NYC w/ son and his "future chef" girlfriend
 

For my son's 18th birthday I am taking he and his steady (of 1 yr) girlfriend (Liz, also 18) to NYC for 4 days/3 nights, Dec. 27-30. It is Liz' 1st time to NYC. I got a great travelzoo special on Millenium Broadway, $249 a night, and booked two rooms.

Liz is great, I love her. She is applying to chef schools; both she and my son graduate high school this yr. She loves cooking and food presentation, has been studying it in classes outside of school for 3 yrs now. She is taking me (!) to the D.C. Food show in Nov. and has gotten us tickets to see Bobbie Flay cook there! (Liz=girl after my own heart) Son and Liz are both very excited about the trip and are fine w/me planning some surprises and giving them time to roam on their own too.

I want to make this trip special for my son and her. I have booked tickets for shows (Gypsy for the 3 of us; In The Heights for the 2 of them alone). I want to plan some food things for us (and them alone)to do. They'll also want to explore the city.

Both are good world travelers (she is military all over EUrope; my son has been to Asia and Mexico,and NYC 3 times, total of 15 days in NYC) and I feel comfortable letting them go w/a subway map, $$, and their cell phones during the day.

I am thinking of taking them to Chelsea Market. I've never been there. Can we explore it on our own or should we do the food tasting tour?

And if we do Chelsea Market alone, maybe the food tour of the Village (new for me too)?

I am taking them to Mesa Grill for son's birthday lunch on the 29th (she takes me to cook w/Flay, I take her to eat at his place). I am thinking of a pre-theater dinner one night and a post-theater dinner another night. Where to go though? Don't want to spend a fortune but something reliably good and a little creative would be great.

Maybe fit in Zabars?

They will do the Irish tour at Tenemant Museum- maybe I'll meet them at Katz' deli after that? Is Gus pickles worth a stop (or Russ and Daughters)?

Would love to pepper their sighseeing in lower Manhattan w/some food places to stop and nosh and buy along the way too.

Anxiously awaiting your insights!

oh, just thought about a walk through the Greenmarket on Sat...

I need help getting the itinerary for each day for all of these goodies!

We have Sat. noon through Tues. 6 pm. in the city, taking train into Penn Sta. (and have theater Sat and Sun night).

First of all - be sure to start watching the new season of Top Chef, which was filmed in NYC this past summer - lots of locations from the show will be fun to see in person.

I live near Chelsea Market - in fact I do most of my vegetable and fish shopping there, so it's not so special to me. But in the past 6 months it seems to have exploded with walking tours. Others here have written about them - all I can say is that I wouldn't pay more than $20 or so to have a walk thru tour. As for the greenmarket in Union Square in December, it won't be particularly interesting, not a lot of product, there is a holiday craft market that takes up a lot of the space, and if the weather is bad, not my idea of a good time . . .

If I were to pick one great, different place that's food oriented, in December (other than Zabars) I would take her to Kalyustans on Lexington and 28th Street. http://www.kalustyans.com/
It has an incredible collection of foodstuffs from around the world, primarily from India and the Middle East - I can easily spend an hour there just reading labels.

You might want to do a search for Aduchamps wonderful list of great food resources and stores - that was a terrific list and thread he started.

I also live right near Mesa Grill - it's good but not fantastic and haven't seen Flay in there in quite a while. I think you might have more interesting food at Bar Americain - which is also closer to your hotel. And I have heard he's there sometimes (but not much). look at the menus on www.menupages.com and see which you like better.

What are the kids' favorite cuisines? I'm sure we can come up with cool, fun, delicious suggestions that follow their interests.

Otherwise, I would suggest some of the newer, food-forward places in the East Village or Lower East Side - Momofuku Ssam Bar, Prune, Ippudo, wd-50, Falai . .. .

Or maybe at L'Ecole, the restaurant at the French Culinary Institute might be fun for her to experience - www.frenchculinary.com

I did a 'food' walking tour of Bleeker Street last year when I was in NYC and really enjoyed it. We went into several specialty shops and had tastings at each. We had a professional chef in our group and she really enjoyed it too. I would recommend it. I'm sure you would all enjoy it. If you don't an organised tour you could easily do the same thing by yourselves.

mp, the French Culinary Institute looks like so much fun for a meal prepared by the students! She would LOVE that! I knew this was available in Hyde Park at the CIA but did not know about the FCI. Thanks so much for that info.

And thanks for the tip on Bar Americain. I was not familiar w/that Flay restaurant til you mentioned it. I guess my lack of being more up to date re NYC dining shows. I loved Judson Grill and went there 4-5 times a yr while in NYC for work until it closed. I actually was thinking if Judson was stil open, I'd take the kids there one night. I see that Bar Am. is in that space, although it gets uneven reviews. Have you been there? It is closer, as you say.

All I can say about Kalustyan's is WOW, double WOW. Never heard of it. You are helping me get up to date! I am restarting the draft of the itinerary based on your suggestions.

I'll be sure to watch Top Chef too, all great info. And I totally spaced in it being Dec. re Greenmarket- I usually travel to NYC in fall and spring when that market is timely and nice.

baysidegirl, thanks- I think you went on one of the food tours I was talking about. I am not sure if we should do that or just wander to these places on our own. My son and I are not tour people, it might go too slow for us and neither of us like to deal w/other people on tours like this when we have a limited amt. of time in a city. And the NYC food tours take 3 hrs. each

I am taking all of the replies to heart. Thank you!

Any more thoughts?

oh, and as for their favorite cuisines, my son (6'6") will eat anything beyond concrete, but he actually loves nice flavorful fresh food, meats, seafood, is easy to please (my cooking is at top of his list, esp. my rack of lamb w/mashed garlic and dill potatoes, and my veal loin chops w/fresh pomegranate chutney). Liz, I think, is into presentation and plating (she has had a course in plating already) and healthy good food, not too over the top, but inventive. And they love to share a dessert that we'd never think of making at home.

I love nice subdued lighting (am very light sensitive) in a restaurant.

How about popping up to Hyde Park to the Culinary Institute of America?

First thing that came to my mind was L'Ecole, too. We have been a couple times and while the menu is not especially avant garde (they are learning the basics, after all) everything was quite nicely done and my guess is she would enjoy it.

Another place that is a personal favorite but certainly not a trendy spot is Cibo. The chefs are committed to doing things well - never had a bad meal there - and it is a great example of a place that is about the food and not the hype. Service is gracious and friendly, and the prix fixe dinner is a great deal. www.cibonyc.com

sobster, nice idea- I have alwasy wanted to go to CIA. I have a wonderful aunt in Hyde Park and her husband (my uncle) passed away last year. I am trying to get her to come to NYC on the train from Poughkeepsie to stay in NYC w/us for a day and overnight during our time there in Dec.-- so kind of a reverse of your idea of us going to Hyde Park.

If the relationship btwn. the kids survives a year of college, I think I will take them to CIA in summer 2010. But I think it would cut into this NYC time a bit to much to do it on this trip.

Seamus, I will check out Cibo.

Great ideas, I appreciate it, and keep them coming.

You don't need a tour of Chelsea Market but the tour of the village with foodsofnyc.com might be fun.

Someone did a self-guided tour of the lower east side on chowhound that you might want to consider. It's in this thread. http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/493333

It's easy to do Bar Americain for pre or post theater.

I think David Burke & Donatella has some of the best looking "plating". They do prix fixe lunch and brunch.

Asiate in the Mandarin Oriental also has a bargain lunch for $24.

Sounds like a great trip.

mclaurie, I was hoping you would reply. Long time no chat. It does sound like fun, doesn't it? A sort of "theme" long weekend in NYC w/some of my favorite people.

And a big =D> =D> =D> =D> for that chowhound self walking tour!! Absolutely marvelous info there!

((Y)) ((Y)) ((Y)) ((Y)) ((Y))

mclaurie, those pics of the plates at davidburke and donatella are to die for! Liz will be speechless - that looks like a must for this trip.

emd - happy to help . . I went to Bar Americain a few times when it first opened and liked it very much - we LOVED Judson Grill too.

You might like Telepan - Bill Telepan's 'new' place. He opened it after he left Judson Grill. I've only been once - I like most of the food, but found the atmosphere and space a bit . . . i dunno, not weird just . .. weird. A funny mix of older, UWS people and a sort of strange layout of connecting rooms. We also had very bizarre service - but that was early in its run. Check it out: www.telepan-nyc.com

I laughed at your description of your son, boy do I know what you mean - my 14 year old is 5'11' still growing and is a competitive swimmer - living in NYC, we can't afford to take him out to restaurants anymore - he wants to order apps, 2 entrees, side dishes and desserts! We think we should make him eat at home BEFORE we go out!

Mclaurie's davidburkeanddonatella suggestion is a good one. But maybe if you want to splurge, and she's into plating, the place for ne plus ultra, influential in American cuisine, beautiful and delicious food would be Gotham Bar and Grill. Still great, after all these years.

mp, I had no idea Telepan had opened a new place. Re your comment about the dining layout-- it is interesting that on the website they have lots of pics of chefs cooking in the kitchen, but none of the dining space. The menu looks more edgy than Judson's. I did like that open, high ceiling dining at Judson (the space that got the review comment: "A room so vast and vaulted you expect them to be announcing Trailways departures."

Will check out Gotham, I've never been there. The pics of the fresh artful plates on the website are making me very hungry for this early in the morning!

I am finalizing plans and making reservations for the trip. Have fit in a visit to either Zabars or Kalustyans.

We are going to Mesa Grill for Sat. brunch at noon as soon as we get off the train. Then we will catch a little something to eat after seeing Gypsy that night. Where to go?

Monday, my son's birthday, we have a Tenament Museum tour at 12 and then will split a couple of sandwiches at Katz and do some of the walking tour in Mclaurie's link above. We have 8 pm dinner reservations at L'Ecole (thanks to the recommendations above- looks perfect), then to Top of the Rock at 10:30 pm.

I am undecided about dinner on Sun. night. The kids are going to see In the Heights at 7 pm, so we'll eat after they get out of the show. I don't want to do anything as pricey as Gotham or David Burke. Any other ideas about post-theater dinner that night? We are staying at the Westin Times Square, so somewhere in the theater district would be good.

Thank you MP for the compliment. I have updated the list and amended it with some suggestions and criticisms from fellow posters.

To EMD's son and friend. Please visit the ethnic stores and restaurants of NYC. Creative American has spread throughout the country but you will not find an assortment of ethnic food like you will in NYC.

These are most of my favorite food stores. This is as highly subjective and geographically limited list you will find. The majority of stores are below 14th Street.
Stars indicate that either I went there at night or they are better than the others on the list. There are scores of excellent places that are not on the list, so exclusion is not necessarily condemnation but it could be.
Tourists can use this to put together their own food tour, buy stuff during the day for a feast in your hotel room at night or for gifts. One time we were flying back from Milan and we purchased a cake there and shared it with family when we landed.


Bagels and Bialys
Just because it is round, does not make it a bagel. There is a lot of crap being sold. A bagel must be boiled before it is baked. The ones with pimples on the bottom, like those you get at the sidewalk carts, are steamed. The ones you get at Dunkin Donuts are white bread in a circle, Rachel Ray.

*Ess-A-Bagel
Various Locations
My personal favorite. There are Ess-a-bagel people and the H & H people. Ess-a bagels are yeasty while H & H are sweet because they add sugar. Ess-a Bagel is a bit of a play on words and means eat in Yiddish. The stores are crazy busy and there is a wide variety of spreads. Once mammoth, the bagels are smaller recently.

H & H Bagels
Various locations but the one Second Avenue is not related and is plain awful
As discussed above with long lines. An Upper West Side institution.

*Kossar’s Bialys (Established 1935)
367 Grand Street
What is a bialy? Originally from Bailystok, Poland and called Bialystoker Kuchen (cake). And yes, Mel Brooks stole the name for Max Bialystock. It is most and doughy, much like the perfect pizza crust but with an indentation in the middle for either bits of garlic or onion. Try their bulkas which are bialy dough in the shape of a hero or an onion wheel also called a pletzel. An onion wheel is round and thin covered with duh onions, or the other version poppy seeds. Toast it, butter it, and keel over dead.

*Murray’s
Various Locations
Murray’s knows how to make bagels, chewy and large. The lines usually move quickly.

Bakeries
Amy’s Bread
Various Locations
The breads are well prepared and my favorite is the black sesame. I have never seen the same kid behind the counter twice, thus the staff is not knowledgeable and some seem confused by an order.

*Balthazar
80 Spring Street
I guess they could have made the space smaller, but then only your hand would fit through the door. Unlike the restaurant, the bakery deserves the praise for their baguettes and croissants.

Birdbath
223 First Avenue
Yes, it is a stupid name and the place has all the charm of a company store at a gulag but it is a sister to City Bakery. They make fabulous almost everything including a pretzel croissant. They only offer about 10% of what can be had at the City Bakery and there is no place to sit and eat. Stay away from a new creation a vegan banana sesame thing with agave. Besides having no taste, it dryly crumbs in your mouth. A rare mistake for Maury Rubin. The staff here and at City Bakery has not been told that space program was discontinued.

Blackhound
170 Second Ave
Very expensive but good as a dessert gift. The cookies are delicious and everything looks tempting some things are not as good as they look.

*Blue Ribbon Market
14 Bedford Street
There is not a bad bread in the house. They are made across the street at Blue Ribbon Bakery, where you can see the ovens on the basement. (They also have a interesting bathroom.)
Pick anything.

*Bouley Bakery
130 W. Broadway
Every time I go there I try something different. My current favorite is the saffron bread. It is so delicate you can taste the saffron. Everything is outrageously expensive you can either pay your student loan or buy a slice of cake.

*Clinton Street Bakery
4 Clinton Street
Not only is this bakery but a great place for brunch which is impossible to enter on weekends. They may make the best biscuits in town followed closely by their scones.

*City Bakery
3 West 18th Street
Try the hot chocolate melted from chocolate bars or the pretzel croissants or the baker’s muffins or anything laid out on the counter. Extremely crowded at breakfast and lunch. Celebrities have been spotted but unless they are disguised as spoon I have not seen any.

DeRobertis (Established 1904)
176 First Avenue
It has the original tin ceiling and tiled walls and floors. Be selective in what you order, order nothing chocolate but the lobster tails, cannoli, and pignoli cookies are good and they are known for their lemon and orange things. (I am sure it has a real name) They hollow out the fruit, then fill it with a sorbet and freeze the whole thing including a peel lid.

*Donut Plant
379 Grand Street
I do not know what they do but the donuts taste so much better than just about any other place. He also makes excellent churros. The valrhona chocolate is a monument to gluttony. Small storefront with bakery in back.

Eileen’s Cheesecake
17 Cleveland Place
That’s all she makes so she better make them well. Not the best but very good.

*Falai Paneterria
79 Clinton Street
Former pastry chef turns out the most delectable and eclectic breads such as pumpkin or fennel. The croissants are excellent. I guess his mother told him not to waste his education so he also makes fabulous pastries. Never leave without a bombolini, an Italian donut/fritter filled with either jelly or crème.

Fat Witch Brownies
Chelsea Market
They make the fudgy type and they have a few variations. Staff is pleasant but sloooow. They have tourist buses that stop at Chelsea Market, so the lines may be long at times.

*Financier
Various locations
In the food wasteland that is Wall Street, Financier knows how to make cakes and croissants. They are often crowded but the staff doesn’t know ganache or panache.

Junior’s
Various locations
Stick to the cheesecake and the rolls.

*La Bergamonte
169 Ninth Avenue
For many years this was in the middle of food nowhere. Now with the Chelsea Market and the fattening of the Meatpacking district is getting its due. Extremely fine croissants and pastries and a place to sit

Le Pain Quotidien
Various locations
A chain from Belgian which makes it Belch. The baguettes are wonderful as are the brownies and raisin whole grain bread. This is probably the best food of any chain. The staff however, is laconic and unknowledgeable and very often there are out of many of the popular items. Nice brunches.

*Little Pie Company
Various locations
Their sour cream apple walnut pie is akin to crack cocaine but only a little cheaper. The other pies are good but not in the same category. People start lining up for Thanksgiving on 4th of July, so order in advance.

Patisserie Claude
187 West Fourth Street
Patisserie Claude has been selling pastries to Pig Warren for a long time. We do not go often by when we do we are rewarded.

*Payard’s Patisserie
1032 Lexington Ave
Everything is well made and delectable, particularly the truffles. Never had a pastry that disappointed. They also have a dining area inhabited by ladies who lunch and seemingly never go home.

*S & S Cheesecake
222 W 238 St, Bronx
Could be the best cheesecake in the city, creamy but not dense, perfect,

Steve’s Authentic Key Lime Pies
204-207 Van Dyke Street, Red Hook
This is place is hard to find when you are standing in front it. Fortunately the silky pies can be found at Citarella and other self-defined fine stores.

*Sullivan Street Bakery
533 W 47th Street
You have probably eaten there breads many times and didn’t know it. It is offered in scores of restaurants and markets. You can identify many of the breads by sight. They are brown and crusty will the inside is light and airy. A paradigm for carbs.

*Veniero’s
342 East 11th Street
Established in 1894 some of those people are still waiting on line. I love this place, the best inexpensive tiramisu, addictive ricotta cheesecake, moist pignoli cookies, there are scores of offerings and no losers. The take out staff is never the same and the lines are long for the café. For Thanksgiving and Christmas, the café is turned to a waiting room for take out. They use an old fashioned machine to wrap the string around the box, while quaint, adds to the interminable line. You can also call in an order.

N.B. You can take your cupcake fight outside. We have tried many but a winner has yet to be named.

Candy and Chocolates

*Economy Candy (Established 1934)
108 Rivington Street
I am not sure they make anything on premises but they do have every candy still in production at very good prices. If you are a fan of candy stores, you will want to be buried here.

Evelyn’s Hand Dipped Chocolates
4 John Street
The best value for hand made chocolate in NY. It is clearly not the best, but most candy is made by hand and Evelyn can be seen slipping in and out from behind the counter. The cost is a fraction of the top notch candy stores. This is the type of place you find in a quaint town with quaint people. This 9/11 survivor should be supported.

*Jacques Torres Chocolates
Various Locations
For some reason people know the Brooklyn location better than the one on Hudson Street. Their truffles are exquisite as are all the chocolates and the hot chocolate. The lines are extraordinary on Valentine’s Day.

*Kee’s
80 Thompson Street
Kee was a banker or a lawyer before she started making the best truffles in NYC. Some are Asian influenced each variety is better than the next. This is a must stop for chocolate cuckoos.

*Teuscher
Various locations
Truffles are flown in from Switzerland. I once bought some for a chocolate loving friend who about to get married. While eating the truffles, this modest woman was made sounds that are usually reserved for her husband. Although she was completely embarrassed, I knew I bought the right gift.

There are many chocolate stores in midtown that make exceptional products but I have not enough experience to add them to the list. These include Richart, Maison du Cholat, and Pierre Marcolini. Just turn your pockets inside out for a taste.

Cheese
Alleva Diary (Established 1892)
188 Grand Street
Not as good as its neighbor DiPalo but extremely offers a fine selection of Italian cheeses.

*DiPalo Dairy (Established 1925)
200 Grand Street
One of NY’s great stores. Not only are the cheeses spectacular but sell perfect prosciutto. Their selections are impeccable. If at all possible avoid the weekend crowds, even though they have adults behind the counter.

East Village Cheese
140 Third Avenue
His cheese must fall off the truck to charge the lowest prices in the city. There is always some $2.99 per pound special. For that price you will not get the best, but at least you will be filled. The staff has become nicer over the years but not much. Cash only.

*Formaggio Essex
Essex Market on Essex Steet.
That should be enough Essexes. This is a tiny outlet from a Boston company. The cheeses are excellent but they have to vats where you take a bottle and fill it with a vinegar sherry or olive oil and both are redolent and extremely flavorful. There is some rules about deposits but I am not good at rules. The Essex market is a poured concrete structure with many stalls selling veggies and Hispanic staples with a barber shop in the back. Do not be deterred that it looks like pig farm from the outside.

*Joe’s Dairy (Established 1925)
156 Sullivan Street.
If you do not like Joe’s you do not like New York. They have been making mozzarella for over 80 years and the smoked version is addictive. The store is tiny, tiny, tiny and the staff is family and know their stuff and the neighborhood. One time I bought my mother-in-law a smoked mozzarella here. The next time I saw her she said she cut off the outside because she thought the outside was burned.

*Murray’s Cheeese
254 Bleecker Street and another in Grand Central
Best in show. They carefully choose only the finest quality of every variety. The staff is cheesemongers, one is even a gossip monger. The ricotta cheese cake is worth going to jail. This is a must visit for anyone who has the slightest interest in cheese.

*Russo’s Mozzarella (Established 1908)
344 East 11th Street
Cleverly they make fresh and smoked mozzarella which are excellent but they also make pastas, sauces, and there own olive varieties. Cramped but the guys know what they are doing.

Ice Cream

*Cones
272 Bleecker Street
In 1986 an Israeli newspaper sent a reporter to cover the NY Mets in the World Series because they heard there was a David Cone. He isn’t related to this place either. Sweet creamy, fresh ingredients with many varieties. Many tourists happen upon it when eating at John’s Pizzeria.

*Australia
Various Locations
You will not believe this is a chain. The ice cream and truffles are rich and creamy and taste freshly made. Be sure to have the hot chocolate. The take their chocolate ice cream, add a little milk and then melt it by using the steam attachment on the cappuccino machine. Silky is the only word.

*Chinatown Ice Cream Factory
65 Bayard Street
Store made ice cream which for wimps offers vanilla and chocolate since they also serve flavors like green tea, lichee nut, and my favorite almond cookie. The kids behind the counter are always nice. There is no better way to end a meal in Chinatown. Inexpensive but cash only.

*Il Laboratorio de Gelato
95 Orchard Street
Everybody claims their gelati is the same as in Italy, blah, blah, blah. Their gelati is like Italy. It is the type you eat four times a day as you walk around Rome or Florence before you realize you have ruined your appetite for dinner. Expensive and cash only.

Sundaes and Cones
95 East 10th Street
They have nothing to do with just Cones and is a shade below, But if you are in the neighborhood, the store made ice cream is creamy and offer interesting flavors.

Knishes

Yonah Schimmel (Established 1890)
137 East Houston Street
Yonah has been dead for a long time and they have not redecorated or cleaned the windows since. If they made great knishes the owners could be considered knish savants but they are not. The knishes you buy at sidewalk carts, however, are shaped like third base, taste worse, are fried and often a green patina inside. Yonah Schimmel’s, you always have to say both names when referring to the store, still makes the baked variety and may or may not have the all types on hand.

Kitchen Supplies

* Broadway Panhandler
65 East 8th Street
They finally moved closer to Broadway. This is good for the semi-serious chef. There is an excellent selection of knives and pans but half the store is dedicated to stuff you use once or cutsey-poo crap.

New York Cake and Baking Distributor
56 W 22
Has what every serious amateur and professional baker needs, flour, pans, cookie cutters, etc. The quarters are Spartan and the staff acts like they just found a cure for cancer.

My favorite store Bridge Cookware has left NYC for the wilds of New Jersey.

Food Markets
Unless otherwise noted these places are expensive or very expensive.

Agatha and Valentina
A large department features hard-core Italian cold cuts like soppressata and hot or sweet cappicola, while the cheese department sports a huge number of offerings and loads of free samples. The prepared foods section also has a thick Italian accent and is among the more interesting in the city.

*Citarella
Various Locations
One of the best spots for fish from standard stuff with gills to razor clams. Knowledgeable fishmongers. Same is true for meats. Their prepared foods are universally good with outstanding soups. The collect bread and cakes from various but good places.

Dean and Deluca
Various Locations
The original food museum. The fruit is laid out to be admired, as are the cheeses, breads, and cakes. The main location on Broadway always a line at the espresso bar. Prices are highrt than buying a stale bagel at the airport.

*Eli’s
*Eli’s Vinegar Factory
Various locations
Eli had a fight with his family at Zabar’s and opened up a much more expensive food market. When you look at the prices, you think you are in a foreign country and miscalculated the exchange rate. On the other hand, every thing here is outstanding.

*Fairway
Various locations
Cheaper than the others
The fruits and veggies are outstanding as are the meats, fish, and store made breads. They also carry reasonably priced groceries. The Brooklyn store has food counters with an outdoor eating area with a view of the Statue of Liberty. But the food choices are not for the huddled masses yearning to breathe free.

Grace’s Marketplace
She is the daughter of old man Balducci, who was such a difficult character, she opened her own place. Physically it resembles the long gone Balducci’s on 6th Ave, but retained the good qualities such as the prepared meats and excellent meat, fish, and produce selections.

Manhattan Fruit Exchange
Chelsea Market
Best veggie value in town. Crowded, crowded, crowded. Cash only

*Russ and Daughters (Established 1914)
179 East Houston Street
A new generation has taken over with the same pride and dedication to smoked fish as their aunts, uncles, and grandparents. Sable, white fish, lox, gravlax, it does not matter they are all mouth watering. Try the chopped liver, it is full flavor.

*Zabar’s (Established 1931)
2245 Broadway
Another NY institution with a well deserved reputation. The prices are cheaper than almost those above but the quality is the same or better. Large cheese selection, fantastic prepared foods, the claim to sell more coffee than anyone in NYC, store made knishes, breads and cakes from the best purveyors, Zabar’s brand spices and olive oil (this is known as one of the best buys anywhere.). The lox slicers reportedly make $85,000 a year. And upstairs is a cookware section. The staff is wonderful but the clientele is often obnoxious and aggressive. Sharpen your elbows and fight for the tri-colored pate.


Meats
*East Village Meat Market
139 Second Avenue
It helps if you speak Polish but you can get by in English. Old fashioned butcher shop where every thing is cut upon request. They also make great, great kielbasa and in many shapes and types and smoked hams. Relatively inexpensive.

*Faicco’s (Established 1900)
260 Bleecker Street
They make their flavorful sausage, rice balls, sauces. You get the old schmooze from the guys behind the counter as well. If you like old fashioned Italian butchers who know what they are doing, this is the joint.

Pasta

*Raffetto’s (Established 1906)
144 W. Houston Street
They cut fresh pasta from sheets to your specification in front of you on a machine that looked obsolete 50 years ago. Not a gimmick just the freshest, tastiest pasta yet. They have many types including saffron. Cash only.

Pickles

*Gus’s
49 Essex Street
The model for Crossing Delancy. They having produced perfect pickles and peppers for almost 100 years and have been on the same block as The Tenement Museum since 2002
A must for any food tour. And usually offer a free pickle.

*The Pickle Guys
49 Essex Street
Some employee defected from Gus’s, the pickles are perfect as is the spiel. They also offer a free pickle. There are barrels and barrels of sour, new, half sour, pickled peppers just calling your name.

Spanish Provisions

Despana
408 Broome Street (Original at 86-17 Northern Blvd. Queens)
Excellent chorizos and morcilla. The are incredibly tasty and are found in many restaurant around town. Their cheeses are also top notch and offer a wide selection. They also offer Serrano ham which is many respects is sweeter and more delicate than porsciutto.

WOW, that is just a PHENOMENAL list, Aduchamp1!!!

Surely this deserves "Fodors Classic" status!

=D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

My printer is getting hot just printing this list.

Anyone have ideas for after theater dinner on Sunday night? I am looking at Chez Josephine, based on escargot's recommendation from her 1/08 trip report. But I wonder if there is a fun place the two 18 yr olds might like more.

Thank you, I hope it helps them enjoy their trip and expand their view of food.

Can only second the reco for Zabars. The kitchten wares department upstairs is phenomenal.

And the food is excellent - prepared or fresh.

Be sure to take a number at the prepared food/meats counter or you'll stand there forever. And don't be shy - or you'll never get anything - grab a basket and wade into the mob.

Oh - and don;t forget the jams/jellies/preserves/sauces department. One of the few places in NY where you can always find Tiptree Raspberry Seedless.

A &quot;future chef&quot; should not miss Chef Wylie Dufresne's amazing, inventive cuisine at <b>WD-50.</b>

www.wd-50.com

Sounds like a great weekend you've got planned!
Two places I've wanted to try for after theatre dining are both kind of funky, but fun - one is Yakitori Totto -it's a Japanese bbq meat skewers supposed to be really good - it's open after 11, it's on 251 W. 55th St. bet Broadway and 8th, on the 2nd Floor.
The other is Taboon, a middle eastern place with great breads and dips and meze - but I don't know if they're open too late on Sundays.

There is always the korean bbq and dumpling places along 32nd St (I like Mandoo, or Cho Dang Gol. Or maybe Artisanal for fondue?

You can read more about these places on www.menupages.com or www.nymag.com

Looks like those recommendations are coming together beautifully. L'Ecole is a wonderfully economic solution to good food. Ippudo is a great choice for Japanese food - their ramen noodle dishes are well priced and the atmosphere is a lot of fun. I also agree on the Korean BBQ idea, especially on a cold night, as a way to change pace. I like Won Jo.
For something really nice, you may also want to consider lunch at Gramercy Tavern (dinner is expensive).
If seeing food markets is high on your list, you can't miss chinatown! It's utterly fascinating.
Bon appetite!

You all are amazing! If I wasn't planning to take my son to Peru for 12 days at spring break, we'd go back to NYC so we could try all these places!

Will let you know how it goes and where we end up, and how we like it all.

fantastic list, love the humor!

emd, I don't think Chez Josephine will suit in the food department. DH and I at there after the theater a few weeks ago and the food did not live up to our expectations. It wasn't <i>bad</i> but I wouldn't spend one of your mealtimes there. The place is fun, though, and instead of a dinner I'd go for drinks at the bar. Nothing wrong with those!

I agree that the food at Chez Josephine is not that exciting but the atmosphere is fun and there's live music. There are not many places within walking distance of the theaters for inventive (and relatively inexpensive) food.

For an after theater snack, either the Modern Bar at MOMA or Gordon Ramsay's London bar at the London Hotel would be fun for them to see and both are trendy and considered very good. Benoit is another idea in midtown not too far. It's not cheap but if you have appetizers and dessert or share a dish or 2 it wouldn't be bad. You could just head to John's pizzeria which is right near the hotel and a NYC classic.

You could also consider heading to another area like Soho or the lower east side for places like Balthazar or Stanton Social.

Definitely skip Chez Josephine ... many, many, <i>many</i> better options in New York City.

We are leaving tomorrow early a.m. on the train for this trip. Had a rocky time 2 wks ago where son broke up w/girlfriend and I wondered what I'd do w/all the tickets I have bought for her, but within 2 days he realized his mistake and they were back together.

Will report back on the food and plays (Gypsy, In the Heights), tenemant museum's Irish tour and the walking tour of food in that area suggested here, etc.

emd:

Looking forward to your trip report.

Sandy

&quot;Had a rocky time 2 wks ago where son broke up w/girlfriend and I wondered what I'd do w/all the tickets ..&quot;

Holy smokes! Hope all goes well. Have a great time!

There is an ice cream store that makes its own rocky road.

Bring umbrellas and rain gear - looks like it will be mild and rainy this weekend . . would love to hear how it all goes!

Also - small independent stores are really hurting - i've been talking to a lot of shop owners, if ou can try to purchase from local, non-chains, if you can!

OK, we are back! Had an amazing time and used many of your tips.

1) We stayed at the Westin Times Square in a junior suite. This was a great room for my son, his girlfriend, and me. It was 440 sq ft, and had a king bed w/LOTS of room all the way around it, a wall in front of the bed w/a large flat screen TV, you could walk around either side of that wall into a living area w/queen size sofa and two large lounge chairs, desk and desk chair. On the side of the wall facing the living area was another flat screen TV, so there is one on each side of the wall.

Son slept on sofa bed which was unusually comfortable. Liz and I shared king bed. Room was on 45th floor w/great view of the west river. Foggy 1st two days but then had wonderful views. Bc we had a suite, we had access to the club lounge and free very good breakfast each morning, and free appetizers (substantial enough to make a small meal) from 6-8 pm, w/$5 wine, beer, or cocktails. We hit this up every a.m. and on Sat. and Sun for a mini-pretheater dinner.

2) Weather very cooperative. Foggy and in the 60s on 12/27 and 28, then cooler on the 29th and cold on the 30th - but not like some cold Decembers in Manhattan.

3) Crowds not bad on 12/27 and 28, but started building on the 29th. Although the hotel as in Times Square area, we were out in the other neighborhoods on all days. But it was nice to have the location after the theater, a short walk back to the hotel.

4) Mesa Grill as soon as we got off the train on Sat. for brunch. They had a power outage in the dining rm and we ate by candle light which was nice, as it was foggy and sort of dark outside. It was very busy when we arrived at 11:30, already a line of people w/reservations for brunch. I had the chili rellenos. It was marvelous, unlike any I had ever had before, cornmeal crusted, light, filled w/roasted eggplant and manchego cheese, w/a pretty and sweet red pepper sauce and balsamic vinegar gracing the plate. Liz had the scrambled eggs chilaquilas, son had spicy scrambled eggs. They loved the buttermilk bisquits and I ate way too many of the green chili cornbread muffins. I had 2 bloody marys. What a great start to NYC.

5) After Mesa we walked it off, through Greenwich Village, Soho, Little Italy (got pastries to take back to the rm. and tried to get pepperoni at DiPalo's but the wait looked like an hour (Sat. afternoon). But it smelled good in there anyway. Walked down Broadway- kids liked the Yellow Rat Bastard store (next to Pearl River) and made several purchases there. We stumbled uopn the Leica Museum. Son is a photographer and got a new camera for Christmas and we LOVEd this musem. The curator was very nice and used to live a mile from where we now live in Northern VA. We bought some books of the two photographers on exhibit. GREAT photo exhibits here- esp. the 3D ones. Great surprise find.

6) Went to a &quot;mentalist&quot; show, the Quantum Eye, at 5 pm. I had gotten half price tickets on goldstar.com ($20 each) for this. It was a very fun and amazing hour and a half. This guy is good. There is a You Tube video on his website that will give you an idea. Currently this show is at 50th and Broadway btu it is moving in Feb. 2009
http://www.thequantumeye.com/

7) Saw Gypsy on Sat. night. Great seats, left orchestra 7th row, 3,4,5 seats off the center aisle. Tremendous show. My son said he got goosebumps in Rose's last number (when her lights go out).

8) Sunday I took kids down to Battery Park for 9 am boat to Ellis Island. I went over to Wall St. area and went to the new Sports Museum of America when they opened at 10 am. I understand the reviews have not been so good for this new museum but I really liked it. I like that they have areas for so many sports, not just the big ones like football (great Heissman trophy exhibit w/info on each winner), baseball, basketball- but they have a nice swimming area, race car driving, hockey, figure skating, track and field, an area deciated to women's sports, extreme sports, boxing, golf, horse racing, etc.

I learned a lot about sports I didn't know all that much about. I liked the theater presenation and all the interactive exhibits. I pretty much had the place to myself on Sun. a.m at opening. Also there is a very good shop. I got my husband a very nice felt banner w/all the Red Sox championship years on it, and a vintage looking red sox shirt I have never seen anywhere before.

9) Then met the kids for lunch near the WTT area. We did not go to the visiting area- we were to far away from it when we realized it was way on the other side of the site. There is so much construction going on now, I wondewr how long it is going to take to build the memorial and new skyscrapers.

We went to Century 21 for awhile before it got too crowded. Then walked to Canal St., the kids wanted to go. We walked through Chinatown and saw some strange sights on the seafood st.- my son spent a lot of time photographing a trash can full of frogs for sale and a woman who was picking thru them, holding them up and examining them to get the best ones.

10) We split up around NYU and I found a fantastic nail place, Jay Nails, 100 Broadway, to get a manicure/pedicure and 20 min. back rub. By far the best pedicure I have ever had- she wrapped my feet and legs up in some kind of peppermint and menthol salve and wrapped saran wrap around my legs. They got very warm then very cold. It took all the pain from walking for hrs out of my feet and legs. Back rub was so good, I was almost asleep. I'd go back to this in a NY minute.

11) Kids went to In the Heights Sun. night and I went to Mam Mia. They lvoed theirs; I did not like Mam Mia. Very short on story, esp. after seeing Gypsy. I have never done this but i walked out at intermission and didn't go back. Instead I went over to Charley O's on Broadway for Sun. night happy hr, drinks $5 til midnight. I sat next to a nice young man fro Louisiana, 22 yr old, and his wife. This bright young man is a seargent in the army and is in charge of tactical operations for over 100 other young men. He is leaving for 10 months in Iraq on 1/5. We talked for hrs. and at the end of the evening he gave me his &quot;defend freedom&quot; rubber bracelet, telling me to pray for him and send positive thoughts while he is in Iraq.

12) I got hot fresh knishes and baklava from a bakery(I think on 8th, down by Port Authority) and took them back to the room at midnight. Where else buy NYC can you do that. We all munched.

13) Monday was a great food day. We went to the Lower East side to the Tenement Museum for the Irish Moore tour. My husband is Irish and son had been to Ireland w/him a few yrs ago, so this was great. We tried to go to Gus' for pickles but it was closed. We walked over to Essex St market and got great cheese (very stinky, like roblechon), spicy pepperoni and sausages at Jeffrey's meats (what a hoot Jeffrey was- he waited on us and after 20 min of talking he was asking me to have his child in return for some good meats he didn't have out in the case- where else but NYC does that happen to a 50 something woman), olives, some little spicy peppers that are supposed to be good for cooking in vegetable dishes, breads, etc.

Then on to Economy candy and then Katz for lunch. I had a couple of Patz' brews and we shared a sandwich since we had dinner planned for that night. We stopped in at Russ and Daughters deli for pickles since Gus' was closed. Then walked all the way through the Village and up 2nd to the St. Marks area. There it was, we stumbled upon Chocolate by the Bald man, Max Brenners. I had read about this in escargot's NYC trip report last yr and wanted to go and here we just stumbled upon it. Had hot chocolates and of course bought some mix and beautiful chocolates to bring home. Kids loved St. Marks area and all the cool shops there.

We cabbed it back to hotel, dressed, and made our 8pm dinner at L'Ecole. The server was not so great, kind of tight, but a nice female waitress befreinded us and when I told her it was my son's birthday and Kiz is going to be a chef, she took them on a personal tour of the kitchen to meet some of the students from FCI who do the cooking. We had the 5 course prix fixe dinner ($42). 1st course consumme w/mushroom flan was very good, the monkfish and wild stripe bass 2nd courses were good. But the short ribs and duck 3rd course were way oversalted. The pineapple lemon curd tart, pistacio creme brulee, and pumpkin spongecake w/mild chocolate mousse dessert were very good. Pol Roger Brut champagne was also good.

14) I went to the Blue Note from dinner to see Chris Botte, kids went to Top of the Rock. I hate the attitude at the Blue Note. I was there at 10 pm and got treated like doo doo although I had a reservation. I hate being smushed up at the little tables w/three people on each side in 3 ft of space. I hate how long it takes to get a drink. But the show was good. I keep thinking I won't go back there, but there I was.

15) GREAT NY DAY! I LOVE walking around NYC and just shopping and discovering and eating and meeting people.

16) Monday we had til 4 pm. Kids went to Wolman rink in Central Park. I walked up to the park, then down 5th Ave. to see some of the windows at BGs, Lord and Taylor, Saks. Walked down to Macys and back to the hotel.

17) after I got the kids off at Penn Station I took the Metro Norht up to Hypde Park to see my aunt. Took her to stay overnight on New Yrs Eve at Belvedere Mansion. GREAT place! We had a two bedroom suite in the Stone House, just lvoely w/big fireplace which was great bc it snowed 6 inches. Wonderful dinner in the main mansion which was all decorated. Loved this place, the workers and owner were so nice and accomodating.

18) Getting ready to go eat some of the stinky cheese and pepperoni now w/some champagne. Happy new yrs, and thanks for the help w/the trip!!

P.S. And it never rained!

emd what a great trip!!! and a terrific report! I think whenever people ask NYC stuff, we all should just automatically respond with this and neopatrick's threads. I'm really glad it all worked out for you.
So funny you were in Hyde Park - we were there the 10 days before, for a swim meet.

Glad you a good time

Aduchamp, because of you we went to Essex St market, Russ and daughters and some of the other places on the list. I have your list and am keeping it and I think I will get it laminated and take it on EVERY trip I ever go on to NYC from now on! YUM, you know the good stuff.

Also, mp, thank you for the L'Ecole recommendation. And thank you Seamus for validating that recommendation. L'Ecole is a very good deal for a 5 course dinner, and the private tour of the young students cooking in the kitchen was a highlight for Liz and my son. Here we were in NYC and someone really went out of their way to give them a unique and meaningful experience on my son's 18th birthday.

Also, I think Liz was a little overwhelmed by the amt. of $$ I was spending on this trip and it was good for her that I chose (w/your help) a place w/a moderately priced menu. She is such a sweet girl and she was totally blown away by NYC.

I LOVE NYC. Where else can you walk and walk and never stop shopping, people watching, and eating your way through the city, and throw in some art and so much history. When I die and go to heaven, I hope it is just like NYC. And I hope they serve the same Bloody Mary that mesa grill serves, and have Katz' brew on tap.

What an awesome trip. Happy New Year and happy dining for 2009!