New York restaurants - sticker shock
 

I am headed to New York for several nights this week and I have been looking for places to eat and I have to say I am shocked and dismayed at the prices - and I live in a big city, Atlanta, where we eat out at nice restaurants. I've gotten some good suggestions from this board but alot of the places have appetizers / salads for 15+ then entrees for 30 or more. We are two weight watching ladies, well sort of, and I am wondering if we can split some of these items. Are portions usually large - will the waiters be grumpy with us? And I have to say I wonder who pays these prices - folks eating on the company dime or Europeans with dollar kicking Euros? Some of the restaurants I looked at were Avra, Alcala, Solaera, Les Halles, Trattoia de la Arte, Un Deux,Trois, - not really the high status restaurants. We are staying in Midtown East but I also looked at establishments in other parts of Manhattan, I must have looked at 50 menupages! I've been to New York before but I don't remember being so shocked by the prices on those trips. I guess NYC is not having recession the rest of the country is?!

There are plenty of nice places to eat in NYC that are not terribly expensive. I visit NYC pretty often, and have felt like the prices there are only slightly higher than comparable meals in Houston. (I usually eat at mid-range or below restaurants in both cities.) You can have a nice dinner with one glass of wine plus tip for $35-$40, especially if you are "weight watching" and, as a result, are having two appetizers or an entree with no appetizer. Kefi, on the west side, is really good. I also love Yakitoro Totto on the east side. The Red Cat in Chelsea is really good,
too--a little more expensive, but especially if you order carefully, not outrageous. There are lots of good, not expensive restaurants in the Hell's Kitchen area (9th and 50th, more or less).

I would highly recommend lunch at Eleven Madison as a great value: two courses for $28 for amazing, exquisite food. http://www.elevenmadisonpark.com/ We each had the balik salmon appetizer and the roast chicken for two when I was there in October...both were absolutely delicious and a bargain for such high quality.

maryanntex - Kefi was the one restaurant that I had found that sounded tastey and reasonable - we do plan to eat there one evening. I'll check out your other rec's.

Ipanema on W. 44th St. is an old favorite Brazilian restaurant. It's been there for years and has consistently good food and really reasonable prices.
Kellari on W. 46th is also very nice - mostly seafood with a Greek/Mediterranean flavor, but it also has a variety of other foods.

Puttanesca on 9th Av. in the low 50's is a reasonably priced Italian restaurant, also with consistently good food.

You will find that ethnic restaurants generally have a lower price range. And certain ethnic cuisines make for very good sharing for two (or more) people. Greek, Turkish, and Persian places tend to have a good variety of appetizers - hot and cold. My wife and I have now adopted sharing for our dining out. We might order a couple of appetizers and one main dish - and share everything - plenty for us. And the service staff has no problem with that and they shouldn't - and just tell them you're sharing everything - and they'll bring you an extra plate. It's becoming quite common. We do that in French restaurants also - couple of appetizers and share a main - e.g. a choucroute. But - yes - many moderate priced restaurants charge in the 20's for a main dish and 10 to 12 or so for appetizers. If you are on the Upper East Side try - Beyoglu or Shalizar - first rate and inexpensive. My beef is the pricing of their wine lists - andthat goes for just about every restaurant in town. Shameful - hardly anything in the 30's or 40's when there are plenty of good wines that they could sell in the 20's and 30's and make a good profit on.

I don't know what made you select the places you did, but they don't strike me as either good for weight watchers or particularly good value. Trattoria Dell 'Arte is a good Italian but it's really pricey unless you eat pizza or pasta, neither of which sounds like good weight watchers fare. There are HUNDREDS of good, inexpensive Italian restaurants; Becco, Maria Pia, Trattoria Trecolori, Basilica are just a few in midtown west. But frankly, if you're eating basic chicken/fish and veggies/salads, Italian is not the way I would go as the best value. I agree that Greek (heavy on fish), new American (like Eleven Madison Park), Brazillian for steak or French, Japanese are all good options for you. It's common for 2 diners to share an appetizer and then get an entree. You can also make a meal out of 2 appetizers.

I also agree that one way to eat very good food at great prices is to have your main meal at lunch when prices are lower and have something small for dinner. Places like Jean Georges, Asiate, Eleven Madison Park, Matsugen (Japanese) do extremely good value prix fixe lunches, some allowing 2 courses where you get to decide which 2 courses you want. Asiate in the Mandarin Oriental hotel has great views, very good (healthy) French/Asian food and a $24 prix fixe lunch during the week.

If you tell us what you like we might be able to steer you better.

Kefi is very ww friendly. You can share the salad to start and each get one of their great fish dishes.

Kellari Taverna is great for dinner, but only for the prix fixe; otherwise it is very expensive. It's an attractive place too. I'm a weight watcher and on the prix fixe, I start with the green salad and then have one of the fish dishes. I've asked to substitute fruit for the dessert; one time the waiter did that for me and the next time, I was charged - $10!!!

I also suggest having a few special prix fixe lunches in great restaurants and a light dinner in a diner, etc. that day. Nougatine has a great lunch.

Sushi can often be a reasonable ww friendly meal.

Atlantic Grill on the UES is a good choice too. You can easily share the beet salad or chopped salad to start and order a great fish entree.

I'm kind of amazed that you are amazed at the prices. It's New York. We pay those prices sometimes in Charltotte and Denver too.
Lunch is a great suggestion.
I understand that the restaurant at MOMA is outstanding--and expensive. But maybe lunch.

Please do not blame NY for your lack of research. Grocery stores prices in that part of the east side are comparable to those of aiport stores.

There are thousands of restaurants which are cheaper around the city and where you can get an excellent meal, especially ethnic reatuarants but one must be willing to leave the neighborhood.

There are many guides that have pages and pages of inexpensive restaurants including Twenty Five Dollars and under: A Guide to the Best Inexpensive Restaurants in New York by Eric Asimov (yes Isaac's nephew) and Time Out NY Dining Guide.

suec1, I chuckled a little when I ready your subject because I get sticker shock when I LEAVE NYC.

Many of us eat out regularly at local favorites that are much less expensive. For example, I cannot remember the last time I paid over $20 for an entree or $10 for an appetizer.

Compare that to tourist/vacation destinations like Newport RI, Or most of Vermont and Maine that I've visited, where unimpressive main courses are routinely $25-30 and simple salad apps are $10! My theory is that the supplies they need aren't as easily available ( I can get mescun lettuce--in various assortments--at every dinky corner store here), plus restaurants typically aren't open all day like many places are in NY, aren't busy everyday of the week, and the turnover isn't as great.

NY has so many choices that I believe that it is actually easier to eat cheaply and well in places like NY.

Keep in mind that some of the places you are looking at are still considered pricey by some New Yorkers. Yes, there are people who go to these places routinely and have the money to do so, but it may be just an occasional treat to regular NYers.
You've heard of them because people on this board and elswehere suggest them thinking that if you're already comeing to NY and looking for good food, you might be willing to spend a little more than is the norm for you.

But if you don't want to , and especially if you are light eaters, you'll find that less expensive places are also more casual and less likely to be upset or surprised by people sharing apps, entrees, etc.

Check out this Times article published today
http://frugaltraveler.blogs.nytimes....ork/#more-1961

The NY Times usually has a dining section called $25 and under that may help you choose some more affordable options.
http://topics.nytimes.com/topics/fea...der/index.html

I gave some moderately priced ideas here:


http://www.fodors.com/community/unit...s-169352-2.cfm

...I agree with McLaurie. Wherever did you find that list of restaurants you mention in the original post?

some other options for fine dining:

L'ecole in Soho 3 courses around $28 pp

Tartine (BYOB)

Jean George Prix Fixe Lunch $28

Le Relais de Venise $24 for steak, fries and a salad (not for the weight watcher)

Convivio four courses $59

Duane Park on Sunday evenings there is a $25 3 course Prix fix with live jazz starting at 7pm

Lots of options, if you give a price range maybe people can offer more suggestions.

I live in NY and NEVER pay those prices. Sure, you can pay those prices if you want. But I don't have that kind of money. There are thousands of restaurants in NY. I suggest looking around once you get to NY and your "neighborhood" (where you are staying) and check out the restaurants around there. If you want a fancy dinner - go for it. But you can eat in diners, ethnic places and get good Italian for much, much less than you quote.

I was looking at the menu for Woodfire Grill in Atlanta recently (because the chef, Kevin, was on Top Chef). Those prices are comparable to what you pay in a nice, but not over-the-top restaurant in Manhattan. Almost all of his entrees are over $25, and most of the appetizers are over $12. That's about typical for an upscale restaurant in New York.

But if you can't find dinner with a glass of wine for $45 or less in Manhattan, then you really aren't looking very hard (and I mean that $45 per person includes the tip too). If you don't drink wine, then it's almost criminal to pay more than $40 for dinner unless you're going to a top restaurant. It's just not worth it.

I almost always share an appetizer (unless I'm going to a fabulously upscale place where we want to try a wider range of dishes and are willing to pay for it), so no one will bat an eye, and most restaurants will even split salads and appetizers in the kitchen for you (Blue Smoke always splits the iceberg wedge salad for us in the kitchen). And I almost always share dessert. With a main course, that's usually as much as I can eat.

ViceVersa is a great theater-district restaurant with a $35 prix-fixe for dinner, or you can get entrees and share appetizers from the a la carte menu for about the same price (most of the entrees there are between $25 and $30, so typical for an upscale Midtown restaurant). Dessert would be more. You can get a half-size entree portion of Pasta there, and that is usually enough for me. But I don't like Applebee's-size portions.

Just one word of warning: If you don't make a reservation for dinner, you may not get into the restaurant of your choice. There are so many tourists in town right now that the best places have been mobbed. Use Opentable to make reservations (you can always cancel later if you change your mind).

But reservations at local restaurants can be made the same day in most cases. Call around 1pm for a table after 7 that night at a local restaurant like Ethos (Great, by the way, for Greek food, especially grilled fish, which you can share for about $20 per person).

Head to the East Village. There's a stretch of restaurants on Second Avenue from 13th St south to Houston that offer good food at good values, well below the prices you name--also on the side streets and other avenues in the neighborhood. Get away from midtown and you will get away from those prices. (I'm with the others--I eat out weekly and well and never pay those prices, except for a special splurge.)

There are good BYOB with no corkage fee restaurants in NYC, and I find that that helps a lot w/the total price. I ate at one on Sat. night, Le Sirene, in Soho. Incredible food. We had two appetizers (incredible goat cheese tart w/shallots, truffles, grapes, and a thin layer of aged swiss- and housemade pate) and two nice size entrees (trout and duck, omg the duck was so tender and good, like a duck prime rib w/cherry port sauce) and total check was just over $80. They have a 3 course fixed price dinner from 5 til 7 for $28.50. The BYOB w/no fee is a huge plus IMO.

If you want less expensive, I did a post in October 2009 asking for cheap eats in Soho, Tribeca, the Village, Chelsea. Take a look at that post (click on my name to find it). Great recommendations there for dinners for $20-25 or so. I particularly liked Cafe Cubana in Soho from that list. But you have to be flexible in your thinking regarding places at that price. They are not going to have the refined atmosphere that more expensive restaurants have. They are generally more casual and ethnic.

P.S. Another good deal-- East of Eighth in Chelsea has a deal where you can sign up for their "club" online. Then you get an email for a free dinner for your birthday. We ate there last Fri. on my husband's birthday for lunch and got the free entree. Nice bistro, good food, great deal w/the free entree.

Sorry, it is La Sirene, not Le Sirene...

There are plenty of places in NYC to have good meals on a budget. It's true that each category will cost more in NYC than in other places, but not SO different. Midtown tends to be more expensive and have fewer restaurant bargains. If you go to more residential areas you will have a lot more choices - of every ethnicity - at reasonable prices.

The size of portions depends very much on the place. Carmines - basic red sauce Italian - has huge portions really meant to be shared. But most places don't have portions so huge you can cut everything in half. When lunching or dining with a female friend we often share and appetizer, each have an entree and glass of wine - and then each have a cappuccino for desert.

If you go in and try to share one appetizer and then share on main course - not only do I think you will be hungry - but the restaurant may not be pleased at your taking a table.

Where I live (upper west side) there are a ton of places with appetizers from $9 to $12 (unless you go for something elaborate) and main courses in the $13 to $17/$18 range - which are excellent.

Obviously if you want to splurge at n upscale places it will be much more - but how often do you need to do that? And their are a lot of basic ethnic places with basic lunches for $15 (no wine of course).

We have found that (sharing everything) two appetizers and a main course are more than enough for us. Of course, it depends on what you order - and we try to select a main course that tends to be sharable. Last week we dined at Quatorze - a first rate French bistro on the Upper East Side. We ordered - escargots (and it was generous portion - served out of the shell), a seafood sausage appetizer (and it was generous) and an order of choucroute. We barely could finish the choucroute. We had half bottle of wine with that. The wait staff was very accommodating and helpful with the service. I am not concerned that I am not ordering lots of food and lots of portions to make the restaurant management happy. That is not why I attend a restaurant. We dine to meet our needs - not the needs of the management. We also find that three or four appetizers (one a salad) - well selected - can be more than enough andvery satisfying in Greek and Turkish places. Never once - but never - has any wait staff looked askance or said anything like - is that all? In fact, they seem quite accustomed to customers sharing.

The more casual the restaurant the more likely sharing is pleasantly accommodated.

We really enjoyed the new Le Petit Un Deux Trois on West 43rd last trip (where Le Madeleine was previously). The menu is extensive and varied so you can order without regard to courses, or choose from salads, sandwiches, small plates.

When we stayed in Midtown East, there were plenty of affordable places to dine in the neighborhood. One of our favorites was a place that offered amazing composed salads and wraps.

We don't really want heavy restaurant meals twice a day, so if we want to experience fancier establishments, we head to the bar for a drink.

It's hard to get much cheaper in New York than Gray's Papaya, Papaya King, and similar spots -- Gray's offers their "Recession Special," two hot dogs and a fruit-flavored drink for $4.45. No atmosphere, not fancy, not haute cuisine or food for the health conscious, and just a stand-up counter space, of course -- but a cheap belly-filling guilty pleasure.

I love NY.

Grazing by ordering several appetizers is fine. But 2 people sharing one appetizer and one pasta may well be hungry - and some restaurants will not be happy at the loss of revenue - esp if they don;t order wine. (This is why many midtown coffee shops/delis make a $10 per person minimum between 11 and 2 pm.)

Doing 4 appetizers will be in the $40 to $50 range (not the $20-$22 range of 1 appetizer and 1 main course).

Wander around the E. Village, there are probably 100s of inexpensive restaurants of all different kinds of food. Same could be said for many other nieghborhoods. The midtown/times square area is probably the overall worst, but even there you can find good deals.

I agree with an earlier post, when I leave NYC I am shocked how expensive other cities are.

You can search on menupages.com to get some ideas. Most $$$ or less are reasonable.

NY has some of the world's most expensive meals... and also some of the most fabulous inexpensive meals. I suggest going with price-fixed pre theater lunches and dinners. Zagat guide,the book or online is a great aid. If anyone reading this likes gourmet Mexican, try the lunch special at Toloache (W 50th). There is a tiny place called "The Nook", simple but delicious food for the budget-minded. I believe you bring your own wine.

We have reservations at Nougatine for the three course $38 meal. I've heard good things.

The $39 p/f dinner at Nougatine is four courses. The $28 p/f lunch is three courses. You won't be sorry either way.Two of the greatest NYC dining bargains. Last time we were there, just a few weeks ago with my brother, visiting from Houston with his ladyfriend, we chatted with Jean Georges himself, who is frequently in the restaurant. It shares a common kitchen with his adjoining flagship restaurant, and he is definitely a "hands-on" chef.

To the OP: you rattled off the names of primarily French restaurants in midtown Manhattan and were amazed by the prices. This means simply that you didn't look very hard for restaurants. There are so many inexpensive restaurants in NY where you can find good food, even in Midtown and near the theater district, that you can easily eat for $35-40 per person, all taxes and tips included.

The fact remains you will pay some sort of premium for a French restaurant that likely does not warrant the extra cash.

I think it's easy to find reasonably priced restaurants in nyc. 3 I like
Back Forty Ave B/12th LES
Quinto Quarto Bedford St, Village
Marinella Carmine st, village

bspeilman, yes, I did get the price wrong. Our reservations at Nougatine are for dinner, and I'm really looking forward to it.

I wanted to add this to my earlier comment, but my keyboard wasn't working: A friend and I spent 6 days in NY, dogsitting in the EV in May, and it became a running joke that every one of my meals, except one at Cibo, cost $9.00. And every meal was enjoyable.

And 4 of us enjoyed Cibo. The prices were within the 40-50 dollar range per person, but I don't think anyone had drinks.

And I mis-typed: $39 p/f dinner should read $38. Enjoy!

Burt,I met Jean Georges one time with our friend who took us to JG. Is he not the most shy retiring man for someone so "famous". No prima donna there.

Agreed about JG; no "celebrity chef" persona, even if he is one.

Not a "BAM!" or an "EVOO!" from him. I suspect that, for him, cooking/restauranting is not a competitive contest such as it seems to be for so many restaurateurs these days.

All you have to do is look at the TV listings and the contents pages of most of the food magazines: "The BEST of this!" "The WORST of that!" "This vs. That!"

JG and his restaurants are a refreshing respite from all that.

Cheap in Chelsea: Le Zie on 7th Ave/20th.

www.lezie.com

Thin

Nougatine is a great choice. For my money, they offer one of the best values among restaurants in the City. And I, too, have seen JG each time I've dined there, or in the main dining room. Unusual these days for a chef of his caliber. His brother works in the main dining room, too.

Oh, bover, some of us are rather posh.

It is usually just some fish fingers and mushy peas washed down with a quart of Gilby's for me.

Ta,
Thin

Cheap in Chelsea: Le Zie on 7th Ave/20th.


We are going Thursday night.