Switzerland - Itinerary recap before we leave
 

Our 2 weeks trip to Switzerland (in exactly 2 weeks) is planned and booked – thanks for all the help. Here is our plan, please take a look and see if we’re missing anything that you consider a ‘do not miss’.

We are a couple in our early 40s, looking for relaxation, easy hikes, good food, amazing scenery and photo opportunities. So here it goes:

1) Arriving in Zurich early in the morning (overnight flight from Newark) – we’ll rent a car and drive to Celerina, where we’ll stay 4 nights at Chesa Rosatsch.

2) I know that the 2nd half of the gondola to Piz Corvatsch is closed, is it worth going only for the 1st half? We have a long list of potential trips in the area, so depending on weather and mood we will pick from: Diavolezza cable car, Piz Nair gondola, visit Guarda with a hike to Ardez, funicular up to Muottas Muragl, visit Pontresina. I realize that all of this might be too much for our 3 days in the area, so if we need to prioritize, how should we do it?

3) Drive to Lugano – stop and explore Sils on the way, and probably have lunch there. Do we have time for the horse carriage trip I read so much about?

4) Spend 3 nights (2 full days) in Lugano (hotel Dante). Visit Gandria, take funicular to Monte San Salvadore and Monte San Bre and take a cruise on the lake.

5) Drop car in Lugano and take train to Wengen (Hotel Park Beausite) where we’ll spend 6 night – no real plan there, just enjoy the mountains, hike around, get to Schilthorn and Jungfraujoch (weather permitted), take a day trip to Thun, hike the Lauterbrunnen valley, etc.

6) Train to Zurich, where we’ll spend our last night at St.Josef (room 414, thanks Ira).

We will probably get the Half Fare card when we arrive. Anything else that we should be aware of? Any restaurant recommendation? Thanks – getting very excited about this trip :)

An excellent itinerary. You've got a bit of everything.

1. Print out time schedules from the sbb.ch website so you know which trains to choose from.

2. If the weather isn't the greatest during your Engadin stay, I'd do the walk from Guarda to Ardez. I haven't done the other two you've mentioned, so I'm looking forward to your trip report!

3. I've stayed at Hotel Dante and really liked it. The views aren't inspiring, but the hotel is very clean, the staff incredibly nice, the location is well situated and the breakfast is heavenly.

4. Aug. 1 is the Switzerland's National Day so find out about any celebrations that are going on in the area you're at.

5. Speaking of events, do find out if there are any festivals in any of the areas you're visiting. The folklore festivals can really be amazing and highly memorable.

Enjoy your stay!

You might be interested in the Villa Favorita although as the attached from the NY Times says, most of the art is now in Madrid. It's right on the lake and at one time the regular transport boat stopped at its dock:

The much-married and much-divorced -- and the very rich -- Baron von Thyssen-Bornemisza was a headline-making legend in his day. He was also one of the world's greatest art collectors, his holdings rivaled only by Queen Elizabeth II. The bulk of his collection was sold to launch the Thyssen-Bornemisza Museum in Madrid. In a 17th-century mansion, Villa Favorita has been greatly reduced in scope but what art remains is worth a visit. Paintings are by such figures as Lucien Freud, Edward Hopper, Jackson Pollock, Giorgio de Chirico, and Andrew Wyeth. Even if you don't like art, the gardens are worth a visit, planted with both regional and exotic flora.

Sounds great! I've been to all the above places. Do enjoy the hike from the cable car on Mt S Salvadore..we stopped at a tiny village for lunch and it so romantic. Take the cable car from Wengen to Mannlichen and hhike to Kleine Scheidegg. Glorious easy hike...have lunch there, it's very festive. If you're up to it, hike further to the train station for the Jung..

Here's some websites for hiking in your chosen areas:

http://www.lugano-tourism.ch/en/148/default.aspx

I just returned from Lauterbrunnen. It looks like your schedule is a good one.

I am curious about the return site of the rental car. Why not drop it in Interlaken? Avis and Hertz have agencies there for sure. I returned an Avis car just this past Monday in Interlaken.

You can easily travel to Wengen by train, which you will have to do anyhow because driving to Wengen is not really possible.

Two years ago some guy in a big Mercedes was told by his GPS that he could drive to Wengen. So he tried it. The locals had a lot of fun with the dumb American in the big car who got stuck in the ditch up on the hill and then got into a heated debate with the local authorities after they cited him for blocking a farm road. The farmer could not bring his cows in because the Mercedes with its wheels in the ditch were blocking the path to the barn.

Don't try driving to Mürren either. It is much easier to take the cable lift.

ROTF BOB!!!!

Schuler, great advice, thanks – and yes, I will have a trip report when we come back. August 1st we’ll be in Lugano, so hopefully there will be some lake celebration (fireworks?) to enjoy. Great link for Lugano hikes, although the site seems to have some problem – the headings are in English, but all the excursion description is in either German or Italian (the last language used) – can’t get to the English version, but I’ll try some more.

Cath, we’ll try to stop at the Villa Favorita, sounds like a great spot to relax.

LindaC, enjoyed your pictures when planning Switzerland, hope mine will turn at least half that beautiful.

Bob, I don’t know why we’re not returning the car in Interlaken (we’re renting from Avis). Didn't think of it, need to look into this – how is the drive, scenery wise? Had a good laugh about the guy trying to drive to Wengen. We know is a car free town, and the only way to get there is the gondola/lift/funicular (no idea what the difference is between all these). Actually, the car free feature was a great selling point when trying to decide where to stay in the area. Poor guy….but cannot help but laugh.

> stop and explore Sils on the way, and probably have lunch there. <

Being in Celerina, you're not far from Sils. I'd substitute the horse carriage ride up to the Hotel Fex for the funicular up to Muottas Muragl. We hiked from the Sils lift to the Fex Valley and took the carriage back down to town.

Pontresina is not worth a "visit".

You intend to go up every lift in that stretch of the Engadin (Piz Corvatsch, Piz Nair, Muottas Muragl) seeing basically the same scenery each time. I'd choose just one (Piz Nair). An interesting day trip to consider is to go over the Julierpass to Savognin and take the lify there. Entirely different scenery.

Oh my, have you forgotten to include Soglio and a hike from there? If you get an early start on your drive to Lugano, you can (and should) spend most of the day there. It's a two hour drive Soglio to Lugano.

a lunch in the gardens behind the Hotel Palazzo Salis in Soglio! Heavenly! Gotta agree, I thought Soglio was one of the most beautiful places on earth, honestly.I'd do that instead of Sils...

The Avis agency in Interlaken is the Waldegg Garage. It is not far from the Interlaken WEST train station.

After we returned the car, the young man kindly took us and our going home luggage to the train.

(It is a long story as to why I returned in Interlaken rather than at the Zürich airport. Suffice it to say that returning in Zürich involved an extra day car rental AND, according to Auto Europe, a different contract and price because I rented in Munich. Bottom line was $$. We planned to purchase half fare cards, so the low rail fare factored into the decision. To be honest with you, I never really understood the whole rationale. I just took my free double upgrade that put me into a B class Mercedes and went on my way to Lauterbrunnen and Interlaken. through southern Bavaria.)

I have not driven from Lugano to Interlaken, but there is a tunnel under the mountains. An autostrada leads to Italy.

When you return, stay on the freeway north until you reach the exit for the town of Wassen and take the route over the Sustern Pass to Inertkirchen. From there you drive to Meiringen and on the Interlaken West to return your car.

The Sustern Pass is one of three spectacular passes that can be done as a loop from the Interlaken - Meiringen area. The other two are the Furka and the Grimsel Passes.

So from the scenery aspect, you get a good one. If one big pass is not enough, you could exit the Freeway near Andermatt and drive over the Furka and the Grimsel Passes to Meiringen.

The Furka is a real experience as is the Grimsel. At the top of the Grimsel Pass there is a big parking area and you can get out and admire the scenery all around. One year we were up there hiking in snow and perspiring because the sun was so hot.

A man drove up in a small wagon with a huge Bernese Mountain Dog. This big boy jumped out and started wallowing in the snow with great energy. Then he started bounding around like he knew what he was doing. He was one happy dog.

Notice above that I said Interlaken West. There is a reason for doing so. The trains to Lauterbrunnen, where you change for Wengen, all leave from Interlaken Ost.

The ride to Lauterbrunnen takes about 20 minutes. Then you need about another 15 minutes or so to ride up the hillside to Wengen.

From Wengen the train continues to Kleine Scheidegg where Jungfraujoch passengers change again.

One excursion I strongly recommend is to take the Luftseilbahn (cable lift car) to the crest of that towering ridge that dominates your view to the East.

From up there, take in the view. Then walk the easy trail to Kleine Scheidegg. From there you can walk up to the Eigergletscher station (or ride) and take a look at the north wall of the Eiger. You can also get a look at some of the glaciers that come off the Mönch and the Jungfrau.

Another favorite excusion of mine is one that is now too physically demanding. Take the train to Grindelwald, walk up the main street (to the west) to the gondola that goes to First (means ridge). From there hike to the Backsee, skirt it on the west side, and huff and puff up to the top of the Faulhorn where there is a mountain hotel.

The view from up there is incredible. To me it makes the Schilthorn view look a little weak.
You can see both of the lakes on either side of Interlaken, the whole (seemingly) of the Berner Oberland, and get long views to the north across the lakes.

I think on that hike, if the day is clear, you could easily take 100 pictures.

Suffice it to say that if the sun shines, you will have all the photo ops you want!! Be sure to have a UV filter and plenty of chip capacity and some lithium batteries.

One word of photographic suggestion:
those mountains are back lit so it is easy to overexpose the pictures.
I bracketed mine. Of course I ended up tossing about half or more of them after I looked at the screen.
Lighting is tricky. I got my exposure set fairly well by setting the aperture at F 8.0 and trying different shutter speeds until things looked right. I ended up shooting many pictures in the manual mode, inspecting them, deleting, and resetting the shutter until I got what looked ok.

I wanted to stay with F8.0 to get the depth of field and the sun was bright enough that I was shooting at around 1/500 which minimized camera shake. I get a little of that even with stabilization features built-in.

PS we had our own fun with the GPS in the Mercedes we had for the visit. Like many of those gadgets, my reaction is just give me a good map!!

My wife was driving the car when we decided to see what the hamlet of Saxeten looked like. We plugged Saxeten into the GPS and started doing exactly what it said. As we neared Interlaken Ost, the thing began gibbering. Turn here, turn there.

We ended up driving into some guy's garage. My wife calmly backed up and went back to where we should have turned left rather than right.

We knew it was wrong; we just wanted to see where that silly babbling thing would send us. Well, we found out.

I don't have time to tell you about trying to follow the GPS to Engstligen Falls when we had to detour in Spiez. Had we followed that thing we might have ended up driving into the Thuner See.

We considered the Hotel Palazzo Salis but didn't find a scenic view so here's where we had lunch in Soglio (at that very table shown in the photo)...

http://www.stua-granda.ch/ristorante.html

True, the restaurant is outside in a gorgeous garden setting under sprawling chestnut trees. I sound like their PR person! Anyway, the food there was just amazing...all homemade pasta..

OOPS In Grindelwald, the First Gondola valley station is to the EAST of the train station. You walk east on the main street for about half a mile before you can see the aerial cables rising to your left.

Of the towns in the area, Grindelwald is the largest and has the most activity. It is very large compared to Wengen.

Wow, I step away for a couple of hours and I get a ton of good info. You guys are fantastic!

Tuck, I am a sucker for views from the top of the mountain, but I see your point about seeing the same scenery over and over again. Haven’t heard about the trip from Julierpass to Savognin and the lift there, definitely need to look into it. And thanks for helping me choose one peak/lift in the area.

I don’t know how I forgot about Soglio, gets great reviews here – that’s definitely the way we’ll spend the day that we’re driving to Lugano. Need to write this down, so I don’t forget “lunch in the gardens behind the Hotel Palazzo Salis in Soglio”. Actually, I’m going to print this entire thread. And the view from Stua Granda, oh my…I want to go there now!

Bob, I need to look at the map and call Avis, too. We got a 7-days reduced rate, not sure how much adding an extra day will be.

Where does the lift to Luftseilbahn start from?

I have a good amount of memory for my cameras (12 GB for my dSLR and another 8 for my point-and-shoot). This should be enough for 14 days, don’t you think? Both cameras use the same battery type, and I have a charger for it and a spare, so no worry there. Bob, thanks for the photographic suggestions, I was wondering what the best way was… I guess I’ll have to try and see what works best. So happy that I switched to digital a couple years ago :)

We’ll have a GPS, too and we usually trust it in new places. But I have a pretty good sense of direction, so we’ll see. And as always, getting lost in a different place is sometimes so much fun, and you discover these remote places that you would’ve never found otherwise…

Thank you so much for all the advice, definitely need to print this thread.

After my recent rental experience, I don't know what the rental contract might turn into if you tack on an 8th day. I just had a relatively wacky contract through AutoEurope myself that ended with us returning the car in Interlaken rather than at the airport in Zürich. The deciding factor was cost.

Moving the drop point changed the rate. So I returned in Interlaken.

In this particular case, I think that the added cost of keeping the car one extra day might be worth it unless there was a steep escalation in the total cost.

Driving over any or all of those 3 passes (Grimsel, Sustern, Furka) is a good way to get a first hand look at Swiss engineering and that incredible scenery. We have been over the Grimsel Pass the most because it is the long way around to Zermatt from Lauterbrunnen, but we have done the other two as well.

My wife usually does most if the driving while I read the maps. She respects those roads, but they do not scare her in the way some people react.

The Swiss have quite a few names for those mountain lift systems that depend on a cable.

A Luftseilbahn is usually a cable system with one large cabin that holds anywhere from 30 to 80 people. They are fairly common around the mountain area. A Golbahn is similar but it is a string of 4 to 6 passenger cars that travel in a continuous stream.

There are two fairly long gondola systems in the area. One goes from Grindelwald to First; the other one goes from Grindelwald Grund (down the hill from the main part of the town) to the crest of the Männlichen.

The Luftseilbahn in Wengen goes from the village up to the crest of the Männlichen. It is a very steep ascent on the eastern face.

You will see it rising out of Wengen rather easily. The lower station is a short walk along the main street of Wengen. It is located near some tennis courts. The cable masts will be obvious to you.

There is also a new Luftseilbahn in Lauterbrunnen that takes people up the steep west side of the valley to a spot called Grutschalp. There passengers have an option:
take the tram to Mürren, or walk it.
The trail is wide and relatively flat, considering that you are in the mountains. We did it a couple of weeks ago for about the 3rd time.
I suggest walking from Grutschalp to Wengen beause you are facing the higher peaks of the mountains as you go along.

If you want a longish hike. I suggest checking out the Eiger North Wall Trail. The lower trailhead is in a village called Alpiglenn which is on the Grindelwald - Kleine Scheidegg rail line. The upper trailhead is near the Eigergletscher station on the Jungfraubahn that goes from Kleine Scheidegg to the Jungfraujoch.

If you are in good shape, I suggest walking uphill on the trail because of the surface. Parts of it are gritty scree that makes footing a little bit treacherous at times.

Now if you want a real blockbuster of a hike, tackle the trail from Griesalp over the Sefinin Furka to Mürren. That one is a trek!!

It can be done by a good hiker, but it is a long day unless you spend the night in the Lauterbrunnen area. The English fellow I spoke with spent the night in Griesalp and then hiked over the top.

He encountered quite a bit of soft snow in early July. By the time you get there the Sefinin Furka (Pass) should be virtually free of snow.

I think you will have enough firepower for the situation. I always carry along an extra storage unit for my camera because if something happens to the bytes, you are out of film!! I also pack extra batteries just in case!! (My fancy Canon S5IS has no battery indicator that I have yet found that estimates remaining life. If it has one, I wish someone would tell me how to use it. It has so much on it that I have not used all the features yet.)

I must have deleted 70 to 75% of all the pictures I took while I was there. I sat on the balcony of our apartment and took many shots of Staubbach Falls under different lighting conditions and a wide variety of settings. I think out of several dozen I got two keepers!!

Now that I have the jpgs on the computer, a few more have bitten the dust. That is the great thing about a digital camera, you can look at the results and delete it on the spot. That step recaptures storage space.

I can suggest a few more hikes if you would like for me to. Just let me know.

Make that Gondolbahn.

There is also a Sesselbahn that is an open chairlift, something we would call a ski lift. The only one I know of in the area is in Kandersteg.

There used to be a Drehtseilbahn between Lauterbrunnen and Grutschalp. The contraption was like an elevator on wheels that ran on railroad-like tracks. The passenger car was pulled up and lowered down the mountain by a cable. It has now been replaced by the higher capacity Luftseilbahn.

You can still see the old trackbed, however, becasuse the new Luftseilbahn uses the same sites for the terminals.

There is also a Luftseilbahn that goes from Stechelberg at the end of the Lauterbrunnen Valley all the way to the top of the Schilthorn.

The line goes up in 3 stages with two changes of cabin on the way:
Stechelberg to Gimmelwald, Gimmelwald to Mürren, and Mürren to the Schilthorn.

A post bus takes passengers from Lauterbrunnen to Stechelberg, or people with a car can drive there and park, for a fee.

Bob,
This is a ton of great info, thank you so much. Will have to call Avis on Monday and see how much they would add for dropping off the car in Interlaken and one more day.

We are in decent shape (not good), but would not attempt any serious, strenuous hike. Relatively flat ones, for 2-3 hrs at a time are the ones we’re thinking of. Some of your suggestions are exactly what we were hoping for (lots of gondolas – however they call them - and easy hikes) – so thanks a lot.

I saw some great pictures of the Staubbach Falls on the internet, hope to get some decent ones, too. Actually, I’m hoping for tons of decent pictures from this vacation :)

We've been back for a week from a similar journey...tons of wonderful photos! I would choose the funicular up to Muottas Muragl instead of Diavolezza cable car. You get a great view of the MTN/glacier for free if you just drive as you are heading towards it (Diavolezza). When you are up at Muottas Muragl make sure you take a sliding swing ride at the playground.
Be sure to walk around Lake Silvaplana and enjoy the Kite Surfers. There is also an easy hike around lake Sils thru the edge of the woods (shade was a welcome relief from the warm temps we had)I was surprised how close everything was in the Engadine Valley. There is BIG Coop grocery store you will drive by when going thru Saint Moritz. The parking garage there offers 1 hour of free parking. If you like chocolate there is a yummy chocolate granola cereal called "Crunch Muesili Choco" it is good plain as a snack, high up on a mountain with blue skies and puffy clouds or with milk.
Drive over to Grindelwald during your stay in Wengen and ride the Luge(we're in our 40's and enjoyed it!) We also enjoyed going up to Mannlichen and hiking. Trummel?? falls near Lauterbrunnen was neat.
The Julier Pass does offer some different scenery, we enjoyed our ride thru there.
I hope your stay in the Lakes will be cooler than ours...we were there when it was 95 (and no AC or even a ceiling fan) We flew from EWR to Geneva. I wish you a wonderful trip!

From First a nice hike is to wander across the meadow to the restaurant at Grosse Scheidegg. The trail is diffuse at times because different hikers have beaten different sub trails in the grass. They all converge at the end. You can see the restaurant because there are no trees in the way.

You can buy a combi ticket to ride up to First on the gondola and ride down from Grosse Scheidegg on the Post Bus.

The last time I was there, private cars were not allowed on the road between Grindelwald and Grosse Scheidegg.

One thing to remember about the trains is that the connections from Grindelwald back to Wengen become lousy timewise after the 17:50 departure from Grindelwald. You must change at Zweilütschinen and the timing of the trains from Interlaken Ost to Lauterbrunnen is not good after 18:16.

One thing I have not yet explained is the train to Lauterbrunnen from Interlaken Ost.

The trains to Lauterbrunnen and Grindelwald leave Interlaken Ost as one combined train from either Gleis 1 or Gleis 2. The train divides at a stop called Zweilütschinen - where the two forks of the Lutschine River meet. The front half of the train goes to Lauterbrunnen; the back half goes to Grindelwald.

On the return journeys the Grindelwald train pulls in first and then the Lauterbrunnen joins it.

Therefore when you leave Interlaken Ost, the Lauterbrunnen train is from Sektor A. The blue and yellow cars have hangtags (as I recall) designating the destination.

I'm still in Sils. Just a quick note.

Of the cable car trips you're planning I would do Muottas Muragl and Diavolezza. Piz Nair is not that spectacular IMO. And the first section of Piz Corvatsch is not worth to see at all.

Found the Julier Pass not very scenic and was stuck there in heavy traffic plus annoyed by road works (yesterday). Savognin ... hm. Not really my first choice.

Definitely Soglio! The other villages in the valley are picturesque too. Vicosoprano, Bondo, Promontogno ...

Have a great trip!

I.

We'll all be thinking of you while you're there. Ditto everyone's compliments on your itinerary. Try to visit Morcote while your toodling Lugano's lake.

And if you've got time for art, there's an excellent exibition called "enigma helvetia" at the Museo d'Arte (and the Museo Cantonale) several blocks beyond my beloved S. Maria degli Angioli along the promenade. It's an expansive, innovative exhibition which groups works by themes of what it is to be Swiss. The exhibition is big enough for two museums, but the better part is at the Museo d'Arte Moderne.

One would think my best memory of Gandria would be the quaint lanes and cuddled houses. But no, it's my lunch of rigatoni gorgonzola. (Actually, it's been so many years, it might have been penne'). Oh, my. J.

Gandria....pasta, yes! However, we failed to check the ferry times and almost had to get a cab...do check that!

deladeb, Were you able to overcome your fear of twisty roads and hairpin turns?

Tuck-Twisty didn't bother me as much as narrow with bikes on one side motorcycles on the other and the oncoming traffic always straddling the center lane. It's amazing how you adapt and luckily DH is a defensive driver. The roads were well paved and the narrowness didn't occur often.
The day we left Silvaplana we drove over the Julier Pass to Andermatt and toward lake Spies/Thun region. WOW, 5 hours of driving and probably not even a quarter mile stretch of straight road. The scenery was magnifucent though!
Another tip for you xyz99: If you are not near or are not hungry for a lunch stop I always had on hand a snack baggie of Dark chocolate covered M&M's (almonds and peanuts) mixed in with plain nuts. I packed 14 of these before leaving. Water can be cheap at the Coop...1.5 L bottle for .30 Swiss Francs, and you can buy it in a 6 pack.

Deladeb,
Thanks for narrowing down our options regarding all the lifts in Engadine. I was not aware of the Luge in Grindelwald, we’ll definitely try it. Actually, I also want to try paragliding – anyone tried it, any comments? And dark chocolate covered M&M's (almonds and peanuts) – you don’t have to work hard to convince me :)

Bob,
Thanks again for the hikes recommendations and the train tips. I checked with Avis, adding one more day to the car rental and changing the drop-off location would add more than a $100 to the price. That’s more than the half fare for the train but might still be worth it, for allowing us to stop on the way and enjoy the scenery.

Ingo,
It seems that there is so much to see and do in Engadine, that I’m not worried at all that we’ll do them all and run out of things to do in 3 full days. I’m sure we’ll actually do only some of all the things I would like to do, but we’ll love it. Hope the weather gets better.

Jmw,
Yes, Marcote and Gandria are both on the list. Unfortunately, with only 2 days in Lugano I don’t think we’ll have time for any art exhibition, and we’ll prefer to spend the time enjoying the nature. Rigatoni gorgonzola…that sounds delicious, we’ll look for it.

And another question for Bob and LLinda (and all the photographers out there): I’m trying to decide what lens(es) to take. I will definitely take the wide angle, but should I take a long zoom? I am interested in birds and dragonflies, but would there be any such opportunities in Switzerland? Don’t want to carry a heavy lens if I don’t have to….Thanks.

I have lugged my share of SLR lenses around those hills. Now I have a digital with one zoom lens that goes from about 2 feet to however far the equal of a 400 mm lens is on an SLR.

Even if it is a Canon camera, I don't the lens is that sharp, unfortunately.

When I had my slr, I took along a 38 - 105 zoom and an 80 - 200 zoom.
Those were the only two lenses I took.

Even with digital if you want to take a telephoto shot at 300 or more, I think you will want a tripod, one of those little boys, just to have something to help steady the camera and allow time for framing without having to hold the camera up for a long time.

if your camera is like mine in that you can look at a reproduction of the image right after you take it, you will have a chance to test the readings and pick the best one.

As I said earlier, when aiming south toward the mountains, the sun is in the wrong place, so you will need to adjust your light meter settings in accordance with what gives you the best results. I finally decided on a spot reading based on the principal subject in the frame.

I then took several exposures at different settings. The only problem with that is that now I have a massive editing job to do with Photoshop.

I must admit that this is a wild year for auto rental contracts. I knew I had a strange one price wise when AutoEurope had a much higher price for returning the car in Zürich at the airport than if I returned the car a day earlier at the Avis agency in Interlaken.

The cost difference was similar to what you experienced: The train fare was cheaper than the cost for the extra day and the escalation in the one-way drop fee. (I got the car in Munich.)

I think you will have to weigh the value of the extra cost against the scenic aspects of one or more of the three passes I mentioned.

Although they are all close to each other geographically, they are different in personality. The Furka is tight and winding, the Grimsel goes over barren rocks, and the Sustern is much greener than the other two. All are thrilling.

I think if I was paying an extra day of rent on a car I would make sure I got my money's worth. If you exited the freeway near Andermatt and backtracked a little over the Furka and the Grimsel Passes to Inertkirchen, Meiringen and Interlaken, I think you would get your money's worth. If you drove up to the top of the Sustern Pass and then retraced your steps, you really would have a day of it.

Is it worth it? That is of course not for me to say.

Oh yes. Gotta throw in one more hike. All the ones we have discussed until now are views of the peaks, the big perspective. The next one is a trip into the inner mountain world: the Kilchbalm.

It is a trip along a glacial valley into a deadend cirque where a few hundred years ago a glacier melted out as the climate warmed. The walls of the cirque itself stream with waterfalls and abound in snow banks early in the season (June and July, even early August.)

To get there, take the post bus from Lauterbrunnen to Stechelberg and the valley station of the Schilthornbahn. Take the first stage of the Luftseilbahn up to Gimmelwald. Get off, and locate the signs to the Kilchbalm.

The trail is relatively flat as mountain trails go and you terinate in the cirque on flat ground that suddenly goes straight up.

One time when we were there cows were grazing. We had to walk around them because they were lying down chewing. Don't worry, if you don't know cows, rest assured that they will not bother you if you don't bother them. These are milk cows and they are used to humans.

I don't usually see bulls out grazing in the alpine pastures. They are a little too much to put out in the open.

I would not worry too much about which hikes you take. Just get out and get moving and you will see something beautiful.

Our week in Lauterbrunnen seemed to disappear like a shot. We are home now, and the whole trip evaporated all 18 days in a flash.

It's quite another thing to run into a herd of Herens (horned)black cows. They are notorious for being "testy" and they are the ones they use for fighting. We came across a herd on the trail and we detoured over manure piles, through a stream and clinging to vines to avoid them! LOL..they might as well have been BEARS.

Bob,
For the umpteenth time, thanks.
We extended the car rental for one more day, although now, that I looked at viamichelin, I realized that the price difference between driving to Interlaken or taking the train might be much higher, when you consider the “road tax”. What is that? Is it something included in the car rental fee, or something like tolls, that you pay as you go?
Anyway, I’m sure it will be worth it…ten years from now we’ll not remember the $100, but the views.

I think I’ll end up taking my wide angle and the 300 mm zoom, and use the point-and-shoot in between. This way I don’t carry a lot, but I’m “covered”.

You know, I read somewhere about the Kilchbalm, but never found more details on it, though it looked very interesting. It seems less travelled, and this might be just what we’re looking for. Thanks.

Linda,
So if we see black cows we turn away and run? How can you tell them apart from normal, docile cows?

Oh I don't think you'll have to worry about them!! They just LOOK fierce.

Switzerland requires that you have on your car a highway tax sticker sometimes called a vignette.

If you rent your car in Zürich, it should already have a highway vignette for Switzerland pasted on the windshield. That will be all you need. Every time I have rented a car in Interlaken, it has had the sticker already on it. (It would be sort of cheap of the rental agency not to put it on there.)

This year and last, I rented from Avis in Munich and had to buy the sticker (vignette) for both Austria and Switzerland.

Germany has no such tax sticker, but I know that Austria and Switzerland require it for freeway driving.

It is one of those little things that reminds one that even though the Schengen agreement has made border passport controls less frequent, each nation is still capable of setting its own tax laws!!

Switzerland by the way is not part of anything like the euro zone or the EU nor did it sign the Schengen Agreement.

When I cross into Switzerland I expect to show my passport. Last year when we crossed the Rhine from Austria into Switzerland we drove past the border patrol station quite easily. The passport control consisted of a hand emerging from the window waving us on. This year we had a full blown check of our passports at the same place. Why? Search me.

Bob,
Good to know the hogway tax is already included in the rental car fee.
10 more days to go :)

Well, let me hedge a trifle: The vignette for autobahn (freeway) driving SHOULD be included.
I have never rented a car in Switzerland without one. BUT this seems to be a crazy year for rentals. It is slightly possible that a car originally rented outside of Switzerland crept into the airport lot in Zürich.

At any rate, I have learned to make no automatic assumptions. Whoever got the car my wife and I turned in will benefit from our expense because it will have our vignette plastered to the lower right side of the windshield.

Let me add a caution here. As you drive north on the freeway from Italy toward Andermatt, a long section of it is underground. You will need to be alert to your exit.
Decide before hand where you want to get off and be looking for it.

You will need to decide if you want to do two mountain passes or one. I think it depends on how well you adjust to that kind of driving. My chauffeur is not fearful of those passes although she respects them for what they are. The roads are well engineered and one need only adhere to the rules of common sense without succumbing to panic or mindless fear.

You might do it this way: Exit for the Sustern Pass. Drive over it and then decide if you would like a taste of the Grimsel Pass. The road that descends from the Sustern leads to Innertkirchen. The road to the Grimsel Pass leads out of the same village.

I tend to like the Grimsel Pass the best because the top is above tree line and there are places to park where you can get good views.

On the Innertkirchen side of the pass, there is a hotel just below the crest. There is parking there, a power dam, and a place to eat.

The other alternative of course is to take both the Furka and the Grimsel Passes to Innertkirchen. Unless you totally change your route, you cannot do just the Grimsel Pass.

Incidentally, as you drive toward Interlaken from Meiringen you will pass some nice waterfalls coming off the south face of the cliffs that form part of the Aar Valley.

You cannot see them from the highway, but the Falls of the Reichenbach are close by, near the parking area for a hospital near Meiringen. If you read any of the Sherlock Holmes stories these falls will have meaning. Otherwise they don't and the falls by late in the summer have slowed to moderate stream. This summer has been wet, so there may be some water left.

I don't think you can go wrong any way you approach it. As far as I am concerned, I think it is a win/win situation. Of course weather can play a role, but even so, you will enjoy the lakes and the other aspects of alpine scenery.

I hope you enjoy your experiences in the Berner Oberland as much as I have on many occasions.

Bob Brown is a wealth of information and I learn from his posts everytime I read them.

There are quite a few options to reach Interlaken.

1. Get off in Airolo (last exit before the Gotthard Tunnel) and do Nufenenpass and Grimselpass.

2. Go over the Gotthard (not through it) and you'll land in Hospenthal (which is right before Andermatt on the Furka side). From there you can go through Andermatt and continue on the Autobahn OR take the Furka and Grimselpass.

3. Go through the Gotthard tunnel and take the Sustenpass.

Please note: if you go through the Gotthard, you'll come out at Goeschenen, which is below Andermatt. You'll have to backtrack up the hill to get to Andermatt.

All options are good and I can't recommend one over the other.

To see a barebone map of the passes:
http://www.alpentourer.de/alpenpaesse/region6/

Avoiding traffic jams be the Gotthard tunnel:

We've been having lots of traffic jams before the Gotthard tunnel lately. This is typical in summer, especially from Friday - Sunday. You'll see a lit up board on the Autobahn in the Bellinzona area giving you info about "staus" (conjestion / jams) before the Gotthard. If you see this, take out your map and get off at an earlier exit. There's a local road that parallels much of the autobahn in the upper part of the valley towards the Gotthard. Take this road and avoid going through the Gotthard by taking one of the passes.

Try to avoid the traffic jams because it's hard on your clutch and gets real boring after awhile.

Schuler is more current on the highways between Switzerland and Italy than I am, by far. No contest in fact.

In this case I think his advice is well worth considering. Take a look at the map and have an alternative route in mind.

The tunnel has an advantage in speed when traffic is flowing. When things are bogged down, I dislike being in tunnels very much. If that thing is clogged, I would not hesitate to take his alternative route.

If you are stuck in a subterranean traffic jam, it is not much fun, particularly when you could be above ground seeing a nice view.

Those mountain passes deserve respect, but they are not dangerous if the driver uses a little common sense.

For example, we drove up to the crest of the St. Bernard Pass to see the old hospice where the St. Bernard dogs are kept. I had heard from others that the pass was steep and winding, treacherous even.

My wife drove us up to the hospice. When we got to the top of the pass, she wanted to know where the steep part was. She was not sure if I was kidding her or not when I said that we were at the top. I assured her that the next move was downhill.

I think she was looking for one of those Colorado dirt road passes that wind around the mountain to elevations of 12,000 feet or more. Those can be a little thought provoking.

Anyone who has traversed Cumberland Pass or Cottonwood Pass knows what I mean.

Bob and Schuler,
You guys are fantastic – I really need to study this with a map, thank you so much. We will do the pass (or passes) after a week driving in Engadine, which I hear has its own challenges. So I hope we’ll be prepared. We drove in Europe before, and had fun on narrow roads in Ireland last year. If the Swiss pass roads are wide enough for 2 passing cars, do not allow sheep crossing, have a minimal shoulder and a railing, we will be fine :)

Part of what we’re looking for is not only the drive, but stopping too, to enjoy the views. So if Grimsel Pass offers this, it is a big contender.

If this was your first trip to Switzerland, and maybe to only one in your life (who knows what the future will bring, it’s a big world with lots of other places to visit), so, in that case, what would be your option #1 way to drive from Lugano to Interlaken?

We’ll be doing this drive on a Saturday, so we’ll try to avoid the Gotthard tunnel.

Of the three passes I named, the Sustern, Grinsel and Furka, all are different in terms of what you see.

The Sustern in my view is greener.
The Grimsel is grimmer, if you will excuse the play on words.
The Furka is very winding and I don't recall a place to stop and view. There may be one, but it has been about 5 years since I drove over that particular one.

We spend a night on the Grimsel Pass two years ago and drove to the top of it last year.

Let me explain about "grimmer." There are fewer trees in view as you climb the Grimsel Pass. You see instead a lot of dark rock. As you reach the top, there are viewpoints above tree line.

On the Sustern Pass there is a good forest cover most of the way.

Each pass has its own character, its own features and its own dramatic impact.

What appeals to one person may not appeal to another.

I happen to like the Grimsel because of the starkness of the landscape and the fact that you can see a long ways from the various viewpoints which provide parking opportunities.

To a great extent it depends on what you want to see.

Just remember that those passes are well engineered, but they deserve respect. We don't race around squalling the tires, that is for sure. Both my wife and I are past 70 and we did not survive this long by being foolish all the time.

I know one thing: If I could relive my teen years with current wisdom, I would live at a much lower risk!!

Which passes to drive? It's a tough decision.

I think I would do:

-the Gotthard Pass
-the Furka Pass
-the Grimsel Pass

and then on to Interlaken.

The Gotthard Pass is quite easy and the road is very wide.

The Gotthard tunnel: The traffic jams happen before the tunnel due to a "drop system", which allows only x amount of cars into the tunnel. Normally, the tunnel itself doesn't have traffic jams.

Just wanted to add that the weather would be the first determiner of deciding to drive the passes or not.

If the passes are in fog or low clouds, skip them. In poor visibility, they can be very dangerous.

If you're tight on time and would like to do just one pass, then do the Susten. Go through the Gotthard tunnel (or over the Gotthard pass) and get off at the Wassen exit.