Spain itinerary
 

We are a couple in early 60s planning a two week trip to Andalusia in late April/early May. We fly nonstop to Madrid but don't plan to stay there as we have been before. We prefer smaller towns and low key, slow-paced travel. Like to visit churches/historic sites but not big fans of museums. We enjoy walking/hiking and being outdoors and people watching at outdoor cafes. And good, unpretentious restaurants! Our itinerary includes a stop in Cadiz to visit a friend stationed in nearby Rota. We planned that for a weekend when she won't be working.
Here is the itinerary (nothing booked yet):
Sunday: Arrive early morning Madrid, train to Cordoba
Monday: Cordoba
Tuesday Cordoba
Wednesday: Train to Sevilla
Thursday: Sevilla
Friday: Sevilla
Saturday: pick up rental car in Sevilla, drive to Cadiz
Sunday: Cadiz area
Monday: Drive to Ronda with stop in Arcos de la Frontera
Tuesday: Ronda and environs
Wednesday: Ronda and environs
Thursday: Ronda and environs
Friday: Drive to Seville, return car, train to Madrid. Spend night near Atocha train station
Saturday: taxi to airport for midday flight home to US

We left out Granada because we hope to come back and visit that on another trip, in conjunction with Malaga and coastal towns in that area. We have a lot of nights in Ronda because we want to take our time visiting Pueblos Blancos and walking/hiking in Parque Natural Sierra de Grazalema. Just couldn't fit it all in at the pace we like to travel.

Any thoughts/suggestions are appreciated, especially hotel recommendations. I am a light sleeper and hoping to find places to stay that are walking distance to restaurants, etc, but in quieter areas on the outskirts of tourist areas. In Ronda, wondered if it's best to stay right in town or someplace more rural since we will be driving to Grazelema, etc for day trips. We don't like changing hotels constantly, which is why we are staying at least 3 nights in most places. Many people seem to do Cordoba as a day trip, but it sounds more appealing than Sevilla to me, since it's smaller and perhaps less big city/fashionable. Also the first day or two we expect to be pretty jet lagged so wanted to give ourselves plenty of time there.
Thank you!

I think you are spending too much time in Ronda. The town itself can be seen in half a day, and the White Villages are not all that interesting. Would be better to go on to Granada and the glorious Alhambra.

agree with Bedar...

((H))

Seville is fabulous. I'd take time from Cordoba and Ronda.

Look at apartments by SpainSelect.com. We loved ours in Seville:

https://sevilla.spain-select.com/en_...cio-san-jose-v

Yes, I've been struggling with leaving out Granada/Alhambra. I'm not a fan of crowded touristy places but I guess there's a reason everyone goes there! It just sounded so relaxing to end the trip with a few days outdoors, hiking around the Natural Park filled with spring flowers by the White Villages. I suppose we could still spend a day doing that if we spend two nights in Ronda. Then we would have two nights for Granada. We could return our rental car there and then take the train back to Madrid on Friday. Or maybe we should spend only one night in Cadiz and add a third night to Granada. There's so many places to go and I remember it being a very big country when I was there many years ago. Although the trains were super slow then.

I agree with all of the above and you need not stay too near to Atocha as Barajas is about 20 cab ride north of the city.

MoBro, thanks for the link to the apartment website. I'm definitly going to look into that. The one you rented looks lovely but is completely booked for many months. but there are others available. I am not familiar with the neighborhoods so if anyone can suggest a quieter area of Sevilla that is still walking distance to restaurants, etc., please let me know. Since it will be April I'm thinking it won't be too terribly hot yet.

We could do:
Cordoba 2 nights
Seville 4 nights
Cadiz 1 or 2 nights
Ronda 2 nights
Granada 2 or 3 nights
Madrid 1 night before flight home

If you don't like crowded, touristy places (who does ?), I hope you won't be disappointed by Ronda which is both. Yes, there is good reason why the Alhambra is both - it's breathtaking. You won't be disappointed there. You could also hike arounf the Sierra Nevada National Park or the Alpujarra which is full of white villages. Have a look.

Just remember, the Feria de Sevilla takes place April 15 - 22. It will be very crowded then.

Thanks Bedar, I will look into the Alpujarra. I guess I thought Ronda might not be too crowded midweek in early May, but that really was a guess. I am aware of the Feria de Sevilla and planning not to arrive there until April 24 when it's over. I figure some people do like crowds, since I read many reviews who recommend visiting during Holy Week or the Feria. When we see there is some sort of "event" or festival in a place we plan to visit, we always avoid that week :)

No, I don't think anyone likes crowds, but these events are so unique, must be seen/experienced, that the crowds are endured. Ronda might have an off day while you are there, but the Costa del Sol is right down the road, and tour buses are sent up to Ronda. Good luck.

You might want to consider Antequera instead of Ronda. Supposedly much less touristed. Considered the heart of Andalusia. You can see ancient dolmens and the El Torcal Nature Reserve is close by for hiking- famous for unstable limestone formations. Lots of churches too. We’re spending a couple of nights there in March on our way to Seville. Enjoy your trip!

Anyway about booking long-distance trains - www.renfe.com where you can book your own discounted tickets online if do early enough -but non-changeble non-refundable from a specific train at a sepcific time so if plane to train leave plenty of time for plane to be late. Check www.seat61.com for lots of help in booking discounted tickets - for general info www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

Agree with bedar about Ronda and overhyped white villages. But they are on way between Seville and Ronda.

Cordoba at 330,000 is a fairly large city but half the size of Seville.

Really smaller cities like Ronda often don't have much to occupy more than a day.

I though Jerez-de-la-Frontera to be a sweet easy day trip from Seville - Sherry House tours and practice session of Andalusian Horses in local arena many days.

I believe Jerez is close to Cadiz where we will be spending a night while visiting a friend stationed in Rota, so might visit it then. I wasn't planning on spending more than one day in Ronda itself, but rather using it as a base for exploring the Sierra de Grazelema region. The White Villages look so pretty in the photos I've seen, so I was surprised to read that they are over-hyped and not all that interesting. I will look into Antequera-- thank you.

Buckminster, our apartment was in a fabulous neighborhood for walking to nearby restaurants. Maybe another unit in that building is available?

You can email Spain Select. They are very responsive to answering your questions.

Why go back to Sevilla to return your car? You can use public transportation from Ronda.

I adored Cordoba and am glad I gave it 2 full (and very busy) days. I don’t think you’ll regret the time there.

If you decide to visit Granada, try to give it at least 3 nights.

I’ll second Bedar’s recommendation of the Alpujarras.

Hope that helps!

Thank you, I didn't realize there was train service between Ronda and Madrid. Fodor's guidebook only mentions buses. I guess I need to do more research!

Regarding the Alpujarras, what is the driving like there? We had such a scary experience driving on a mountainous road with no guardrails (with heavy fog/rain) in Costa Rica that I am much more nervous now. My husband is the driver, and usually fearless, but that experience has made him more cautious as well. I read some reports that used the word "terrifying" and others that say it's easy, so I'm confused. I don't think we would go to Sierra Nevada National Park as it sounds like there still could be snow at that elevation in late April.

For public transpiration to Ronda, you probably have to go transfer en route. Check rome2rio.com, and be sure to click on the links to which it directs you, as the main site is not sensitive to seasonal variation.

I didn't (and wouldn't) drive to Las Alpujarras -- I took a bus from Granada into the Poqueira Gorge, and I must admit that I found the bus terrifying. I'm glad I went, but OMG, I would not want to drive those roads! JMO, though; lots of people do it every day.

Fodor's guidebook is, IMO, a great start for the area. The Rough Guide and Michelin Green are likely to give you a bit more detail.

Have you made your airline reservations? If not, I recommend flying into Madrid, and then fly home from Seville, otherwise you are wasting time backtracking to Madrid. This is called an open-jaw ticket or multi-city ticket.

`We spent 2 nights in Córdoba and loved it, and could have used a 3rd night. It was one of our favorite cities. Seville is more beautiful architecturally, but also a lot more crowded than Córdoba. We spent 4 nights in Seville, so your allotment of 4 nights there is good.

I also recommend taking the time to visit Granada and the Alhambra. It is magnificent. Try to schedule a night time tour as well.

We looked into flying home from Malaga but we would have to connect back through Paris with several hours layover and then still have a 9 hour flight to Chicago. Flying out of Seville connects through Madrid, and the flight leaves early in the morning so we would have to spend the night before in Seville. Flying nonstop out of Madrid just seemed simpler, and we thought taking the fast train might be more enjoyable than sitting around an airport. I briefly checked the rome2rio site and it looks like we could train to Madrid from Granada although you do have to connect through another town. It's about 4 hours.

Is it possible for you to visit Seville at the end of your trip so that you will already be there? And won't waste time backtracking to Seville. In September, we flew into Madrid, and we flew home from Seville, our last stop. We live in Boston. Our return flight was Seville to Lisbon, with a few hours layover, and then non stop to Boston.

If this helps with scheduling, our itinerary was as follows (after visiting Madrid and Toledo):

Córdoba - 2 nights
Granada - 2 nights
Malaga - 2 nights
Seville - 4 nights

Because you are visiting 2 places we didn't go to (Cadiz and Ronda), and because you need to be in Cadiz on a weekend, this might not work for you, but thought I would mention it.

If you stay with your current plan, you would take a bus from Granada to Antequera, then change to the train to Madrid. This is because the train tracks from Granada have not been completed yet.

Not clicking that link and advise others not to either. Have reported it. This person provides same link on multiple forums so guessing it is spam.

MoBro, I found that apartment on another website! It looks great and I think we will rent it. I know you loved it, but you didn't mention--is it quiet? I am a light sleeper and concerned about street noise in Seville (from tipsy people walking home late at night). Thanks

Just to elaborate on Karen’s description of the journey from Granada to Madrid. Renfe—the train operator—arranges the bus/train combo. You don’t have to book them separately yourself. Just book the train tix like you normally would. If by some miracle, the track upgrade is complete by then, then you’ll be able to travel all the way by train from Granada.

buckminster, it is on a relatively quiet little street. The apartments face into an inner courtyard, where our windows opened to.

The only sounds I heard were people in the courtyard in the morning, which was minimal. The windows are good, and there are indoor window shutters, too.

Where did you find that apartment? Or is it a different apartment in the same building? The building is small-ish, with maybe 8 apartments. Most of them were much bigger than ours. They all look fabulous.

When you leave the front door of the building, go to the left and find a small, out of the way area with great restaurants. We usually headed to the right, then discovered the left was good, too.

indyhiker, thank you for that clarification. I have looked at a couple sites and saw the train/bus combo. Right now, I am investigating KarenWoo's advice to rearrange itinerary so we would move Sevilla to the end of our trip. This means we would travel Cordoba to Granada, which I think is also a train/bus combo connecting through Antequera. I haven't been able to find any info on when the high speed rail will be finished to Granada.

Current version of our itinerary:
Overnight flight to Madrid
Train to Cordoba--stay 2 nights
Train to Grenada--stay 2 nights
Rental car to Ronda--stay 2 nights
Drive to Cadiz--stay 2 nights
Train to Seville--stay 4 nights
Train to Madrid --stay 1 night
Fly home

This is a faster pace than I would like, so I'm still considering changing it. I also am afraid I will be burnt out seeing so many churches, etc, which was why I initially planned to skip Grenada.

MoBro--found the apartment on airbnb. Homeselect is no longer the rental agency.

Don't worry. You won't be burnt out by churches. The famous Mezquita in Cordoba was a mosque, and the Alhambra was a palace, not a church. But, I would visit the cathedral in Granada where in the Royal Chapel Ferdinand and Isabella are entombed.
You could just take a direct bus between Cordoba and Granada and not bother with the train and transfer to the bus. I'd drive from Cadiz to Seville and stop by Jerez for some sheery and a horse show.

Buckminster, we took the ALSA bus from Cordoba to Granada (which Bedar suggests) because we didn't want to bother with the train and bus transfer. The bus ride was about 2.5 hours. The bus was fine; it's very modern, comfortable seats, and air conditioned. The bus we took did not have a bathroom so you have to make sure to use bathroom facilities before you board.

I know that some people on this forum have done the bus/train transfer and didn't mind it, but we chose the direct ALSA bus and were fine. No complaints.

Karen--Yes, the lack of bathroom is what made me hesitate.

Bedar, I was using the word "Church" loosely, I know some are/were mosques and palaces :)

Sounds like a good plan! Personally, I’d spend 3 nights in Granada -- the Alhambra can easily take a full day, so 3 nights would give you time for some of Granada’s many other treasures. But many people give Granada only 2 nights; it really depends on what you want.

As Bedar suggests, the styles of architecture and the purposes of the buildings in these cities are sufficiently different that I don’t hink you need to worry about burn out, and the Alhambra is, IMO, among the world’s most magnificent buildlings. That said, each of us is different….

Just hold the coffee before boarding bus!

I know, that's always my problem! I love my morning coffee...

One of our daughters lives about 2.5 hours drive from us and I often have to stop at a rest stop on the way!

If I remember correctly, there was an afternoon ALSA bus from Córdoba to Granada that has a bathroom. I think it’s called the Premier or Premium bus. On this trip, I always chose early morning or mid-morning buses or trains so that we could arrive at our next destination early enough to check in to our hotel, become familiar with the area or sightsee if possible, and have dinner. In fact, when we arrived in Córdoba from Madrid, we had time to visit the Mesquite in the late afternoon after having a late lunch.

I don’t like to leave a destination in the afternoon because that means leaving our luggage at the hotel (which is I know is doable), and walking around or sightseeing before our train or bus, but that means constantly looking at our watches, which I personally don’t find enjoyable. So that’s why we took the morning bus from Córdoba to Granada, and that bus did not have a bathroom. I believe if the trip is 4 hours or more, all the buses have bathrooms.

Sorry to be so long-winded . . .but you might be better off with the train/bus transfer. Or check the bus schedule to see if there is an afternoon bus that definitely has a bathroom, if this suits your schedule. I think we took the 11AM bus from Córdoba to Granada, and this one does not have a bathroom.

Meant to say Mezquita. Auto correct can be frustrating sometimes.

Why don't people turn off autocorrect ? It seems to be more annoying than helpful.

buckminster, that's interested it's on airbnb now. It was the cleanest lodging we have ever seen, so I hope they kept the same housekeeper.

We also took the train from Seville to Madrid. It's a nice train ride. Book in advance for best rates.

We also took the train from Seville to Madrid. It's a nice train ride.>

Yes AVE trains are amongst the most fastest and comfy trains in Europe - especially in first class. Scenery as in much of Spain unremarkable but it's only a 2 hour ride at speeds up to nearly 200 mph!).

Wow sure wish we had those high speed trains in the states. I could visit my daughter on a day trip!

I looked into flying out of Seville so we wouldn't have to spend our last night in Madrid (which I think Karenwoo suggested). The only thing I turned up connected through Madrid and cost thousands one way. There were also some that connected lisbon-Boston-Chicago (first leg on propeller plane), but we don't want more than one stop. So I think we will stick with our original plan to fly nonstop and spend last night in Madrid.