UK -Trouser Gate?
 

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/13/wo...s-uk.html?_r=0

gimme a break - a pair of trousers sets off a political storm?

Just to keep travelers to the UK in the know of important recent political developments!

And leave the expensive trousers at home!

No it's not a storm, it's one of those internal spats in a party that contribute so much to the gaiety of nations. And of course, the press love nothing more than the fact of its being women who are snarking at each other.

Underneath it all, of course, is the cats-in-sacks infighting over Brexit that's going on behind the scenes in the Tory party.

Nicky Morgan and her handbag

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entr...b0e9baa8779be6

Coming from the New York Times, an American newspaper, it's a wonder they didn't refer to that item of clothing as "pants" which would have set of another kind of media storm...

The handbag was a big improvement over some of the HIGNFY guests.

I watched a recent programme where male athletes were asked the same questions that female athletes were asked, "I like your clothes, can you give us a twirl?" "how have you felt about coming back to work after having a baby?", "did you feel sorry for the person you beat?" etc etc

Boy were those men confused.

So, when the Daily Mail picks up on a piece of sexist nonsense and the NYT, whose journalists seem to spend all their time on the internet, don't keep the BS flowing.

Merry Christmas everyone!

uh uh Merry Christmas everyone!

should be Happy Holidays!

"Underneath it all, of course, is the cats-in-sacks infighting over Brexit"

Nah.

Underneath it all is the resentment of someone from a public school who did law at getting fired by an old bat the bright young things had written off who'd not only gone to a comprehensive but had done geography.

Clothes are the excuse. Morgan's hidden text is "I dress scruffily and really live in the countryside. May acts like a fashion plate and lives in a suburb. Left to herself, she'd probably vote UKIP"

There's huge snobbery behind much of this. Blair got sniggered at for wearing Paul Smith, and looking as if he did. Cameron spent far more on his Saville Row suits, but got away with it because they didn't look much better than everyone else's £400 Charles Tyrwhitt (but £179 if you buy in the next 24 hrs) numbers.

Remember: this nonsense started with Morgan, not with the Daily Mail. Sexism's got nothing to do with it: just plain old British ruling-class woman bitchiness. Listen to Shirley Williams on Maggie sometime.

Sorry both wrong.

What on earth does "Happy Holidays" even mean, unless you are off to a Disney hell hole. I may not be an official member of any religion but at least I know what this festival is about. As Clarkson would say "the baby jesus and violence in the middle east".

Sexism; no one cares if a man wears a suit, no one rushes up to the President of China and says "wow, another great suit" no one gets upset that Trump's taylor is a few bob short of a quid. But let a woman wear trousers, or kitten heels, or carry a naff handbag..... just so much childness.

I repeat.

The first shot was fired by Nicola Morgan who spontaneously attacked May's spending on trousers.

The counter shot came from Fiona Hill, May's chief of staff, who texted a middle-ranking (male) MP, telling him not to "bring that woman [Morgan]" to a Downing St meeting.

The Tories don't come well out of this for all sorts of reasons: including Morgan's bizarre belief that spending £950 on a pair of leather trousers now is immoral, but spending £950 on a handbag a decade ago is just fine.

One of their offences in the saga is the behaviour of Hill, an unelected and overpromoted lackey.

But ALL the misbehaviour has come FROM Tories, AT Tories. None of it owes anything at all to the Mail, the Sun or any other medium fashionably hated in polite society.

And none of it's got anything to do with one set of rules for women and another for men. Except that ALL the cattiness in this story has come from women, and is aimed at another woman.

It may be that the world pays too much attention to what women wear.

In this case, though, the only person commenting on May's clothing was another, marginally more privileged - and clearly substantially madder - woman.

it's fun watching all you chaps debating the tory spat over Mrs May's slacks; my main objection to them was that they look ghastly and don't match her top at all, not that that's any better. I've never paid that sort of amount for something to wear in my life but if i did, I'd want it to look better than that.

IMO women are no more immune from cultural misogyny than men, hence Nikki Morgan's opening salvo, which for an experienced politician was a bit of an own goal as she should have realised that this would lead to open season on her spending habits, and be taken up by all and sundry eg the Mail which hates women with a passion.

Bring back the Whigs is all I can say.

I doubt very much if any of us know who started what, or infact if many of us really care. What I will point out is that men wearing a uniform ensures that (unless wearing a donkey jacket) it never gets mentioned. I also don't like advisors as a general point of view, while recent elevations have ensured that I will turn down any national honour if ever offered to me. :-)

What on earth does "Happy Holidays" even mean, unless you are off to a Disney hell hole.>

well it is inclusive also of Moslem and Jewish holidays that may fall in the period and also New Year's -Merry Christmas means only one thing and one day and days leading up to it

Seasons Greetings or Happy Holidays covers much more - including Boxing Day over there.

<So, when the Daily Mail picks up on a piece of sexist nonsense and the NYT, whose journalists seem to spend all their time on the internet, don't keep the BS flowing.>

I'm sure the Times picked it up as comic relief which I thought upon seeing it - much ado bout nothing but funny as heck.

Jews, Muslims, Hindus etc. have their own festvais.
This "holidays" stuff is an American thing that mercifully has not arrived on these shores. We will continue to Wish you a Happy Christmas and demand figgy pudding with menaces.

Well you join Donald Trump whose big thing is to make it Merry Christmas and nothing else- so you're in good company.

Pal - I think you need to appreciate that UK culture is not the same as american culture in that virtually everyone will wish each other Happy Christmas irrespective of their religion or lack of it. For example my mum exchanges Christmas cards with her turban and sari wearing sikh neighbours, as I do with my jewish friends.

It has no religious connotations at all and very few brits will be going to Church over Christmas; it's just how we say that we hope the other person has a nice time at that time of year. If we started to say "Happy holidays" we'd get some very strange looks.

I was visiting my daughter in the East End of London and saw a halal butcher with Merry Christmas in his shop window.

I understand and that's fine -it was the same here too until some PC folks decided to make an issue of it and most Americans still say Merry Christmas -I have quit saying M Christmas because of the likes of Trump who stridently say that's the way to say it because this to them is a Christian country or should be.

A non-issue or should be until Trump types make a big deal of it.

Merry Christmas!

I've had Christmas cards from the manager of our favourite local curry house (run by a Bangladeshi family) and my Iranian barber. Nobody here says "Happy holidays".

that may be because the UK is such a secular country - with about the most un-believers in anything of any country anywhere if stats I've seen are right - I am shocked that on Coronation Street so many characters say they are non-religious - never see that on popular US shows

I believe one of the contenders for PM with May was an atheist - an atheist could not be elected dog collector in the U.S.

So Christmas like religion is treat in UK as something not religious.

Many here do too but many take it seriously.

Do those Merry Christmas cards send my say Hindus or Moslems have pictures of Jesus as a baby or angels on them? Or just snow and tree and Merry Christmas?

We are a much more religious country (which I of course deplore) than the UK and some take things more seriously in that regard.

I'd rather have the UK stance on it and have Merry Christmas have no real meaning other than the time of year (and again many here think that but not all)- bah humbug anyway!

I'd say that very few Christmas cards have religious themes. It's more likely to be a robin or a jolly coaching scene

I do tend to pick and choose what to send to different people. Some get the secular pictures of trees or baubles or winter scenes, some people get the more overtly churchy ones, depending on their interests.

We have a house rule that our family Xmas cards (business and political cards have a different code) feature Nativity-related images from churches, art galleries or manuscripts that are either in the neighbourhood or that we've recently visited.

Yet over 80% of arriving cards have secular themes.

I agree with Ann regarding the trousers.

The cards I send depends somewhat on what I have photographed during the year. Occasionally the card is of a church, or a beautiful stained glass window, but normally it is definitely secular, since I a one of the non believers. They do wish people a merry Christmas and a happy new year though.

Was it Birmingham that tried to introduce Winterval to the UK? What an abomination.

The Dutch tend to say Fijne Feestdagen (Happy Holidays) as it covers Christmas and New year, not because saying Fijne Kerstdagen might offend someone. The hajib wearing girls at our supermarket, and the Turkish supermarket and baker all wish people fijne Kerstdagen, on the grounds that they will probably see you again before New year.

Of course Christians took over existing "Pagan" feasts such as Saturnalia and Yule so my Christmas is just a mix of festivals under another name.

not because saying Fijne Kerstdagen might offend someone>

That black Moor - Black Peter dude helping Father Christmas which I understand is now not PC (politically correct) offend anyone -is it still on cards and in parades as I saw once in Sinter Klaus processions in Amsterdam and Utrecht? curious

https://www.google.com/search?q=blac...HVXfB3cQsAQIHA

Yet over 80% of arriving cards have secular themes.>

I try to send a real Christmas card with Mary or Jesus or manger scene, etc to my relatives who I know are very religious

to others never

yet I'd say most of the cards we get are with religious images. Less though - I prefer a pretty snow trees, etc card to the same old religious images.

I do enjoy going to right wing "news" sites, and picking a random message thread, wish everyone happy holidays. Too easy really but fun just the same.

<i>Was it Birmingham that tried to introduce Winterval to the UK? What an abomination.</i>

Are there still people who believe this BS, even the Heil has gave up on it, it was a marketing idea nothing to do with replacing Christmas.

"Quite simply, as head of events at that time, we needed a vehicle which could cover the marketing of a whole season of events... Diwali (the Festival of Lights), Christmas Lights switch-on, BBC Children in Need, Aston Hall by Candlelight, Chinese New Year, New Year's Eve, etc. Also, a season that included theatre shows, an open-air ice-rink, the Frankfurt Open-air Christmas Market and the Christmas seasonal retail offer. Christmas—called Christmas!—and its celebration lay at the heart of Winterval."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winterval

<i>Yet over 80% of arriving cards have secular themes.</i>

The first commercially produced Christmas Card was secular, religious cards have always been in the minority

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christ...istmascard.jpg

I do enjoy going to right wing "news" sites, and picking a random message thread, wish everyone happy holidays. Too easy really but fun just the same.>>

I do approve of that.

Christmas Crackers?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_cracker

seems to be non-secular? More of a party atmosphere than solemn occasion? I like it.

Kind of like Santa Claus - nothing religious now about him.

Tis the season to be greedy!

don't you have crackers in the US, Pal?

No -never heard of them until watching Corrie! And nothing like them TMK.

Maybe in Canada?

My impression is that crackers were a Victorian invention, and wiki agrees with me.

[I've never heard them called "bonbons" though!]

You guys do understand how wiki works don't you? It is all made up by a series of editors like you and me, so all it needs is a bunch of crazies to start working on it and you get nonsense.

Remember the old Murdoch entry that seemed to suggest the man was a multi-married, multi-born-again-Christian who made a muck of most of his business deals with daddy's fortune rather than the most honest, wonderful, humble god-fearing self-created-man that he is...

(Ed, surely something getting confused here)

so are you saying that crackers aren't Victorian then, bilbo?

just remember your sources, wiki is a wonderful resource, but, it isn't a source of information, it is a sink hole and it depends on who did the shoveling ;-)

so are you saying that crackers aren't Victorian then, bilbo?>

We say happy Xmas and have Xmas crackers in Australia as in UK. Even the Muslims at the local stores say happy Christmas . When I get a card a that says happy holidays I know it's from my US friends.