NYC - first timers
 

This is a rather broad question - forgive me if I should have found the info in previous posts/archives, as I didn't see it - We are a fairly well-traveled couple (Europe, Mexico, South America, USA, Canada) in our early 60s, but have never visited New York City. (Actually, I briefly lived in the lower East Side and in Brooklyn in the summer of 1968 - hardly remember any of it, for various reasons!)

We are planning a week-long trip to NYC in late September - early October, and are thinking it might be a good idea to look for an apartment or flat. I started looking through VRBO, but realized I have no idea of which neighborhoods are best for our needs.

We are good at using public transportation - subways in major cities (Paris, Madrid, Mexico City, San Francisco, Rome, etc.) have been easy and convenient for us - and we enjoy history, museums (not too much art in one week, though), ethnic foods, walking, getting to know locals and local culture. We're not big shoppers. Maybe one Broadway show would be nice.

I'm thinking we'll contact New York Greeters for a tour, and perhaps look for some other walking tours. We are both quite fit, and enjoy long walks.

Any suggestions as to where we should consider staying? Sights and events not to be missed? We aren't looking for super cheap accommodations, but on the other hand, we're not high rollers, either.

Thanks in advance for any information or ideas anyone might have - or for pointing me in the right direction for such!

When it comes to sights and things to do, a guidebook might be in order, especially for first time visitors.

One thing that is often overlooked is the subway art:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca/...7623088372713/

You figured wrong with respect to the NYC apt. rentals. They are a bad idea because many are scams or illegal.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g6...t.Rentals.html

You can use the search engine here also to find out more on the subject.

You picked an expensive time of year to go.

You have not mentioned your exact dates or nightly budget.

First, you need to understand that subletting an apartment for less than 30 days in NYC is illegal. there are many people advertising such. Quite a few are scams. Others are doing it despite knowing it is ilegla. The city is making an effort to crack down on this -but due to the number of apts involved what they can do is limited. But if neighbors complain about the problem - the city can - and has - evicted illegal tenants in the middle of the night. (When they shut an illegal hostel all the guests had to find other places to stay at 2 am.)

There are a few legal sublets - if the owner of a townhouse chooses to rent one floor out short-term - but this is rare and not easy to find.

Strongly suggest that if you want more room you check legal apartment hotels - Radio City Apts, the Affinia group and the Beacon hotel. However, these are ususally good deals - and often fill up months in advance.

And you should know that Oct is heading into high season and deals will be hard to find - so if you provide a specific budget people can make better recos.

As for where to stay - do you want frantic (Times Square) busy but residential (upper west side), trendy (SoHo or Chelsea), elegant (east midtown or central park south).

In any case the key point is proximity to a subway station.

As for what to see/do - my list would be

SoL/Ellis Island
Top of the Rock
the Met
Museum Natu; Hist
Staten Island Ferry
NY Historical Society
Grand Central Station
Main branch NY Library Reading Room
Explore central park
Several B;way shows
Lot of lunches and dinners at sidewalk cafe in different neighborhoods getting the feel of them

And you may well find the areas you used to live in are now uber trendy and ultra expensive.

Oh - and it's Big Apple Greeters.

Okaaaaay ... I get it. Maybe an apartment or flat will not be the way to go. The kitchen part is what always draws me to having an apartment - but perhaps that's not a possibility in NYC. What about other boroughs? Is the law the same everywhere?

Any suggestions for reasonable alternatives?

Had no idea that October was the beginning of high season.

Thank you so far for the info - even though it's kinda bursting my bubble.

We're just beginning to consider this trip, so we have plenty of time to make adjustments to our preconceptions.

No maybe about it. There are apartment style hotels. Radio City Apartments is one that comes to mind. I think Beacon is another company.

The "boroughs" are just as much a part of NYC as Manhattan

If you at least give your nightly budget, people can say if it's reasonable. Not expensive etc. descriptors are useless.

if you're thinking something to the tune of less than $100 per night, the Ramada in Newark (directly across from the airport) is an option. It's very clean. a shuttle will taxi you to the airport and a train will bring you into the city

Let's not recommend drastic surgery like staying in Newark to see New York unless absolutely necessary!

First, the area around Newark airport is a dump. Second, keep in mind the train option will cost two people about $50 a day round-trip!

We are thinking that about $1500 for a week's lodging would fit our budget. We don't want to be outside the city - i.e. Newark or near the airport - and thank you for the info on the boroughs being just as much a part of NYC as Manhatten is.

We aren't looking at VRBO apartments anymore. We get it that that is not a good way to go.

I will check the legal apartment hotels mentioned above.

What about the Gracie Inn Hotel? I looked at it for my family, but they didn't have a suite for us. They have a kitchenette. In late September, it came up at $199 before tax. Here's the address so the native NYers can comment: 502 East 81st Street. http://www.gracieinnhotel.com/

The other hotel that looked like a possibility was the Newton at $202/night. But I don't remember the reviews well enough here.

We stayed at an Affinia but I don't think they're as close to your budget especially for the time of year.

If you go for this kind of thing check out Air B and B...can find some good deals to stay that way, check reviews for the place! Have FUN!

NO. Do not check Air B and B unless you want to rent a room in someone's apartment.

The law applies to all of New York state. It might be easier to find someone willing to rent part of a house in the outer boroughs - but then it could easily take you an hour or more to get to and from the city.

The afinia group is a chain of hotels in converted apartment houses and all suites have basic kitchens, some full kitchens. As do Radio city apts and the suites at the Beacon - which used to be an apartment hotel. All are reliable - but check now since they sell out.

The Newton is a reliable budget hotel (you budget is very low for that time of year) but I don;t know if they have kitchen facilities. Oct is heading into high season and you probably need to spend more like $300 per night to get something decent.

<<<The law applies to all of New York state>>>

It does? I'm surprised by that -- obviously, the purpose of the law in NYC is to keep rental units for the regular population of renters, as opposed to vacation renters, since they're in short supply. But Elmira? Albany? Skaneateles? Is it really the same problem?

Don't know the conditions in other places - but it's a state law.

Your budget is not unrealistic but at that time of year it will be. The UN general Assembly, fashion week, and busy fall social calendar keep hotels filled and prices are based on supply and demand. I think you need to up the budget, change the dates or consider staying outside Manhattan in an easily commutable location like Long Island City in Queens, part of NYC and connected by subway. There are quite a few good hotels there near a subway like the Verve, Country Inn &Suites, Holiday Inn Mnahattan View, Fairfield In. Queensborough bridge (not the other Fairfield inn which ian't near the subway). You can be in Manhattan in 15 mins. Be careful though because not all the LIC hotels are near a subway station.

The Canal Park Inn is another b & b that I think is a bit nicer than the Gracie Inn and has one room that will fir your budget. http://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Rev..._New_York.html

Never heard of the Gracie Inn - but it's a very inconvenient location - not near any subway. Not familiar with the Canal Park but it appears to be stairs, not an elevator - which can be a PIA if you have to haul luggage up 5 long steep flights.

NY Traveler--If they are firm on their budget, I'm not sure they can do a lot better. I did check Affinia's site and they are well above $300 once tax is included.

The Gracie did appear inconvenient to me from a quick glance on the map last year but I didn't pursue it since they had a kitchenette (which we wanted) but no larger family suite available. I guess the real question is, would it be more convenient to stay there and be in Manhattan, or better to stay in Brooklyn right near a subway line? Also I am hoping you confirm whether the area is unsafe.

With either the Newton or the Gracie, it appeared there weren't many rooms left. If either are of interest to the OP, I'd get a reservation soon. I myself prefer to call the hotel in question directly and ask if they will pricematch expedia/orbitz/etc. and get a refundable reservation.

Regarding the Canal--I had studied a lot of the B&Bs and I remember that nice larger suite. But aren't some of them still getting hit with fines?

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.1075091

The Ivy Terrace, quoted in the article, has met all the new rules and reopened-- but their prices aren't listed on their website so the OP would need to call them: http://www.ivyterrace.com/index.html

Gracie Inn is right neat Gracie Mansion - the mayor's residence - and is in a very upscale neighborhood. It's just not convenient to the subway - at least a 10 minute walk to either nearby stop - Lex & 96th or Lex & 86th. The area is quiet at night - with shops a couple of avenues over.

I would think it more convenient to stay in Long Island City - if right on top of a subway stop - although the area around Gracie Mansion is MUCH more pleasant (multi-million dollar co-ops and brownstones).

It's just that I have lived on the far est side (although right by a bus route to work) and taking the subway from there was a pain. And tourists need the subway.

The Newton is a real hotel in a much more lively area - right near two subway lines and Central Park - and a lot of shops and restaurants. But not sure if there are kitchens.

and anyplace at a bargain price will sell out quickly - they can;t dawdle.

Is it essential that you need a kitchenette where you stay? We stayed at the Beacon last October which has a tiny kitchenette and it was one of the reasons we chose the hotel, but in the end, we didnt use it. We ate out for all our meals. We found New York too exciting to be sitting in our room for any length of time. We only used the kettle to make a cup of tea when we woke up and as we relaxed (with our feet up) late at night watching a bit of tv before going to bed.

It may give you more options to find something in your price range if you really didnt need the kitchen. Eating out in Manhattan doesnt have to be expensive either.

Hope you find something. New York is amazing and you will enjoy it. I would go back in a flash.

OT - october_fun, you have to come back, they settled the NHL strike!

Well, we are not finding much in the way of hotels we can afford in late September/early October. Most are in the $300-$400 range per night - well outside our budget.

We have two options: We can just go elsewhere for our week's vacation. It's my birthday, and we always take a week and try to visit somewhere new. Last year we flew to Boston and had a wonderful time on Cape Cod and in Boston. The year before we took a Caribbean cruise. There are plenty of cities and other vacation possibilities beyond NYC, and we obviously have plenty of time to plan.

Second option: We may decide to wait until August to make our final plans (we have airline vouchers, so no worries about airfare costs)and go with airb&b for an apt in NYC. I've looked at the recent news articles, as well as other information, and I'm not too worried about being "evicted in the middle of the night," as has been posted here by one of the regulars.

(I realize from perusing many of the topics/posts on NYC rentals on Fodor's that this entry may bring nytraveler close to apoplexy, but just take a deep breath, my friend. Everything will be okay in the end.)

The illegal apartment problem is that there are a lot of scams. Such as, you show up at the building and there is no rental apt, never was.

The chance of your being evicted in the middle of the night are small.

The chances of an apartment being a scam are significant. It has happened to people reporting on this board, on other boards, in the local newspapers (the doorman of one building reported he has european tourists looking for non-existant sublets at least once a week) and in real life. Late last year two young Italian women were trying to get into my building as I left for work. They had been scammed out of the cost of a 2 bedroom apartment in a luxury building for a week (paid in advance by wire transfer) and were in tears when they found out the apartment didn;t exist and their "host" wasn;t respoding to his emails.

Reports on Air B&B (yes, illegal and NYC is pursuing this with them - to require a notice on each NYC listing that it is illegal) are mixed. At some yu get what you expect - at others you don't. If you decide to go that route I suggest you get complete info in advance - include exact address of the property (so you can check on google earth), references from previous subletters and the name, land and cell phone numbers of someone in the building you can go to if there is a problem. Then do a reverse check to be sure the numbers are correct.

Problems reported her have included "rooms" that are closets with a mattress and a bath shared with 9 other people.

I'm not Nytraveler, but I've weighed in on this topic in the past too.
You might get something that exits, or you might fall to a total scam (as HappyTrvlr notes).Even AirBNB , VRBO etc do not verify all their listings and tell you tnat.
You might find a real apartment,but could be evicted, ratted out by neigbbors in the building whatever. It could also exist but be a dump, they may or may not live up to what you expect. You have decided that you're not worried about those things.
You would most likely be renting something that is illegal. That's your decision, of course, but don't expect that people will agree with your decision and help you out with vetting a place, commenting on the neighborhood etc. And of course you'd have nowhere to turn if the service is not as promised (no credit card or travelers insurance would cover problems for that situtation)
It is absolutely your choice to go that option, but if you do post about it,you can expect there will be comments.

By the way, NYC hotels are very high, I agree, due to supply and demand, Other cities in the U.S. (like Boston) and abroad are too. I've paid over $200 per night for a basic Hampton Inn in a corporate park for business trips. That's just how things are.
When I've come across that problem, for a leisure trip my option is to sometimes shorten the trip by a day or split the trip with part in the more expensive area and part in a less expensive city. I also have used free airfare as a reason to spend a little more on a hotel since the whole trip still comes in under budget. Just other options to consider...

It happened to friends after I'd warned them. Beautiful photos of a non-existent apartment.

Was it airb&b, HappyTrvlr? The reason I ask is that on their website airb&b says the owner is not paid until 24 hours after the renter has taken occupancy. I don't quite see how one could show up to a non-existent rental under those circumstances.

This is taken directly (cut and paste) from the airb&b website:


Secure Payments

All financial transactions are facilitated through our secure system, ensuring peace of mind for guests and hosts alike. We hold guest payment until at least 24 hours after check-in, to make sure guests are satisfied with their accommodations and to uphold host cancellation policies before payments are processed.

No it was not air b n b but it was posted on seceral well known sites.

<Well, we are not finding much in the way of hotels we can afford in late September/early October.>

I played with several dates for the two hotels I suggested to you, and they were available. Were things that you didn't like about them? If so, it might help us to know what you're looking for.

I'm still wondering if you really want a kitchenette if just the two of you. I presume you did not have one on your cruise. Restaurants are very good in New York.

There have been reports of Air BnB paying the host even if the guest objected to the property - as not being as promised. Don; t know if they have payed if the property didn;t exist at all. And are you sure that Air BnB accommodations you are looking at include a kitchen? The BnB part isn't literal - some places provide breakfast but some don't - you need to read all of the listings carefully.

Agree Oct is moving into high season and the annual average of %250 per night isn;t going to get much. Do you really just need a fridge for beverages - or are you really looking for a kitch for cooking?

sf7307 hello. Yes we didnt get to see the Hockey game which was a disappointment. We did get to a game at Yankee Stadium so all was not lost. One day I will get around to doing a trip report so you can read what we finally got to do/visit/see. The main thing though, we absolutely enjoyed our trip to the States. Fell in love with New York. Truly amazing city.

I hope the OP gets to enjoy this city too.

Not all NYC short term rentals are illegal. I have rented this one. http://www.vrbo.com/145694

You can go to her site and read reviews, and that she follows the short term lease laws of NYC. The building is small and Katie and her husband own it. I rec the One bedroom apt with full kitchen.

What about staying north of NYC, up in the White Plains area? Experts?

"<i>All financial transactions are facilitated through our secure system, ensuring peace of mind for guests and hosts alike. We hold guest payment until at least 24 hours after check-in, to make sure guests are satisfied with their accommodations and to uphold host cancellation policies before payments are processed.</i>"

Which is totally irrelevant/useless in NYC. So what if they don't pay the landlord until one gets there? What good does that do you if it isn't legit? Where else will you go at the last minute in NYC where the rack rates are astronomical?

If it was me - I'd change my 'official' birthday this year to a less expensive month. A little white lie will save you hundreds of $$$

<What about staying north of NYC, up in the White Plains area? Experts?>

I'm kind of struggling with this because you didn't answer my last question but you throw us another one. Did you not like the recs I gave you and what did you not like?

But I will be fair and answer this: I'd stay in Manhattan if I could, and Brooklyn if I couldn't. I hate commuting at home and wouldn't want to do it on my vacation.

I can say that I stayed at the property 3 times and Katie is prompt, accomodating and gracious. She lives on the top floor. Her apartments are legit. They are owner occupied and she only rents two, which is what the law allows. There is the vrbo rental guarantee as well.