Good Wine Opinion
 

We went on vacation to California in October and I have a new respect for, good but reasonable, wines.
Can anyone tell me their opinion of a good, but "reasonable" wine. From Calfornia or not.
thanks.

I think your question would be better put elsewhere but I'll bite (or sip).

Anything by Gallo of Sonoma. This is the Gallo daughter's business with all the money of the huge Gallo organization behind it. Her Sonoma chardonnay is around $8 at my market and $7 on sale and has that buttery maleolactic taste that Chard's at 3 times the price have. Their Cabernet Sauvignon is outstanding and they have a new Pinot Gris (like pinot grigio) that is causing a stir. I think they don't care if they make money at this point.

Another excellent winery making non-estate bottled wine (eg less expensive) is Beringer.
Their winemakers are top notch and the cheap stuff is way better than it has to be.

LMF

There are lots of choices out there and everyone has a different idea of "reasonable" so here is a few to ponder. Some a slightly more expensive than others but within each winery you will find some inexpensive wines.

Siverado
J. Lohr
Joseph Phelps
Frogs Leap
Clos Du Bois
Lolonis
Robert Pepi
Bonny Doon
Ch. St. Jean
Liberty School
Columbia Crest
Rodney Strong
Murphy Goode
St. Supery
Ravenswood
Simi
Cambria
Sterling
Estancia

As someone had recommended in the past on one of these threads, if you go to a local grocery store, the wines are cheaper than buying them directly from the winery.

We found this to be the case in Healdsburg at the local Safeway. Additionally, if you buy a case of assorted wines, they will give you an additional 10% off, and I think if you get one of their shopping cards, there's an additional 5% off.

Then again, wine is a personal thing. I know people who love that "boxed stuff," and it's pretty reasonable. ((b))

I have found this book to come in handy when trying to find out about Cal wines. The title is The Connoisseurs Handbook of the Wines of California and the Pacific Northwest by Norman Roby and Charles Olken. It is great for anyone - novice or expert.

"Reasonable" will vary by variety, vintage and your palate.

For instance, a reasonable Calif Cab might be considered $25-30.

A good place to start is on the Wine Spectator web site. Registration is free and you can searc thousands of wines.

http://www.winespectator.com/Wine/Home/

My latest favorite is La Crema Pinot Noir. It is a Sonoma Valley wine.

If you have a Cost Plus World Market by you, they have a lot of very reasonable wines. One of my favorites is Yellow Tail Chardonnay, which is from Australia (which I've also found at my local grocery store.)

Being a real lover of the big cabernets of California, I have been thrilled with my discovery of Estancia Cabernet. My market normally sells it for $8.99 or $9.99 a bottle and it would fool a lot of people as being worth double to triple that.

And I think SuzieQ's list is quite good. Liberty School used to be my favorite "cheapie".

Our community theatre went through a phase of selling the range of Yellow Tail wines (available dirt cheap from a distributor) and the bulk of our audiences praised our "new and better quality" wine being served.

Yes, Yellowtail is one of our fave cheapies, esp the Merlot. Littlemiss, I think the Gallo Wines are excellent too, esp. Chard. and Pinot Noir, Another excellent wine is Pepperwood Grove's Viognier 7.99$, Viognier being my new fave white. La Crema Pinot is fantastic, as is Villa Mt. Eden's Pinot Noir. Chateau Souverain's 2001 Chardonay(93) was 20th on WS's best of the best list. So many wines, so little time, is my motto! ;-)

Patrick,
If you like Estancia Cab try their meritage red. It is more expensive but really good. Cheers!

SusieQ, I haven't noticed the Frog's Leap but I am a big fan of the Stag's Leap.

Agree with the Yellow Tail.

I remember the days when Robert Mondovi's Chardonny was under $7 a bottle and he didn't have twenty different lables. It was fantastic and cheap.

Glen Ellen used to have a Country Chardonny that was good and quite cheap.

I picked up a bottle of La Crema last May while in Sonoma -- now owned by Kendall Jackson. Looking forward to opening it up. It wasn't reasonable, though -- $20.00. Probably can get it cheaper at a grocery store. ((b))

There is a thread called Wine O's on the Other Topics board of Fodors.com/forums. There are some good recommendations on that thread. Cheers.

SuzieQ, I'm ahead of you on the Estancia meritage. I've liked it for quite a while, but its popularity has brought the price up to around $27 a bottle here -- not bad, but almost triple in price for the cab -- my "daily" affordable wine. My market had a recent sale on the Estancia cabernet at $7.99 per bottle with a 10% discount by the case, so I stocked up.

California wines this year are getting too expensive, and unless you pay a lot, most are not very good...
Try the Montes label of wines from Argentinia. Excellent, excellent wine at a fabulous value. Their Malbec (red) can be found at CostPlus storesfor $6, their Cabernet for about $13. Both are rated highly by Wine Spectator mag.! (The Cab's in their top 100 wines of 2003)
That said, the Coppola-Niebaum Claret is good for around $14, and that's a California wine!!

There is a fantastic and popular California Zinfandel called "Rancho Zabaco Dancing Bull" that sells for around $8. It's a relatively easy to drink red wine that goes over well with many new wine drinkers. If you like that, you may also like a Shiraz from Australia, particularly Rosemount, $7-10. Both of these are pretty easy to find. Andrea Immer has a great book called "Great Wine Made Simple." Happy toasting!

Piper Heidsieck Champagne used to be my favorite wine for the money but it too has shot up in price. I bought a case of it for 1999/2000 New Years Eve at $25 per bottle.

south africa makes VERY good wine. if you like red wine, try kwv merlot, it costs about $8 (at least in nj).

Robert Mondavi puts out quite drinkable reds under its Woodbridge and Private Selection labels-- and they're cheap. Frei Brothers is another excellent winery for mid-range reds (I don't drink whites as a general rule). Stags Leap Winery in Sonoma Valley is one of my favorites, but the merlots start at $30 and the cabs at $37, so they're an occasional treat. The Gallo of Sonoma brand is dependably good, as LMF notes correctly. I like the Coppola 2000 Clarets (these are "generic reds", i.e., not specifically "Cabernet" or "Merlot" or "Pinot Noir" grapes, but a combination), but the 2001 Clarets seem to need more months in bottle to my palate (as I noted in another thread).

Go to a good local wine store and ask-- and don't be afraid to give upper limits on how much you want to spend! They appreciate customers who want to learn about fine wines, and usually love letting you in on their "bang for the buck" specials.

You may have already learned this at the wineries, but just in case: with the red wines, especially the powerful ones, pour some into a glass and let it "breathe" for at least half an hour to let it mellow out. There's a huge difference in aroma and flavor when you give the wine a chance to "develop." If you do like the reds, go to Target and get a set of red wine glasses (the big, round ones) as they enhance the wine-drinking experience tremendously. Some bigger cities offer wine classes, and many wine shops have frequent tastings--watch your local newspaper's Food section if there is one. The more you sample, the better chance you'll find the one(s) you really like.

rjw,

(from In and Out burgers to fine wine :)), have you tried Laurel Glen's "Reds"? I prefer it to the Coppola meritage.

LTCM17, our favorite but reasonably priced wine is from Austrailia. Any of the reds from Rosemount we have enjoyed greatly and they are priced very well. I can get a case on sale and it averages to be no more than $6 a bottle. Our fav is the merlot, or the cab/merlot blend. Enjoy!
Also if you have a Trader Joe's near you, they always have some great wines at reasonable prices...

I'm new to this red wine thing too. I started experimenting with red wine after a trip to NYC in October and having a very nice red Italian wine at Becco's. They have this enormous list of Italian wines that are all $20 a bottle. We told our waitress that we liked Merlots (not me but my dinner companions) and let her make a suggestion. It got me hooked on Italian reds. Naturally we didn't write down the name so, I did the same thing at the local package store that has a big wine selection. The guy there recommended a Dolcette D'Alba (sp?). Another good wine. And since then we've been experimenting with different wines - some good, some not so good. Formulae is another Italian red that we've enjoyed. Nothing has been over $14/bottle. Now we have a hard time going back to white wine. Maybe in the summer.

Just a small example of how you learn while traveling and it can make a difference in daily life.

Cost Plus World Market is definitely a good place to buy. They have Pepperwood wines that are good. These are "grape glut" wines... Actually wines from more famous makers but smaller wineries have bought their extra grapes and made their own private label wines. You will only see the name of the winery, year and type on them. I believe Pepperwood is the same as Sebastiani. You can get a good Pepperwood Cab at World market for about $6.

Also, Sams has great wine prices. I like the Meridian Merlot, which sells for about $6.50 at Sams. ($13.99 in the grocery store) There is a nice Louis Bernard Cotes du Rhone at Sams for about $7.99. It was ranked 89 by Wine Spectator.

The one thing that shocked me about Sonoma Valley is that the wineries, for the most part, don't grow their own grapes.

I had always assumed wineries grew their own grapes.

I love Goats du Roam, a South African rhone-style. It's about $8, but oh-so-hard to find.

My understanding is that if a wine says "Sonoma County" on the label, at least 75% of the grapes must be from that county.

The broader the geogrpahic listing on the label, the broader the area from which the grapes f may have come.

For example, California Chardonay on a label only means that the grapes came from within the state of Calif.

Another point, while the term "reserve" may have some legal meaning (in Italy for instance), in the US it means whatever the winery wants it to mean. It could be aged, better grapes or simply a nicer label.

I

Oops..please excuse the typos

One to check out, not sure of availability in other regions is Falesco Vitiano. It's an Italian red from Umbria. I believe that the importer is Leonardo Locasio (sp)? At least, that's who it was when I was working in a wine department. Costco carries it, I know for sure. It's about $8/bottle, and is a GREAT everyday wine. I believe that it's a Cab/Merlot/Shizaz (?) blend. Check it out!

Wendy, I like the Goats du Rhoam too. Found it up in Atlanta, and yes it is hard to find! A lot of S. African wines are very good and relatively inexpensive. Austin: Costco has an excellent wine selection too. Brancott Vineyard Sauvignon Blanc for 12.99$ and Chauteau Souverain Chard for 12.99$. Also, the Black Opal Cab/Merot blend...2 bottles for 10.99, it is a GREAT everyday wine :-)

I agree with the La Crema Pinot and Clos du Bois Pinot Noir and Zinfandel, plus lots of the others mentioned.
One I haven't seen mentioned that I enjoy a great deal - around $7.99 at the grocery is Camelot Pinot Noir. It's by Kendall Jackson.

Has anyone else tried 7 Deadly Zins, which I get at Costco - a good place to find excellent wine? This is my current favorite, very (too?) drinkable. It comes from Lodi in California.

I like Australian Chardonnay. Lindeman's Bin 65 is better than "good" & it is reasonably priced.

"Goats du Roam". That is such a fun name! I think I'll try that just to see it. Central Market has a great wine selection and helpful staff.

My favorite wine of the day is Vinasoro Merlot. 1999. It's a merlot from Spain. $10 a bottle. Wonderful.

Hi Jocelyn! Say, what red would YOU drink with an In 'n' Out Double Double? I'm thinking Two Buck Chuck Red and a straw....

Haven't tried the Laurel Glen reds. I'll have to hunt it down. I had a glass of Maddalena cab last night at Ocean Avenue Seafood in Santa Monica-- delicious, a bit less complex than most cabs, not particularly heavy. Went well with the buttery sake-glazed cod I had.

Quick rave: Ocean Avenue Seafood is still the best seafood joint on the Westside!! Awesome food.

rjw, I still haven't tried the Two Buck Chuck...call me a fraidy cat. Have you seen the threads on the Europe board about the SoCal get-together?

Jocelyn: I have. My weekends are booked solid through spring, so I'm regretfully going to have to miss it/them.... But I hope everyone has a superb time! I know they will-- the SoCal posters on this forum are a very friendly and helpful bunch!

Dick is spot on with his 75%! To add to the confusion California has AVA's-
American Viticultural Areas-(sort of like the French appellations). You may note that most people here refer to them as "Districts".
There are something like 150 AVA's in the US.
15 in Napa (Caneros,Stags Leap) and 13 here in Sonoma County (Russian River Valley,Rockpile)alone!
Now there are even sub-AVA's!
BTW-Wine with an 'estate' label was grown on that winery land.
There is so much good reasonable wine
here that the selection overwhelms!
Cost Plus is a dangerous place to venture with one's debit card! Better deals are to be found at Trader Joes'-
at least here!
My favorite label for 'reasonable' wine is STU PEDASSO from Topolos in sonoma County. (Any one not get that?)
Since Kal's in HI I will borrow his
tag-"So many wines, so little time!
R5

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