Swimming w/dolphins: bad idea?
 

I just finished reading something about how dolphins are "harvested" to supply swim-with attractions, and it wasn't pretty.

In summary, the piece said dolphins are trapped, then the younger ones are taken from their pods and mothers, while others may be killed or injured during the hunt.

I'm not some raving environmentalist, but if the story is true, that sure takes the shine off the swim-with idea. Has anyone else heard or read anything like this?

Yes, it's a bad idea. These mammals should be seen and appreciated in their habitat.
-Bill

There have been several threads on this in Fodors lately-search "dolphin swim".

Observing this in several places in the Caribbean and in a huge National Park in Cozumel- I was underwhelmed myself.

They are in very large screened / fenced areas and the people to dolphin ratio is too much, IMHO.

When I swim in my lake in Michigan I am often accompanied by one huge turtle, scores of blue gill and perch in my face etc. But I wouldn't do a dolphin swim because it just seems too forced and artificial to me.

I've read that their longevity is actually longer than in the wild, but what about the quality??

Yes, it's true. I actually saw a show (don't remember which channel) that showed the dolphins being trapped. They force the dolphins to swim toward the shore, then trap them in shallow water. Several of the dolphins were killed or injured--the water was red from blood.

I've always been intrigued by dolphins and had planned on scheduling a dolphin swim into our Mexico vacation, but after seeing that show, no way!

It is a horrible thing. If you do a little research you will find all kinds of information why it is bad practice.

You can see dolphins, like you can whales, by taking a boat trip and seeing them in their natural habitat. You don't need to swim with them held captive at Dolphin World or whatever.

Almost every time that I take a morning walk on the beach I see a pod of dolphins. No matter how many times I see them it's still so exciting. Sometimes they are just cruising along. Sometimes if the sun is out they take turns jumping straight out of the water and over the waves. To put one of these animals in pool would be a crime. I understand the desire to swim with a dolphin, but it's so forced and artificial. I think once someone sees a dolphin in the wild and with their family they would never want to see them in a pool. That goes for trained orcas as well. One of the child actors ( who is now an adult) from the TV show Flipper is working really hard to get abused captive dolpins released.

These are wild animals. They're doing this becuase they've been captured and are being forced to. It's not their idea and given the choice they would undoubtedly rather be back with their pods. And most die within quite a short time of capture.

Another thing that some people overlook is the potential for an injury to the swimmers. These are large animals with nice sharp teeth - and are not domesticated - that's why they make you sign a waiver of responsibility before you're allowed to take part.

They are incredibly cruel. I did it once and have been sorry ever since. No matter how clean or nice it looks, more than half of the dolphins die within 60 to 90 days of capture.

In order to make an informed decision, please visit:

http://dolphinproject.org/

http://www.hsus.org/ace/11727

(The second site is the Humane Society of the United States' position on SWTD programs.)

<I've read their longevity is actually longer than in the wild,>

I don't think that is correct (well you may have read it somewhere but I do not believe that it is accurate or fact), I'm pretty certain that statistics show dramatically shortened life spans in captivity.

My roommate in college worked for a legitimate scientific organization that studied dolphins. They had very strict rules on when you could interact with them. Their skins are more delicate than you think, and no one was allowed to touch them unless their nails were filed down low and smooth. You could not wear jewelry, perfume, sunscreen, or even deoderant. I seriously doubt the commercial "swim with dolphin" programs bother to have or enforce these type of rules to protect their dolphins.

Then you have the marine mammal entertainment centers that "accidentally" allow wolphins (killer whale-dolphin mix) to happen. This does not occur in the wild. At worst, they are deliberately tampering with nature to create an exploitable commodity; at best, they don't care enough for the dolphins to keep them seperate from the killer whales.

I hate, hate, hate, these type of organizations.

I am pretty sure the dolphin isn't benefitting from the practice. That's how I always kind of decide on issues such as this.

I've just looked up the longevity issue. Lifespan is 25 to 40 years but very rarely do they reach 40 in the wild. But if you count all the diseases etc. resulting from captivity, it is about a wash. So says two sources I read, but I do not think they know- nor is that definitive. Still it is a forced and captive life regardless.

There are actually quite a few species that live longer in captivity. My cockatiel is one. He's 24 and would never, ever have lasted that long in his homeland. Parakeets in Australia only last 2 years.

This was an interesting thread. It has always been one of my dreams to swim with dolphins, but after reading this I think it will have to remain a dream.

While I think it would be appealing on the one hand, what it would take to make this happen would destroy whatever joy I would gain from it. I don't know how people can overlook that, but I guess many do because it's a booming business.

Living near the beach, I know I always get a thrill when I catch a glimpse of dolphins out beyond the waves or swimming along the bow of a boat. They are beautiful animals and should be left in the wild where they belong.

It blows me away that attractions like this, or Sea World for that matter, are so popular. Video of dolphin and whale capture are heartbreaking, and I don't understand how the general public who flock to these attractions can ignore the facts raised in this thread. How can anyone think it's okay for marine mammals to live in tanks so that people can watch them jump through hoops or swim with them?

You are right that swim with dolphin programs are big business. It's so popular w/ tourists in the Caribbean that resorts pay fisherman to capture wild dolphins. I saw were one resort had 2 sick dolphins in this tiny filthy pool. It was so bad that the government had their navy rescue them and set them free.
I'm sure the people who pay to swim with dolphins wouldn't do it if they knew the situation.

Well, the good, and I'm not sure that the "good" out weighs the bad, but being able to get that close with the animals makes some people actually aware of them for the first time and begin having the repect for these animals that they deserve, and more respect for nature in general. The downside is, that these programs do NOT benefit the animals that actually have to participate in them. I can't remember where it was but I walked over the the site where people were swimming with the dolphins, and the pools that these animals had to live in were much too small..it was horrible. Personally, I think their has to be a better way to raise peoples awareness. I would never participate in one of those programs.

I don't believe there is any consciousness raising possible in a person who would do such a self-indulgent thing, except possibly for someone who realized how wrong it was, like one of the posters above.

As I posted earlier, I did this years ago and have suffered with my conscience ever since - so much so that I have made it kind of a mission to do what I can to help educate people how bad the swtd programs really are.

I learned along the way that berating, scolding, name-calling and insulting aren't nearly as effective as providing legitimate information to people so they can see for themselves what the issues are and make their own decisions.

In my case, I had wanted to do it for years but had the nagging feeling it was just wrong. Every time we vacationed, I checked into the places that offered it and passed.

Finally, in about 1993, I found a place in the Bahamas (UNEXSO) where I could do an open ocean SCUBA dive with a dolphin that I was assured "could come and go as it pleased." Only after paying $150 along with 30 other suckers to watch the obviously-very-hungry dolphin perform stupid stunts for food for a half an hour did I find out that the reason they always come back is that they have lost the ability to hunt and obtain food on their own in the wild. :(

So please, do educate yourselves (and others) about this practice.

(As an aside, I know of NO legitimate research centers that allow in-the-water interaction with their dolphins and the public.)

Don't get me started on Sea World. "Breakfast With Shamu" is beyond disgraceful...

Instead, how about diving with dolphins in the wild? This was a big reason I learnt to dive (my husband's main reason was to dive with sharks). You get to see dolphins a lot on the boats to and from dive sites, playing in the bow waves, and then very rarely you get to see one underneath the water. They look really muscley under the water - more intimidating than sharks, actually, and they move so fast you can feel the whoosh as they whisk past you. You can tell when a dolphin's coming because all the fish scatter, whereas they don't scatter nearly as much for sharks!

I honestly don't know much about the swimming with dolphins industry, so I appreciate the posts.

In Georgia, we have the Dolphin Project, a diverse mix of volunteers from around the state (and a few from outside) that goes on about four weekend observation trips a year (a few more are held just for taking photos). We usually leave from Savannah or Hilton Head. We go out in small boats among the marshes and literally look for dolphins. We watch them, take photos and record their activities.

We never, ever feed or physically interact (nobody ever gets out of the boat) with the dolphins. Nor do we chase them down. Some days we see dozens, on others, there are none. Sometimes, they may come near the boats out of curiosity, flip their tails at us and then take off. It's really something to see. These dolphins are pretty much all Atlantic Bottlenose dolphins and the population is very stable.

The data is sent to a professor at the University of Montana, Bozeman, who is tracking the habits we've recorded along with the photos.

Go to www.thedolphinproject.com for more information. It's a non-profit that's been around since 1989. It is NOT an activist or political group.

Wow, is this an eye-opener!! I was in Cozumel a couple of years ago and we passed on swimming with the dolphins because it was so expensive. I thought that if we ever went back we would do it, but you all have talked me out of it. Thanks for that.

Well, thanks for all the responses, though I didn't anticipate quite so many.

I think most people look at captured dolphins and orcas in the same way they look at monkeys in a zoo -- a restricted but seemingly comfortable life attended to by trained people who know how to care for them. I'm not saying that depiction is accurate or not; it's just the perception.

So, what about zoos? Are they any different from "pools" that hold dolphins? Why or why not?

Yes, they are very different from zoos.

Firstly, the monkeys and other animals at reputable zoos are almost always from captive breeding programs or within the zoo network where they regularly "trade" animals for exhibit. Captive dolphins are almost always wild-captured.

Secondly, many (not all, certainly) zoos try hard to replicate the animal's diet and even their habitat as accurately as possible. Dolphins are fed dead, frozen fish loaded with antibiotics to try to kill all of the various diseases they pick up from the people they interact with and the unsanitary conditions in which they are kept. (Where do you think all that dolphin feces in those little "tanks" goes?)

Thirdly, zoo animals are NOT forced to interact with humans in order to be fed or solely for entertainment's sake. If the animal wants to go inside or behind a knoll or a tree, they can. The dolphins are FORCED to perform in order to eat and cannot get away from the loud, ogling tourists, the blaring music and the (sometimes) unwanted attention.

ONE dolphin brings in an estimated $250,000 per year to these programs. Anyone who thinks they are education-oriented and not money-driven is misinformed.

Yes, you could tell just by the pricing etc. that they are making $$$ on the animals, so it isn't about them but about the "owners".

There are zoos and there are zoos. I happen to know a lot about this one since I have been a docent and presently am a Brookfield Zoo(IL) member.

Many zoos are not humane. But also the alternative in the wild for some species is so bad that it is a blessed alternative. Also there are some extremely dedicated and responsible people who do their best to give the animal the best diet, life/health and choices it can have.

I am not a big fan of small habitat zoos like Central Park or Lincoln Park in which the animals are caged and YOU walk a realitively small area to look at THEM. But if I raise my opinion I am always nay-sayed.

I have to say that I'm very happy to read everyone's opinion here. Fodor's has many enlightened posters.
Diane, it's been most interesting to read your post since you have done a swim with program. If you felt it was wrong after doing it that says a lot.
The zoo question is interesting also. There is such a wide range of zoo habitats that it's hard compare. I think that zoos like the San Diego zoo do a huge service with their breeding programs. Some animals species would be wiped out if it weren't for some zoos.

Stella45,
As a child we (my cousins and I) regularly swam with porpoises (which is what we called them then) in Perdido Bay, Alabama.

My grandmother had a summer home there, and during our visits we children would row boats all over the bay.

The porpoises followed us and frolicked about, and we often jumped into the water and let them swim around us. I don't know why, but we certainly weren't frightened of them.

This has nothing to do with the subject of this thread, but your comment about diving with dolphins reminded me of the fun we had years ago.

Byrd

Progressive countries such as the United Kingdom no longer have dolphinariums (since 1993). Similarly, Brazil, Israel, the state of South Carolina in USA and the state of Victoria in Austrailia have also enacted legislation making it illegal to keep marine mammals in captivity.

Why is South Carolina the ONLY state in the US to ban this?

Call your senator and ask why.

Diana

I thought this was something I would like to try but after reading a post on the Caribbean Forum decided that it was a seriously bad idea.

My sister swam with dolphins with her children in Florida a couple of years ago and was planning on trying it again. I sent her your links and while her daughters are still pleading with her to do it again she is refusing.

Without the information you posted she'd be swimming again next week.

keep up the good job!

Agree with all on dolphins, we've sought them out in the wild, and really ahd a ball with them swimming under and around our boat for quite a long time, but would not do a captive swim.

Re: the Central Park zoo, it was, when I was growing up, a model for horrible zoos, tigers pacing back and forth in 10 ft cells and all that.

But a few years ago it was completely redone in the "natural habitat" mold, and though they have far fewer animals (no more tigers), the ones they do have get much more space and are in natural surroundings.

For Diana -

I just wanted to clarify what I said about "legitimate" scientific research: It was a research program run by the state university and my roommate worked there. They were all scientists and doctoral candidates from the University. They only touched a dolphin when necessary (such as medical reasons). My point was that noone - not even the doctors - were allowed to touch a dolphin unless they had specially filed their nails and were devoid of deodorant, perfume, makeup, etc. - all because the dolphins' skins are much more sensitive than most people realize. This was NOT a "play with the dolphins" program, and noone from the "public" was allowed to visit. I was trying to point out that legitimate research centers realize how delicate the dolphins are, unlike commerical centers. If a member of the public were allowed to swim with a dolphin, it aint legitimate.

OK. I haven't read this entire thread. Normally I do. I used the browser's search and didn't find any talk about something worse than swimming w/dolphins : our Navy using them to locate and explode bombs. Yes, I know that a human life carries more value. I'm all for that. What's the big deal with swimming w/dolphins - by comparison??

J_999_9- If you want to swim with dolphins, just swim with them in the wild. I was snorkling in the caribbean one time and a couple came right to me. It just depends on the personality of the dolphin, some swim away from you, some swim to you. Dolphin Watch Cruises are a waste too. I see tons of dolphins in the water close to shore from standing on the beach in North Carolina. You could go out swimming with them there.

alya - Thank you SO much for your help. You made my day! :)

jolie - The program you cited sounds absolutely wonderful, and I only wish there had been something like that around here that I could have participated in. In my post, I was referring to someone who said they felt some of the swtd programs contribute to public education.

TripleSecDelay - Your question is more than answered in this thread and about 50 others over on the Caribbean side.

To all - Thanks so much for your input in this thread. I was really heartened to read all of the positive input about other alternatives to the captive programs. I've encountered dolphins spontaneously in the wild many times.

In May of this year, we went to Isla Mujeres in Mexico, where they have a particularly nasty swtd "attraction." The fisherman who took us past the place during a snorkel tour said that because most of the tourists to the island are Europeans and NOT tolerant of this practice, it's not doing very well. (By and large, the majority all over the world of people who visit the swtd programs are Americans.)

He said it was possible the park may discontinue the practice since they were meeting with a lot of opposition.

Unfortunately, the dolphins of Puerto Aventuras (close to Cancun), rode out the recent hurricane in a hotel swimming pool. :(

I agree with all of the above opinions condemning the swtd programs!

From asdaven: " I see tons of dolphins in the water close to shore from standing on the beach in North Carolina. You could go out swimming with them there."

When you see a pod of dophins heading up or down the OBX coastline, they're usually following a school of fish. To suggest people join them is idiocy.

Dolphins typically swim beyond the breakers and point of safety for even the most experienced swimmers.

But more importantly, dolphins aren't the *only* predators tracking the food source. Sharks are prevalent though less noticeable, especially in the early morning and at dusk.

Wow - I read alot of these posts and they really do surprise me. I do agree that probably the majority of swim with dolphin programs in the Caribbean are poorly run and cruel to the animals. However, I believe that such programs held by accredited institutions like SeaWorld are permissable. Accredited zoos and aquariums stop taking animals from the wild for exhibit a long time ago - since the late 60's/early 70's. 75% of the dolphins you see at SeaWorld Orlando were actually born, right there. The others either came from other SeaWorld or other accredited zoological parks. Also, that's one way in which zoos know that their animals are at least fulfilled in their lives - they are eating and they are breeding. SeaWorld Orlando has one of the largest Atlantic Bottlenose Dolphin Breeding programs in the U.S.

I've read several of you talk about swimming with dolphins out in the ocean. If you approach any marine mammal in U.S. water within 150 ft/48 meters, you're actually breaking a federal law - the Marine Mammal Protection Act. So by accredited institutions like SeaWorld providing these opportunities, people get a once in a lifetime opportunity to see and interact with these awesome creatures upclose.

Poster Diana - Breakfast with Shamu is a character breakfast where a guy in a Shamu suit, joined by Dolly the Dolphin and other SeaWorld characters comes to have breakfast with family, especially those with small children. What's the harm in that?

The harvesting of dolphins or any other animal is inhumane and cruel.

Poster Jolie - animal hybrids like the wolphin occur in nature often - where do you think mules came from. And it's not a killer whale or orca that mated with the bottlenose dolphin, it's a false killer whale which is much smaller that an orca. However, orcas are just huge dolphins anyway - they are all related in the family Delphinidae.

It really does aggrevate me when people get down on zoos and aquariums - especially SeaWorld. Did you know that Anheuser-Busch, which owns the SeaWorld parks, rescues more animals than any other organization in the world?

SO long and thanks for all the fish

" So by accredited institutions like SeaWorld providing these opportunities, people get a once in a lifetime opportunity to see and interact with these awesome creatures upclose"

Just because self-indulgent humans want to "interact" with a marine specie doesn't meant they should.

Is there no end to the feeling of entitlement we have about the planet and its resources?` SeaWorld is a theme park, first and foremost. Please don't forget that. Saving animals is okay as long as it's good business and keeps the tanks stocked and the kiddies happy.

By interacting with animals, we are learning about them and from them. I think dolphins are just as curious about us as we are about them. I don't think this is self-indulgent at all. If it is, then every dog, cat, fish, pet and horse owner is "self-indulgent", because at one point in time, these were all wild animals too.

In order to get a permit to have an interactive dolphin exhibit, an organization must adhere to the standards of education and conservation set forth by the AZA and other associations like it. A big part of dolphin educating at zoos and aquariums is letting people know about the MMPA so that if they do encounter a dolphin or other marine mammal, they know to keep their distance and preserve the animals and their environment.

SeaWorld is definitely a theme park and they are in the business to make money, as is every other entertainment venue. Since 1970, Anheuser-Busch has rescued over 13,000 animals. Many of these are endangered or threatened species, such as sea turtles and manatees. Having income from SeaWorld makes those rescues possible - 99% of those animals probably would've died without rescue. Most of the animals that are rescued don't even go on exhibit - so it's not about keeping the tanks stocked and kids happy.

Capturing wild animals to put on exhibit is inhumane and cruel. All of the animals that we see in zoos worldwide today, and our very own pets, too, are either themselves or the descendents of animals that were at one point in time captured. I don't agree with this practice at all. But my feeling about accredited zoos and aqauriums and the animals that they have now is this - let's learn from the past by not repeating it and learn all we can from these animals while we can, and save some along the way, too.


Man, I feel like I'm writing a book! Sorry for the long post but this is something I feel very strongly about and believe is worthy of discussion.

Of course if you are scuba diving, what ever happens to be in the water with you is what you will come across, be it dolphins or sharks. We seem to give dolphins and whales a "magical" quality, and I include myself in that but you have to remember that these are wild animals, just as if you were visiting the African plains. I saw a program on Animal Planet a couple of years ago and it was about dolphins and I have to say they are NOT always the sweet, curious, friendly, creatures we like to see them as. Some of them can be quite territorial and agressive, particulary when mating. So, I am glad to hear of anyone that has encountered dolphins while diving and have had a good experience, but keep in mind that it may not always be so.