where to go besides Paris, London, Rome
 

Need help from the seasoned European Travellers. Planning a ~2wk vacation. My wife and I are at a lost as to where to go next. Been to London,Paris,Rome,Venice,Milan,Amsterdam. Sad to say, we are not the adventurous-go-anywhere with a map and back-pack types as many of you. We like fairly develop tourist locations with a well defined list of sites to visit, hotel-pickup tours are nice. Convinience/comfort would be more important than budget. Shopping for the wife is a bonus. Considering Vienna+switzerlan+prague, or madrid+provence+nice(not sure what to do in provence or nice) maybe Florence (an easy location with lots to see). Also considering Asia, but that's another forum. Any itinerary suggestion is really appreciated. Thank you all in advance!

Hi T,

When?

How many times have you been to UK, France and Italy?

((I))

You have listed some good alternatives (maybe not in that mix, though...). My advice would be to prioritize by choosing a selection criteria and see which one of those alternatives fit it best. Bottom line, Europe isn't going anywhere and you can get to all eventually :-D

This is what I gather from your message:

Must have:
-cities/tourist locations
-day tours packages availability
-comfortable transport btw/bases
-Good Shopping

My suggestions would be:

-Spain (Madrid-Barcelona-Andalucia)
-Provence/Cote D'Azur
-Vienna-Prague
-Germany-Austria (Munich-Bavaria Region-Rhine Valley-Salzburg-Innsbruck)

What time of the year would you be going?

If you can an open jaw flight, say arriving in Zurich (or vice versa) and departing from Vienna, then you could probably do you Swiss/Vienna/Prague combo. If you have to fly in and out of the same city, then that might be too ambitious for three weeks (unless you like packing and unpacking).
Actually, Provence+Switzlerand would be easier. If you want to see Alpine vistas, then drop Switzerland from the Vienna+Prague trip and put in the Salzburg countryside instead.
Vienna certainly meets your wish list of comfort, convenience, shopping, and sighsteeing.
FWIW, a friend who went to Krakow with me last week and who had been in Prague last year, said he preferred Krakow to Prague on several levels. But if you plan to shop for crystal, the Prague would be the best bet.
Anyway, yours is a nice dilemma, let us know what you decide!
(note: for hotels in Vienna and Krakow, we found some of the best rates from the www.hotel.de site.)

Oops, meant two weeks, not three.

I think that these Prague and Vienna would be a nice base upon which to build a 2 week trip.

Prague is fairly compact and walkable, with well defined attractions and amazing beauty. Vistas including the river, the Charles Bridge, the Castle, and the many spires of the city make for failproof pictures. There are lots of tours of the city; most of the walking tours meet in the old town square. There are day trips that leave from the square or pick you up at your hotel. 3-4 nights would give you a good flavor of the city.

Vienna has a lot to offer and is a wonderful cosmpolitan working city. There are wonderful museums, churches, palaces, and cultural events. The Kunsthistorisches Museum is one of the world's premier art museums, and the Albertina has an amazing collection of Old Master drawings. The coffee shops and pastries are legendary. Again, 3-4 nights would be good.

You could add in Salzburg and Munich. Salzburg is picturesque and small enough to see the highlights in 2 nights. Munich is warm and lovely, and there was good shopping, as well as its many attractions. Any of these destinations are as visitor-friendly as the destinations you have already visited.

Alternatively, you could combine Prague and Vienna with Budapest. I haven't been there, though, so can't comment on it.

Oops, I meant to say "I think that Prague and Vienna..." (and I did preview!!). One other point, you can travel between Vienna, Prague, Munich, Salzburg, or Budapest by train very easily.

Thank you all for the replies so far, please keep them coming.

Some answers for those so helpful: Timing is flexible sometime between April to May. Been to London/Paris twice, everywhere else I listed only once.

Viajero2: your must have is perfect, well, more of a good to have than must. Thanks for all the suggestions. I probably know what to do in Vienna-Prague. I've considered Provence/Cote D'Azur, I need to research more about it, looks like beautiful places to visit, but not sure what to do (besides walking around), same with the other places (well, spain maybe a little easier, bullfight-museums-paella...) Please excuse my ignorance. I really need to improve.

BTilke, I'll consider open jaw. For Swiss/Vienna/Prague do I take the train between these. Within the cities, do I need a car or is public transport good enough

Seems like nice/Monaco would fit my needs?

Any additional itinerary suggestion welcomed

thanks noe847

anymore? thanks

I was in Copenhagen and Stockholm right after Christmas...both are wonderful cities. Just a thought.

You should consider Portugal. There is so much to do and see;read on the "Things to do and see in Lisbon" for some examples.

"Considering Vienna+switzerlan+prague, or madrid+provence+nice(not sure what to do in provence or nice) maybe Florence (an easy location with lots to see). Also considering Asia, but that's another forum. Any itinerary suggestion is really appreciated. Thank you all in advance!"

Florence is far less interesting than Rome or Venice, so I wouldn't make a special trip.

Forget Madrid. Not much there. However, Andalucia would be a good choice: Seville, Ronda, Nerja, Granada all excellent. And Spain is relatively cheap, so you can afford to live it up a bit.

lmhornet: thanks for the info on Florence, good feedback

Please don't write Florence off that easily based on one comment. You'll find plenty of people here (me one of them) who've made repeat journeys and still haven't seen it all. If what you are truly looking for is "a well defined list of sites" you can't go wrong with Florence. I'm not sure you could get 2 weeks out of just Florence, but with all the sites in Florence proper, then Pisa, Siena, Luca, Bologna, and maybe a guided ride through Tuscany, I'd be hard-pressed not to fill that time!

That aside, I think Budapest/Prague/Vienna/Salzburg might be an interesting combination. I've seen Prague and Vienna and wish I'd made it to the other two.

I agree with Amyb regarding Florence. The masterpieces of Michelangelo, Donatello, Leonardo da Vinci, Bernini, Botticelli, Ghiberti, della Robbia, the architectural wonder of Brunelleschi's Dome and the works of dozens of other Renaissance artists make Florence an interesting place to visit. Toss in that Chianti and Tuscany are just down the road and you have a destination that competes with almost any other destination in Italy.

But to address your original question: Think beyond each country's main cities. You don't have to be adventurous to have a great trip to middle-sized and smaller cities serviced by the excellent train systems in Italy, Switzerland and France and the ferry system in Switzerland and Italy.

"I agree with Amyb regarding Florence. The masterpieces of Michelangelo, Donatello, Leonardo da Vinci, Bernini, Botticelli, Ghiberti, della Robbia, the architectural wonder of Brunelleschi's Dome and the works of dozens of other Renaissance artists make Florence an interesting place to visit."

Exactly what I said. Not that interesting, except to the culture Nazis. There is no reason to go all the way to Europe to do nothing better than waste time in museums that they would ignore if they were next door at home.

Only "culture Nazis" appreciate some of the greatest, most beautiful art created by man? Geez.

You know, two somewhat opposing concepts can be equally true. Florence is home to some of the world's great art and architecture. But when we stayed there (Fiesole, actually) for 7 days, it was probably 5 days too long - for us.

But "culture Nazis?" Ease off on the rhetoric, big boy.

Imhornet --

The correct term is "culture vultures." Proud to count myself among them, and begging your sublimely idiotic pardon, I regularly visit my local outlet, the Metropolitan.

Go "soak up some atmosphere" until you're blue in the nose.

I happen to agree with you about Florence.

Florence is fine if you are into Renaissance art and architecture, but it doesn't appeal to everyone. 1 day was more than enough for me, but Mrs. Fly wanted 2.

Vienna and Pragure would be fine.

Germany has a very well developed tourism infrastructure. Even many smaller towns and cities are easy to get around in, and the quality of even inexpensive accomodations and restaurants is relatively high.

I agree that Munich would be a wonderful place to go for your intrests. I have traveled all around Europe just like you all the tourist areas and Munich is by far my favorite.

Tangelo...don't ignore the world class city of Berlin...plenty to do, see, and side trips of all varieties. Wonderful city, geared to the visitor. We were there in '93 and were amazed at the progress in the city to attract visitors since that '93 visit. Thoroughly enjoyed the seven days we spent there. See Palenque's Berlin reports in this forum. Just type it in to the search box.

You could combine Prague and Vienna with Berlin...wonderful combination I would say...or even Berlin, Munich and Vienna...or Budapest, Prague, Berlin. You've got options old boy!
Stu T.

Concur with other writers about Seville and Barcelona. For travel tips on these cities, do a search on this board. We absolutely loved these cities. Madrid is great once - exciting huge squares, restaurants, museums. After one visit, no need to return, (and watch out for pickpockets).

We have travelled much like you (except we've been to England and not to Amsterdam) and our next trip in May is to Amsterdam, Brugge and Rhine/Munich/Bavaria. Future trip ideas include all those as suggested here (all excellent ideas) but our first trip after this one in May will be to Greece and Turkey for a little something different.

Some girlfriends and I did a very nice 2 week trip last year that included Munich, Prague, Vienna, and Salzburg We had a great time and I loved all of these places so I would highly recommend it...

Prague and Budapest

Bavaria

To narrow down Florence to Renaisance art and architecture is really the dumbing down society to a hazel nut shell.
Food , wine , olive oil and culture of the tuscan capital would be enough but when add the home of the folllowing:

Galeleio Galelei - Astronomer
Leonardo Da Vinci - Artist/Inventor
Michaelangelo Buonarotti - Artist
Lorenzo Da'Medici - Ruler
Niccolò Machiavelli - Statesman/Author
Filippo Brunelleschi - Architect
Dante Alighieri - Author

If you do decide on Vienna / Prague, (one of your original suggestions) then Budapest would be a great third location, as others have stated. It's easily accessed by train from Vienna, but not so easy to get to from other European locations... so it's best to go there when you're practically right in the neighborhood! It's a beautiful city with lots to see and do.

Berlin is another logical choice, but it would fit in better with another trip that could include Dresden, for starters.

As I recall, Budapest is closer to Vienna by train than Berlin is to Prague... if that makes any difference to you.

All the best to you!

Well, a few of the people on that list had something to do with the Renaissance.

Istanbul . Easy to fly to from London Paris or Rome or any major European city.Still cheap .Very exotic .Vibrant and friendly.Safe - at least as safe as any other city as long as you are sensible .Some wonderful hotels and a contextual framework for the development of much of the art and architecture of the rest of Europe .Defined sites to see in the city plus shopping ( do some homework on rugs ).

I totally agree with amyb and jean - Florence is a must (4 days are good for a start) then tour Tuscany. Vienna fits your bill also, great food, great music, lots to see. Fly into Munich take the train to Salzburg, spend the next day here, take train to Vienna, spend 4 - 5 days here, take train to Prague, spend 3 days here, take train back to Munich, spend 3 days here. That's pretty close to 14 days. A nice side trip out of Vienna is this, take a train to Melk-tour the abby where the book Name of The Rose was set,-take a boat trip down the Danube,then short train trip back to Vienna. Just some thoughts - wish we could do it again....

You must go to Berlin.
You don't know Europe when you haven't been to this city. It is full of everything - historical buildings, the world's best museums (where else can you see ancient Babylon's original city gate?) and a spectacular cultural life?

I think Florence is a "do not miss" city. It would take four days to do a superficial job of seeing some of its incredible sights. And a side trip to Siena, San Gimignano, Greve in Chianti, Montalcino or one of the hills towns (readily available from tour operators in Florence if you don't want to plan it yourself) would give you a very special experience.

In addition, I have to say that I adored Switzerland. I visited the Sion region (where a gorgeous ski resort was dirt cheap in the summer, and the views and the food were equally spectacular, as were the local Swiss wines) and also spent time in Berne, Lucerne (a favorite), Interlaken (stopped there for lunch, wished I'd had more time), and Zurich.

Last, if you haven't been to Edinburgh, I heartily recommend it. If not this year, then put it on your list. It's a beautiful, beautiful city with incredible castles, art museums, music, theatre, guided tours and walks in and near the city, and wonderful people.

thank you all. sounds like a lot of supporter for Florence, and some alone the line of Vienna, Prague+.

"Author: Jean
Date: 03/20/2006, 06:38 pm

Only "culture Nazis" appreciate some of the greatest, most beautiful art created by man? Geez."

According to whom?You only believe they are beautiful because you've been told so often by previous culture nazis that you accept it. There is art that I like, but not 99% percent of the crap that hangs in museums and is there mostly because it is old and not because it is good. Going to those musuems is like reading Dickens. It might have been the thing at the time, but now is stilted long past its time. Some museums are better than others. But the the ones in Florence are not among them. The Uffizi is OK, but the rest are boring, boring, boring.

It is a mystery to me why anyone would waste time in Florence museums when they could be walking around Venice or Rome or even Assisi.

Portugal. Portomaio (south) is lovely. Great serene beaches. Algarve is over-crowded. Avoid it. Azores Islands (our plan for next year) are not for the "jet setters." We have had the pleasure of traveling extensively (with some budgeting, of course) & have concentrated on areas outside of the "London/Paris/Rome" circle (with all due respect to those who have.)
Another suggestion: Malta. Absolutely nice & cordial people. Lovely.

Whatever your plan, enjoy. Trying a destination outside of the "advertised norm" might just prove interesting.

There are so many places in Europe to see and visit! Like I've suggested before, look up the destinations you've considered on Google Images. The pictures honestly helps you decide your perfect destination, often you'll find one place or places which are specifically appealing to you. It works every time. :)