National Parks - planning help appreciated
 

Hi Fodorites :-)

We are planning our first trip to the USA in Sept / Oct this year and we are keen to spend time in the beautiful National Parks. I have searched this forum and found some good advice, and looked on the National Parks sites as well, but I am having trouble getting my head around the best way to actually structure the trip.

I guess, more specifically my questions would be...

How long should we allow for the different parks? We will be away for 6 weeks (we'll hire a car), want to see Vegas and San Francisco, and Zion, Bryce, Yelllowstone, Yosemite and the Grand Canyon. We dont want to short change the parks (ie dont want to do the Grand Canyone in a day trip from Vegas). We enjoy (shortish) hikes and are avid photographers. I know asking 'how long' is a bit hard to answer, but a rough guide would be good.

Is there a logical way to see the parks, combined with San Fran and Vegas?

Are we better off flying into a closer city, rather than driving to Yellowstone?

What is accomodation availability like mid Sept - Oct?

Thanks, any help appreciated :-)

Thanks

Cathy

I think on the NPS site they have the "Grand Circle" which would include going to Bryce, Zion, and the Grand Canyon, with great suggestions on timing and driving. I will go look and come back to your thread. San Francisco/Yosemite would certainly be one grouping, and probably Vegas/Grand Canyon/Bryce/Zion another grouping. Yellowstone might stand on its own.

I'll go take a look and come back to you, but you are also certain to get some great advice here. You might especially want to look up a trip report by 2 Brits and a Chevy and Myer here on this board.

I'd also like to suggest you get the America The Beautiful Nat'l park pass. With as many parks asyou want to visit, it should be a real savings overall. I'll look and see if you can order it overseas.

Oh, and if you want to stay in the parks (which I personally recommend) you'd best get on those reservations now. You can always cancel if you find someplace else. In the Grand Canyon I loved being in the Bright Angel Lodge cabins where we were just steps away from the edge.

Okay, this is someone's commercial site, but it still gives you a sense of how you can route:

http://www.us-parks.com/1-week-grand-circle.html

It starts and ends in Las Vegas. You could use that routing map as a start for planning. Personally, I think one week is too short--one of those if it is Wednesday it must be Rome sorts of things. And, you have six weeks so you certainly can stretch it out a bit, allowing yourself time to stop and take hikes in each place rather than do a drive by sighting. Maybe take two weeks for this trip rather than 1.

I'd like to suggest that you also include Monument Valley in your trip, it truly is spectacular. Stay at the View or Gouldings Trading post for the best views.

The above would give you Las Vegas, Grand Canyon, Bryce and Zion for your list.

Where are you coming from? perhaps you want to fly into San Francisco, spend your first week there and surrounds, including Napa and Yosemite, then take a short hop flight to Las Vegas (you can find a cheap one on Southwest probably) rent a car and do your two week loop, then fly or drive depending how much country you want to see, up to Yellowstone. You can stretch out any of your times of course to fill your six weeks. You have the opportunity to see some beautiful country.

I like to use www.aaa.com for trip routing, use their online triptik feature and you can drag to different points, including parks, based on how you want to go rather than the fastest route (which I don't always want to do)

here is the America the Beautiful pass:

http://store.usgs.gov/pass/index.html

If it doesn't allow you to have it mailed internationally,k you can also buy at the first national park you visit.

I hope this works! Here is an absolutely fantastic trip report by Myers

http://www.fodors.com/community/unit...rks-sedona.cfm

Toucan, thank you so very much :-) I so appreciate your help. I agree about the 1 week being a little short... we want time to experience and really get a sense of the beautiful country, not just drive by and and say 'oh wow' :-) We are flying over from Australia. Thanks for the tips on passes. We will look into accom. It would be good to find places that allow cancellations (not that we would intend to) ... but we quite like travelling with some sense of flexibility. Thank you!!!

And here is 2 brits in a chevy:

http://www.fodors.com/community/unit...orthern-az.cfm

Okay, I am done planning your trip for the moment! :) Hope I didn't take over too much.

Lakesidechick,

I would definitely start with Yellowstone first - because things there start to shut down mid-Sept and there will be snow by October.

Fly into Jackson
4 days Yellowstone
3 days Jackson & Tetons
Fly Jackson to SF
4 days SF, maybe include 1 day in Napa?
3 days Yosemite
1 day drive to LV
2 days LV (I hate LV and would recommend skipping it, but I know most people feel it's a must)
2 days GC
1-2 days MV/Page
5 days Moab (Arches, Canyonlands, Dead Horse Point, CO River)
3 days Goblin Valley - Capitol Reef - Escalante on Hwy 12
2 days Bryce
3 days Zion


These would be my minimums. If you can spend more time, do it!

You could also fly into Bozeman, MT and take a couple days for the heavenly Paradise Valley and arrive at Yellowstone through the north entrance. After Jackson, drive over the Teton Pass and through Idaho and Oregon to the coast and down the northern CA coast. See the redwoods. Gorgeous.

I can't emphasize enough that you do Yellowstone first! Sept is the end of the good weather there. The southern Natl Parks normally have wonderful weather end of Sept/Oct. Best time of year to go!

Toucan, you are amazing , thank you so much, I so appreciate your help and if you ever come to Australia, I hope I can return the favour.

Dayle, thanks for the tip re Yellowstone... we actually leave home at the end of August so could get to Yellowstone early Sept which I assume would be better? Thanks for your idea of how we could spend our time... I am finally getting my head around how we could put this trip together!!

I think Dayle's itinerary is pretty good, but I'd add 1-2 days to see Sequoia after Yosemite. You might want to include Mesa Verde in southwestern Colorado, although it does add an extra day or so of driving. It's very different from anything else on your itinerary. You have a great trip ahead of you. Six weeks will be fabulous!

And yes, definitely the earlier the better for Yellowstone. Summers are very short!

Thanks Althom.... I was wondering about Sequoia, I have heard it is a nice place to visit. I'll look up Mesa Verde too, havent heard of that!

Great itinerary Dayle! I knew someone would come up with something very reasonable.

I'll second Mesa Verde. It was one of the most amazing places I have ever visited. Again try to stay in park, Far View Lodge.

LakesideChick, I've been to Australia twice now and if I had my way I'd pack up my bags and go there permanently :-) Better watch out, I might look you up! Hope to be back soon if this economy every cooperates.

I look forward to seeing your final itinerary.

Thanks Toucan, this forum is amazing ... within a few hours.. so many responses and so much amazing information. Australia is a wonderful place.. hope you get to return soon. Sty tuned as our itinerary takes shape!

Well now that Toucan posted the link to my first Utah, AZ trip, there's another that includes Arches, Canyonlands, Capitol Reef and a few other spectacular sights (Lower Calf Creek Falls, etc).

Photos of that trip are also on my web site.

At the start of August I'll be going to Yellowstone and Grand Tetons. Sgould be another very interesting trip.

Dayle knows her stuff and layed out a great trip.

Have fun.

I thought you had another trip report Myer, I'm glad you mentioned it. Your photos are amazing.

I am pretty much beside myself with excitement now.We are meeting with our travel agent on Sat to plan flights... is Jackson the best airport to fly into for Yellowstone? Is Salt Lake City another option? We will probably start our adventure at Yellowtone as suggested and then fly down to Vegas or San Francisco.

As close as you are to Sequoia, I'd consider it a "must-see". The trees are just incredible. I'm pretty sure the biggest tree in the world is there (too lazy to look it up). The diameter of them is unreal, and they just soar into the sky.

Yes, we will definitely go to Sequoia, just had a look online, they are the biggest trees in the world!!!

Right. And the General Sherman Tree is the biggest of the big.

Toucan2,

Yes, there's a trip report somewhere here for the 2008 Utah trip. Also a couple of more minor trips NY-Philadelphia (2007) and NY-Boston (2008).

2009 was a physical recovery year.

This is my dream trip--and 6 weeks--be sure to schedule some time at Grand Teton NP when you are doing your Yellowstone visit. And bring some warm clothes. It can get cold there in Sept.

What's Yosemite like in Sept / Oct?

Yes, you could go into Salt Lake City, we have been to Yellowstone/Tetons the past 2 years and used that airport. It's about a 4-hour drive. Jackson is much closer, right at the Tetons really, but it is smaller. Salt Lake would let you see the Salt Lake, of course, and it is something you may not want to miss. Plus, we found some interesting driving, and it's not a difficult drive.

By the way, since you will be going to Yosemite - if you have a chance and your route takes you that way, consider a stop at Devil's Postpile (on the Nevada side of Yosemite). You can see it with all the other parks at www.nps.org. There's a nice shortish hike to the top of the "postpiles" that we have enjoyed. And Mono Lake is nearby (pretty weird).

Thought perhaps you could work it into your route to Las Vegas from San Francisco & Yosemite.

September/early October is a great time for Yosemite, although the waterfalls will be scanty, especially the faous Yosemite Falls, which may be dry. The scenic beauty of the cliffs and all the rest is still there, the weather is fine, and the crowds have decreased. Still, try to visit at mid-week. And do include the high country (Tuolumne Meadows) in your plans.

I like Dayle's plan and the going in the order he has it listed. There are plenty of other secondary things to do and see on the routes he has suggested.

Very true. From Yosemite, you could continue on towards the east entrance, visiting Tuolomne Meadows and then out to Lee Vining (Mono Lake) and close enough to Devil's Postpile for a detour, if desired, then to LV.

As a side note, if you decide to include Monument Valley, be aware that it is NOT a national park. It is Native American land so you would not be able to use your National Park pass to enter. I would strongly encourage making reservations for as soon as possible. We will be staying in Gouldings Lodge in Monument Valley in early September, and I am aware that there is a National Geographic tour that will be in the area around that same time. Make reservations as soon as possible.

lakesidechick,

I agree that if you feel like you have time, add Mesa Verde and Sequoia. Both are wonderful!

Yes, you can fly into SLC. Flights are more frequent and less expensive. Drive from SLC to Yellowstone would be about 5 hours or more depending on which route you take. The route up through Logan Canyon, past Bear Lake and through Star Valley is the most beautiful!

Spiro - I'm a she!

Dayle, I know that, but I still get it confused every time. Even after Myer said "she" earlier. Sorry.

No problem Spiro,

It's provided a lot of entertainment in my life!

Actually, every "Dale" or "Dayle" I have ever known or met, starting with Dale Evans, has been a "she".

I had a boychick cousin named Dale. He was a he :-)

Good point to bring up about MV Jill. But, I don't remember the entrance fee being very expensive, was it? I think $5 a person or something? I should look it up.

The food in the restaurant at The View is also very good. The green pork chili was especially good, so keep that in mind :-)

Wow -- kudos to Dayle for a really good itinerary suggestion above.

Would definitely recommend spending a day in Jackson, WY. It's a fun town to explore for this length of time.

I'd personally spend more time in San Francisco and Las Vegas if you can, as both cities have plenty to offer -- though I wouldn't do so at the expense of cutting time in the parks.

Am thinking one could easily spend a week in San Francisco seeing the neighborhoods, museums, and other sites, plus this city should be on anyone's short list of great food destinations in the US. Four days wouldn't be unreasonable for Las Vegas, and there are good food options there as well. They're very different cities, plus they'll make a good contrast to the parks.

I agree that there is plenty to do in San Fran. 1 or 2 day would be enough for me in Vegas.

You can spend two weeks in Las Vegas without even hitting the casinos. In the immediate area, you can go hiking, rock climbing, rock scrambling, kayaking, ride an ATV, drive a dune buggy up a 500 foot high sand dune (or at least try to), sky diving, bodyflight (indoor skydiving), jet skiing, land sailing, race car driving, play 1950's and 1960's era pin ball machines...the list goes on and on. Las Vegas has also developed a world class set of dining options in the last 3 or 4 years.

And by the way, we'll be wanting a trip report! :-)

Thanks so much everyone... trip report approaching in October!!! (Probably 1000 more questitons before :-) )

We are late to the party but have spent some time in the area you will be covering. Flying to Jackson to start will get you running immediately, and in a jewel of a location then you can pick your route driving over as some suggest. However, It seems noone has mentioned in Page to see Antelope Canyon, though it may have been implied. If you see mesa verde and it is very cool, other close parks include Black Canyon of the Gunnison, which is very different from the Grand Canyon, Great Sand Dunes is a hoot, especially sliding down after you hike up, In escalante, mentioned above find a slot canyon (we did peek a boo) will change the way you look at the power of water. Part of Canyonlands is Horse shoe Canyon and the Grand Gallery, do not miss it, but unlike us, go down early or like us hike out by flashlight, not recommended by us or the park service/BLM. Las Vegas is the polar opposite of a national park but there are several parks close by including Death Valley and contrary to popular opinions it is abosutely gorgeous, you can go in the south and drive out the north entrance, many stops, bring ice pops, for the hot temps.

some things I would not want to miss in each park
Arches - the primitive trail in the devils garden
Zion - Angels landing and the narrows (spend the time and bring your best camera in a wet bag even a four hour hike upstream is not too hard but worth every minute-cold water in october but that is when we did it)
Grand Canyon - Be sure to hike in even part way to skeleton point or so, btw can snow in October and north entrance closes, but a few hours away in page could be 90 degrees
Muir woods in San Fran was nice but small to see tall trees not "fat" like sequia
It has been a while but preferred Sonoma County to Napa Valley, but may be just as bad now, its been a few years.
Monument Valley is nice, in a few weeks we are planning to go just north of MV to Natural Bridges (especially for the night sky), goosenecks and Valley of the Gods, UT which is billed as mini monument valley, also can get from there over to Arches or Vice versa
Bryce - hike in very different view
I agree Dayle has laid out a nice itin, I would have as many days as you can spare in Yellowstone, we spent 9 days and would love to go back, it is a big park with lots of things to see and do - We changed hotels every night or every other in yellowstone and Tetons, otherwise you will spend your day driving in and out of the park instead of seeing what you came to see.
Rent/Hire a car that has four wheel drive or some places may be off limits to you and your vehicles abilities.
For giggles, you can get the National Park Passport and have it stamped in each parks visitor center (and help the economy by buying the stamp if the park has one)
I apologize for length but hope you understand my enthusiasm for the west. We live on the East Coast but get out every chance we get. Probably goes without saying but a camelback full of ice is worth its weight in gold in these areas, hot desert ice cold water, say no more. I did not see age or experience but our kids are 4 and 6 and we take them everywhere, if we can do it so can you :) Enjoy.