I have often spoken for the right of people to travel with their babies/children, and I have never accused anyone of being stupid for thinking otherwise. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I have thought that some of the posts were pretty mean spirited, and I wish people would give their real e-mail addresses when posting, but on to the discussion. There are several basic reasons for people to be able to travel with babies on planes: <BR> <BR>In no particular order: <BR>(1) Sometimes they just have to, and it beats the heck out of subjecting a baby to a three-day car ride (not even an option for Hawaii) - what would you say if someone lived in Hawaii, had three children under 5 (maybe even triplet babies), and the rest of their family lived on the mainland - should they not see the family for years? - should everyone come to visit them instead? <BR> <BR>(2) Families should spend time together, and people need to take vacations to experience the world and to take a breather from the work world; some people want to do both at once or just have nobody to keep the baby. Yes, people have to make sacrifices when they have children, but you can't ask them to give up travel or anything else they really love, if they really don't have to. <BR> <BR>(3) It is just simply their right to do so. I am a big believer in people being allowed to do what they want if it does not harm others. A crying baby on a flight might make it harder for me to sleep, but I just deal with it. It does not harm me. I recognize it is what babies do, and just do the best I can. I am far more bothered by rude adults on flights, since they can help it. I do agree with those, however, who say that parents often don't monitor their children enough. If someone does what they can to keep their children/babies from bothering me, that is all I have a right to ask. I do not question why they have the children with them because it is none of my business. The argument that someone else used about this being public transportation also fits under this point. It is no different than a city bus with wheels, when you look at what a plane basically does. <BR> <BR>Finally, just let me say that I have flown quite a lot, on business trips, trips home to visit, and trips abroad, and have used many different airlines. I have never encountered even one baby that bothered me. The only people I have ever encountered on a flight that I even remember were a teenage boy and teenage girl going to Europe together. They talked and played the whole way and kept me from getting any sleep. Did I complain? No, I just did my best, and when I got to Europe I had a great time. If we all learned to relax a little more, all the air and road rage that we hear about these days would decline, and we would all be happier people. Think about it. You only live once (unless you believe in reincarnation of course), and why spend your whole life complaining over such small things.

I meant to say a "city bus with wings," not a "city bus with wheels." I think they all have wheels, except for of course Venetian taxis and city buses on the Jetsons.

<BR>I would recomend earplugs. I use them at home to reduce the noise from my neighbors barking dogs. They're inexpensive and light to carry. Maybe the airlines should provide them to passengers when requested.

Wow! One of the first messages here was at least partially correct. Lots of defensive, self-righteous people around here. Why get so worked up? Guilt? Follow your own advice people, and ignore everyone who disagrees with you! <BR> <BR>I for one didn't this Susan referring to anyone else by name on this board, but I do have a question -- if someone is at work is that the reason they have time to post long messages here? And to keep checking back on them? I find that amusing, but then again, I'm not the employer of these people. <BR> <BR>I think this forum is an interesting place for people to discuss topics with no holds barred. The things I've read here are things that very few people would ever say to someone in public, but you gain an insight as to what people are really thinking and feeling. I don't think people deliberately try to annoy others during flights, but rather they are just not aware of how their actions affect others. <BR> <BR>I've traveled extensively and found Americans to be the kindest, most considerate, most helpful nation of people I've ever encountered. That American passenger with the screaming baby would probably give you the shirt off his back if you were in trouble. You don't find that in many places -- behavior like that is considered foolish and naive -- so I'll take the good with the bad as far as Americans are concerned. <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>

Ricki, <BR> <BR>I took the time to post my first message, as I indicated to Susan, in an attempt to provide helpful information to Jeff and to anyone else travelling with children. I did this to make his life more pleasant, as well as the lives of those who are travelling on planes with him. <BR> <BR>As to your comment about my having time to do this BECAUSE I am at work, you will be interested to know that I have a progressive employer who allows parents to work a flexible schedule, and I am not currently on the clock. So yes, I do have time to post long messages, and keep checking back on them, as it is my perrogative to do on my day off. <BR> <BR>I really cannot believe the meanness that has come through in so many of these messages. A guy asked for some tips. He asked for help. And what he got in return was judgements and spite. What a shame.

Ruth, since you seem to believe that everyone here is addressing you directly, I WILL address you directly: get over you victimhood here. Nobody wants to read every detail of your life on some message board. Who cares? This isn't the Life of Ruth forum. <BR> <BR>Dan W. has made some reasonable (if very long-winded) comments here. Examine the reasons for the travel and figure out if it's worth it to you to put yourself, your infant and other travelers through a flight. The airlines cram so many people into such small spaces that no one can truly relax or enjoy a flight. It's just something to get through.

JG, <BR> <BR>Sorry if you think I'm taking up more than my fair share of airtime - this forum is public, and anyone can post as often as they like. <BR> <BR>Contrary to your opinion, I don't feel at all like a victim. I fell like I am one of very few people who actually answered Jeff's question about what to do when travelling with infants. The fact that I did so, and at length, seemed to irritate a number of people who took issue with the fact that I sent a long post, and questioned my work ethic. I took issue with Susan's comments because they mocked language directly from my post. <BR> <BR>My point here is that I would like to stop the acrimony on this post. That's not its purpose. Jeff asked a question. I answered it, as did a few other well-meaning folks. No one has to agree with me, just, as I said in my original post, respect my right to have a different opinion than yours, or someone else's. <BR> <BR>No where in my original post did I call anyone a name, make assumptions over parental status, or indicated that this forumm was about me. I simply tried to help out a father looking for tips from other parents. <BR> <BR>We agree that Dan W. had some very good points. Let's agree to disagree about babies on planes, and leave it at that. <BR> <BR>Had you shared your e-mail address, I would have welcomed the opportunity to engage in a private dialogue with you on this matter. However, since you didn't, we'll have to keep it here. <BR> <BR>I only wish that everyone would read Dan's post again, and realize that this is not one of those things to get worked up about. Cancer, death in the family, divorce - those are things to get worked up about, not this. <BR> <BR>I hope everyone has a pleasant rest of the day, and takes some time to focus on the important things this evening.

Ruth, just a word of advice here: you're allowing yourself to be baited. Don't take the bait. I've watched people in my office post on message boards and deliberately try to rile some of the more serious people there, all the while laughing their heads off because people are taking their bait. <BR> <BR>Just a heads up for next time.

The obnoxious adults I've encountered on planes were those who were ignoring/indulging their obnoxious kids. It's multi-generational. Make your older kid behave, anticipate your baby's needs, and that's all anyone can ask of you. People don't hate kids, they hate irresponsible, lackadaisical parenting. <BR> <BR>P.S. Ruth should heed her own advice about not getting worked up! No one else is posting their autobiographical novels here, complete with lectures, sermons and tortured defenses. *Yawn* My guess is that people omit their e-mail addresses precisely in order to avoid contact from overly-intense people like her. <BR> <BR>Fodor's needs to do a little editing here.

To those traveling by air: <BR>In addition to infants/children that are annoying, the following are also annoying in my opinion: overweight people (taking over my seat), laptop users (the noise drives me bonkers) golfers (I don't really care what your handicap is, and I don't want to listen to it for 2 hours.) women who don't shave their arms and legs (nuff said)denture wearers (must you click your teeth) drunks, excessive talkers, people who chew gum, men who think they are God's gift to women and women who are ugly and think they are God's gift to men. People who think they are better than the rest of us. Jesse Jackson. Bill and Hillary. People who think they have money and brag about it. Tall people (I can't see the movie through their head) Bald people, (the glare from their head annoys me) And, I hope I never have to sit next to a b**** like Susan on a flight. God help me!

Luke, and anyone else who advises medicating kids for a flight: Please be aware that not all kids get zonked on Benadryl or any other antihistamine. Some of them have a nasty tendancy to develop what we call "paradoxical hyperactivity" on antihistamines. If you plan to premedicate your kid with any drug before you get on a plane, please try the drug out at home before you subject an entire plane to an episode of "paradoxical hyperactivity". I've seen it and it isn't pretty.

Whoa! Remind me never to piss off anyone on this forum! First you teaf into Jeff for being lucky enough to be able to fly first class to Hawaii, then you spend the afternoon tearing Ruth a new one. <BR> <BR>If you look, you'll see that what people are complaining about most is parents who don't prepare, and children whose behaviour is reflective of that. <BR> <BR>Jeff was trying to be prepared so his kid wouldn't bother other travelers, that's why he asked his question in the first place. <BR> <BR>You people are merciless. Who raised you?

Let's face it -- people don't like it when *other people* inflict their lives on them. Period. Everyone wants peace and privacy. Everyone buys as much land and as much house as they can afford in order to get as far away as possible from their neighbors. They move from cities, to suburbs, to rural areas. They build fences. They look for alternate routes to work in order to avoid other cars. Everyone is trying to get away from everyone else. <BR> <BR>People fly first class in order to get away from as many other people as possible. You don't think they're paying all that money just for a little more leg room do you? It's the fewest number of people in the plane. One more person, baby or not, is not going to matter. Jeff's trying to learn how to make his baby and fellow passengers comfortable. He sounds like a new parent. His reasons for bringing the baby seem pretty logical. So what's the big deal? <BR> <BR>People who hurl insults and call others names here, I suspect, are probably the parents of the types of kids everyone else complains about. That's where they learn it.

I cant believe how obnoxious some of these comments are. People have every right to bring babies on planes!!!!! SO WHAT if the baby cries, coos, whatever its nobody elses business. What do you people do if someone snores, burps, or whatever on the plane, its none of your business!

Just for the record, I did not address anyone specifically, but apparently some felt the shoe fit -- so wear it! <BR> <BR>If more parents spent time actually parenting instead of posting sanctimonious lectures on message boards all day, everyone would benefit.

Hi Jeff C: <BR> <BR>I have a proposal for you *wink* If you'll take my husband and me along with you to Hawaii we promise to sit behind you in first class and be the most understanding, helpful, kid-loving fellow passengers you've ever met! <BR> <BR>Just kidding -- although my hubby really IS the most kid-loving passenger you'll ever meet. He will make faces back at them, giggle with them, shoot rubberbands, play their video games, you name it. I've had to restrain him in restaurants several times from encouraging kids to be too rambunctious, especially when it was obvious that their parents were trying to teach them how to behave in a public place (not letting them stand on seats and bother the people around them, etc...) He's a big kid himself, and kids love him. <BR> <BR>I hope you get someone like him to sit near you. There ARE some out there!

Well we are sorry we started such an uproar....(I know I'm being graded on my spelling so I'll try and type more slowly and have Court double check it......NOT!!!)... <BR>First off I appreciate all of the posts...all of them, but we really just intended to solicit advice from others who have witnessed/experienced babIES in flight. How did the parents handle them? Helpful suggestions for keeping them busy etc....so once again we thank you for the helpful advice. <BR>It is a family reunion where all of my great grandparents, aunts, uncles will be there so it is very important to take our baby...(thanks....we realize the baby won't remember but, the rest of my family will, including some that might not see him/her again due to their age) <BR>You people who think we are bringing the baby to "roast" in the sun are seriously challenged. I won't even respond to that. The reason why I said I was flying first class was because I had got some feedback from other that coach was just as good if we bought an extra seat. Prior to contrary belief it wasn't meant to impress. (Actually I just won the LOTTO...hahahah just kidding) <BR>We have decided to bring our child to Maui and we hope to have an uneventful and peaceful flight. Again, we greatly appreciate all of the posts. Hopefully we will be sitting near the nice people...bye for now

Hey Jeff, know what? You WILL be seated next to nice folks, because you seem like a nice, considerate person yourself. You're taking time to learn about how infants fare on planes and will no doubt be a prepared, considerate, thoughtful dad. Even the grumpiest have a hard time being angry at someone who is sincerely thoughtful and kind, and you seem to be both. You will win them over! Have a great time.

Hello, <BR> I read your message on the Fodor's page about your worries over flying with your 10 month old child. <BR>We live in England and love travelling to Florida. We have a young son who is just over three years of age. <BR>He has already been with us twice , the first time he was just over 10 months old and the second time just under the age of 2. <BR>Now Florida is about an 8 hour flight for us and we travel in Economy Class. <BR>Believe me if we can fly all this way then so can you, particularly as I have a Fear Of Flying and always will have. There seems to have been some very negative feedback to your message. <BR>From experience I would say that travelling with a young baby is easier than it would be with say a three or four year old, because at that age they are much more aware of their environment, are more active and much more likely to be restless during the long flight. <BR> <BR>We felt exactly the same way as you do before we took Joshua to Florida at the tender age of 10 months and nearly cancelled our vacation because of it but in the end he was fine. He slept for over 4 hours on the way there and even more so on the flight back. Sometimes you just have to cope the best you can and just get on with it, and I certainly would not even consider thinking about other passenger's feelings. You have every right to be there just the same as they have, you paid for your ticket after all! <BR>Plus once you are on your way all of your attention will be focused on your child and you will not care what else is going on around you. <BR>If anyone else has a problem with this , tough! They are the uncaring ones not you. <BR> <BR>Pack a few of your child's favourite toys in your Hand Luggage as well as at least two changes of clothes. Remember it can get quite cold on the plane. Plus the usual Food requirements etc <BR> <BR>I have talked enough for now if you have any other questions please e-mail me. <BR>

It’s amazing how babies on planes can make people so uptight! Such little creatures to have such power! I don’t have kids myself, and I’m not at all fond of babies, in any place, but life is a process of give and take, wherever we are, whatever we do, whomever we're with. If people "took" with some awareness and gratitude and people "gave" with some understanding and grace, the world would be a better place. Maybe that’s idealistic, but people, it all comes out in the wash. We're not here that long. Let's try to be good to one another. Maybe the person with the noisy kid won't appreciate your generosity, but the attitude you bring to such a situation can come around back to you in other ways. Then it's your turn to "take." <BR> <BR>As for Jeff, the only thing I'd be concerned about is the baby's ears, a topic others have discussed. Obviously you're aware that traveling with a baby can be problematic and are willing to seek advice to lessen the problem. I'd be happy to have your family sitting next to me on a plane. Like anybody else, I don't appreciate neglectful parents; but you don't sound neglectful. <BR> <BR>I've had kids making noise next to me in planes--sometimes with attentive parents and sometimes not--and so far, it's never lasted a lifetime. (Not even the dreaded "kicks in the kidneys through the seat" have been endless.) If the plane is still up in the sky, and taking me safely to where I'm going, I'm happy. (Why tempt fate with complaints about the little things?) I don't demand the right to a perfectly peaceful plane ride because that’s ridiculous. This is life, not "Shangrila." The very worse situations I’ve seen with kids on planes have involved lone kids, doing the holiday journey from one parent to another (the ex-spouses), sitting real quiet and looking unhappy. One little boy nearly broke my heart; he was impossible to cheer up. I would rather have had him screaming into my ear with delight over anything than being so still and looking so miserable. <BR> <BR>As a final word, I recently read a magazine article in which a doctor suggested doing the following if an infant is have problems with air pressure on a plane. First, you take two plastic cups and pack a warm damp paper towel into the bottom of the cups; put over baby's ears to form a seal; then put pacifier in baby's mouth. The warmth and sucking should clear the ears and can even save a baby's eardrums from rupturing in a worst-case scenario. The doctor had helped a baby on a plane with this technique. (For older kids, simply sucking on a lollipop can help with pressure.) Maybe this tip will be useful for you to keep in mind, Jeff; or for anyone else taking an infant on a plane. <BR> <BR> <BR>