Relocating: Phoenix, Houston, or Dallas
 

I currently live in the Northeast and I'm looking to relocate. I'm looking for a strong economy. I'm moving without a job lined up, so I want a place where I can find a job quickly. I'm also looking for a place where I can live as a non-driver. I don't drive (medical reasons, will never be able to drive). And I want a low cost of living. I've narrowed it down to these 3 cities and I'm looking for advice.

Phoenix is my dream city. But the unemployment rate (just below 7%) is the highest out of the 3 cities I listed. However, the unemployment rate is much lower in Phoenix compared to where I currently live. I also prefer a desert climate, so Phoenix wins in that category. Phoenix has the light rail. They also have buses on all the arterial streets that run every 15 or 30 minutes.

Houston has the strongest economy. The current unemployment rate is just below 6%. They also have a lot of jobs in my field. Like I said, I prefer a desert climate. But I wouldn't mind Houston's humid climate either. My biggest thing is wanting a warm climate.

Dallas: At 6.3% unemployment, the economy is somewhere between Houston and Phoenix.

As far as the Texas cities are concerned, Dallas has a better rail system. But it appears Houston has the better bus system.

You might want to add Albuquerque to your list. (5.8%).
They also have a good bus system and the UNM is along Central Avenue which was the old Rt. 66. http://www.bestplaces.net/city/new_mexico/albuquerque
My advice would be to spend 4 days M-Th in each city looking for a job. Sometime Friday head for the next city whether by bus or Amtrak.
The drawback to Phoenix is that it no longer has a direct Amtrak connection. The Amtrak trains pick up and discharge in AZ in the middle of the night.
Good luck on your job hunt.

What is your profession? That may make a big difference.

Albuquerque has high rates of unemployment for most types of workers - I don't care about published % since that doesn't include people who have given up looking for work and are underemployed. aAlbuquerque has a definite winter, with cold but sunny days, very cold, below freezing nights and we do get snow.

If you need medical care, ABQ isn't the best place for it. Not enough doctors and waits to see the ones that accept new patients.

Between Dallas and Houston, I would choose Houston every time. More down-to-earth. Cost of living should be broadly comparable between all 3 cities.

Agree that profession may be the deciding factor.

The field I'm hoping to get into is GIS, and I also have some experience with urban planning. I recently graduated college and I'm not currently working in my field. I'm doing unrelated temp work through a temp agency right now. But I'm waiting to hear back about an internship in my field (the internship is up north, where I currently live).

I'm not moving immediately, but I plan on moving in the near future. And I'm willing to work outside my field. I'm even willing to work a minimum wage job while I get on my feet in a new city.

It's ironic that someone mentioned Albuquerque. I went to college in New Mexico (but my college was in Las Cruces). I realize none of the cities I listed are known for their public transportation. But I got by in Las Cruces without a car. If I could live without a car in Las Cruces, it would be a cakewalk to live without a car in Phoenix/Houston/Dallas.

Well, there is certainly a lot of GIS work in the Houston area.

Personally, I wouldn't even entertain the thought of living in any of those cities without a car.

What is GIS?

<i>What is GIS?</i>

Geographic Information System. Basically mapping on steroids that integrates a lot of data, using the location (both in space and time) as the key variable upon which everything else revolves. Useful for things like urban (or rural) planning, space exploration, pollution remediation, and mineral extraction.

<<Between Dallas and Houston, I would choose Houston every time. More down-to-earth. Cost of living should be broadly comparable between all 3 cities.>>

Sheeyoot, between Dallas and Houston, I'd take Dallas every time and twice on Sundays. Houston is just an unholy transportation and urban planning mess (no zoning) and the humidity makes it a hellhole in the summer - 98 in Houston is worse than 103 in Dallas (although 110 in Phoenix is another story). The whole "uptight/laid back" issue is just nonsense. Houston also gets hurricanes on occasion, Dallas doesn't. And Houston's violent crime rate is 43% higher than Dallas'.

No Southern city of significant size has transportation options equivalent to NY, Chicago, Boston, Philly or DC, and none of the places you're considering are equivalent to Las Cruces - they're all far larger and you likely won't be concentrating your activities in the area of a college campus. If you have time, travel to each this summer and spend a few days. Start in Phoenix or Dallas with Houston in the middle (thinking Southwest flights - from Dallas you can't go nonstop to Phoenix, from Houston you can).

There's something else that might be worth mentioning: Even though I'm from the Northeast, I haven't been "spoiled" by NYC or Boston's public transportation system. My time in the Northeast has been spent exclusively in small towns.

As the father of a son looking for GIS work, I would select Houston

Oh and I've visited Phoenix twice. Only been to the airport in Dallas and Houston.

Having lived in both Dallas and Houston, I've got to chime in here and say that I think Big Russ's assessment is waaaaay off base. I'm not sure why he's so negative about Houston, but I absolutely love it here. Granted, we have humidity that Dallas doesn't--not that Dallas's weather is all that great in the summer, either--but apart from that, it's no contest. Houston wins over Dallas by a landslide!

Yeah I was trying to think about public transport. Phoenix has been developing it, but I think that would be so important to you.

I lived there for several years, and it's not for everyone - the heat finally drove me out.

I was never quite the same after it was 120 degrees on the same day that my car AC broke. Having a swimming pool saved me that day...

^

Regarding the heat in Phoenix: I think I should be able to handle it. I spent a couple of summers in Las Cruces. Granted, the summers in Phoenix last longer and get hotter. But I think the hottest day in Las Cruces is comparable to an average day in Phoenix. Las Cruces is typically in the 90s during the summer, but it gets into the triple digits on the hottest days. There was a time when I spent the entire day at an outdoor concert when it was 102 in Las Cruces. From what I've read online, it looks like the average high in Phoenix is around 104 in the summer.

If Las Cruces is like ABQ, we get hot during the day but once the sun goes down, the temps drop 30 degrees. , Phoenix doesn't cool off at night during the hottest months. I have been in PHX when it was still high 90s at midnight. And the hot lasts a lot longer in PHX.

Las Cruces is a higher elevation and not nearly as big as Phoenix so yes, it cools off a lot more than Phoenix at night.

Denver is warmer than you might think in winter, and it has a good light rail system.

Depending on where you work and where you choose to live, Houston has a growing metrorail system and decent bus service in the Downtown/Medical Center areas . . outlying suburbs would require driveing.

I like the heat, so I don't foresee any trouble in Phoenix (if I end up choosing Phoenix). But I guess only time will tell.

As for Houston, I've pretty much written off the suburbs. If I moved to Houston, I'd most likely live in the city limits. Even if I didn't live downtown, I hear Westheimer has good and frequent bus service. I've also researched some other pockets of Houston with good bus service.

Someone mentioned Denver. I actually looked into Denver. But I ultimately decided it might not be best for me. I know the winters are relatively mild, but they still get 53 inches of snow. And I've read stories (from reputable sources) about bus stops getting snowed in. That's a concern to me since I'd be relying on the public transit system.

Denver has a lot of opportunity for my career. But they also have a high unemployment rate compared to the other cities I'm considering. So I might have a hard time finding a job. Their cost of living is also higher than the other cities on my list.

I'm in Phoenix now and you really don't want to do the summers here. They run from like mid April to mid October and are hot, very hot. You open your front door to walk out and feels like your walking into an oven. The hottest part of day is around 4 pm. It's been getting to be around 107 or higher as an average and this lasts for most of the summer months. It doesn't cool off at night. For counting on public transportation don't count on it to highly buses never run on time so if you hope to get a 6 am bus you might get it by 6:30. They also don't connect with each other very well. You'll probably miss your connection and have to wait another 30 minutes for the next one. They aren't scheduled to connect. They also keep cutting service and routes while raising the fare. The light rail goes no where so if your counting on that be aware it doesn't take you anywhere. Think about doing all this in the HEAT that never ends. I am stating this from experience. And yes you do sweat out here too. I also believe the wages are less than in Texas. One last thing, you can talk to a lot of people out here and you won't find many that are happy being here. Not sure if this helped but hopefully gives you something to think about.

For a temperate climate with no snow, the SF Bay Area might be the ticket. Transportation is good, with private frequent bus services provided by major Silicon valley employers. However, housing prices are extremely high.

The Bay Area is great, but I would note that the cost of living in San Francisco is a bit more than double that of the places mentioned.

San Francisco is out of the question due to cost of living. Since I probably won't have a job lined up when I move, I want to go somewhere where my money will last the longest (just in case my job search takes longer than expected). I'm going to be living off my savings until I find a job.

Why would anyone simply move somewhere and HOPE to get a job?

<Why would anyone simply move somewhere and HOPE to get a job>

A number of reasons.

A lot of jobs won't hire you unless you're local. As much as I'd like to secure a job before moving, it is highly unlikely that someone in Texas or Arizona will hire me when I'm living in the Northeast. Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet and move somewhere, then focus on getting a job once you move.

There's been a recession for the past 5 years or so. We're just now recovering. Some states are doing better than others. If your state has a bad economy, it can't hurt to move to a state with a better economy. Right?

I also have goals/dreams. My goal/dream is to live somewhere I actually like (instead of living in the region where my family happens to be from). I'd be miserable if I spent the rest of my life where I currently live just because staying here is the less risky option.

I know it will be a risk to move somewhere without job. But I've also come to terms with the fact that there's really no other way to move.

I did it like that in 2000 when I decided to move to San Diego. I didnt have a job nor did I know anyone. Just packed up and did it. And it was.mostly great for 10 years and glad I did it.
Now toying with the thought of doing it again to a new place. Move, it will be fine no matter where you go.

Funny, I just read this a few minutes ago. Have a read and this may help.

http://blog.chron.com/opportunityurb...ard-of-living/

I live in Houston and work at the Med Center and DH is in the oil industry. A lot of people complain that there's not a lot to do in Houston - not true. You may prefer other places, depending on what you like to do but certainly plenty to do here. Between Austin, Dallas, San Antonio, and Houston, I always recommend those other cities first for tourism but there is still quite a bit to do here if you live here. Yes, Houston IS humid here but then again, so is Dallas. I myself prefer Arizona's dry heat versus the humidity but between the 3 choices, I would choose Houston anytime. If I were to move, I'd move to Colorado or out of the country. :-)

We do have a light rail system but it is only in a concentrated area (they are planning to build out more) but the bus system is perfectly adequate.

Wanted to add. It won't hurt you to try to apply for jobs before you come and make sure you note that you are willing to relocate. I'd hire someone from out of state if I knew they were wanting to move here...(and qualified for the job, that is). That will at least get you a head start.

I think that people who live elsewhere have a hard time appreciating just what a massive cost of living advantage Houston (and Dallas to a lesser degree) has over virtually every other large city in the US. For the most part, if you live in a big city, you could take your income, cut it in half, and still be "better off" in Houston.

agreed, travelgourmet. Seriously, have a read of the report. Very interesting. It is saying that Houston makes a case for the WORLD'S highest standard of living...from the Manhattan Institute.

http://www.manhattan-institute.org/pdf/cr_75.pdf

<<I think that people who live elsewhere have a hard time appreciating just what a massive cost of living advantage Houston (and Dallas to a lesser degree) has over virtually every other large city in the US>>

That's too true - on a scale of 100 being average, Houston and Dallas are in the 80s, NYC is over 200 and San Francisco scale # is probably close to the President's salary in dollars.

Still Dallas over Houston - good GOSH what a commuting fiasco the latter is. Still prefer the additional rail facilities in Dallas too.

BigRuss, have you taken the bus in Houston? I have, and it wasn't bad so am interested to know why you think it's a fiasco.

Thanks

<i>That's too true - on a scale of 100 being average, Houston and Dallas are in the 80s, NYC is over 200 and San Francisco scale # is probably close to the President's salary in dollars.</i>

Let's not exaggerate.

Taken from the web:

You would need around 3,814.35$ in Houston, TX to maintain
the same standard of life that you can have with 5,500.00$ in San Francisco, CA (assuming you rent in both cities).
This calculation uses our Consumer Prices Including Rent Index.

Median income in Houston is $40,000 while it is $71,000 in SF.

<i>Let's not exaggerate.

Taken from the web:</i>

Other sources give different numbers. Sperling's (bestplaces.net), for example, says that the $40k median income in Houston equates to $89.5k in SF. And Sperling's ignores differences in state and local taxes, which would have a significant impact too.

Other sources support the Sperling numbers. For example, Trulia reports median home prices for all properties in Houston of $82,540. For SF, the same number is $760k.

In my estimation, I would say that Houston is easily a fair bit less than half as expensive as SF or NYC, at least for those on lower to middle incomes. The numbers converge a bit when you get way up there, as show homes in the Houston area can be pricey, though you will get far more space and "luxury" than you will for a comparably-priced property in SF.

If I had that sort of money, I would live in SF too! ...but that wasn't the OP's question. :-)

<i>If I had that sort of money, I would live in SF too! ...but that wasn't the OP's question.</i>

That's funny, because I always say the opposite.

Whenever the Powerball gets above $300m, I buy a ticket. I figure that - at that level - the $1 buys me a chance to dream about what I would do with that kind of scratch and I get $1 of amusement out of it.

The one thing I always say is that I wouldn't want to really "live" anywhere and that I would travel extensively. The problem, of course, is that some state will try to sink their teeth into you and extract their pound of flesh. And I always thought Houston was a good solution to that problem. I always figured I would buy a nice place in Houston (maybe River Oaks) and establish that as my primary residence. A nice place to store stuff, low taxes, and a large airport that I can use as a launching point for travel. It is kind of perfect actually!

Of course, Houston is also my solution to the problem of "getting sick of my job and want to scale back", because I know I could cash out of my current house, pocket half the equity and take the other half and buy a quite nice house with cash in Houston. With that out of the way, I could find a low-key, if low-paying job that covers the basics and take comfort in the ready availability of cheap and yummy eats that litter the Houston area.

What about Austin, Texas? It is often ranked as a livable city in many surveys.

Phoenix, IMHO, is blistering hot 6 months out of the year. And is drab. If you like the color brown then that's your town. On the other hand, we have friends who moved there and the cost of living made home buying a reality for them. They loved the schools.

I would certainly spend some time in each place before deciding.

I was interested in Austin. But the high cost of living (at least by Texas standards) caused me to shy away.

When I lived in Las Cruces, I actually liked the brown scenery.

Like I said, I've already visited Phoenix. But I was leaning toward not visiting Dallas or Houston. I feel like you can't truly get to know a place from a short visit. I visited Las Cruces before moving there. But I didn't really get to know the city until after moving there. I think it would have been just as well if I didn't visit.

Also, travelling would really dip into my budget, even if done cheaply. I feel like my money would be better spent if I just saved as much as possible so I'd have a financial cushion when I move.

With the huge data processing used by the Oil Companies and Geophysical Data Mapping companies that support them, I would think Houston would be your best bet for finding employement

Op, dallas and houston love to hate each other. I'm born and raised in dallas so I can say that. It is JUST sibling rivalry, so take it with a grain of salt. I will say, not driving is an issue in all the cities u mention. Good luck! We'd love to have you here!!