train robbery
 

Hi, I wanted to add a caveat to everyone travelling...My daughter was on the overnight train from Barcelona to Nice and had her backpack broken into (lock was broken off) and valuables stolen...money, credit card, atm card, passport, camera, walkman, travellers checks. She was quite shaken up by this...she and here friends are 17 and 18, travelling after graduating from high school. A royal pain to deal with, but we had insurance which should cover all the valuables (travellers checks have already been refunded). A couple of phone calls averted any fraudulent use of the cc and atm cards. Despite plans to have someone stay awake, she and her 5 travelling companions all fell asleep, and she was victimized by a fellow train passenger who got off before the Nice stop. Future train travel will involve sleeping ON the luggage.

I was with a friend in Florence a week before this happened, and she had her bag unzipped (but nothing was actually stolen) while we were walking down the street, by a slovenly woman. We noticed immediately and yelled at her. We were already alert, but this made us even more so.

It seems like paranoia, but it is, after all, just common sense, to be aware of your surroundings and not let yourself be vulnerable. Those atm scams on the board are amazing...things I never would have thought to be looking out for.

The supplement for a couchette berth is 14 euros in Western Eurpe and 11 euros in central Europe. Couchette compartments have doors that have a lock, and an extra lock that cannot be opoened from outside. It is very hard to stay awake on a train at night. For more, please see the note on getting the best from sleepers and couchettes at http://www.twenj.com/tipsnighttrains.htm

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Oh what a shame! Thankfully it sounds like she's weathering it well. And I hope she has plenty to good experience to counterbalance this bad one.
Train thievery is one of the reasons that I won't travel by couchette and only book a private sleeping compartment on an overnight train. Thefts don't happen often, but when they do...what a pain!

Yes, and to think that for the cost of the latest CD, or less, it could have been prevented!

Sorry for your daughter's loss. This really is a confirmation that using a money belt around your neck or waist is a good idea. A money belt would not have prevented the theft of the camera or walkman but those things are much easier to replace than the passport, credit cards and travelers checks.

I was concerned about this during an overnight ferry to Morocco. I locked my bag and tied it to me. I wore a jacket over the rope so that I could unfasten it in an emergency (like the ship sinking - I didn't want to wear an anchor in the form of a suitcase). The jacket did cover the knot so thieves couldn't see it and study it. Whether or not this was a good idea, I was not robbed.

This is at least the third thread recently about someone's having things stolen from a backpack (or the pack itself). In none of these cases was the individual wearing a money belt. I thought that was a given that any smart traveler keeps passport, credit cards, ATMs and most money on their person (hidden) at all times. Any of you out there who don't use an under garmet money belt - please start now. It's just commen sense. The fact that there are so many of these posts lately certainly indicates that its necessary.

I've noticed that everyone who gets robbed is wearing a backpack. I feel for everyone but is this a big surprise to anyone that having all your belongings in something that hangs on your back, away from sight is not the safest way to carry your belongings? I wouldn't do that if I was going to any crowded places at home.

On my recent trip, my friend did have a backpack, but each pocket also had a lock which makes it unappealing to pickpockets who want to do their thing quickly.
As far as falling asleep and being robbed, that's a whole different situation and it seems that unless you get a sleeper compartment, there is no other way, except for maybe sitting/lying on it. Not comfortable, but I can't think of any other way.

These posts are plain silly:

As others have already addressed & as has been mentioned on several threads recently... your PASSPORT and cash do not belong in a backpack!!

Money belt, neck pouch, zipper hidden pockets, etc. ON your person, with passport, travelers checks, cash... and we wouldn't have to hear of these kind of problems. Use a disposable camera, and leave other electronics at home. PROBLEM solved!!

Especially with young people best they figure out how to travel safely early on, if they plan to be frequent tourists. Read up on Lonely Planet, Rough Guide, Rick Steves, et al. and if they followed tried & true advice this could never have happened.

Topping this post because I think there is a valuable lesson to be learned. And because I found my answer above overly harsh when I reread it (my apologies).

If you know any first time travelers, especially young people, but this would apply to anyone who has not traveled abroad before ...

Please help them get and understand the information they need about safety precautions for travelers. There is nothing in the unfortunate situation described in the original post that could not have been fairly easily prevented.

To reiterate, daypacks are a great idea, especially the ones that zip-on and off of the rolling backpacks, but they are NOT meant to substitute for moneybelts!!! My only theft incident was by small gypsy children in Spain because I was too lazy to put my credit card back in my moneybelt right away after buying something. Luckily, I caught the little girl's arm with my card grasped in her fingers! I watched my American companions get robbed right out from underneath them, as they slept ON TOP OF their backpacks! That was in 1992, and I was 19. Since then, I use safes, moneybelts and only carry my guidebooks and water in my day pack. Be careful out there.

What a terrible experience. I have been traveling around Europe(sometimes with friends and sometimes alone)since I was sixteen. MONEYBELT, MONEYBELT, MONEYBELT! On our last trip, I even bought a moneybelt for my Italian husband. He felt silly walking around his hometown with a moneybelt on but, better safe than sorry. My mother-in-law wears a money belt when she comes to California to stay with us. She is worried that all the gypsies in La Jolla are going to rob her. On our last trip we toted around a light backback for the water and kid stuff.

Although I have never heard of this first hand, I have heard through the grapevine that even if you are locked in your car on a train, there are thieves who will spray gas in your face causing you to pass out. At this point, they take your money belt along with everything else. Does anyone have first hand knowledge of this or is this travel folk lore? Makes me think that I will not be able to extend to my children the same freedom of independent travel that I enjoyed.

The storyb of gas spray is now dsome thirty years old. The Italian police took action, and it is now urban myth.

Even when it was true, use of the lock and fitted chain on a sleeper door prevented thieves getting in. But those days are gone. as yiu say, folk lore

Ben Haines, London

The storyb of gas spray is now dsome thirty years old. The Italian police took action, and it is now urban myth.

Even when it was true, use of the lock and fitted chain on a sleeper door prevented thieves getting in. But those days are gone. As you say, folk lore

Ben Haines, London

ttt

How nice to *meet* you again Mr. Ben Haines. Always a pleasure when you're on the BB's.

Though I will be travelling to Spain and Southern France using cheap flights rathan than trains, I would like to know if anyone out there experienced any luggage theft in trains between Italy, Switzerland, France, & Germany during "daytime". My friends and I would like to ready ourselves and avoid any problems.

Few of us are using cables to tie our suitcases to the luggage racks, but they're asking if this is more a hassle than a precaution.

I can't guarantee it, but have not heard of suitcase theft stories. Mostly it is the issue of passport, money, credit cards, travelers checks, etc. Which is why the money belt or neck pouch is such a good solution.

If you use the cables just be sure to allow enough time before your stop to get it undone. Sometimes I did not realize my train stop, until it was almost time to exit the train, stops can be pretty quick!

A very good friend of mine decided to relax and take off his shoes on the trip (no one sitting with him). He was tired and with the gentle rocking of the train he fell asleep. Only to wake up 45 minutes later to discover that his shoes had been stolen!

All kidding aside, you have to be a little on the ball when you are travelling. Crime can and does happen anywhere.

I would like a monthly report by credit card companies noting the reported loss or theft of credit cards. It should also be by country.
The disuse of money belts can be attributed to a phenomenon called "cognitive dissonance". Yes, we know we should use; seat belts, life jackets, and money belts, but we don't!
Is it reasonable to avoid night trains?

It is reasonable to avoid day cars in night trains, but reasonable and safe to take coychettes or sleepers, where you can lock and bolt your compartment door.

My disuse of money belts can be attributed to a phenomenon called "keeping my valuables in the hotel safe".

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Just a friendly question here, Ben. While I agree with you generally, how does one keep his valuables in a hotel safe when traveling from one city to another?

Also, I'm a bit amused by your comment, "it is very hard to stay awake on a train at night". I've often disagreed with you and others about night trains, because for me it's very hard to SLEEP on a train at night.

Unless is an emergency or something behind my control, I never take the overnight train...I like to travel in daytime and enjoy the scenery.
Feel much safer this way.

I *love* overnight trains, but do pay the extra for a private sleeper. I normally can't sleep on planes or in cars, but overnight, on a train, in a normal bed, I do OK. You can lock the door from inside the compartment.

On those long trains where I might sleep, I've used a strong bike lock to lock my pack to my seat, and lock the zippered compartments separately, but don't leave anything valuable there anyway. Also, Dockers has a pretty new line of "mobile" pants that have discrete zippered pockets on each leg at mid-thigh and a hidden zippered pocket inside the normal front pants pocket. So, that's an alternative to the moneybelt, I think. I'll try them out in Barcelona soon

Within a country, I have about a hundred euros of cash in my trouser pocket. Credit cards, debit card, passport, tickets, and other money are in a cardboard folder of papers inside my suitcase. On busses this suitcase goes into the boot beneath the passengers. On trains it goes onto a rack above my head. I travel in a compartment or saloon which has other passengers, so it is not clear to a passing thief whether the owner is sitting under it. If I go to the restaurant car and it is very empty I get the waiter?s permission to bring my suitcase into the car. But usually I leave it in the compartment, and ask fellow travellers to keep an eye on it while I eat. The suitcase has no locks, chains, or other devices to suggest I am carrying the crown jewels.

Crossing a non-Schengen frontier I travel in the same way, but have cash for both countries in my trousers pocket, and my passport in the top pocket of my pyjama jacket, easy to hand over to assorted frontier staff. Crossing a Schengen frontier the passport is with the sleeping car conductor by night and in my suitcase by day..

People do indeed vary as to night trains. Some sleep: some do not. And once they are convinced they will not sleep people do not sleep: it is a matter of mindset. Infants sleep well. Children start excited, so take a time to drop off, and if their parents have told them that they cannot sleep in trains the children will not (mindset again), but otherwise they sleep well. You and I are agreed in saying that you do not sleep on trains and I do. We know no way to change this.

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Ben, I think you are wonderful (and I have the same feeling about hotel safes and money belts), but believe me, sleeping at night has nothing to do with mindset--if it did, I would be able to sleep at home. But unless I stay up till at least 1:00am, I wake after two hours. This situation doesn't change abroad. (maybe this has something to do with clear consciences)

Thank you for your kind opening. The word mindset may be ambiguous. I do not mean that you or I can control our mental position. Rather, I agree with you that one s mind has a setting, which usually one cannot alter.

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Hi y'all. I know you've explained this to me before, but it must be the arteries hardening or something. At any rate, please elucidate. Ben recommends the safety of both couchettes and sleeping compartments because of the locks. BTike writes "I won't. . . . couchettes, but always reserve a sleeping compartment instead" (I don't think my quote is accurate, but the letter is up near the top.) Sooooo, for this slow coach, one more time. Is a couchette as safe as a private sleeping compartment? Thanks for your patience, J.

If you are traveling with friends/family and you take the entire couchette compartment yourselves, then it's as safe as a private sleeping compartment. However, if you're traveling alone or with just one other person, then you're sleeping with strangers and trusting/hoping they're as honest as you (and also that they remember to keep the door locked; you could pay for someone else's carelessness). It's *unlikely* for someone else in your couchette to rob you but it *has* happened. The safest way to take a night train is to have a private sleeping compartment and keep the door locked.

ahah, got it; thanks.

Hi all,

A long time ago, when I couldn't afford a sleeper, I was traveling in a compartment with three other people. We all knew each other although we weren't trveling together.

Sometime in the night I fell asleep. I was awakened when the train stopped in the morning. My companions had gotten off somewhere, and I found myself stretched out on the seat alone except for a man who was reaching above me to remove my suitcase from the rack.

Taking him by the cojones, I asked "May I help you?".

We engaged in fitful conversation until the train started off and gained some speed, when he indicated that he would like to go to a different compartment.

I have always wondered how he explained to the conductor why he didn't have a ticket.

a good example of "you can never be too careful". I had my back pack unzipped as I got off the train in Riomaggiore. A woman in front of me stopped in the exit and acted odd-bouncing around like she was looking for someone b4 getting off the train. I realized later this was to delay me so someone behind could get into the pack. Luckily I got moving b4 anything was actually taken out!

Nice one, Ira! (but what happened to the guy's ticket?)

*very* funny, but I too wonder what happened to the guy's ticket? did i miss something in the story??

thanks Ira!!

Caledonia Sleeper, just took. First-class single was 39 pounds (includes nice snack and coffee or tea for breakfast), about 30 i think in second-class doubles. Also regular seats at no extra charge, but need to be reserved in advance as do sleepers. In person can only be done in Euston (departure) station. Train fare is extra. For bargains reserve ahead on web - limited number of berths including rail fare advertised as low as 40 pounds! Euston-Glasgow, Fort William, Inverness, Edinburgh and points in between these stations. My train had a nice restaurant/bar car.

For G Steed. Yes, such figures ould be useful. The travel notes by consuls are relevant in that they draw on their experience if various kinds of theft, including theft of cards. You can find their advice
from Australia on http://www.dfat.gov.au/consular/advice
from Britain on http://193.114.50.10/travel and on http://www.fco.gov.uk/travel/countryadvice.asp
from Canada on http://www.dfait-maeci.gc.ca/menu-e.asp, under "Research your trip"
from France on http://www.dfae.diplomatie.fr/voyage...s/alphabet.asp
from the USA on http://travel.state.gov, under "travel warnings"

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Many years ago when on Inter-rail and therefore on a budget we used to figure in overnight trains because they avoided the cost of a hotel.I sewed a pocket into my sleeping bag and at night slept on top of all my belongings.
Last year when my daughter went to Greece and reckoned it was too hot for a sleeping bag she took a duvet cover and when travelling overnight on boats she put her valuables and herself inside the cover.It then closed around her neck with the poppers. It was also used as a sheet sleeping bag in hostels.
In case you think this all sounds too smug the same daughter is currently flying back from Thailand having had £100 stolen on a state run bus!

This whole thing is so five minutes ago! As long as there are travelers who are unprepared (by their uninterested parents or otherwise) there will be robberies.

Anecdote. Conductor on Krakow to Bratislava train told my wife that thieves preferred 'premium class trains'. On our last train trip, curtains had been removed from interior windows and soldiers were patrolling the wagons. Europeans do not consider pickpocketing a crime. Reread Oliver Twist. Where did the word, 'cutpurse' originate? Successful bandits target their victims. They see them at ATM's or in a shop displaying money. Make plans for yourself considering that you have lost passport, money and credit cards. Check with AX about emergency funds. Where is the nearest US Embassy? How do you get there? Memorize card numbers or have copies of them hidden. Be sure to have telephone codes with them. Happy Travelling!

"Europeans do not consider pickpocketing a crime."

Jeez Louise, GSteed, do you truly think this is a fact? Or is this just your opinion? Of course pickpocketing is a crime, all over Europe.