dullest place
 

You all rave here about your time in europe, but what about the disappointments. Where were you disappointed? Where did you find dull?

For openers, try Pisa. Other than its Leaning Tower and surrounding buildings, we found nothing else to see. Made us wonder that if or when the Tower finally topples, why would anyone go there?

I think Arizona's answer is a riot...and is so true!!! <BR> <BR>Besides Pisa, I was dissapointed with the Rock of Gibraltar. It is an amazing sight from the road, but once you go in, it is such a dissapointment!. Another one: the interior of Neuschwanstein Castle. <BR>

As a Fodor's Forum junkie (almost), I was at first surprised at the question and without a doubt...I thought Pisa, but no one will say it! I went there a sa student of art history, based in Florence...no other excuse. So far, unanimous. I am not fan of Germany or the food...efficient, but so what. So, if one must see the leaning tower, take quickie side trip, and move on. <BR>

Definately Pisa, don't know what would happen if the Tower fell, it might be more interesting. I also agree with Gibraltar. Not worth the trip...It's filthy. Ravenna is also not much.

Well I've got one. Fortunately it's the only one I can think of. Rick Steves raves about Bacharach, a small town on the Rhine. So we went. It thrilled us not. Plus, it's impossible to get a good night's sleep there since the town is built along the railroad tracks and trains go by every hour, even at night. Skip it and head on down to Heidelberg. <BR>

Arizona is absolutely right about Pisa. At night the tower looks a rocket on the pad with all that nitrogen coming up around it, and there really isn't much else to do except tell a street vendor why you don't want a $25 Rolex. However, the most bored I have ever been in Europe, Great Britain anyway, is at the changing of the guard at Buckingham Palace. I think that watching paint dry might be more exciting!

Hysterical. Such iconoclasts! Add another icon not worth the battle, The Mona Lisa. I've been trying to figure out for over 30 years what's so special. Beats me, and I'm in the art history business. In fact, after battling the crowds and hot galleries so my son could honestly say, been there, done that, I decided my favorite picture of Mona is the one my son took from the back of the gallery holding the camera over his head. It's too funny - this giant mob all pressed forward around this heavily framed and windowed box - and much to our great amusement, you can actually see the painting in the photo! He left me for a few minutes with the camera and squeezed to the front and was back in a flash. Been there, done that - what's next?!

I guess that I was surprised by Becky's response concerning Germany. <BR> <BR>When I first moved there, I wasn't thrilled with it either. It seemed so <BR>regimented and even confusing. After I started to understand the people and their way of doing things, I started to go out and explore it and really came to enjoy the country and the wonderful sights that you can see almost everywhere. The more time I spent there, the more I wanted to see. Now, back home, I plan on the next trip to go back and see it some more. <BR> <BR>Most boring? For me, living in a hanger for nearly a week waiting to get out of the former Saigon, Vietnam not too long before it's collapse to the communists. <BR>

I agree with Lee - you need to observe and learn about a place to understand it. Why bother going to Pisa or the Mona Lisa if your attitude is simply a seen it, done it one? You might as well look at pictures on the internet for all the value you get out of it. Have you taken the time to understand how something came about? What were the prevailing cultural values of the time, do they still exist or has the culture changed. What can you learn from this country, its people, their way of living, etc. Yes, there are going to tourist attractions all over the world that will not live up to the hype, but is that your only reason to travel there? If it is I feel sad. Being dull , disappointed, unhappy with something can be an internal state of mind. Paris is not simply the Eiffel Tower, it is the culture, history, food, wine, geography, etc. that have shaped it. I guess it all comes down to how people travel, what motivates them - I believe an earlier topic on this forum.

Angela: You said it so well. <BR> <BR>I can't remember going somewhere (by choice) and being bored. It has a lot to do with who you go with and/or what frame of mind you take. <BR> <BR>The first thing that I pack is an open mind. <BR> <BR>Happy travels! <BR>

I know a LOT about the Mona Lisa and Leonardo (the old one, not the new one) and I still found the picture boring. Perhaps boring is not the right word in this context. Perhaps "over sold," "not worth all the hype," etc. But I think we are definitely into a situation of "one man's meat is another man's poison"--or woman's. <BR> <BR>I for example cannot get enough of Germany. And France, although beautiful and cultured and I enjoy going there, is not somewhere I can really get close to, feel an affinity for. <BR> <BR>Still, I find it interesting to read what others have found boring, or oversold. I certainly don't feel like I've missed anything, not having seen that infamous tower in Pisa, after reading the above postings! <BR>

I have never been to a community in Europe that I found boring; not to say that if I lived in some of them I couldn't get bored. The most boring for me: When I was in Europe for a three week international business course, with my wife also taking the class, we were taken to a solar house in Freiburg (interesting for fifteen minutes, not two hours). But the worst was when we were taken to a water treatment plant outside of Freiburg on our annivesary - something was rotten in the state of Wuerttemberg. The year before we had both taken the same course but that time in Asia, and we got to spend our anniversary at the Great Wall and the Summer Palace - now that's more like it! <BR> <BR>I think this is a good question because fellow travellers may be interested in what is overhyped. I found some places not quite as interesting as I expected, such as Montmartre, but not boring. <BR> <BR>What I find the best about travelling is when something is even better than expected, since some times too much familiarity can create unreasonable expectations: for me the things that were even way beyond my imagination were the Great Wall, the Eiffel Tower, the Jungfrau, and the Maya ruins of Mexico.

I agree with Kay wholeheartedly. Angela may be confusing, maybe even simplifying the issue. Her logic could be applied to just about everything, so... where exactly is room for an individual to DISCERN or distinguish based on what is relevant to him/her? <BR>Personally, I love history and have never approached a sight with a "been there, done that" attitude; but there have been sites that just "don't do it for me"...(call it discriminating traveller?) <BR> <BR>I guess this may go back to another discussion I saw on this forum; tourist VS. traveller... <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>

<BR>I don't know that I'd ever use the words dull or boring for any of our experiences, BUT we too were a little disappointed in the Leaning Tower of Pisa, and also the Mona Lisa. I understand someone feeling they were overhyped. But I'm glad we saw them, however if someone were pressed for time and had to make choices about what to see, I'd definetly say skip Pisa, unless it was on the way.

Sorry folks, you missed the boat with Pisa. The campo is one of Europe's great cathedral squares. The Cathedral itself is one of the mosyt beautiful and innovative in Italy, perhaps Europe. I didn't bother much with the campagnale (the leaning tower), but the Cathedral and the Bapistry were a joy. <BR> <BR>Overrated? Skip the Accademia gallery in Florence and go to the Bargello instead. The ONLY thing there of real quality is the David, and there is a good copy in it's origial site in the Piazza della Signora near the Uffizi gallery (NOT overrated)! <BR> <BR>Bologna is overrated unless you VERY into food. Even then, places like Parma, Modena, Padua, and Ravenna are close or as good and have better sites. <BR> <BR>Urbino (in the Italian marches) is overrated. Not much except the palace. Absent a car it's a royal pain to get to and not worth the effort. If you are motoring through the Marche stop by all means. Don;t go out of your way. The Lido in Venice is overrated, but Venice is not overrated as a whole. <BR> <BR>The cathedral at Cologne is overrated, though some of the Romaneque churches are breathtaking. Unfortunately there are 12 of them and perhaps 3 worth going out of the way for. <BR> <BR>Unless you are VERY much into fashion Milan is overrated. Brussels is kind of overrated. It has a charming center and a good (not great) art museum. Apart from that it's a cross between the worst parts of Paris and Amsterdam. Go to Bruges or Antwerp instead.

Hmmmm....How 'bout the Blue Grotto? All that hype & all those boats! See, zee water, eet ees blue! Hysterical. And yes, the Changing of the Guard. Yawn.

This will cause an uproar but here goes. <BR>We found Berlin's Kurfurstendamm to be a tacky, littered, and rundown street that for a city -- that prides itself as the capital of the New Europe -- to be overhyped and a big letdown. The ruins of the old Kaiser Wilhelm Church and the Eurocenter are interesting. But the street itself looks like a work-in-progress. The Ku-damm looks unfinished, poorly maintained, and awash in ragamuffin kids who don't have a clue what to do other than mooch money for drugs. Compared with Fifth Avenue in New York, Chicago's Michigan Avenue, or about any boulevard in Paris, the Ku-damm is a big nothing.

At the risk of being booed--the tower of Pisa is lovely and worth seeing. However, what the rest of you don't know is that Pisa airport (from London or Frankfurt) makes getting to Tuscany a joy. So, land in Pisa, spend an hour to see the tower, rent a car and go. I am also never bored when somewhere new. If there is not some wonderful architecture or art, there is always the people, food, wine etc. of the region. I don't understand someone who can't appreciate the Mona Lisa or the changing of the guard. Perhaps they expected something different than what it is??? I think we must realize that Europe is real and not Disneyland east!! I pity those who can list a dozen places in Europe that are "boring"--perhaps they belong in the Magic Kingdom. <BR>

I like the word, "oversold". It's a good word. And there is always something for everyone. It's not really a matter of something be absolutely and definitively not worthwhile. Never. It's just that what's for you is not for me. And I sometimes find it very interesting that we don't all fall in love with the things we are "supposed" to be in love with. <BR> I've never been to Pisa, so I couldn't say. Brussels? I'd rather be in Brugges. Baroque style cathedrals? I understand them, but I'd rather dawdle in a Romanesque or gothic style building. Etc. <BR> As for the Mona Lisa - I feel a tiny need to defend myself. My "been there done that" statement was meant to be a little light hearted and silly. Hopefully most of you know that. <BR> It is a fascinating issue actually, of a painting that was written about and talked about in the artist's lifetime. One of only 3 works he kept with him throughout his life. And it has always been raved about, meditated upon, etc. At this point however, it is hard to understand. The cultural phenomenon and history is becoming, to me at least, more interesting than the painting. The current huge controversy, which has been going on for some time, is about whether or not to clean it. The French authorities have, said, absolutely positively, "non!" This was just in the art press within the last month or so. My expertise is on medieval art and American art, but....I would have to say that part of the problem is that the poor thing has untold layers of yellowed varnish which neatly seal in several centuries of grime - and since old varnishes are themselves unstable, they yellow. We might well be able to get back to appreciating what the painting really looked like and understand the half millenia of appreciation for this painting if it were cleaner. The same agonizing went on before the Sistine Chapel was cleaned - and thank heavens they did it. What a dramatic and glorious transformation. <BR> So - I say that part of travel is learning what grabs you visually, intellectually, gastronomically, and you are allowed, with good humor, to be bored with some stuff! <BR> Happy travels!

I have travelled all over the world and I have never experienced to find a dull place. Every place has its charm in my opinion. <BR>

The one place I was disappointed in was Mont St.Michel....not because it wasn't an incredible structure-in fact, driving up on it was worthy of a "Wow" upon first sight. What threw me off were all of the little trinket stores(which sold,among other treasures,Eiffel Tour "cologne"!) and refreshment stands that lined the path up to the structure. OK, so this was back in 1991, and perhaps things have changed (I could only hope...), but I just felt the whole ambiance was ruined by the triviality and tackiness of these establishments.This is, of course, only my opinion! <BR>

Message: Yes Arizona- you are right- this is going to cause an uproar. <BR>First of all your observation that the Kudamm looks totally unfinished is smashing....what do you think a city looks like after it was bombed into bits and pieces- like Rothenburg ob der Tauber in the XXL- version? <BR>Secondly- major cities like Berlin usually have littering problems - and I am really sorry, but if you take a look around the streets of Paris , New York and Chicago you will exactly find the same amount of rubbish.(The Germans themselves are proud of living in a clean environment as it can be found in the rest of the country) <BR>Thirdly - fantastic that America does not have any problems with kids hanging out in the streets. And of course, this should not be forgotten, there are no drugs problems in America either. <BR>Last but not least- the next time you go somewhere, you should read a travel guide before your departure. If you had done this before you went to Berlin, you would have found out that it is not the Kudamm, which is Berlin`s traditional premier shopping avenue. The original shopping avenue is called Friedrichstrasse and is located in the former east part of the town. <BR>As you might have noticed as well there are a lot of building sites and new buildings which try to give Berlin a new face. In consideration of this everything looks still unfinished and 'in progress'. I think it is a fantastic sign to see such a historical place as Berlin growing together again after having been separated for so many years. Anyway, you probably have to be German to appreciate the atmosphere of a reunited Berlin and to consider its history and its new situation in an appropriate way. If you are able to use this 'pair of glasses' to see Berlin, you will find out that it is not about tacky shops or comparisons with other cities what makes Berlin special and that there is much more about it than your superficial view of the Kudamm.

This forum began with the word disappointment! And on to the full war of discussion...which is what I love about the forum. Hype..overrated...lots of things are. Everything isn't for everyone...and we are free to discuss it. Cliches, yes. I was disappointed in Pisa, not sorry I saw the leaning tower, but wouldn't go back. Whoever mentioned the Bargello is right...also the Museo del Duomo is wonderful and never a line. Also two cents on Mona...and I minored in art history...love Leonardo, but I probably wouldn't get up early for her either. Haven't seen this much discussion since the lady ask about first class hotels in Paris and was blasted left, right and center because she wasn't interested in the real "essence" of Paris.Love it! <BR>

Put this in the "disappointment" category, Monet's Water Lilies in the Orangery. Fresh from an exhibit of Monet at the Kimbell in Fort Worth this was nothing like the work we saw there. <BR>

WOW - great discussion. I do believe that many of you made a great point: I like the words :disappointed" and "over hyped". I've certainly been disappointed and especially saddend by the commercialization of certain sites. Thank you for your reactions and comments!!! <BR>

I've loved this whole set of postings, but especially wonderful was when someone suggested that Arizona should "get a guide book next time" and he couldn't possibly understand Germany, etc. etc. Since I know from his postings that Arizona may well have traveled more often to more places the most of us put together, I really got a charge out of that! <BR> <BR>And as long as I am writing, I guess I have to vote along with Arizona to say that the Ku'damm was indeed -- well, how best to put this -- not quite what I had expected. BUT IMHO the KaDaWe department store deserves even more hype than it gets for being Europe's biggest and perhaps best department store. Take that, Harrod's. Ok you guys, let's hear it in Harrod's defence! <BR>

Kam makes a good point, that noplace in Europe is truly boring if you seek out the interesting parts. <BR> <BR>When I worked in the Netherlands, friends and I visited a small city in the middle of Zeeland (the low-lyin areas in the southwest of Holland). This was a perfectly normal town which draws few tourists. It was perfectly wonderful! Picturesque, and it had a great market going, nice churches. If it was in the US it would be world-famous! But in Europe it was nothing special, a bit ho-hum. Theare are hundreds of place like this!

Don is so right. Every country in Europe seems to have these little gems, which would be huge tourist draws in the US. I can think of dozens of unsung places even in France, which has more foreign tourists than any other country in the world. Charming, picturesque, relaxed. And best of all, the local people are usually delighted to meet a real American!

While the above may be true, there are nevertheless places that, when you get there, it ain't what the guidebook said it was. Herewith some personally disappointing places in Europe: <BR> <BR>1) La Defense: Why do guidebooks recommend this as a "must see" sight for "bold modernism"? Thirty years ago, the Parisian government wisely pushed office development out of the city center. The result was La Defense, the corporate "downtown" of Paris. It contains some of the most startlingly unattractive buildings ever designed, including one intended to "interpret" the Arc de Triomphe. America has its share of bad architecture, but I have never seen such a concentration of awful stuff as here. <BR> <BR>2) Horrible architecture runner up: the Amsterdam Hilton. If you are of an age to remember John Lennon and Yoko Ono's "bed in," then you may have made a pilgrimage to see where it happened. The Amsterdam Hilton is a mid-60s concrete monstrosity set in a drab part of the "New City." When it sinks into the Dutch soil, it will not be missed. <BR> <BR>3) The National Portrait Gallery, London. Gallery after gallery of politicians, noblemen and noblewomen from the past. Out of the thousand of portraits on display, there are perhaps three or four that inspire. <BR> <BR>4) "The Last Supper" fresco at Milan's Santa Maria delle Grazie church. It is heartbreaking to see Leonardo's masterpiece on life support. Three centuries of abuse have made this once-beautiful fresco a muddied mess. In this case, at least, the guidebooks warn you that it is "somewhat faded." <BR> <BR>

It seems that Pisa is getting a battering, so I'll stand up for her. Pisa is an attraction to those interested in art and sciences. Or so I am told. Myself, I agree with the others. A couple of hours around the tower and basillica is enough. <BR> Antoher place is the former West Berlin. It is so boring. I think that it was so damaged in WWII that nearly everything was rebuilt. It is just the same as any modern city.

Eek! The National Portrait Gallery in London boring??? I loved it--putting faces on all the people I've read about. After almost 30 years, I can still remember the thrill of seeing Richard III, Charles II and the Brontes. <BR> <BR>Cannes was not exactly what I expected (could have been Cancun, almost), but swimming in the Med and the moules made up for it. And, the catacombs in Paris were longer than my interest in them. However, I think if my French were better, the inscriptions would made the trek more interesting for me. <BR>

Since couples traveling together can't always agree on their assessment of locations, I am surprised that there is not more disparity in the opinions voiced on this thread.The dullest place for me was on a cruise ship in the middle of the North sea..B O R I N G!In Pisa, after seeing the tower,we found a little pizzeria(away from the tacky tourist area)had a great pizza and were chased half a block by our waiter who thought the tip we had left him was change we had forgotten and tried to return it..so even Pisa was fun. <BR>

How about looking for the Leaning Tower of Pisa from the train - "There! That's it! - no. That's the Straight Up and Down Tower of Pisa." "Look! There! That's it!-- No, that's the Leaning Apartment of Pisa." <BR> <BR>How about all the fake Davids and copies of copies in Florence? "Dees-a statue, she used-to-be a real Michaelangelo but we move-a him in 1840." <BR> <BR>If you go to any Italian hill town in the morning it will disappoint you. San Gimignano at 10 AM is like the oyster bar at Grand Central Station. You can't even see over the heads of the tourists. They can't fit in the walled gates! But go there at 5 PM and it's a miracle of the Renaissance. Same for Siena. And for that matter the same for crowded, groaning Florence. <BR> <BR>In Florence wait for the rain. All the pensioners stay in the hotel. Then go see the Bapistry ceiling and David at the Accademia and the Gozzoli frescoes at the Medici Palace. If you try see these miracles at noon you'll hate them. No, you won't hate David. Nobody could hate David, anytime. <BR> <BR>The Louvre? I loved it, even though a tourist straining to see the Mona Lisa popped me in BOTH eyes with TWO flashbulb cameras when I turned around. How could she confuse ME for the Mona Lisa? But to tell you the truth I loved the Mona Lisa. I think she is beautiful. It's not her fault they have yards and yards of signs posted to lead all the tourist hoards to her. <BR> <BR>The Notre Dame catacomb tour (Zzzzzz). But Notre Dame at night from the Seine Riverboat tour is a miracle. Same with Isle de San Louis. During the day it's just more boutiques. But at night it's glorious. <BR> <BR>The Champs Elysees. I already know about freeways full of cars. But when you study it's history you appreciate what this has meant to the French. Without that knowledge it's just another wide road. <BR> <BR>It's always how you look at it. What you put in you get out, ususally.

I'll describe the dullest place, and see if you can guess where it is: It has big parking lots, lots of people and the following stores: Home Depot, Toys'R'Us, Circuit City, Eddie Bauer, Caribou Coffee (or Starbucks), Applebee's Restaurant, and others. Where is it? Everywhere in the US! Hasn't anyone else noticed that the US is becoming one giant homogenous superstore shopping area? The overdevelopment is ruining us, and I often wonder what Europeans see in our country other than the natural beauty where it is not yet developed. I have a hard time saying I'm disappointed in the Mona Lisa or Pisa or Athens or Istanbul. Luckily, the old stuff takes up all the room, and they can't junk up their countries like we do. I live in a city which boasts of the country's biggest indoor mall. Wow. We travel whenever we can just to see something unique, and that I never find dull.

We had a great time in Pisa. The basilica and tower hold so much interesting detail. We purchased an unlimited pass to explore the associated museums. We drove to the ocean and had a fantastic dinner at a seafood restaurant. We visited Normal Univeristy, which is world-renowned for attracting top scholars in mathematics and physics. We met a local couple and had a fun time.

Sometimes it's all in the circumstances. The first time I saw the Mona Lisa was in April 1947 as an 18 year old soldier. You could walk right up to the painting, no protective glass, and stand and look at it as long as you chose. In those conditions, being able to see the detail and subtle use of colors, you could gain an appreciation of why the painting is such a great masterpiece. It was a wonderful experience. The last time I saw it was in the circumstances described above - it was a dull experience. <BR>

How about the Little Mermaid in Copenhagen? <BR>How about Stavanger, Norway? I lived there for 3 years and went stir crazy. <BR>How about Aberdeen, Scotland and all the gray stone buildings? <BR>

How about the Aran Islands? I know people rave about them, but it was beyond my wife and I. You end up wasting an entire day to see a barren Island, with a reconstructed ring fort that people spend perhaps 25 minutes at. Basically, a tourist trap. The miserable thing is that you're trapped on the island for almost the entire day, while the beautiful Burren and Connemora regions of Ireland are so close! <BR> <BR>Mike <BR>

<BR>&lt;gulp&gt; here goes . . . <BR>What people have to realise is that Europe isn't Disneyland. It's not a place primarily constructed for peoples enjoyment. It's a continent - where people live which also happens to have a lot of history. I am of the opinion that Americans see Europe differently to Europeans ( quite understandably ) but this view can somewhat cloud the reality of things. To say everywhere has its charm is a little far-fetched. I can recall standing in a dank,dark, industrial town in Germany called Stolberg in a sour mood thinking 'One day this will be 20 years ago' . There was nothing at all picturesque about this place in my opinion although you may have though differently. It's all about opinions.