Plano,McKinney,&Frisco are all great little old towns with new business and residential components. All have good schools, parks, and other amenities. The overall cost of living in TX is quite good compared with the coasts and the mountain west. The proximity to Dallas offers culture and sports teams. It is hot and somewhat humid, but the wind blows and that helps. Buy a home with a pool; you'll live in it or near it 8 months a year. Church is a big deal in TX. There will be several of your favorite flavor fairly close to any home that you like. As a long time resident (now p/t) buy a house that you LOVE. A short commute on "The Tollway" is worth every penny. Avoid North Central/US75 if possible. Best of luck--you will like Dallas area and Texas if you go.

MomDD -

Honestly, Texas sucks. In a lot of ways. I have lived on the East Coast and in OC, CA as well as Marin Co.

Heat index today will be 106 (downgraded from 108-109).

The driver's here are absolutely friggin clueless.

No state tax but house taxes are high. We pay over $13k/yr.

Consider that A/C will be on 24/7 - you can never open your windows for a fresh breeze in the spring, summer or most of fall.

The houses here are very nice. Really nice. But so far, that's all I like about Texas - and my 20 minutes to DFW airport.

You run out of things to do in DFW after about 3 years.

Restaurants, for the most part serve the same sh^&.

I am trying to figure out where I want to live now that the kiddies are gone. I am OUT of Texas!

PS: Wanna buy a house???

soogies,
Here in Chicagoland we get the same RE tax, an income tax AND an outrageous sales tax...BUT we do get good variety of excellent restaraunts

So I think we are even

Frank - you are waaay better off. Your summers don't last seven months...

It's interesting to read everyone's comments.

I too moved from the E Coast to Dallas, and thinking that it'd be hell. Well, Dallas, like a mold, grew on me, even though I was only there for 3.5 years. I don't miss Dallas too much, but there are some things I do miss, now that I'm back in the North East.

It's cheap to live there, esp considering that you're moving there from Orange County.

But like soogies said, there's not much to do in/around DFW. You can drive for hours (or even days) and still be IN TX! The only consolation is that DFW is AA's hub and so we flew a lot during those years we were living there.

Heavens - you should check it out then for jobs - sounds like you would have a great support system and know Texas. I will know one person. :(

Well, hot hot hot today in CA - mid 90's and I hate it. Just a taste I guess.

Thanks for all the feedback. I like the look of the historic district to McKinney but that most likely is not practical for a variety of reasons.

Soogies you are funny. No, we will not be buying a house at all right away. Got a big ole house in California need to figure out as well as so many other things.

Church is a big part of our life on many levels, socially it is where most of our friends have come from and it is something we are active in - but we are casual. I guess they still get dressed up for church there. The biggest things for us is a GREAT youth program - as well as competitive cheer for one of our daughters - that will help her to adjust.

We do like the fact that DFW is a major airport and it is closer to my Mom and Stepdad (3 hour drive) and an easier flight back east.

One day at a time. I do appreciate all the feedback... not freaking out YET in S. California... might be all for nothin'. Gotta get a firm offer first eh?

Dawn - it's been a rough few weeks for me and I have been especially hating Texas, so take that into consideration when reading about my hates.

You will find lots of churches and very active youth groups of all sorts here. Of course, cheer is only second to football ya know!

We do love the convenience of DFW. I think I am just really spoiled by our own cultural growth experienced on all our trips to Europe. Nothing in this area can compare to anything in Europe as far as the arts, the museums, for example. IMO.

Good luck wherever life takes you!!

{{{{Soogies}}}} I am sorry.

Yes, I love Europe as well - I do know what you mean - and I spent sometime in Dallas but it was many years ago when my now almost 22 year old was just a toddler or so. Now when I have gone it was only been two weekend trips to see the Cowboys.


<You will find lots of churches and very active youth groups of all sorts here. Of course, cheer is only second to football ya know!>
Yeah...ya'll kill girls over it ;-) Yikes.

I wouldn't live in Texas unless it was the the only possible choice. The heat is oppressive, the famous << Texan >> superiority complex about the biggest (debatable) and the best (never debatable), the bible-belt mentality, et cetera, all combine to give it a poor rating in my book. I've visited a few cities in Texas (Houston, San Antonio) and no job could ever make up for the lack of civilisation.

A pool is a good idea. I was thinking about the lakes but don't know the schools around Lewisville. When I lived there all the families at my company lived on or near Grapevine. That's too far, but Lake Lewisville may work. You're going to miss the water. A pool or a place or at least a boat on the lake may help a lot.

The winds can be surprising, especially in the winter. Our building was just north of DFW with huge glass doors. Sometimes it would take two people to open the darn thing against the wind. The Dallas area can be great, but I really missed trees and hills. You're going to miss water.

Good point Starrs - I will miss the water...as well as the trees... and the hills. We sort of have it all here - it is very pretty where I live in our opinion. :(

Well, if you are comparing Dallas to Europe, well, doesn't measure up.

I am not sure why everyone is whining about the heat so much. It is like that almost everywhere in the south. That is why they invented AC and plenty of it.

Where I live, the desert of So Cal, it hit 113 today, now that is HOT!

Heavens..it is hot hot hot here today in Orange County - I am complaining about the heat cause I sure don't like it :))

Heavens - of course there is A/C and I do use it. But , sheeesh, I can't stand the feeling of being closed in by it 24 hours a day. It's not like you can open up the windows at sunrise and get some cooler air. And, it doesn't even cool down enough at night to ever open them.

No. I will never get used to it here. And the more I see of the world, the more I want to be anywhere but here.

Hi Mom: I saw this thread yesterday, just assumed you were traveling to Dallas for a vacation of some sort, and then wondered why a request for info on travel to Dallas was posted in the Lounge instead of on the U.S. board.

Finally opened it just now and am surprised to see that you are possibly moving there. Wow - after everything the last year or so has brought you, now this!

No advice, I'm afraid, but just wanted to say that I wish you luck and I hope that whatever happens goes smoothly.

My step-daughter lives in McKinney and likes it a lot. But I have to say that part of Texas wouldn't be one of my first choices. Unless you really love football, movies, Texas food and people with very conservative views. It feels like one of the more boring places that I have spent much time in.

Saraho - I love footbal & movies and hold some conservative views.. no idea what Texas food even is? Steak? Don't eat it. Yikes.

Iowa - I know right? :-? One day at a time...

MomDD--parts of TX are indeed the back forty. Dallas is not.
There are excellent restaurants at every price level, not just chains. Steak, well yes, some do eat steak, but seafood is plentiful, even Maine lobster,--remember that huge airport? We took vegan nephew to a pricey specialty seafood restaurant and I'm allergic. We were both accomodated pefectly. Dallas is multicultural; maybe not quite up to SFO or NYC, but certainly as much as LA. McKinney,Plano,&Frisco have all the chains and also independants. Diversity of culture and food does exist even in the suburbs. You'll only starve if you want to. A popular local small town chain, Cotton Patch, has places in each of these towns. They serve 'Texas' food. The only other 'Texas' food is Tex-Mex.

BTW--conservative fits right in to the towns you're considering. It's the left wingers who might feel outnumbered. As for church dress codes, they don't dress up except for Christmas and Easter, unless you pick a really big church in DALLAS. So, while you're settling in, drive by on Sunday morning and scope the couple that you plan to visit. You will be noticed on your visiting day and made almost embarrassingly welcome. Embrace it!

I recommend that you live 'today'. Embrace and FEEL your feelings. This is an adventure, even just the waiting to find out jitters. Life is a journey, it's only done when it's over.

soogies, I tell my students that "Attitude is Everything" because it is so true. There are positives and negatives to every town, city and valley one could live in; too hot, too cold, cost too much, too much traffic, not enough museums. But, when it comes down to it, it is the people who make the place. And in Dallas, they are abundant with warm, generous, caring people. Sorry that has not been your experience.

I would like to suggest an experiment for you, if I may; go out today and run errends, meet and smile and talk to people that you meet. Go and have coffee and talk about your winning baseball team or football team, your colleges, lakes, and other areas of culture in the town. Have you seen the Myerson? Have you been down to the art museums in downtown or in Fort Worth? Go have a drink at local bar and strike up a conversation. Join a church, a club, take a class, get involved. Put out some positive energy and you might recieve some back in return...give it a try and see if your attitude about Dallas and Texas changes. If not, then you do have something to complain about.

Heavens - thanks for your suggestions. Yes, I have done those. Subscribed to both Ft Worth and Dallas symphonies. Been to a fewl museums: Kimball, Modern Art, 6th floor to name a few.

It's just that I am done with what they offer here. I don't find much of the culture interesting. Done with the cowboy and cattle shtick. Call me a snob, I guess. But nothing compares to the great museums of Europe. Or their cathedrals. We saw the latest exhibits at the Kimball, the art of Spain. Of course the paintings were wonderful, but how can that hold a candle to the Louvre or the Rijks?

I have a few friends but so many of them here are of what i call "Southern mentality." They marry young, fresh out of college, don't stray far from home. Texas style church/religion has destroyed any interest I had in it.

So, yes, I am a snob. There, I admitted it. Of course, some people are very nice here, without a doubt. So many of them don't care to travel, and most aren't interested to hear about our travels. I have always hated football. Forget about baseball - I love it, but you'd never know it existed here since football overshadows everything.

I am just done. Eight years is enough time to have given it a chance.

"But nothing compares to the great museums of Europe. Or their cathedrals. "

I think the same thing can be said of a large majority of the US. A VERY large majority. We are not Europe. Only a few cities can offer anything to attempt to match the great museums and cathedrals of Europe.

No advice to offer, other than to find a way to be happy where you are planted. Life's too short to focus on the negatives, rather than the positives.

Soogies, some ideas for options near Plano. People who enjoy doing the things you enjoy doing -

http://www.meetup.com/DallasEntertainmentGroup/

http://www.meetup.com/theater-166/

http://www.meetup.com/Tours-Adventures/
“ My husband has lived in Dalllas for twenty years and was surprised by what he did not know. Nice people. Interesting day. ”

http://www.meetup.com/getoutandabout/

http://www.meetup.com/DIY-Fashion-Meetup-Group/

Those meet-up groups represent a couple of thousand people in the North Dallas area (I used Plano in the search since that's the topic of this thread) who are also interested in art, museums, theatres and seeing what the DFW area has to offer.

They are just a few computer clicks and one meet-up away.

<i>None of the above are single groups. They are meet-ups for people looking for like-minded people to share experiences and life with. Give it a try! :-)

i would never relocate teens to plano. there is something about this town and 'nice' upper middle class teenagers...major heroine and suicide problems among the youth. plano's youth problems were subject to a lot of publicity over the years.

I think the heroine problem is mostly a problem in the homes of the very wealthy, where the parents substitute "things" and "possessions" for parenting. The kids are usually unsupervised for a large portion of their time while the parents travel or work instead of being home with their children. This is my understanding and you can find this delimma in almost any city in America.

soogies, I foresee that if you compare every place where you live in the US to the great cities of Europe, that you will never be happy. This is why we travel. Live in a city that is likable, be content, do your work, then travel and GO SEE these great places. Or move there, but now city in the US will have a musuem like the Louvre or a cathedral like in Italy or Paris. That is just my observation. With those standards, there will always be disappointment, imo.

soogies, I totally understand what you are saying. Many, many years ago I lived in North Texas (Argyle and Denton) and just went back to visit for the first time in 26 years. While thrilled to see old friends, I couldn't believe I had ever lived there! There is, in my opinion, a Texas culture, which appeals to some, and not others. But, again, that's true with most areas of the country, no?

As far as comparisons to European cities, I don't think it's apples to apples, because in addition to being in these new and exciting places, we are usually there in vacation mindset. I bet my beloved Paris would even feel different if I had to experience day to day life there.

Yeah, I think I will be unhappy in most cities, although SFO, Boston, DC, NYC have a lot more to offer. Starting next year, we intend to rent an apt somewhere in Europe for a few months and see how it goes.

Can I come?

starrs - thanks for trying to help with the links! But I am done here.

You are welcome.
Try them. Until you move, be busy doing things you like to do with people who like to do them too. :-)

Thanks again everyone. I had a rough morning ...going to be a long few weeks.

Good, luck, Dawn. It'll all work out in the long run.

Irego, I agree with your statement, "There is, in my opinion, a Texas culture, which appeals to some, and not others."

Soogie, I agree with a lot of what you said, too, but I don't think Texans have a Southern mentality. To me, their mentality is very Western. Some of the Texans I know(and like) are very abrupt and have strong opinions about everything- kind of the opposite of many Southerners.

But good luck,MomDD, with your possible move.

Hi Dawn, Sorry you had a rough morning. Just want you to know I am thinking about you. Hope things get better.

Dawn - sorry you had a rough day. Sorry, too, I've been such a Debby Downer on this thread. I apologize, truly.

Saraho - I guess I am thinking about "southern mentality" differently. Maybe I am meeting more southern folks than "true" Texans.

"I guess I am thinking about "southern mentality" differently. Maybe I am meeting more southern folks than "true" Texans."

Please re-read what you are writing and think about how it sounds.

starrs - I d on't know what you mean. Please 'splain.

The reality of the prospect is starting to sit in and it was hard yesterday. Fortunately I had class in the afternoon so my pity party ended.

Yes, this thread has been eye opening. I wonder if I started a thread about Orange County and moving here what it would look like.

"I have a few friends but so many of them here are of what i call "Southern mentality." They marry young, fresh out of college, don't stray far from home. "

That's not "southern". *

I understand you don't like Texas. I moved there and left because I missed the hills and trees. It's fine not to like Texas. You've posted a lot that you aren't happy. Sorry about that. But will the anti-Texans/ anti-Southerners POV/comments improve your happiness? You slam Texas because it doesn't have the museums and cathedrals of Europe...yet later admit only a handful of US cities could come close to offering the museums/cathedrals of Europe. It just seems that in your personal unhappiness you're lashing out at others.

It was just an idea - re-read what you are writing here and see how it sounds. If you're fine with it, okay. But, IMO, your happiness is not going to improve with unreasonable expectations and/or trashing the people around you. IMO becoming a happier person begins within.

*based on census stats, your "Southern mentality" theory doesn't hold water. The only color on the map that could be called regional would be the darkest color/ oldest age at first marriage = NE
See slide 14 at http://www.census.gov/acs/www/Downlo...ised_final.ppt

Dawn,
I knew a girl that moved from here to San Clemente, she pulled in to her apt with everything she owned in a UHaul injust next to the Kmart parking lot and broke down & cried. She later grew to love SC, but it was hard at first. No matter where you move its hard at first(even San Clemente)