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-   -   Trip changes- added Paris and Florence! (https://www.fodors.com/community/europe/trip-changes-added-paris-and-florence-1139023/)

WoinParis Oct 27th, 2016 10:51 PM

As long as you don't mix wine with coke and don't add ketchup in the sauce a l echalotte nobody will bar an eye.
Yes tap water is free and you don't need to tip - some might say you mustn't but it is your call after all.
For very cheap meals check the creperies or the so called Japanese sushi shops - usually recycled Chinese restaurants.
Kerouac posted a great link to inexpensive restaurants.
Last tip : lunches are cheaper than dinner.

WoinParis Oct 27th, 2016 10:53 PM

lespetitestables.com
And it might have been somebody else but a great tip !

marvelousmouse Oct 27th, 2016 11:44 PM

I like the link, Wo. Although I feel like I may end up ordering blind a lot.

That reminds me...does anyone know of good food dictionary apps? My book collection has grown to the point that I am going to have to start culling some from my backpack.

bilboburgler Oct 27th, 2016 11:52 PM

Meals, you should be able to find three course lunches including wine for E15 M to F throughout Paris. Wine will be jug wine. You see the signs outside places but note the timings are pretty specific.

Ethnic is the way to go in the evening. There are so many good ones, just look around student areas (5 or 7 are good).

Vegetarian will prove even cheaper, especially within ethnic restaurants.

Espressi, are everywhere in little bars, ordering at the bar and drinking there will be cheaper than sitting at a table, normally you can buy with a croissant/pain au raisin. The days of the E1 are going but 1.2 or 1.50 are still easy.

neckervd Oct 28th, 2016 12:26 AM

Roma Termini - Pompei Vila dei Misteri, some train connections:
Rome dp 7.35 - Pompei ar 9.47
Rome dp 8.48 - Pompei ar 10.47
Rome dp 10.10 - Pompei ar 12.17
Pompei dp 15.53 - Rome ar 17.40
Pompei dp 18.23 - Rome ar 20.10
Standard RT fare 93 EUR/PAX

fuzzbucket Oct 28th, 2016 12:32 PM

Wherever you end up, look for "happy hours" if you want to splurge on cocktails. You have to take whatever they are promoting that day, but it's much less cheaper than paying an average 15 - 20 EU per cocktail. In my experience, cocktails are not so great in Paris unless they are expensive.

The main business of coffee shops is selling coffee, so you'll either have to be prepared to fork over a lot of money to fill up your thermos, or maybe ask to use the kettle or microwave at MIJE.
The alternative would be to buy an inexpensive immersion heater so you could heat water when you wanted to.

If you drink coffee with milk, a large one is called "un grand creme". If you want a very small one with just a little milk, it's called "un noisette".
"Un express" is espresso, you can order "un double express" if you want double the coffee.
I wouldn't order "cafe allonge" or "cafe americain", because it's just watered down coffee.
Under no circumstances should you order "un cappuccino" - an overpriced mess of watered down coffee with a bunch of useless foam on top.

Where you sit in a cafe matters and will cost you more money for drinks. The terrace is the most expensive, inside is a little less, and standing at the bar is the cheapest of all.

Meal times are observed pretty strictly in Paris - 7:30 - 11:30 breakfast, 12 - 2:30 lunch, snacks and drinks from 3 to 7PM, then dinner from 7 to 11PM. If you just want a drink, look for tables which have not been set with cutlery and glasses.

Tipping a "free tour" guide doesn't mean that the guide will get the money, even if you slip it to him/her very discreetly. Depending on the outfit you choose, the tour guide may not even be paid a salary and might not be allowed to keep tips.

fuzzbucket Oct 28th, 2016 12:35 PM

PS - In Paris in January, I don't think you'll have too much trouble with crowded museums. Get the Paris Museum Pass if you want to skip the admission lines and/or want to re-enter the same day. Make sure that the museums you want to see are covered on the Pass. You can purchase it at the first museum you visit, then sign and date it.

bvlenci Oct 28th, 2016 01:50 PM

The regular train stop in Pompei is not near the entrance to the archaeological site. It's near the Villa dei Misteri, a great ancient villa, which I recommend you visit. The villa is outside the actual archaeological site. There is an exit from the site nearby, but to enter, you'd have quite a long walk from the train station.

Most people take the train to Naples and then switch to the Circumvesuviana, a little local railway whose cars resemble a metro more than a train. This line leaves you off very near the entrance to the site. It takes about half an hour from Naples. They now have a more expensive express train on the Circumvesuviana which will get you to Pompeii quicker, and without the jostling of the commuter crowd on the regular train.

By the way, the Italian city is Pompei while the ancient city is Pompeii.

annhig Oct 29th, 2016 03:32 AM

marvelousmouse - fuzz bucket has given you the lowdown on coffee in France - so if bvl will allow, I'll have a go at Italy.

un caffè - is an espresso - if you say un café they will usually ask "espresso?" to make sure as many tourists don't realise that what they have asked for is a small black coffee.

un cappuccino - is not just watered down coffee with foam but is an espresso with steamed milk and froth. Italians only drink it "or a caffè latte" [coffee with hot milk] for breakfast but they are used to our funny foreign ways and will oblige you with whatever you order.

Ask for "latte" [milk] and that's what you'll get - just milk. The type of long milky coffee often served in a glass which is the British call "a latte" is unknown in Italy, so far.

un macchiato - is an espresso with a dash of milk

un ristretto - ditto but with a shot of grappa or brandy

un caffè lungo is espresso with water added - like an americano which you can also ask for if that's what you want.

Drink it at the bar, it'll cost about €1, give or take; at a table it's more and outside on the terrace probably more still. In some places they will serve a glass of water with your espresso, and in Sicily we were given a glass of water that was half still, half sparkling, which I'd never seen before.

WoinParis Oct 29th, 2016 04:31 AM

I still remember my first caffe in Milano in 1990.
About 2 ml but it made a hole in my stomach that is still there. Now I drink tea in Italy.

fuzzbucket Oct 29th, 2016 04:55 AM

marvelousmouse - will you be in a private room at MIJE?
If so, you can go to Monoprix and buy wine for less than 5EU and drink it in your room. Nobody will see or mind what you do if you toss the bottles in the bins on the street.

bilboburgler Oct 29th, 2016 05:01 AM

Tea in Italy; amazingly it is possible that some cafes or restaurants will have a tea pot, we have been lucky but if not you will be offered a cup of hot water and a tea bag from some unknown company like "Abduls of Croyden". Good news, you may get a little ginger biscuit to go with it.

Do you have a teapot? is "Hai una teiera?" with a rising inflection at the end. "di piu acqua calda per favore?" may well get you a free fill up.

marvelousmouse Oct 29th, 2016 09:59 AM

Fuzzbucket- so a museum ticket is not good for same day reentry but a pass is? That is good to know- would not have expected that. Usually the city museum pass is good for one entry per museum which often renders it rather useless to me.

No private room. I was tempted but might as well stay in a hotel at that price!

I've been trying to figure out Italian pronunciation. How are piu and teiera pronounced? Pe-u or pew? Tera or tey-ra?

MmePerdu Oct 29th, 2016 10:08 AM

I look forward to a report, mm, to know what you think of MIJE. In particular, the bathroom situation as I couldn't seem to find them fully described on the site. For instance, does each room have one for it's occupants?. The private have "sink & shower" but a toilet? I was also not sure if one knew which building was being booked or are we not given a choice? I see only young people in the photos so are there older guests? And anything else that strikes you about the place.

marvelousmouse Oct 29th, 2016 10:27 AM

Yes, I could not figure those out either, mmeperdu, so I will certainly report back! It's not a very explicit booking site.

But from what I read in the reviews, it is a mix of ages (people complained about schoolchildren and families). Not a party hostel but excellent location was the gist so I am thinking it will be pretty basic.

How compact is Paris? I'm thinking in terms of the arrondissements? It's difficult to tell from the map, and I cannot really figure out the layout- how each area is determined.

MmePerdu Oct 29th, 2016 11:10 AM

I find Paris quite compact, especially the center, those arrondissements along the river. But one can also walk from those farther out, for instance from the 18th to the river (which is downhill- I usually bus or metro back up).

If you get one of the pocket map books, available everywhere by various publishers, you may get a better idea of where one ends and another begins. Each has a sort of nebulous identity so people think they know what sort of neighborhood you're in even when they don't. Each arrondissement has a variety of identities and they can change from street to street.

But I find it much more organized than many other cities and more walkable. But that may be also because I know it a bit better. I'll be interested to see answers from those who live there.

StCirq Oct 29th, 2016 11:27 AM

<<How are piu and teiera pronounced? Pe-u or pew? Tera or tey-ra?>>

Pyoo (one syllable)

Tay-era (it's 3 syllables, not 2), with the rising inflection at the end as noted.

Buy a Paris par Arrondissement booklet at any kiosk or bookstore.

marvelousmouse Oct 29th, 2016 12:28 PM

Thanks! It's the syllables and emphasis that I'm having the most trouble with!

StCirq Oct 29th, 2016 01:09 PM

Italian is one of the easiest romance languages, as its pronounciation is almost perfectly regular. Go on Duolingo or some other site that has audio and listen - it's a really easy language.

MmePerdu Oct 29th, 2016 01:27 PM

Italian sounds to me on the street just as it does in the movies. I've found I'm understood best when it feels to me like I'm doing a caricature, with expression & a bit of body language. And that makes it fun.


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