Rome, BIG Disappointment !
 

My sister and I just returned (07-69-07)from
Rome, Italy. It was truly awful. We first went to Paris for 8 days, then on to Rome. We were shocked at how dirty it was and how there was garbage everywhere. The graffiti was on just about every square foot of the city. I understand the city is old, but can't it be cleaned up. The Italian flag that hung from many buildings were so dirty and tattered. Ive travled all over Europe and some 3rd world countries and I've never experienced such deplorable conditions as was Rome. And the Italians are so unhappy, it is so sad there.
Does anyone one else feel a little bit this way?
Thank you Fodor readers for all the great help in planning our trip.

Where did you stay in Rome? That might affect your perceptions.

I did not have the same experience of Rome as you did, but I did travel there in winter, not summer, which likely helps.

I hope you were able to garner some enjoyment of the historical buildings and art.

This might be of interest...

http://fodors.com/forums/pgMessages....p;tid=34406329

Yes I agree Rome is awful - please everyone stop going there...

OK. Yes, there is a lot of graffiti. Yes, the city can be dirty and polluted. But, what about the fabulous Borghese Gardens? What about the great restaurants? What about the Vatican? What about all the great art museums? What about the Via Condotti? What about the fantastic people-watching at the cafes? La Dolce Vita, sweetie.

I can't believe you didn't find a few things worth crowing about.

The Great and Powerful Thingorjus

I loved Rome when I visited... it remains one of my favorite cities in the world thanks to its lovely people, incredible history and fine food.

When my sister and I had trouble finding Campo di Fiore via bus, an entire busload of Italians took our arms and walked us to the square. Everyone we met was twinkly and full of life. But maybe we were there at a good time... spring is a nice time to be anywhere.

I'm sorry you had such a bad time... it really can be a magical city.

I found going to Rome at the start of a trip instead of the end of a trip makes me enjoy it more. I can tolerate the chaos a lot more since I'm amped up for the trip. Also, taking cabs makes getting around much more pleasurable. The Roman public transportation system is a nightmare.

The Romans did seem a lot more hostile last May than in my prior trips. The tourists crowds seemed a lot bigger as well. Maybe the two have something in common

Topping in the hopes of discouraging more people from visiting my favorite city.

I was in Rome last October. I loved the city.

I was in Rome in August a few years back, I loved it - it stands out as one of my favorite cities (ahead of Venice, Florence, Prague, London and many others). All of the Romans we met were great - I especially enjoyed the parents of the boys who played soccer on our pedistrian street and the guys who played dominos at "our" local cafe every day. There was NO graffiti or trash in our area (Via Giulia) only lots of flowers.

I am also quite curiuous as to what neighborhood you chose, it makes a huge difference.

Grafitti? The Romans did a big clean-up for the Jubilee Year in 2000. Not sure when they'll repeat their actions, but I found Rome to be cleaner than many areas of NYC. In terms of unhappy, I'd say that probably has to do with the intense heat and the influx of tourists that summer always brings. I've been in Rome in every month OTHER THAN July and/or August, and found the Romans treated me with the greatest respect and kindness. Paris is fine, I've no problems with London, but give me Rome any day! Thingorjus is so right--it's a town where it's delightful to sit in a cafe & check out the man-candy!

BC

Certainly not every place appeals to everyone, but it's hard to imagine how Rome could be called "truly awful".

<<The Romans did seem a lot more hostile last May than in my prior trips. The tourists crowds seemed a lot bigger as well. Maybe the two have something in common>>

Sad to say my last trip was almost 6 years ago. I had previously found Rome to be hot, crowded, andseemingly a historic mess and a little tedious. But that October I found an incredibly beautiful, happy and vital city. It is one of the best-remembered weeks of my life.

Can't say I enjoyed the grafitti, but neither did I find it "everywhere". Also, we stayed on the Aventine, minutes away from almost anything we wanted to see or do, but seemingly distant in terms of calm and quiet.

Rome can be disappointing, as I know from experience. (The kiss of death is to try to do too much) But he* can also be magic.

*Roma for me is a masculine city, as opposed to feminine Paris.

Well, I'm always glad to hear people's honest impressions. Although I hope you'll give the Eternal City another chance, perhaps during a cooler month of the year. I confess that my first trip to Rome was less than wonderful, the second time I couldn't understand why I hadn't liked it the first time.

What incident prompted your impression that the Italians are so unhappy?

I will say that our family expected to love Rome, but we did not. I would not describe it as "awful" but it was stressful. The traffic was so thick that just crossing the street was an "adventure" with three kids in tow. The graffiti took some getting used to. I didn't find it particularly dirty, but there was small trash (e.g. cigarette butts) between the cobblestones of the older streets....hard to sweep that kind of thing up. We had some decent meals, but no fantastic meals and several below average meals.

I would like to return, but only to see the many many churches I couldn't fit in on our first visit.

Just keep traveling. I know that I really love some cities that others hate (e.g. Florence and Barcelona). If Rome doesn't do it for you, I'm sure there are many other places that will.

Wow, then something dreadful has to have happened since I was there a 6 months ago. You certainly missed a wonderful and vibrant city...that's a real shame.

The Italians were so unhappy and sad there? How in the world can you say that? It's not a Disneyland existence like Venice, it's a huge, gritty working city that has been occupied for over 2,000 years. You might want to look at pictures or watch travel shows before you go on your next trip so you'll be better prepared for your destination.

http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...p;tid=34821434
"Amyone Else Just Not Fall in Love with Rome?"

a thread on others who agreed.

Also, the thread "Did Anyone Else Find Rome A Horror?"

I think it must be a personal experience...but others have expressed your feelings unfortunately.

hoping to enjoy it in ottobre!
Andiamo.

I have to say I did Rome in the summer of 2001 and fell in love. Then I returned in May 2005 and was shocked. The city felt crowded and hostile. It was not the warm and welcoming city I had experienced the first time. And yes, we stayed in the same place and visited several different areas of the city. Sadly, it is not a place I wish to return to very soon. It just did not feel safe.

We were in Rome the week before you indylady. It was our first trip, was it yours?

If you were like us...

I think we spend too much time planning and thinking of Romantic Rome. The guide books don't show the traffic around the Colusseum or the homeless people sleeping at the Pantheon.

And July was so so very hot. I think we all had a little less tolerance. And then there's dealing with the maps. And certainly it's hard to find the street names.

Then you have to get passed the people selling the fake designer bags and sunglasses. Oh and their certainly was alot of graffitti.

Then you get by all of that and fall in love. I'm thinking of all the things I missed and can't wait to go back.

It's a big city like anywhere else in the world. It has the good, the bad and the ugly.

Where else can you enjoy your gelato on 2000 year old steps? Or share a table with an old italian couple that doesn't speak English but smiles and passes ciao when they leave.

Our a young choral group singing at the Pantheon while eating their pizza in the piazza. A free concert for everyone nearby.

Early morning the business owners would be out cleaning in front of their stores.

Travel when it's cooler weather. Remember everyone isn't on vacation and the heat can bring out the worst in anyone.

Find the little treasures.

Will you people stop? Rome is a downer -- a real bummer! You don't want to go there. Florence and the Amalfi Coast are worse! Please go to Prague or Germany, You will like Prague or Germany. Every morning the graffitti police sandblast the previous night's defacements. Everyone is happy happy happy. Only decadent romantics like Italy these days. The truth is -- Rick Steves prefers Austria and wants to keep it all for himself. Don't let him get away with it! Boycott Italy! Thank you Indylady for telling the truth.

We were in Rome for three days last October - and loved it. Didn't notice garbage.

We happened to be in Piazze Navonne about 7.00pm one night. A band started up and, I think it was impromptu, but the whole Piazza full of people from grand parents to bambinos stood and and started waltzing. Magic.

We then ate in Campo d' Fiori in the most delight little restaurant. At the end of the meal, a gentle old man came up to our table and poured us a very unusual fruit liqueur and drank it with us. He spoke no English, but was so charming.

Pausanias, if you can get a few million of Rome's annual visitors to read your post, you will have solved the overcrowding issue!

We were in Rome at the end of May. It was very warm and crowded, like any big city. I adored it! The Vatican museums I could have done without but the city...it was so alive and vibrant. I can't wait to go back and plan to do so for our very next European vacation.

After much deliberation which included chastising myself about how I should see new places if I'm going to spend the money and take the time to travel overseas, I've decided that I really loved Rome so much and that there was so much I didn't get to see and experience in the 6 days we were there, that I'm going back in October of 2008. I'm returning to Paris for this next trip too. Sorry Pausanias, no Prague or Germany for me!

LOL at Pausanias! By all means let's discourage people from going to Italy--my favorite country!

I hated Rome the first two times I visited there. Then I went in February and learned to love it. Last year I was there in August (GOD, the crowds, but I still enjoyed it) and again in October, when it was simply wonderful. It's one of my favorite cities now. Never thought I'd say that.

Hi Indy,

Could not DISAGREE with you more!!!

Yes and the pasta is terrible and the gelato doesn't taste good. please everyone don't go to rime.

Everyone has a different experience when visiting the same city.

I have been to Rome twice. I wouldn't say I love it, though it certainly is not a disappointment. I agree that it's not the cleanest or the most organized European city, but the history/art/architecture etc makes up for it.

I hated Amsterdam when I first visited at age 20. I waited over 10 years before returning - and enjoyed it much more at age 32.

I loved Venice when I visited as a child and again at age 26; but disliked it when we went there for our honeymoon at age 32. It felt like a giant Disneyland overrun by tourists.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to his/her opinion, and even one's own perception of the same city can change as one ages...

We just returned from Rome last week, and we have already made our plans to return next summer. I don't think you saw the real Rome. This is a fabulous city with beautiful Piazzas, great restaurants and more history than I can take in, and this was our 5th trip there. Did you visit the markets, the Gardens, the beautiful piazzas, the churches, the vatican, the forum, walk across the bridges and just let Rome cast its spell? I guess not. You should revisit Rome with a different attitude and you just might enjoy yourself. This is our favorite city in the world and we have been traveling all over the world for the past few years, and Rome is the one city we return to every year.

My first trip to Rome was during the summer and I remember being hot and miserable, vowing never to return.

Well, I was just there again in early May and I loved it so much that I cried when it was time to leave! Yes, it is an exhausting, dirty, jam packed city but I was enthralled by the churches, the people, the art, the ruins, and the nighttime charms. I also had a very nice apartment next to Campo di Fiori that seemed like an oasis
in the chaos.

I really disliked Florence, however, due to the heat, crowds, and the weak a/c in my apartment!

Everyone's perception is based on a myriad of factors like weather, traffic,
queues, accomodations, local encounters.

I hope the original poster can go back to Rome in the off season and give it another try. I think Rome is my new favorite European city.

Our family was there at Christmas time and found it wonderful. BUT as we drove in the taxi from the airport my kids were a little worried. My son said he thought he might get mugged in this place and everything looked so old and run down. Funnily enough after 4 weeks in Italy on the drive back out to the airport he had completely changed his mind. He couldn't even see the dirt anymore. Rome probably takes a bit of getting used to but it has so much happening it is worth it.

I'm sorry indylady, that had such bad time in Roma. I pray that you give it another chance. I visited Italy about 3 years ago and was completly captivated by Roma and all of her glory. I too went off season but I can imagine it is crowdy in the summer. You say the Italians were unhappy, perhaps it was the heat and all the crowds. When I went in October it appeared to me that the Italians were loving life. I think if you go off season, you'll get an entirely different perspective of this wonderful city. Please dont' give up on Roma.

I adored Rome. Walking through the ruins, the amazing food...the art...the architecture...It was all amazing. Sure, I could have done without the graffiti, but I found it to be a very joyful place. I can't wait to go back!

My wife and I were in Rome in September of 2004. I admit that the ride from the airport was through parts of town that looked a bit rough, but once we arrived in Centro Storico and at our convent on the Piazza Farnese (one block from Campo Fiori) we had a totally different opinion.

We loved the city, even the grittiness of it. The hustle, the bustle, the fast moving cars, the people---all mixed together with 2000 year old history around every corner.

As mentioned earlier, beautiful piazzas, churches, relaxing and people watching while drinking wine, nice meals at small, family run restaurants---we can't wait to return.

Truly, in some ways Rome is like a rather complicated person who can be a bit (or a lot) off-putting until you get under the layers to find the fascination.

After my first short (hot and frustrating) trip to Rome = when I fell in love with Italy in a small town north of the city - I came home and was seldom without a book about Italy at my bedside. Many of those over the years have been about Rome: Paul Hoffman's "Seasons of Rome", Elizabeth Bowen's "A Time in Rome," Eleanor Clarke's "Rome and a Villa" and many others. And lots of films, Fellini, Visconti, etc. When I returned to Rome it was with a far greater appreciation for the eternal city. And it was October.

It's entirely possible that the "difficult" Rome of today is just another layer, along with the ancient, early Christian, medieval, renaissance, baroque ... although they are less layers than neigthbors = random books of different eras shelved side-by-side by a vexed and vexing librarian.

As has been said by many wise travelers, Rome can be visited many ways: see ancient Rome, or see Renaissance Rome, but see them together at your peril.

Indylady needn't feel bad about having bad feelings for Rome - as many here have pointed out, the first taste isn't always a favorable one. Rome is a good lesson, though: complicated places and people need more knowledge to be enjoyed fully, and more familiarity to seem friendly, perhaps.

One thing: Indy wrote <<The Italian flag that hung from many buildings were so dirty and tattered. >> I don't recall that, but I imagine it happens, because it happens here with the stars and stripes. One of the most irritating things I see over and over in the US is people "proudly" flying the flag in any weather, or whipping from a car's radio antenna, until it is in rags. This doesn't honor the flag.

Funny, I can't remember a bit of graffitti on our visit to Rome last year. Although it was our first trip, and we didn't expect much (other Italophile friends don't like Rome) I think we really had three trips in one, since we spent 9 days in Rome, and stayed in three different places for various reasons: 1. finishing an Elderhostel trip, 2. staying in my dream place: Albergo del Senato, and 3. trying out what became DH's favorite place ever, the better priced Daphne Inn. We ended up loving Rome so much, after many trips to other parts of Italy. Soooo - I think it has a lot to do with expectations. I've had better food in Tuscany, better views at Lake Como, lots of fun with friends in Milan, seem incredible art in Florence (three times) but Rome is vibrant and (still) alive like no other place on earth, except Jerusalem. Try again. (and take me with you.)

Stay in the US. Visit Las Vegas, take a gondola ride, visit Caesar's Palace, Bellagio, and the Venetian. It's clean, neat, and everyone is oh so kind. And.....you can get a good hamburger. Leave Rome and Italy alone for those of us who are brave enough, tolerant enough, and I guess, unjoyful enough to enjoy one of the greatest cities in the world.

Well - I've never notice that the Italians were so unhappy - they seemed to be enjoying themselves a lot to me.

Part of what you're reacting to may be a result of the Italian tax structure. A lot of tax is based not on income, but on all the property you own. So- it's to your benefit to have the value of your property underestimated - if your house or apartment building looks tacky/dirty/ratty on the outside (no matter how beautiful and expensively furnished on the inside) you'll pay less in tax.

Also - buildings 500 or more years old are NOT going to look like a troop of brand newm otels.

(Paris looks much more modern, since in the late 19th centurty Haussman tore down huge areas of historical buldings, some dating back to midieval times, to "modernize" Paris by putting up row upon row of the 6 story apartment buildings we associate with much of Paris.)