Okay--here's a question for those with children. I don't have children yet, but when/if I do, I will be carting him/her on a plane to see his/her grandmother (who cannot travel) and other relatives in Ireland. I'm aware that traveling with an infant is much easier than traveling with a toddler. So my question is: <BR> <BR>During what age range would you advise NOT taking a child on long flights? I know every child is different, but I'd like to get your opinions. <BR> <BR>And I hope no one will take medical advice provided on this site, and instead talk to their own doctors.

Angela, <BR> <BR>Unless you know that you cannot control your child, or if they already have ear trouble, I don't think you should have to avoid flying with them. It has been my experience that most instances of a child who cries throughout a flight occur because of ear discomfort. That's why you should talk to your doctor first and go prepared with medications, bottles, pacifiers etc. If it's your child's first flight, don't assume their ears won't bother them because they don't have a history of ear trouble. I have two children with ear trouble and one without. My pediatrician recommended giving each of them a decongestant prior to flight to be on the safe side. It doesn't hurt them and can elimate a painful, even damaging situation. As you said, each child is different. We could fly anywhere with our daughter at any age. However, each of our boys went through a stage (at different ages) where we wouldn't take them to a restaurant, let alone confine them to a long flight. You'll be the best judge for your child.

If anything seems to arouse the emotions on this forum, this topic is one of them. I am a parent, but I have been on the other side of the equation too. Both sides have some valid issues,after you dimiss the trappings of emotion. The problem IMO gets into extremely polarized points of view. On one side, the parents that don't control their children or socialize them appropriately, thus placing an unfair burden upon everyone else; vs. people that are so rigid and intolerant they view any interface with kids while traveling as an assault upon their rights. <BR> <BR>Have you considered breaking the trip up into two parts? Maybe fly into LA, spend the night and do the second leg the next day? Many airlines will allow you to overnight on the same itinerary. <BR> <BR>Or is this just prolonging the potential agony? Don't know, just a thought.

As a new mother, 14 month old baby, I would NOT take my child on this trip. I have very good child who sleeps alot and I just took him from Chicago to California over Christmas to visit relatives which was not a good idea. he did sleep most of the way on the plane and yes I did buy him his own seat and used our car seat but it was bad when we got there. Just the time difference between Chicago and California was hard for him to adjust too. He was cranky for the first 2 days as his sleep pattern was messed up. I was with family an was able to stay at the house and let him sleep when he needed to (onhis Chicago schedule) but when you are on vacation and are out and about you are not going to want to stop everything and go into the hotel room for baby's schedule, sorry. Use this as a "second honeymoon" for you and dad and enjoy yourselves with baby at home. I'm going to Italy in august and my son will be with his "nana" 14 days and 5 cities in a rental car witha toddler not to mention the plane trip does not appeal to me! <BR> <BR>For the poster who asked what ages are good for plane travel, very small babies less who have not started crawling yet (less thn 6 months) might do well. There is alot of sleeping at that age and most likely they will not be as affected neither will they want to get down and crawl or toddle around. Past that age I would wait until your child is old enough to understand when they must be quiet and still (probably not until 3 or 4 years old), but I am no expert, this is just my opinion.

Well think of this - I am about to do the following trip with a 17 month old and a 4 year old (with my husband thank God). We're doing a round the world trip which will incorporate three 12-14 hour flights and various other 4 and 5 hour flights. So feel less nervous knowing that there are people more foolhardy than yourselves. <BR> <BR>I have done several 8 hour flights with the children - a return London to Barbados (8 hours each way) when my eldest was 7 months - she was fantastic and slept both ways. We also flew two 8 hour trips London to Antigua when my elcest was 3 and the youngest 5 months. Both were again fantastic and slept a good deal of the way. <BR> <BR>This is the trick. Eventually they will fall asleep. Try and arrange the flight to be at night if possible, preferably a couple of hours before baby's normal bedtime.If you don't want to pay for an extra seat, make sure you reserve the bassinet/skycot position. Your airline may persuade you that your baby will be too large for it but just say it's a small baby. I've always managed to get those seats. British Airways have these fantastic baby seats which are like carseats which fit on the bassinet table which are great for older babies. But they are the only airline that have these. Still even if you get the normal bassinet position, these are in the bulkhead position which gives you loads more room and you have the added advantage of having no-one in front of you to disturb. If you decide to splash out on an extra seat, get the configuration of 3 seats together, and hopefully separated from other seats. In economy, they are normally the winndow seats. But still ask for them to be in the bulkhead position. <BR> <BR>Take the small toy surprises and the chocolate treats. <BR> <BR>I must admit, reading all your negative replies, has made me a bit nervous about my trips.

Take your child with you, even though it will not be easy. I have travelled with both of my boys and we figured out we had to plan ahead. Visit your doctor and ask if his ears are clear and have him recommend a decongestant in case it is neccessary. pack lto's of toys and snacks and especially pack something familiar. They do get antsy and you must be very patient. <BR>

Hey Sal-Chocolate has caffeine in it! I sure wouldn't want my kid all caffeined up on a long flight! <BR> <BR>To Dave-Why the h*** did you post here? You are obviously going to do what you want to do.

I flew with my 16-month year old daughter from Boston to Italy last April. It was just fine. Go for it!

Lisa, Fine for you? Or fine for all around you? <BR> <BR>Parents have a tendency to overlook the problems their children cause because they are used to them. <BR> <BR>Others aren't and should have to be. <BR> <BR>Of course, your child is OK. It's the OTHER children who act that way.

Dear Huh <BR> <BR>Well as I said my kids have always slept very well on flights, chocolate and all - we're obviously not talking mega bars!

Passenger: <BR> <BR>When I flew to Italy with my daughter, everyone on the flight treated her as any other passenger. Many of them complimenting her on her behavior, where in fact I KNOW my daughter had cranky moments, as all children do. <BR> <BR>I've flown on flights where adult passengers acted like children, which is by far more annoying than any cranky child in my opinion. <BR> <BR>Children are CHILDREN, and they are going to act like them on flights and everywhere else they go!! What do you expect to live in a world without them? I just don't get it!? If you did sit next to me and my child on a flight, I would do the best I could to be courteous and teach my toddler to be also, just as I would expect you being seated next to me should act too. <BR> <BR>Maybe all passengers who would prefer not to sit next to children on a long flight should stay at home until the airlines develop children-free flights. <BR> <BR>

Lisa says:"Maybe all passengers who would prefer not to sit next to children on a long flight should stay at home until the airlines develop children-free flights". <BR> <BR>Typical yuppie parental attitude. The world revovles around the world's only child. <BR>First non-smoking flights, next non-children flights! <BR> <BR>One could only wish.

Lisa, don't get riled by them. They probably don't have kids. I must admit I was pretty much like that when I didn't have any. I'm sure you've got a great kid and you're a great parent.

UNBELIEVABLE!!!! <BR> <BR>Now come on Lisa and Sal.... <BR>You can't really stand by a statement like that can you? "Maybe passengers who prefer not to sit next to children on a long flight should STAY HOME..." <BR> <BR>That's one of the most narrow-minded, egocentric, asinine statements I've EVER read on this forum!!!! <BR> <BR>Let's change it around to make the example clearer, OK? Someone who has a very bad body odor problem, perhaps someone from another culture who doeasn't bathe with regularity or who reeks of cooking spices.... <BR>Maybe all the passengers who can't deal with this should just STAY HOME until airplanes with vacuum air vents over every seat become available!!! <BR> <BR>Pull your head out of your %$#*@ and recognize the fact that you live IN the rest of the world....the rest of the world DOES NOT revolve around your child!!!!!

I have 2 children of my own but still I hate being cooped up on a plane with them or anyone else's children. My children are VERY good and do not cry on planes or whine because they can't get down and run around but they are children. I hate to inconvenience others because I know how it feels. Dragging kids out to bathroom 2 or 3 times on the flight and crawling over others who I'm sure just loved it! not to mention the fact that my children while not loud fussy or whiny are little chatterboxes. My daughter talkes all the time, to me to her dolls , to her imaginary friend . . . even if she is not loud I can understand how someone could get annoyed by this. recently i flew to London solo on business and there was a mother sitting behing me with a baby (no extra seat for baby) and another child. I fth back of my seat was bumped one time, it was bumped 1000 times. Tray up, tray down, feet accidentally and unoticeably kicking my back, mom bumping into my seat all the time as baby is in her lap and so on! As i sais I was on business and needed to do some work and sleep on the plane, neither of which was accomplished. Maybe they could make a "with child section" and a "without child" section of the plane. Not only would adult travelers be more comfortable but if you are in the kids section yu wouldn't have to restrict your children as much or be embarassed be cause you are jumping out to the bathroom all the time. Just a thought that of course I will probably be bshed for . . .

Oh great. Another "not MY child" parent checks in. <BR> <BR>I've raised my kids and I should not have to raise yours when it comes to living in a society, especially in such closed quarters as an airplane. We never traveled by air until they showed they could behave and would appreciate where they were going. <BR> <BR>And, I agree with a comment made earlier about seeing adults acting like children on flights. Maybe we should drug them, too?

Yes I think that's a great idea Cecile. Basically we all can't stand being near kids until we have them and when we some of us try to make them behave as well as possible but you wonder why with some of these people's attitudes. If we're going to get lynched for it no matter what we might as well not bother. But we do!!

Sal- <BR>I agree with you (or do I agree with me?). Either way I think you make an excellent point. Darned if you do, darned if you don't. As long as my children behave, I'm not going to ground my family and restrict our travels to a 300 mile radius from our house because my kids may use the restroom more than once on a four-hour flight. I'd much rather sit by Cecile's chatterbox than the woman who sat behind me on my last flight and never stopped talking about her bunyon surgery. She was so loud, and talked so long, those of us seated around her were ready to jump out the emergency exit by the time we landed two hours later. <BR>I have had a child constantly kick the back of my seat on a flight. When that happens, I ask the parent, in a non-confrontational manner, to have the child stop. I find that if I'm sympathetic to the fact that their child is restless, 90% of the time they stop the child. If I get a dirty look and no response, I chalk it up to the adult. <BR>PS [email protected]--would you mind changing your anon posting since ours are so similar--we may not always want what the other says to be credited to us! Thanks.

Holy crap! Leave the kids home. You'll have much more fun and you won't indirectly annoy everyone around you - parents often forget or don't realize how annoying their "adorable" children are. <BR> <BR>Oh, and don't reply to me, because I don't read them.

oh boy. temper, temper, temper. We all have to try to get along, be it on a plane or otherwise. There are some very well behaved children in the world, & some not as cooperative. However, there are adults who are just as much of a problem. Rude is rude, no matter how old you are. The problem with unruly children on a plane is that we are vertually trapped with them for hours. We can't just walk away. I always compliment parents in a restaurant (in front of the kids), when the kids are behaving beautifully. The parents usually start beaming with pride & the kids are thrilled that their behavior has been noticed. On the other hand, I would not dream of telling a parent to make their child be quiet or to sit still. Don't know why that is. Maybe I just think the situation is hopeless. They don't want to deal with a fussy child anymore than we want to watch them do it. Like honking your horn at the guy in front of you when the traffic is at a dead standstill. He doesn't want to be there either. Most parents I see are thoroughly embarrassed when their kids act up in public. Why not throw some encouragement their way instead of making them feel worse. As for the parents who feel bad behavior is acceptable, there is really not much you can do about it, except to hope you aren't booked on the same return flight. Sometimes travelling with a child is necessary--to visit a grandparent, or perhaps the child is ill and needs to see a specialist in another state. Whatever. You are the adult, deal with it.