Rick Steves web site
 

In 2000, I had the chance to meet Rick Steves. Steves was staying at the same hotel that I was staying at in Zurich. <BR><BR>I think Rick Steves does a wonderful job in his bringing a more budget, backdoor Europe to the young traveler on a budget.<BR><BR>I love his PBS series as well. His Berner Oberland is what first got me interested in this wonderful area.<BR><BR>Now that being said. I wonder why Rick Steves has an entire folder of messages on the UGLY American. I just looks to me as if it gives some people an oportunity to American bash. Yes I know that some Americans act rudely in Europe. I've seen it first hand.<BR><BR>But here is a this just in: Travelers from other countries can act jerky while traveling also. I saw a bus tour of Germans cause a big time scene in a hotel lobby in Prague once. I thought that there was going to be a brawl.<BR><BR>I guess I get a little annoyed at this American bashing!<BR><BR>I saw some Americans and oh my God, they were wearing Nikes and wearing a Yankees baseball cap. OHHHH BOOO HOOO HOOO. How rude. That is what some of these posts sound like to me.<BR><BR>God bless the USA!<BR><BR>Orange( proud American) Sun<BR><BR>

He is fantastic for the FIRST time traveller because he mostly backbacks and stays at hostels and budget hotels.<BR>unfortunately, every place he mentions gets over run with Americans, which is still ok for th first time traveller.<BR>I prefer Rudy Maxa, I think the photography is better, the same places, more of the off beat sights, and hotels or b&bs more charming.There is room for both to appreciate.

Oh I know Steves is a first rate travel author and all. As I said, I have benefited from his books, web site and his TV series.<BR><BR>When I met him in Zurich, he seemed like a nice, easy going gentleman.<BR><BR>It is just that web page on his Graffiti board devoted to trashing some Americans that bothers me.<BR><BR>I was impressed with the way Steves handled himself when he was cornered in a Zurich hotel eleavtor . He was a polite gentleman all the way.

orangesun, I looked at the site, didn't find it. What's it listed as? <BR>The book that was called "The Ugly America", later made into a film I believe with Marlon Brando.<BR>The interesting thing is The Ugly American was the good guy.

I think it's called ugly American sighting. I could only stomach a few posts.<BR><BR>It is in the graffiti board.

Hi orangesun. I'm not sure I understand exactly what your criticism is. Is it the fact that some people who post there might perceive "ugly" in an aesthetic sense and bash Americans for how they look or what they're wearing? Or is it the fact that Steves provides *any* kind of a forum for people to talk about "ugliness" in a behavioral sense?<BR><BR>In the latter case, your issue would be with Steves, for providing that forum, but in the former case your issue would be with the individual posters who bash based on appearances, rather than obnoxious, or "ugly" behavior. <BR><BR>Personally, I don't fault Steves for providing that forum, along with the wide range of others his website provides. <BR><BR>There's no question that travelers from other countries can also be obnoxious while traveling. However, since I think Steves' services are used primarily by Americans, perhaps the intent -- successful or not -- of that forum is for us to hold up a mirror to ourselves.

You want to see American bashing? Go to the lonely planet, an Australian site, I believe.

I do have to say that I did some posters in that forum defend American travelers. I was pleased to see some people speaking up for Americans. One person said that most Americans are polite while traveling.<BR><BR>As I said, yes I have seen some nasty acting American travelers. I saw this one lady bang her fist on the check in desk demanding this and that.<BR><BR>However, I really do feel that most of us American travelers bend over backwards trying to be good ambassadors for the USA.<BR><BR>

P.S. In looking at the archived posts, the second one points out "This should be Ugly travelers sightings", not just Ugly American sightings, and this person goes on to note that he/she saw people of ALL nationalities behaving badly. <BR><BR>Anyway, I'd agree with that. I have no problem with people reporting examples of obnoxiousness, but perhaps the focus (or title) of the forum could be on the "ugliness" of all travelers, or people, not merely Americans. Americans have no patent on obnoxious behavior.

n reply to capo. It is not that I have a problem with Steves. He just provides the vehicle for people to post this. It seems to me that there is just too much bashing. I like Steves web site as well. I tried to make it clear that I found Steves services valuable. I just can not understand why there is an entire section devoted to this.<BR><BR>Capo, I think it is mostly how certain American travelers act rather than the aesthetics aspect of this. My point was that I have seen rude behavior coming from travelers from other countries as well. Not just rude behavior from Americans.

Perhaps most Americans do that now, go out of their way to be good representatives of the U.S., but I'm not sure that was always the case. <BR><BR>Certainly, in my personal experience, the vast majority of fellow Americans I've seen in Europe have been well-behaved. I can only recall a few incidences where they've made me cringe. <BR><BR>Another thought: doesn't *some* of what we perceive as rude behavior vary from country to country, or culture to culture? For example, in the UK, queueing is fairly well-observed (at least it was when I was last there), whereas in other countries it may be more acceptable to not wait in line, or at least not observer queueing quite as rigorously. <BR>

Since Rick Steves is American, and most of his customers and readers are also American, maybe it's considered more appropriate for us to "police" our own and our fellow Americans' behavior when abroad, rather than turn the forum into a vehicle for ridiculing and "bashing" the behavior of non-Americans. That can easily turn into something bordering on bigotry...<BR><BR>For myself, I am embarrassed when seeing an American behave in a gauche manner, just as one might be with a family member whose bad behavior might reflect on us. And just as with family, I might feel defensive upon hearing "American-bashing" from non-Americans, even if it's justified. <BR><BR>If it's a non-American being rude or demanding, it doesn't affect me that way, and might even relieve me when I see it's not an American. If I were honest, I might even say I get some secret amusement, or a feeling of superiority from it. But I'm not that honest.

Capo, I think the perceptions of rude behavior does vary from country to country.<BR><BR>When I travel to Switzerland and Germany, I wear my hiking boots and sometimes wear a pair of the dreaded white Nikes. I know that annoys some in this forum for people to wear Nikes.<BR><BR>A few years ago while in Switzerland, I saw this young woman wearing a pair of faded jeans, a pair of white running shoes and a Florida Gator shirt. Thinking she was American, I started a conversation. I found out that she was Swiss and had bought the Florida Gator shirt on a trip to Florida. So, Europeans do wear the dreaded white sneakers and sports shirts also. LOL<BR><BR>What really annoyed me was that she bought a Florida Gator shirt. ::major eyeroll:: Just kidding Gator fans. As a Tennessee Vol fan you could expect no less a reaction from me. :-)<BR><BR>Back to Steves, I did read several postings from people who pointed out that rude behavioe occurs from citizens from many nations. I was glad to read that.

orangesun, in scanning through the archives, I noticed a number of posts that pointed that out as well. One British guy though, had a perceptive comment. He said that because Americans come from (arguably) the most developed country in the world, they're likely to encounter things in other countries that they may feel are "substandard" and, therefore, may be a *bit* more prone to complain. <BR><BR>Dina, you said what I was trying to say -- about "policing" our own -- much better. Thanks. <BR><BR>Also, this is a tangent but your use of word gauche is a reminder of the historical prejudice against left-handed people. Both gauche (French for left) and sinister (Latin for left) have negative connotations, whereas droite (French for right) and dexter (Latin for right) have positive connotations, as in adroit and dexterous.

Well, I am right-handed, so I will try to avoid the terms gauche and sinister in my ongoing mission to become a fair-minded person and not disparage the under-privileged.

I too am offended by Americans bashing other Americans on the travel boards. Not only is it found on Rick Steves, but also here, on the AOL boards, and even in the Washington Post travel section. These criticisms come from self-hating Americans with inferiority complexes who think that Europeans are superior in every way, and want to prove to the world that they are better, classier, more cultured, a better dresser, than their fellow countrymen. I find it incredible distasteful - my mother taught me that putting down other people only makes ME look bad.

Is ANY criticism of Americans by Americans "self-hating" and indicative of an "inferiority complex" or a worship of all things European? Or is that a bit of exaggeration from someone who has the opposite perspective, an *excess* of national pride? I see an excess of pride (yes, there is such a thing) as more common, since Americans are taught since early childhood that our country is, in fact, superior in every way, and that most non-Americans wish they were us.<BR>Maybe what some of us call "Bashing" is just a way of taking us down a peg. <BR>If one really felt merely confident rather than bloated with pride, it wouldn't seem so outrageously insulting and infuriating---just an opinion we don't agree with.<BR>Yes, I am putting on my flame-proof undies now.

At least one of the respondents to this subject has reiterated what I have tried to tell people before: when Rick Steves, or any other well-known travel author or guidebook, recommends an "out-of-the-way" place, or a "little-known secret," or something of that ilk, you will always find that the place has already been mobbed by tourists, most of whom are American. Or you will find that it's so small, and so out-of-the-way for normal folks, that it doesn't fit your travel aspirations. The great thing about the Fodor's site, I think, is that individuals tell other individuals about personal experiences that haven't been published in millions of books or seen by millions on TV. Those are the little jewels that I treasure the most, finding the not-yet-mobbed little places that ordinary people somehow discover and enjoy.

I think that what people need to realize is that there are rude Americans and non-rude Americans. People act like that whether they are at home or abroad. Some people just feel that they have a sense of entitlement.<BR><BR>I was in Taco Bell yesterday and saw a very rude woman who complained for 10 minutes. She complained about everything (how slow the line was, how they hadn't given her everything she ordered, how the bag was too thin). If this woman was complaining in a place like Taco Bell, you know she's going to complain everywhere else.

Dina: I cetainly agree with your posting except for one sentence: "most non-Americans wish they were us". As a European, let me share my perspective on that. Most Europeans (surely western europeans) view their nation as ally and friend of the US, but not as their vassal. Debates, discussions, diverging opinions, are allowed between friends, it is even desirable. There are many aspects of the American society whch are considered as inspiring examples, and many other that are repulsive to Europeans. The US are certainly not viewed as a monolithic entity which is either all right or all wrong.<BR><BR>We however often notice an inclination on the American side to disregard any comment or criticism as solely motivated by envy or jealousy. However I never met anyone, in Europe, in all the circles where I am introduced, whether professional or private, who ever mentioned the project, or even the idea, of settling in the USA. This is never an issue in the press, it is never discussed as a topic in any conversation I have been part of. I doubt that Europeans form any substantial part of the current immigrations flows to the USA.