Kauai helicopter crash
 

A tour helicoptor from Heli USA crashed a couple o fhours ago in Kauai. 5 have survived. Condition of the other person is unknown right now.

Dusty, I've "googled" this tonight and can't find the information. Where shoud I look?
Meantime, here's an excellent summary of helicopter information for Kauai:

http://www.explorekauai.com/helicoptertours.html

Personally-- took helicopter once (Air Kauai) --never again.

Just found something about this sad story.

http://starbulletin.com/breaking/breaking.php?id=3785

At least there are some survivors. The last crash three years killed everyone on board. The article left one with impression that they were flying in a pretty bad weather. I hope the survivors are not seriously hurt and recover quickly.

-Bill

So sad:
http://starbulletin.com/2005/09/24/news/index.html

We were having _horrific_ weather for flying when these 2 helicopters were up -- thunder, lightning, and torrential downpours. And these conditions had been forecast from early in the morning, so the copter company knew it was coming, and when.

HeliUSA had a perfect safety record here...until these 2 copters went down within minutes of each other.

Good friends who live in Kailua, Oahu, love hosting friends & family visiting Hawaii. The ONE thing they always advise against is the helicopter tour. Their son is a pilot for a major airline, and the father loved to fly, traveled his whole working life. They always tell us that it isn't that safe, when you look closely at the statistics. It's unforgiveable that the tours took off with that weather forecast. To each their own adventures, but I won't try it ...

I'm with you bonnie. Luckily my partner has a thing with high places and looking down, so the heli thing is off the menu of options when we are on Kaua`i. What a tragedy.

-Bill

TWO coptes went down within minutes of each other? I can't find anything about TWO copters.

bonnie: Your claim, "They always tell us that it isn't that safe, when you look closely at the statistics" is pretty incredible. I've always understood these helicopter trips are substantially safer, statistically, than driving on freeways. If you (or they) have a reference for these numbers I'd sure like to see it.

Here's another link to the crash. We're heading to Kauai in February and were considering a copter tour, but I guess we'll spend our money on something else wile we're there. Not a knock on the tours (we've been on a couple in Maui), but I'm getting too old for this -----
http://www.kauaiworld.com/articles/2...ews/news01.txt

rusty,

One actually crashed and one was forced down by the weather.

-Bill

fdecarlo, no, I don't have the numbers but I trust my friend (the airline pilot) to know his stuff. On one of the TV newsmagazines (don't recall if it was 20/20 or 60 Minutes???) a few years ago, they basically said the same thing. What someone else does is their business,and I know nothing is perfectly safe ... but I'll decline this particular thrill! :-)

Three have died as a result of the crash.

A second helo (from the same company) was forced to land in the same area an hour later due to bad weather.

The first crashed because of bad weather. A witness said he saw lightning hit the helicopter, then it went down.

Why in the world was the second one even in the air in the same area? It was on a tour and not assisting in any rescue operation of the first.

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/ap...WS01/509240329

Fdecarlo, here are the statistics that strongly suggest that helicopter tours in Hawaii are not safe:

Sept 24, 2005 Helicopter crash in Kauai

July 23, 2003: A Jack Harter Helicopters Bell 206B crashes at Mount Wai'ale'ale, Kaua'i, killing five.

June 15, 2003: Three tourists and a pilot are killed when a Tropical Helicopters Hughes 500 crashes in Hawai'i Volcanoes National Park on the Big Island. The cause remains under investigation.

Aug. 25, 2000: A Big Island Air Piper Chieftain plane ditches in the ocean off Hilo. The pilot and seven passengers survive, one passenger dies. The NTSB cites loss of engine power and an engine fire.

July 21, 2000: A Blue Hawaiian Tours helicopter crashes in '?ao Valley on Maui, killing seven. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into cloudy weather.

Sept. 25, 1999: A Big Island Air Piper Chieftain plane crashes on the slopes of Mauna Loa on the Big Island, killing all 10 aboard. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather, improper navigation and disregard for standard operating procedures.

June 25, 1998: A Eurocopter aircraft operated by 'Ohana Helicopters smashes into a mountainside at Mount Wai'ale'ale, Kaua'i, killing six. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.

July 14, 1994: A Papillon Helicopters Aerospatiale Astar crashes into the ocean off Kaua'i's Na Pali Coast, killing three of seven people aboard. The NTSB cites engine failure.

April 18, 1994: An Interisland Helicopters craft crashes near Hanapepe Valley on Kaua'i, killing one and injuring four. The NTSB cites engine failure.

Jan. 25, 1993: A Kainoa Aviation Hilleer 1100 helicopter plunges into the ocean off Hawai'i Volcanoes National Park on the Big Island. The pilot survives but four passengers are killed. The NTSB cites loss of tail rotor control.

Sept. 16, 1992: A Hawai'i Helicopters Aerospatiale Astar slams into the southern slope of Haleakala on Maui, killing seven. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.

April 22, 1992: All nine aboard a Scenic Air Tours Beech E18S plane die in a crash near Haleakala Crater. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.

Here is more info on this topic - an article written in 2002 which includes data demonstrating the dangers of tour helicopters.

http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/...s/02173365.htm

dusty56438:

There are many heli-tour companies on Kaua`i, and during the day over our Na Pali coast it's like a heli-freeway with all these copters from all these companies taking folks to see the coastline.

That there were 2 copters from the same company in nearly the same airspace at the same time, is not at all unusual. Crowded, but not unusual.

My hat's off to the copter pilot who had the good sense to get out of the weather and _land_ that craft, rather than continue flying!

Rumors are rampant here on the island this morning..."the chopper was in flames before it went into the ocean", and on and on. Even our own island newspaper mis-reported that only 2 passengers had perished.

The truth will come out when the NTSB and FAA folks complete their investigations...but that can take a year or more.

Rusty, thanks for your information. Sadly, add another recent crash to the list, from just a yr ago Septmeber 2004 when a Bali High copter crashed, killing all 5 on board:

http://starbulletin.com/2004/09/26/news/story1.html

Bill/ IAMQ--I 've no fear of high places, and have taken a heli tour of Kauai (3 weeks after a June 1998 crash--of which I was then unaware ) but I'm with your PM--I'll NEVER again go on a tourist helicopter flight ANYWHERE.
BTW, St John doesn't have helicopter island tours, so you won't feel you missed anything there (-: On St John, there ARE decisions about wonderful boat trips--which IMHO are the more economical and safe way to have a great adventure in Kauai as well.

I meant Bali HAI. Apologies to the great singer Juanita Hall.

Thanks for the list, and also the article reference, which mentions a 460% increase in the number of helicopter accidents since 1996. Guess I need to update my recommended activities list.

But I have to wonder how many of these accidents are due to inherent design problems with helicopters, and how many are due to sheer stupidity on the part of tour operators and pilots.

auntiemaria

The second helicopter was forced to land in the same area an hour after the first one crashed.

The pilot of the first one had radioed a mayday and mentioned wind shear. I don't understand why a second helicopter was in the same bad weather area an hour later.

In an unrelated story, yesterday two passenger jets that had just taken off from Honolulu airport got struck by lightning and had to return (safely). One was on route to Kona, the other to Sacramento.

My personal theory is that it's even more dangerous to take helicopter tours on the Hawaiian islands because of the sudden changes in air conditions and climate, especially on the wet sides of the islands.

I also believe that it's a combination of psychology ("I've flown through worse, so I'll survive this") and trying to make as much money as possible in less-than-great flying conditions (which is really not great customer service anyway).

Sad news from Kauai. Three individuals involved in the Heli-USA Chopper crash yesterday on the North end of the island, near Kee Beach did not survive. The pilot and a couple were able to swim to shore where they were rescued but tragically, two women and a man did not survive. Another Heli-USA chopper had to make an emergency landing near the same area shortly thereafter. From the news, it sounds like fast moving weather/wind shear were the cause. Interestingly, other tour helicopters were grounded yesterday due to weather. We were wondering why the Heli-USA flights went out. So sad.

My husband and I took an Air Kauai tour (helicopter) the day before and it was definitely the highlight of our trip. Despite knowing of this crash and others in past years, we would do it again.

http://starbulletin.com/2005/09/24/news/story2.html

"But I have to wonder how many of these accidents are due to inherent design problems with helicopters, and how many are due to sheer stupidity on the part of tour operators and pilots."

There are many documented accidents with helicopters at Grand canyon and most other areas with phenomenal views. Who knows if its downdrafts, or people asking for a little closer look, pilot stupidity (??) or passenger stupidity.

I have very stong acrophobia. I am almost afraid to go out on my kitchen deck which is 25 feet above the ground.

I took a helicopter tour in Kauai. I was not afraid. It seemed that the pilot was in complete control, moving us up and down in the canyons and above the surf. delicately using is little finger (!!)

I would do it again.

On our first trip to Hawaii, 1998, a gentleman from the FAA told us how they came in a couple of years prior and shut down all of the heli tour companies for faulty maintainance records. He felt at that time that they cleaned up their act but they essentially weren't that safe and he would never fly them. The young women who worked in the concierge room, chimed in and said, "we think that the tourists are brave because none of us locals would ever fly in them". She said that her father had to fly in helicoptors for law enforcement and he hated them. He felt that with wind sheer, weather currents, etc that they were not safe. I am not a timid person, but I would not take a helicopter tour.

We did a helicopter tour in Maui last May with Blue Hawaiian, who I see is on Rusty's list. I have to say that the ride was super smooth and I was glad I did it. Not so sure if I'd do it again, though, after reading that list!

We did not do the helicopter in Kauai b/c I heard so many stories about crashes there. Since I was traveling without my kids, I felt it would be taking a too much of a risk. After seeing the spectacular Na Pali coastline by catamaran (and feeling queasy), I figured if there was a next time and my kids were grown, I'd love to see the view from the helicopter. But threads like this have me second guessing that, too...

FWIW, I used to work for a law firm that represented helicopter manufacturers in product liability actions (i.e. lawsuits alleging a crash was caused by faulty design of the helicopter or some component of it). The senior partner of the firm, who had handled many, many of these cases over the years, recommended against a helicopter flight when I told him I was going to Hawaii. His words, "you couldn't pay me enough to go up in a helicopter."

I went anyway.

Friday's Hilo newspaper had an article that said one helicopter company was falsifying the passengers weights on flights to fit more people on and to put less fuel. Someone from the company blew the whistle, was fired and is now suing. How many other companies do the same thing? I live here and I wouldn't ride 'em.

I've certainly seen these posts in the past. I've watched this post while backing away from comment. How easy to say, to judge, to condemn a person, a company, an industry. I myself am at a loss and mourn those lost as well as those who will recover their survival.

This I know. There are a whole lotta copters flying in Kauai. They are usually flying clockwise W-N-E-S in the same direction everyday, seeing the same sights and droning to tourists like me about the canyon and the coast and the crater.

If you flew around every day in circles...it is a tough job filled with very hazardous wind and weather conditions...a very tough atmosphere for the most qualified of pilots.

I would immediately want to blame Heli USA for having two passenger flights out. However, I have read no proof that no one else was flying as some have insinuated. If they were the only two tourist copters out there, then someone who makes the final choice should be awake for many nights to come for making a commercial decision and a case for manslaughter/negligence. But I have found no proof that they were the only two copters.

I applaud the second pilot for safely landing in a desolute area.

Would I take a heli tour again...maybe if I didn't prefer what I feel is much safer trike flying. But the industry, although competitive is growing and learning. Gone are the days of the Vietnamvet doing dangerous manueveres.

(although I selfishly wish I could fly with one of those pilots, that knew the wind and flew wild)

But now are the days of perhaps too many copters in the sky circling.

I'm sure, this recent crash will force authorities to once again look at the safety of their highest commodity...the tourist.

While people say, he said, she said, their to blame.......I wish the pilots and the victims and their families peace. Realize helicopter travel has always been dangerous. That fact has not changed.

G'Lou

gyppielou: The article referenced by Orcas mentions a 460% increase in the number of accidents since 1996. This has to be more than just random bad luck. Tour companies in spite of all their rhetoric to the contrary are obviously putting profit before safety, and there's no excuse for that.

Update:
http://www.kauaiworld.com/articles/2...ews/news01.txt

Article from today's Garden Island newspaper regarding the recent heli crash:
http://www.kauaiworld.com/articles/2...ews/news02.txt

The quote from Chuck di Piazza -- owner of Air Kaua`i -- regarding his company's commitment to safety, is why that's the only heli company with which I flew, or recommended.

I personally wouldn't be disappointed if they were all grounded on Kauai. My husband, two friends of ours and I tried to hike the Kalalau Trail to see the Na Pali Coast and I found the constant buzzing of helicopters very annoying and out of place next to the beauty of the scenery. And if you're wondering why I said "tried," it's because the weather was bad and we turned back rather than risk it, although it didn't seem to deter the helicopter tours.

We were in Hawaii when these accidents happened, 3 people passed in the Kauai crash, the pilot and 2 other tourists survived.

We flew into Honolulu on the morning the 2 planes were struck by lightening, I am so glad I did not hear the news as we probably would not have flown that day@-) Our flight was fine.:)

I seem to remember there we 18 helicopter deaths in Hawaii in one year several years ago.... I would never fly in one of those planes, I'm way too chicken.

Interesting link, Auntie. I found this comment most interesting:

<i>&quot;He said another area of safety concerns were helicopter companies whose owners and operators offer &quot;incentives&quot; to pilots to complete their 45-minute tours ahead of schedule, to save money on parts maintenance.&quot;</i>.

I have taken three helicopter tours in Hawaii. One with Air Kauai, one this past May with Inter-Island and one with Blue Hawaiian. I loved them all, especially the Inter-Island with no doors.
I saw the posting of the list of accidents but didn't see the ratio as to how many flights have flown and not crashed. As for the rising incidence of accidents, I believe more and more people are travelling to Hawaii. Unfortunately, this can result in companies trying to take advantage etc.
Common sense would tell you, (and it's written about in one of my travel books) to check out the helicopter companies safety record, how long they've been in business and to ask how much experience your pilot has. Although, even with all this info you could still crash, but... you could have an amazing time and a memory to last a lifetime.
Hopefully the result of this terrible accident will be an increase in safety and accountability.

My wife and I took a helicopter tour of Kauai on Tuesday (Safari Tours), then on Friday we hiked the Napali Coast. On our descent from the highest point of the hike, the skies opened up and we were caught in a major rain storm, along with what seemed like dozens of other hikers, most less capable hikers than we are.

We had a harrownig journey back to sea level as the mountains drained the water, most of it raging down the trail we were traversing. Some of the hikers we passed were clinging to trees, trying not to be knocked off the trail.

We heard a steady drone of helicopters but were more concerned with our own safety than what the choppers might be doing (although it did seem strange that they would be flying around in a deluge).

Even though we were safe at sea level, we were still stranded because the road was blocked by the Limahuli Stream which had risen so high that it was a torrent across the road. It was an incovenience to us, but it was a real problem for the rescue vehicles stuck on the other side of it. It was at that point that we learned of the helicopter crash. At that time, we thought that five had survived and one was unresponsive. Turned out that was wishful thinking. It also turned out that the rescue was completed solely by the rescue helicopters that we had heard and some boats that had made it to the area.

We met a lot of people on the island, and we wonder who the victims were (so far only one has been identified). A very sad day.

Wilki, you are a happy ending to a tragic story. So happy you made it back to Ke'e safe and sound with flash flooding and landsliding abounding. Very lucky indeed!

The three fatalities were visitors from the mainland. Here's the latest news, from today's Honolulu Star-Bulletin:
http://starbulletin.com/2005/09/29/news/story10.html

Very glad to know that you completed your hike safely -- but disappointed (again) that Parks officials didn't have someone positioned at the trailhead to warn hikers of the day's weather forecast (&quot;heavy rain with thunderstorms by early afternoon&quot;).

According to the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel this morning, the 68-year-old man who died took his wife to Hawaii for their 45th wedding anniversary; she didn't go on the helicopter ride; his daughter and son-in-law did; they survived.
Scary -- when I searched for &quot;helicopter crash&quot;, a thread from last year came up that was very similar; it does sound like it happens fairly &quot;regularly&quot;.