 -4 stars hotel in all of the arrondisment(district.) I choose the 1st up to 5th district and print all of the 1 star hotels in these areas. I must have at least 15 to 20 names, phone number and address. Once I reached the city, First thing I did is buy a phone card with the least amount (50FF in Paris). Then start calling several hotels in my list and ask for the price. I definietly agree to go for a WC outside the room which can drop the price drastically. You need to take a shower only once or twice a day so it was never a problem even if you have to wait occasionally. The earlier you arrived in a new city, the better your chances of picking a reasonable rate and location of your choice. After 4 or 5 calls, I would look up the city map and pick the best location neareast to the points of interest. Tell each hotel your name and that you are on your way to the hotel. If the hotel does not accept credit card, find an ATM on or near the train train station before proceeding. Also get a metro, bus or tram map and with the direction from the hotel reception, you can easily reach the hotel with minimum complications. I also learned that since I'm travelling with another person, the 1 star (double room) centrally located hotel is sometimes cheaper or slightly more than the Hostels usually located away from the center. It's worth the hassels of commuting to the center plus privacy. For example, A double room in 1 star hotel in the 1st arrondisment in Paris cost me FF180. Whereas the youth hostel in the 11th arrondisment cost FF 80 each and share with at least 3 to 7 other people in the room.

Yes--I would love a bulletin board devoted to inexpensive travel. Many traditional travel guides (especially Frommer's) seem to feel that most travellers are multi-millionaires who want the best of everything. Even if I was rich, staying at 4 and 5 star hotels is a great way to AVOID meeting the locals and taking in the atmosphere. As far as books go, I like Rick Steves and the Let's Go series--both (especially Let's Go) are geared towards doing Europe "on the cheap side".

I liked the subject very much. I think that it was because we always travelled with a cost/benefit mind and we've had wonderful experiences. <BR>Going to the point: <BR>1- Transportation - Eurailpass used to be cheap. Today it isn't. Eurobus, that I never used, can be a good solution. Renting or leasing a car can be good for 4 persons travelling together. The car is a good way to stay at hotels outside the cities, especially in France with the chains of hôtels economiques. <BR>2- A budget staying - France is the country with many alternatives for cheap lodging. Unfortunately the great majority is out of city center. <BR>B&B and similars are good choice too. <BR>Finally, I think that the budget forum is very good idea.

<BR>A budget forum is a great idea. Yes, travel agents think only in terms in fancy places and don't even know about the inexpensive, interesting places - B&B's in a private home and such. It is not a matter of can you afford to do things in an expnsive way - it is just more fun to do it in a budget way and we are senior citizens. <BR> <BR>Our trip in two weeks is all planned but would love a good source for future trips. Let's Go and Rick Steves are good sources but so is Internatioal Travel News.

The idea of a budget forum is a great one. And, if anyone has the name of a cheap hotel or B&B in Amsterdam, let me know! I'm going to be there next weekend and am having trouble finding a place -- most places are fully booked so any ideas would be appreciated.

Add my name to the "yes" voters! I recently retired on an early retirement, and find myself in the same situation as when I was 20! Lots of places to go, and not as much money! But, when I was 20, I would accept accomodations that I wouldn't accept today at age 50!! So, I agree that we could benefit from recommendations for less-expensive accomodations, outside of the hostel environment. (I don't mean to offend anyone who loves hostels)

Thanks again for all the support, everyone! <BR> <BR>I'll write Fodor's editors tomorrow and forward suggestion, based on the apparent level of interest. Have had a much lower volume of responses to the same posting on USA/Canada Forum - don't be shy.... please post a reply there, as well! Thanks again!

I hope that I am not too late to post my message. I fully support the proposal for the budget sister site. My husband and I do not have a lot of extra money to spend, but we love to travel. This information would be most useful.

Owen, Sign me up. My wife and I travel in Europe at least once a year and budget $125US per day for meals and lodging, up from $100 a few years ago. I don't know if a separate forum is needed, but if folks would be more specific about their budget when posting here, replies may be more useful. <BR>

I think this idea is unnecessary and not a good one. <BR>I hope when you present your petition to Fodor's, <BR>you do not selectively choose only positive comments. Very few of the posts on the board are <BR>strictly devoted to only one subject--"budget" hotels, etc. which appears what you want. If that <BR>is all one is interested in (whether a budget hotel <BR>or budget restaurant, etc.), a post can easily make that clear in the title. The reason I think this is a bad one is that most posts cover a variety of related subjects, and who is to decide what the criteria of "budget" vs. non-budget is? It will be a waste of people's time to have to post and read in both places, both budget and regular, in order to cover all responses. Someone may ask for <BR>a recommendation for a good restaurant in some area <BR>and would appreciate all suggestions, not just those <BR>limited to a certain price range. Some of the remarks on this thread are off-target, for instance, the comment about how most people on this board/Fodors guides, etc. are only geared towards those staying in 4 and 5-star hotels. This is nonsense. From the posts I read on this board, most people are in the budget to moderate category (which is not surprising as people who can afford 4 and 5 star hotels are not usually trolling public BBs for information); also, Fodors guides have a variety of recommendations in all price categories which are clearly stated, and the budget to moderate outweigh any luxury ones. If you solely want hostel-type guides for grownups, stick to Rick Steves' or Lonely Planet, that ought to do it. Anyway, I appreciate your enthusiasm, but I think trying to segregate and break up a board by "class" or budget is a very, very bad idea.

Thanks for raisingl these worthwhile objections, Christina. Your position is well thought out and your diplomacy appreciated. Your suggestion that "budget" or some similar phrase should be included in posting titles (in lieu of a budget forum) was also offered by a response to this same posting in the USA/Canada Forum. I agree that many folks (perhaps most) in these forums are looking for reasonably priced accomodations, meals etc. (more often than not) but want to know the FULL range of what may be available. I, for one, often choose budget dining options for most meals when traveling but spring for one or two pricier dinners if I can. I respectfully disagree, however, that it's a very, very bad idea. My point is this: until "searchable forums" are available (Fodor's says they will be), many of us lack the time to sift through countless postings, opening and reading each to find the specific information needed when we're making targeted plans (i.e. with respect to budget). I suspect most folks would choose to read BOTH types of forums regularly (I know I sure would), picking and choosing the posts of interests as needed. The LAST thing I wish to encourage is a sense of separation or division among the folks who frequent these pages. I'm quite new to web surfing and very appreciative of the open-minded sense of camraderie and sharing that I find here. Thanks again, Christina, for voicing sensible opposition. If you'd like to respond further, I'll welcome and look forward to your input here or you may e-mail me directly. I have yet to contact Fodor's to make this suggestion. Perhaps they'll have some valuable input as well. By the way, I've visited the other sites you mentioned and quite simply: I like it here better! Just trying to expand options and make more info easier to find... <BR>

Here I am, voting again!!! Ooops, I don't mean to cheat!!! It's just that I've read the suggestions of also checking Rick Steves, Let's Go and Lonely Planet. Can anyone send me their www addresses? Or do they only exist in books? If so, could you possibly send me the full title plus name of author plus publishing house. Because I was surfing the net I learnt about Fodors, checked it out and only then bought the Fodors Guide. So I might as well check the sites and then buy the books. Thanks in advance! <BR>

Glaucia, ricksteves.com; lonelyplanet.com and frommers.com. In my opinion, Fodor's is the best, in structure and response. <BR>

I agree Richard - Fodor's really does have the best structure and responses have been great during my limited time here. With few exceptions, people are genuinely helpful and interested in sharing. Btw, I have now forwarded the request to the Fodor's folks (along with mention of Christina's concerns). Thanks everyone, for all the great comments!! <BR>

YES, you have my vote!

What did happen to the Berkeley Guides <BR>Books. I know that they are not in the <BR>book stores any more and I miss them so <BR>much. They were the best guide book that I ever read as they had an opinion. I am also in the budget traveler mode, but I have been statisfied with the quality of budget info available on this site. Maybe one site for budget hotels only and then this site for info about everything else to satisfy Christina's good point that we don't want to have two boards going on the same topics (where to go, how long to stay, what is best to see,...) Thanks Fodor's.

Your idea is great! I know that I would check out a budget conscious forum here. It would be great to get suggestions on places to eat without spending all of your money. Michelle <BR>

I like the idea of a budget forum but I think that everyone might consider themselves budget minded. I hate to pay over a hundred US for any room anywhere and am happiest when the room is less than 50USD. Others might set the threshold at 200. Would the focus be on lodging only? or include other bargains? Isn't the internet great that all of us as strangers can share advice and tales of woe and glory? <BR> <BR>One way to extend the budget is to use FF miles. If anyone is looking for a new way to rack up miles send me an email for infor.

<BR>Yes, very good idea.

<BR>Well thank for that gem, Erni ! <BR> <BR>Bad idea. Where do you split budget and higher priced accomodations? Does someone who can afford to pay roundabout the split point have to trawl through two forums? <BR> <BR>What next, budget accomodation with facecloths and a left hand bidet forum ? <BR> <BR>Christina has a point.

Let me start by saying that I had similar concerns to Christina's, although my first reaction was to say that it is a great idea. I think it could work if Fodor's can link its search screens in the various regional forums to the proposed budget forum. <BR> <BR>Another possibility is to create a separate forum where people post general questions about how to get the most for their money. <BR> <BR>I will give a yes vote to a budget forum, but it should be approached carefully. You can end up with so many forums that it becomes too tedious to use the site.

Richard's above-mentioned Frommer's website prompts me to mention it again, because it is definitely and proudly geared to budget travel. You can also sign up on that site to receive an email newsletter of current bargains <BR>in travel. <BR>HOWEVER, I agree with Christina and others in not wanting to further subdivide this wonderful Fodor's forum. <BR>A simple mention of your preferred price range in a posting can generate lots of helpful "budget" information. The majority of postings here does not mention wanting to spend as much money as possible. And even those of us who are not backpacking and who indeed wish to bathe everyday (see above!) and perhaps have a private bathroom,are interested in keeping expenses to a reasonable minimum, or perhaps splurging on a meal here and scrimping on the hotel there. Besides, as others have mentioned, I enjoy having access to the wealth and range of information that is here, everything from 4 star hotels to the cheap little Greek restaurants in Paris that were recently mentioned on this site. I'm sure each of us can winnow the suggestions to find what we need. <BR>Let's not separate this into the haves and the have nots, we can all help each other. <BR>

It is my first time traveling to Europe and I am constantly investigating budget hotels and travel secrets. I feel that I can maximize my time there without going broke. And, I would like to return again very soon. With a concervative budget, I can plan on returning sooner than later. Can't wait to see it. <BR>

<BR>Budget forum -- wonderful idea!! I'd sure check it out.

Great idea !! <BR>I myself travel most of the time by <BR>timeshare exchanges , thats the way for <BR>me to minimize accommodation costs. <BR>I love the idea of sharing info about <BR>hou to save and still travel with stile <BR>and comfort. <BR>Zeev <BR>

It took me a long time to find this, but I think it's worth a discussion.