Too feeble to travel?
 

My husband and I recently put his parents on a plane to Dallas (from Baltimore) to visit their youngest son and grandchildren for a few days. As we watched them toddle away, it struck me that they have no business traveling anywhere on their own. My mother-in-law has had two heart attacks, mastectomy for breast cancer, with resulting lymphedema which makes one arm virtually useless, double knee replacement with one knee that "still doesn't work right", and gets stressed very easily. Father-in-law has severe diabetes and cannot walk well. His joints are terribly stiff and getting him in and out of cars is a job. He also has emphysema and uses oxygen. His diabetes is not well controlled (mostly because he loves to eat), and he has had a stroke from which he has pretty much recovered. He's also had surgery for heart bypass. Let's see...is that all? Anyway, you get the picture. I don't feel like they should even be out alone. Someone could knock them to the ground with very little effort and snatch my MIL's purse. If FIL had another stroke, MIL wouldn't know what to do.

I should add that my husband, their son, and his older sister don't seem to notice how frail his parents are. My husband says "they're fine...they'll be okay." He doesn't seem to notice how his father sometimes seems a bit disoriented.

AND, they will be leaving in a few days to drive to North Carolina to visit younger daughter for the holidays. Yup, they are driving. *sigh* FIL drive very very slowly, and they stop frequently.

If their own children aren't worried about them, I suppose I shouldn't be.

Has anyone ever faced this situation?

I have another question which has nothing to do with this, but I am asking everyone I possibly can. Does anyone have any experience with debilitating cluster headaches? My 27-year-old daughter is currently in the throes of a six-week attack of horrible twice-daily headaches that require the use of Imitrex. She is taking Imitrex (shots and/or pills) twice daily! I am worried sick.

Thanks.
Vicki

vickib2, look at it this way:
They are adults. They can still make decisions, and they should. Traveling gets their mind off their ailments. It may not be the quality you or I would like, but it gives them something to look forward to and something to do - which in turn keeps their brains and bodies active. Except for the driving (grrrrr) I say, help them visit their loved ones. Which is just what you're doing. You are a good daughter(in-law)!

Cluster headaches: my husband gets them. They are absolutely awful. He has gotten remarkable relief from Capsaicin (hot pepper ointment for arthritis). You rub it inside the nostrils - it is very very hot, but it somehow has the effect of preventing the cluster headaches. But it takes several weeks of doing this for it to become effective. I know it sounds weird, but it's the only thing that's helped him.

I think a lot of people do drive after the time it's safe for them to do so. That's the trip that would worry me.

Put them on a cruise ship. They'll be well taken care of in high style.

Vicki-

Wow, how stressful! I can relate because my father, while fairly young, has multiple sclerosis. He walks with a cane, although I think anyone else in his position would've gone to a wheelchair by now. He's incredibly willful which can be scary but I suppose keeps him going.

He loves to go to NYC and it scares me to no end. He falls all the time and we all know NYC is a walking city really. He fell getting out of a cab the last time and people on the street had to help him up. Anyway, I worry endlessly but it really keeps him going. How awful to know that your body will completely fail you soon, I think for him just to sit home would kill him. Good luck with your in-laws.

It's perfectly understandable (not correct, just understandable) that sometimes the closest family members are in denial about a loved one's infirmities. It's too painful to contemplate the implications, and some of those implications include the children having to make decisions, or insist on life-style changes, that are unfortunate, upsetting, and difficult emotionally, even financially. Each of us sometimes has to listen to brutal honesty from friends or family if we appear to be behaving in dangerous ways, or in ways that cause them great worry.

The parents are relatively well-looked after on an airplane. It's their driving that would keep me up nights. If you don't feel comfortable calling a family meeting about this, then what will be will be. Many of us seem to behave as if we will not only live forever, but we will be in perfect health until the day we die, so not enough of us make contingency plans for long-term care, assisted living, where to live if we have to give up driving, how to adjust to life stage changes. Coping with old age (in our parents, in ourselves) is what we have to HOPE we live to do.

Illogic above about living forever <u>and</u> dying, but you get my drift.

At least they are traveling together. My mother just returned from a trip to NYC to see my brother and a few days before that had been in Birmingham to see another son. She's talking about going to Ireland to see yet another son. She has a litany of health issues any one of which should have put an end to her traveling but she keeps going. She had told me that she doesn't plan on dieing until she's dead. During those time periods where she hasn't taken a trip in awhile she tends to lose her confidence about going again but once she goes there is no stopping her.

If your parents-in-law are willing (even if maybe a little less than able) then it is probably better for them from a mental health perspective to go than to sit around.

As mentioned above, it's the driving that would concern me. On a plane, cruise ship, train they are likely much safer. When my time comes, I hope I am still traveling, rather than giving up hope and sitting home watching TV.

If you REALLY want to &quot;do something&quot; about caring for your elderly in-laws the first thing may be to make sure they have advance directives and durable powers of attorney completed.

Yes, your husband is very much in denial by saying &quot;they'll be OK&quot; because denial is easier than taking the steps YOu already know are required.

I deal with this sort of situation almost daily in my professional life. It is never easy and it is never uncomplicated.

What is worst of all, perhaps, is convincing the two persons we are discussing here to realize that THEY need to make changes.

Bless you for being observant.

Jeez, I hope my relatives are not online someday, worrying to others about my ailments and inability to toddle onto the plane without help and worry about my driving. LOL...kinda makes one dread old age even more!
Florida is FULL of the people you describe ,vicki and they all seem to be managing. Some of them are even Old.
Their relatives come visit them the minute the weather turns cold up North, and the roads are clogged with all sorts of people who don't know how to drive :D

As long as these 2 are able to think clearly, I guess it is up to them, I say good for them. They have been through SO much and they are still Living and enjoying Life.
I think the best thing you can do is not to worry, and stay off the road when they take a trip :)

I,m sorry..but the best thing for them might be to act rather than worry and then Scarlett won't have to about staying &quot;off the road.&quot;

For information on all sorts of headache issues, look at headachedrugs.com

Cluster headaches are one of the worst types. You do have to give the drugs time to work. If she is taking Imitrex twice a day, I assume she is in close contact with her doctor and will continue to follow his or her treatment guidelines.

Regarding your in-laws, I have a lot of sympathy. You seem to be in the throes of having no control in a worrisome situation. One person to enlist on your side is the out-of-town relative; since she sees the parents at intervals, she'll tend to notice their areas of decline more than the children who see the parents regularly.

Your husband, and any other children in your in-laws' city, should develop a plan for when a precipitous event occurs. Help the parents get all their paperwork in order - will (and living will), doctor and insurance information, a list of their drugs and dosages, etc.

Keep in touch by phone or e-mail, so that family members are aware of the impending problems, and discuss the changes in routine, etc., as you take them so that everyone feels as though they've been included. This can lessen the resentment that sometimes divides families in these difficult times.

Ask you husband to pull his head out of the sand then smack it.

Hopefully that will wake him up.

Also, it wouldn't hurt to give him this thread.

&quot;He doesn't seem to notice how his father sometimes seems a bit disoriented.&quot; Oh, how familiar that sounds. I went through that my mother several years ago. She was often disoriented and confused, but it wasn't until she couldn't figure out how to use her telephone that some members of the family finally agreed that there was a problem.

It's hard: you see a problem and want to take action before the situation worsens, but others can't/won't see it. I was surprised that some of my siblings just couldn't wrap their minds around the fact that mom was having problems - just realize that some people have a very, very hard time facing that. But take heart - you're being realistic and compassionate to try to help your in-laws.

Unfortunately your FIL could have health problems anywhere, not just while he travels. Does your MIL have a plan for what she would do in this circumstance and could the plan be adapted for their travels?

I agree with previous posters that driving is the first issue facing you. I'd suggest working on getting some family agreement about the in-laws driving as a starting point.

Good luck.

I don't see big problems with the flying part. Flight attendants are very aware of elderly flyers' needs.

The part that gives me the creeps is the driving part. Your inlaws and others on the road could end up dead. Maybe your DH should do the driving for them.

Would you rather they sat in chairs at home waiting to draw their last breath? Seriously, I understand your concern - really - but I think you have to let them continue to be adults and think for themselves. As long as they want to travel and can actually do it, you really should not offer up &quot;hey, you've had a stroke, you're slow, you're knees aren't original, something could happen etc...&quot; A lot of people who don't have use of both arms or have had a masectomy travel, as do people who have had heart attacks, not everyone who travels is &quot;perfect&quot;. But, I understand that you are concerned because you care.

Personally I think you should stay out of it. However, the long distance driving is a legit concern, I totally agree that is dangerous to them and others on the road. Any way to get these folks to consider train travel? Or to fly to North Carolina? Or, if you want to get involved, maybe you or your husband could offer to drive them?

I can understand that's it's neither fun or easy to grow old, but I will pick up my cane/walker/oxygen tank and deck the person who takes it upon themselves to decide I'm toddling too slow to get on the plane (the car is another story!!)

Scarlett, I know....I felt badly about discussing them so personally on the board but I really wanted some feedback from impartial people.

About the driving....DH, as well as daughter they are visiting have offered to drive them to North Carolina. They said &quot;no thanks, we're fine.&quot;

My husband said &quot;I asked them, and they said they'd be fine&quot;. And that's that.

I doubt that MIL has a plan for when they are out. Her in-home plan is &quot;call 911&quot; which she does frequently since FIL has problems with &quot;becoming unresponsive&quot;. This is due to the fact that he occasionally will mistake a funny feeling in his chest for needing more insulin, then he thinks perhaps maybe he's having cardiac pain, so he takes a nitroglycerin pill. Apparently, mixing these two things can sometimes cause a dangerous drop in blood pressure.
!!!
Vicki

In yesterday's New York Times (Tuesday) there was an article on how tell if someone should no longer drive and how to convince them to hang up their keys. You can see it on the Times website. Their driving would make me very nervous, not only for their sakes but for others on the road, too. It is a very sad and scary to watch parents get old and sick and I sympathize.

Vicki,

I agree with the poster who suggested enlist the help of the out of town children. They will certainly be more aware and notice the decline in their parents.

I recently came back from visiting my 86 year old mother who lives in the U.K. and her decline had not been recognized by my two siblings. When I gently pointed out things I observed in our mother they agreed and we had a little meeting as to how and what is the best plan of action. I was not critical of them because in the end it is my two siblings who live close to my mother who will be responsible to see the changes we agreed upon are done. I will be very supportive from far away.

I wish you the very best and thank you for caring about your in-laws.

Sandy

About a year ago I had to be the bad guy and get my Dad's drivers license taken away from him. He was madder than a wet hen. He had hit 2 parked cars and after I had done the dirty deed, I found out he had other close calls. He never knew it was me who was responsible for him losing his license and he still talks about the SOB who caused him to lose his license. Yikes!!!!! It had to be done :-(

As for elderly parents - either travel with them or sign up for an Elderhostel program - it's not exactly a tour group, it's a program designed for not-so-strong-any-more.

As for headaches, had she been to an experienced neurologist? Imitrex is not to be taken often, and NOT for prevention of migraines. Did she have a CT scan?

The caring/concern issues aside (read my post above, I understand you love them) BUT does your daughter know you have posted her medical problems here for the world to see? Are you going to take our advice and pass it on to her doctors? Did your in-laws ask you to resolve their travel/growing old problems for them? or is this advice you are seeking all unsolicited?

You need to tread carefully, or the next thing that will happen is your daughter will be posting here on behalf of herself and her grandparents about how to deal with the meddler!

vicki - your concerns are totally legit and come from a loving heart!!!
i too have faced the parent/child role reversal thing. when it is your own parents it is hard to face and makes you aware that before too long it will be you, which can make us less willing to see the obvious. and we americans (or is that humans) have a terrible time facing mortality.
one suggestion is for you and dh and sil's and their dh's to arrange to have all YOUR medical/legal paperwork put in order and ask your inlaws to do so as well at the same time. less offensive to them and good for everyone involved.
i agree that they should be &quot;safe&quot; while flying but being disoriented in an airport would not be fun. could you call the airline and request those riding carts for them?
if you are close to the sil in dallas, give her a call and see if she sees the changes you do. she might have better luck talking to her sibs than you are.
good luck.

Two years ago an elderly lisenced driver was disoriented and confused the gas pedal for the brake. He plowed through the Santa Monica Farmer's Market, killing 10 people. Maybe his children were &quot;minding their own business&quot;.

Vicki's concerns are more than legitimate.

Catbert, you didn't read everything I wrote. I was AGAINST the driving, as was I think almost everyone here. As far of the rest of it I think she needs to back off a bit before dispensing (well meaning yet unsolicited) advice.

I hope your in-laws are flying on a plane with some dedicated healthcare workers like my son (nurse) and daughter in - law (RT) who spent their flight from Paris EACH working on passengers needing emergency care.
On our last flight from Amsterdam we turned around and return to Shannon to provide medical care to a 75 yr old diabetic.
This is not the time for denial !!

Intrepid, your post made no sense to me, but I don't live in Florida anymore..so there is no more worry for me about getting hit by anyone driving there.
BTW- I was hit by an elderly lady, backing up in a huge cadillac, even though I was honking, she backed into me anyway. But she was in great shape, just deaf..and could not turn her head...and was very very short..but she was in great shape.lol

Catbert, an old poster that was banned, named Grasshopper, used to have elderly parents who took cruises all the time! I personally, think if an elderly person can travel at all, that is a great way to go! although I imagine when I am elderly- I will still get seasick, so that will not be an option for me :D

vickie, do they live in their own home? do they cook and go about their days unaided? Then why do you all think they cannot travel ?
If my relatives had 2 heart attacks, cancer surgeries, diabetes and bad knees and still felt like traveling, I would be thrillled!

Scarlett- they say some people outgrow motion sickness. Maybe by the time we're 82 we'll be able to cruise?!?!?
;-)

LOL, suze, I have a feeling I am never outgrowing this..but that does not mean that I would say no to a free trip on the QE2..even if I have to wait til I am old :D

Scarlett, have you ever taken a river cruise? I get sea sick, so want to try quieter waters, somewhere in Europe perhaps.

No, but I like the idea of the houseboats in England or in France. But I used to feel woozy on the Ferries going across to Fire Island in NY, so I have low hopes for being able to float on anything without turning <font color="green"> green</font> :(

Suze, FainaAgain &amp; Scarlett, do not despair!
My husband used to love to tell everybody I couldn't watch certain TV shows because I get seasick. But these things do change. And although I started out with a scope patch on my first cruise a decade ago, I have graduated to just chewing a little ginger when things get that &quot;off&quot; feeling. Amazingly, this is all I need now. Although I still cannot read in the car =;.
And I'm still young - 47 ;;). Try now! There are several first class cruiselines out there...what a way to see Alaska!

I wouldn't mind living on a houseboat, After reading Joyce Cary's, The Horse's mouth, I took a boat ride to little venice in London to look at the bedecked houseboats.

Grantop,

Yes, my daughter is very aware that I freely discuss her headaches, in hopes that someone might suggest something that will help her. She does the same. She also posts regularly to the cluster headaches message boards.

Cluster headaches are called &quot;cluster&quot; because they occur in clusters. A patient may go months or years symptom-free, then experience weeks, or months of daily debilitating headaches. These headaches are on one side, centered around the eye, which is served by the trigeminal facial nerve, a major pathway for pain. In the event of a cluster headache, there is an unidentified process which causes abnormal blood vessel activity, and the trigeminal nerve becomes inflammed, causing intense pain. These headaches are not helped by analgesics or narcotics. Research and development of new drugs has been hindered by the fact that some researchers feel it is unethical to deliberately give someone who is in excruciating pain a placebo.

My daughter was worked up by neurologist at the time of her last cluster of headaches (18 months ago!)She underwent a CT scan of the head and MRI of the brain. All were normal.

People who have suffered from these headaches can frequently offer tips and other suggestions as to what has helped them. No single thing works for every one but my daughter tries just about anything suggested to her in hopes that she may be one that will benefit from it. Her doctor advises her to try anything within reason.

Joan was kind enough to tell me of a technique that her husband has tried for his cluster headaches, which I will pass on to my daughter.

I am grateful that she has a patient and loving husband who is very supportive of her during this difficult time. Cluster headaches are also known as &quot;suicide headaches&quot;, so I'm glad that she is not alone when they occur during the night, which has been the case for the past six weeks.

She will see another neurologist on December 22, although I doubt that he will be able to offer anything new. We are praying that her cycle will be over by then. She and I will be taking a trip to New York City on the 28th, and I really want her to be able to enjoy it.

As for my in-laws, my concern for them is not mean-spirited. As I watched them walk away, they just struck me as so terribly fragile, and I thought suddenly of how horrible it would be if they got hurt in some way simply because we failed to notice this deterioration of their abilities.

Vicki

I think the fact that they want to travel is great. That they want to drive - not so much. Does sound like your husband has his head in the sand about their abilities. If you really are concerned, maybe you can contact the Drivers' license bureau in their state and ask what can be done.

I took Imitrex tablets for my migraines.
On one hand they are a lifesaver when you find something that actually works when you are in the throes of a migraine.
On the other, they have serious side effects and the shots have more than the tablets.
I hope your daughter is seeing a doctor on a regular basis..keeping an eye on her blood pressure and heart.

I would concentrate on her and let the adults ( even the really older adults) enjoy themselves.

Hi Vicki,

I had the same feeling with my Mom at Thanksgiving. Just watching how little balance she had when getting in and out of cars, and fumbling with the seat belt. It hit me in my gut - that sense of how frail she really was.

Vicki and others facing the driving issues - I work in health care. In our location, our local hospital has a program to assess elders driving skills. They use Physical and Occupational Therapists, do sight and hearing tests. Then they recommend levels of driving safety - full liscense, daytime driving only, etc.

They are very respectful of elder drivers and counsel them about what is safe for them. You may want to see if such a program is available. I agree with Grantop that this will be a sensitive subject, and one best approached by their son or daughter.

But most people recognize that they wouldn't want to injure others. If they don't feel like you are trying to just restrict their driving, they may be willing to have a driving assessment. The hospital based program is a nice approach, because it looks at it from a health standpoint and what they can do, rather than from a Liscense suspension and what they can't do.

Not sure if this is helpful, but I know you are raising these questions out of a sense of caring and concern.

I read this thread with interest. I think, vicki, you need to talk to your husband, let him see the light and then, he and his siblings should deal with this together.

Vicki you don't come across as mean spirited in the least bit. I would encourage them to travel as long as they are interested. I feel that it is healthier for them to make an effort to get out than to hide away at home.

The driving is another issue. If your FIL has stiff joints and difficulty getting in and out of the car, he has no business driving. There is no way that he could quickly respond to a situation where he may need to brake fast. For the safety of other drivers and pedestrians, it is the responsibility of your husband and his siblings to take action on this immediately.

Vicki, this might sound like a dumb question - but has your daughter had a full spinal scan? Reason for my Qn is that my cousin has excruciating cluster migraines from an injury to c2 &amp; c3 that she wasn't aware of and her Dr told her that is frequently where really bad headaches start.