Potential return trip to Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina
 

I've been to all three countries before and am considering a return trip to see more, as soon as this spring perhaps. Most likely I'll be flying into Amsterdam initially so have to get down to and from the Balkans from/to there.

On my previous visit to Croatia, I saw Zagreb, Plitvice, Split, and Dubrovnik. I missed Istria, so this time I'm thinking of starting there (from Ljubljana), renting a car, and driving down into Dalmatia and then over into BiH and up to Sarajevo, then back to Zagreb to fly out.

I'm most interested in feedback on the Bosnia section - I drove to Mostar last time so I have half and idea what the drive is up to that point. It's hard to gauge driving distances - how much to drive per day. I know it's very hilly on the drive from Mostar to Sarajevo (I've read Julia_t's trip report among others.) I hate having to do long drives but it seems like the most practical way.

Here's the itinerary I've thrown together for 15 nights in late April-Early May that is one possibility on an award ticket:

Fly AMS to Venice, bus to Ljubljana

<b>Ljubljana</b> (3 nights) - day trips to Kamnik, perhaps elsewhere (I loved Ljubljana)

Train to Rijeka - pick up car? Or maybe bus down via Koper, pick up car somewhere in Croatia

<b>Rovinj</b> (3 nights) - explore Istria by car
<b>Rab</b> (1 night)
<b>Zadar</b> (2 nights)

Drive to Krka National Park, spend a few hours there.

<b>Sibinek</b> (1 night)

Drive to Sarajevo (3-6 hours it sounds like, including a few stops)

<b>Sarajevo</b> (2 nights)
<b>Travnik</b> (1 night)
<b>Jajce</b> (1 night)

I think that's 14 nights and I'll probably have 15, so I might add one somewhere...

Drive back to Zagreb
Fly Zagreb-AMS at 16:10 (so leaving Jajce in the morning should give me plenty of time)

Thoughts? I know this is before tourist season - but any idea how good of a time late April/Early May might be in Croatia on the northern coast? I'm expecting rain in Ljubljana...

Hi Andrew...Here's my 2008 trip report with photos on my website. Check out Chapters Eleven through Twenty-Three. It's all Croatia and Slovenia. I also hope to return some day.

http://travelswithmaitaitom.com/cent...e-venice-2008/

((H))

Thank you. That's a very nice report. I skipped down to Istria because I had been to all of those other places (but not in the same trip!). And then I got to the part about your cat and I stopped caring about your trip. :-(

I wouldn't try to pick up your rental in Rijeka - the traffic in that area can be a nightmare. Look at other options, e.g., Porec, Pazin, even Pula.

Thanks - was thinking Porec probably via Koper too. Whatever is easiest...

Train to Rijeka is an easy option and you will have no traffic problems at the time of year you are going.

Thank you!

There's some chance I might take buses/trains to get to Rovinj the first day and pick up the car the second day. It seems there are some rental agencies that will "deliver" car to you; otherwise I will probably pick it up in Porec. I may want to spend my first day exploring Rovinj and not bother with a car until I want to get out and explore some of the hill towns in Istria.

Bus to Rovinj would be good, bus to Pula also. www.buscroatia.com is one good site to look at.

I love this thread. It's given me lots of things to think about as I plan my trip. I'm looking forward to seeing how Andrew's itinerary develops.

(and maitaitom....I loved your trip report. I stayed up far too late last night trying to read the Slovenia and Croatian sections. Thank goodness I didn't check in on the earlier chapters or else I would have been up ALL night and been useless at work today.) (Sorry to hear about Cupid.)

One update: I looked more carefully at the estimated drive times from Google maps for the whole loop I mapped out from Rovinj down to Split and Mostar, up to Sarajevo, and back to Zagreb. 18 HOURS of driving!!! Wow, that's just way more than I want to do.

So as an alternative, I'm thinking of driving only from Rovinj to Split, dumping the car there, and taking buses/trains on to Sarajevo. There are several buses a day from Split to Mostar, and from there there are two trains a day up to Sarajevo. The trains are supposedly very old and not nice but the views breathtaking, on about a three hour trip. So that sounds pretty enticing.

And then fly from Sarajevo back to Amsterdam. It's more of a challenge to fly that way (no direct flights) and a little more expensive - I think I'll wind up taking a Lufthansa flight via Munich. I'm also toying with the idea of reversing the direction and starting in Sarajevo and ending in Ljubljana.

The car still seems to make sense from Rovinj to Split - about 9 hours of driving over several days. I actually drove part of this before (Zagreb to Dubrovnik mostly on the A1) and it was about the same driving time and pretty easy.

Yes, that would be better IMO

I'm not crazy about the long bus ride though I've done a few like that before. I may miss having a car from Mostar driving up to Sarajevo because I may want to pull over for pictures. But I hear the train doesn't always run very fast. I suppose I could rent a car in Mostar for a few days and return it in Sarajevo.

Are you planning to spend time in Rijeka? If not you can take the train from Ljubljana to Kanfanar, then a cab to Rovinj. Also, if you are staying in Rovinj you can pick the car up in Rovinj. No need to go to Porec to do that.

rialtogrl, it appears that direct trains start running between Ljubljana and Kanfanar only in late April. Depending on my final schedule, that may be too late for me. Otherwise, I would have to travel to Kanfanar with two connections.

There are direct trains from Ljubljana to Rijeka twice a day, and I could pick up a rental car there - that may wind up being easiest after all. It appears the Rijeka bus and train stations are no adjacent, so taking a bus from Rijeka to Rovinj isn't quite so simple. It looks like there's one fast bus a day from Ljubljana to Poreč that takes about the same time, but it only runs in the afternoon/evening. I think I'd rather travel in the morning, so Rijeka may be easier.

According to the bus website, there are two morning buses to Rovinj from Ljubljana, 07.10 and 09.30

Hey, Andrew. Since you said you've been to Ljubljana before and loved it, you might wanna join the Travel To Ljubljana Facebook group. Would be nice if you shared your experience there :) https://www.facebook.com/groups/722958401152341/

Andrew, then it makes sense to pick up a car in Rijeka. I've driven through a few times and never saw the bad traffic kja saw, but I never went through during a rush hour.

Kevina, can you post a link to the bus site you see direct buses on? Do those buses run in April?

Hi Andrew

My most recent trip was a longish driving route from Zagreb, south into Bosnia near Bihac, across to Jajce, then back up to the Croatian border via Banja Luka. I then drove all around the Zagorje area of Croatia north of Zagreb, along the Slovenian border to see the castles of Veliki Tabor and Trakoscan, up as far as Varazdin (all on minor roads) then back south to Zagreb.

I've not finished my trip report yet (!) but the Bosnian section is completed. I loved Jajce, and the road north towards Banja Luka was absolutely stunning. With your cameras and ability to take fabulous photos, you really shouldn't miss it.

Here's the link to the trip report (which also contains links to some very amateurish pics taken on my phone)...

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...t-explores.cfm

I had already visited Travnik (which was in my 2010 'off the beaten track in BiH' trip report) where the fortress high above the town, the pretty architecture and of course the Plava Voda are worth seeing.

Last October I did cover a lot of miles - somewhere around 550 - but never drove for more than 2 or 3 at a stretch. And half of those miles were in northern Croatia. I spent around 18-20 hours driving in total, but spread over 5 days didn't seem like it, and wasn't as bad as it sounds. I loved the freedom to stop as and when I wanted, and personally would have hated to be trapped with the time constraints of a bus or train, let alone actually being stuck on said mode of transport! I saw some adorably pretty villages, gorgeous baroque houses, ruined castles, stopped in roadside cafes for a coffee, never saw another English person, but I absolutely had a fabulous time. Do you know, I never even had the radio on or put a CD in - I spent the entire time in silence just admiring what I was seeing and soaking up the atmosphere of such beautiful sights all around me.

I think with your photographer's eye, you would be able to capture some wonderful pictures of this spectacular part of Europe. And I don't think you should miss it by getting on a plane to Amsterdam from Sarajevo.

Any more questions, just ask away...

Thanks, Julia! I don't know how I missed your Oct 2014 report when you posted it originally. Maybe I simply wasn't thinking about a Europe trip again at that point. Or maybe I read it quickly on a busy day.

I'll reconsider driving in BiH instead of flying back from Sarajevo. I'm thinking either way that I will wind up flying out of Zagreb at the end back to Amsterdam. It will turn out to be cheapest that way even if I take an early morning flight the same day from Sarajevo to Zagreb and spend half a day in Zagreb before the second flight (which would be KLM's only direct flight of the day, in late afternoon). That way, I can also decide to drive back to Zagreb something like originally planned above.

You did have a lot of rain on your trip, apparently. It didn't seem to bother you, but I'd be disappointed to have a lot of rain when trying to take pictures! (Some water on everything after a rain can really add to pictures, though, of course.) It could be I will keep my BiH portion of the trip flexible until near the end or even change it on the fly.

I'll definitely ask more questions after I nail down the BiH part - thank you!

BTW, you can take a bus instead of a train from Mostar to Sarajevo - better times and no tunnels. Click on my name for my Balkans TR.

Yes, the bus to Sarajevo would be much more convenient of course. But the point of the train - old and run down as it is known to be - is that the views are supposed to be spectacular. I've read more than one review of the ride describing it in the most glowing terms.

Taking the train (if I wind up not driving) would also require more planning and maybe even an overnight in Mostar - been there once, don't feel the need to spend another night - but it still might be worth it for the train ride.

Well, I thought the views from the bus were pretty good....

I'm sure the views are great from the bus, but I'm also planning to snap a few pictures if I can. I understand that the train windows open (I have been on a number of old trains like that in this region where the windows open) and that you can move around on the train and take pictures as you wish. I've done that before too. I even sold one of the pictures I shot somewhere on the train between Maribor and Celje, Slovenia.

I don't think I'd have the same flexibility to take pictures that way from a bus.

Of course, driving in my own car would give me the maximum flexibility. But I enjoy trains too, and I think I would miss not having that train experience. On the other hand, if it's pouring rain or something and photo ops would be limited I'd probably just take the bus.

I've also taken the bus from Sarajevo to Mostar and back again as I did it on a day trip on my second (non-driving) trip to Sarajevo, and wrote about the journey, my reasons for taking the bus v train, and impressions of the journey, views, etc

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...eturn-trip.cfm

Actually, there was no real rain on my October trip - just cloudy, grey, overcast days while I was in Bosnia. The weather was a lot better later in the week.

And if you do drive north from Sarajevo for an overnight in Travnik, try to detour to Kraljeva Sutjeska - you can read about this enchanting village, the home of medieval Bosnian kings, in the trip report linked above.

Rialtogrl, all information is on the bus website I have posted above.

Thank you Kevina! I see the 7.10 bus there (it does not come up on the Slovenia bus site.)
This is very helpful!

Andrew I may be renting a car and taking it to Rovinj from Ljubljana (about the same time you are traveling.) I will post if it seems like a reasonable drop off fee.)

Really? Maybe if it turns out to be the same day you could give me a lift to Rovinj? ;-) Not sure yet which day (or if you'd even want to) - would be 3rd week of April most likely...

I will go too late for you - April 27. But I will be in Slovenia from around the 22nd on, maybe we can get a drink!

If you end up going on April 27 let me know, I'd be happy to give you a lift. I am still not sure if I will keep my car - I need to call AutoEurope and ask them about the drop off fee. Its on my list of things to do this week.

Thanks, rialtogrl - I'll let you know if I'm in Ljubljana at that time! My plans aren't firm yet, however. I'm also considering spending my first few nights in Venice...or starting in Bosnia and doing my trip in the opposite direction. We'll see!

I may come up with a rainy weather option as well. I've been to Ljubljana twice, and the last time the single day there (2 nights) it poured rain all day. I understand rain is likely in April, and if it does rain I may not spend a whole lot more time in town again...

No worries, I will let you know what I find out from AutoEurope. I'll be in Venice too, 12th to the 20th. When I looked at a rate on AutoEurope for picking up in Italy and dropping in Croatia, it wasn't too bad, but the drop off fee was not included on the quote.

Have you checked out EconomyCarRentals.com ? Julia used them, and I've seen other mentions of them so they seem legit. While they seem not to let you drop a car in a different country (but you can drop in a different part of the country, one way), the rates seem ridiculously cheap. In other words, you may pay a whole lot less taking public transportation to Croatia vs. picking up the car in Italy and Slovenia. When comparing prices, I'd probably use EconomyCarRentals and other budget sites for comparison.

For example, I'm getting a quote for an eleven day rental from Rovinj to Zagreb for just under $150 USD TOTAL including everything! That's for an economy car, too larger than a "mini." I'm probably going to sign up for American Express Premium Car Rental Protection - a flat rate of $24.95 per rental. I used it on my last trips over there a few years ago, and while I didn't need to use the coverage, I've read good things from others who have ($0 deductible for damage for example).

thanks Andrew - I have check out EconomyCarRental before but I have never used them. That IS a really great rate!

I would be very surprised if you get a reasonable drop off rate for picking up a car in Slovenia and dropping it off in Croatia. Positives for the bus route are good roads and coaches.

<<The trains are supposedly very old and not nice but the views breathtaking, on about a three hour trip. So that sounds pretty enticing.>>
This is an accurate description of the train trip between Sarajevo and Mostar as we experienced it a few years ago. Really it is a beautiful trip and you would see much more from the train than from driving a car. Lots of tunnels either way. If you are a train buff, you will be impressed with the engineering feats involved in building the line.

I wrote a long TR of our first visit to Sarajevo in 2010

Thanks, Vttraveler! I will check it out when I plan the Sarajevo part of my trip.

I've been mulling over this itinerary I proposed. Although it still seems like a lot of driving for two weeks, I'm thinking what really matters is how difficult or stressful the drives are every day and not how long they are. Nothing could have been easier a few years ago than driving on the A1 highway in Croatia, so a few hours on that should be nothing especially in April. On two lane roads in BiH I might want to plan for shorter driving days with more breaks.

One change I think I'll make is to skip Rab. Although Rab Town looks like a neat place, I've read that the drive down to Rab via the coastal road from Rijeka is not particularly amazing for scenery nor is it a fast road. Looks like I could save a few hours by bypassing the whole Kvarner Gulf area and going from Istria right to Zadar via the fast highways. But I'll try to be flexible and see how I feel.

I might also make do with a single night in Zadar, after an easy drive down from Istria.

So that would give me an extra two nights. Not sure what to do with them yet. In Slovenia, Logarska Dolina has been on my radar on past trips but I never made it out there. I'm expecting rainy weather in Ljubljana in April, but if by chance I luck into nice, sunny weather in Slovenia, maybe I'll rent a car up there for a few extra days and return it down in Koper or nearby, bus down to Rovinj, and pick up another car there.

IME, the roads in Istria are NOT like the A1. The ones I drove on were mostly narrow, twisty things with limited sight-lines and crazy drivers.

"the drive down to Rab via the coastal road from Rijeka is not particularly amazing for scenery" -- true, but I thought it fascinating to see the barren, wind-swept eastern sides of those islands!

Exactly - that's why I'd skip some of them and hop on the A1 as soon as possible on the day of departure heading south. I imagine I'll have a day of just exploring the hill towns while staying in Rovinj and will have some narrow roads - that's OK. But I don't want every day to be like that.

Andrew, Kevina was 100% spot on, renting a car in Italy and dropping it off in Croatia is crazy expensive due to the drop off fee. I'll probably end up renting in Trieste and bringing the car back to Trieste then taking the bus to Rovinj. We'll have to compare notes later as to how we worked all this stuff out!

<< I'm thinking what really matters is how difficult or stressful the drives are every day and not how long they are>>

Regarding my October road trip, I was on minor roads moast of the time and didn't find it stressful at all. And remember, I was on the wrong side of the road and the wrong side of the car! Well, OK, perhaps picking up the rental car in the centre of Zagreb city wasn't perhaps the brightest idea I've ever had, talk about baptism of fire! But the rest of it was absolutely fine.

The thing is, there is remarkably little traffic on the roads. The roads themselves are well-maintained with few bumps, potholes, etc. Signage is pretty good. The most traffic you will encounter in Bosnia will be on the main road from Mostar to Sarajevo. From Sarajevo to Travnik and on to Jajce, Banja Luka and the border, not nearly so much.

I tell you, I loved the drive from Jajce to Banja Luka. It was through the deep gorge of the River Vrbas, through tunnels and along the river banks. Some places the river was wide and calm, at others barrow with rapids, and here they hold national white-water rafting competitions. It was spectacular scenery the entire way along.

And Banja Luka itself was a nice little town. I was only there a couple of hours passing through, but the old castle with a riverside restaurant tucked away in the ruined walls was worth a visit.

Thanks, Julia! I picked up a car in Zagreb too on my last trip to Croatia, but luckily it was on a Sunday morning, when there was no traffic, so it was very easy driving out of the city.

By "stressful" driving I mean hours driving along sometimes narrow roads, sometimes stuck behind slow trucks, trying to find a place to pass, etc., not necessarily being stuck in heavy traffic. I rented a car in Czech Republic for a few days on a trip in 2012, and while driving there was easy (Moravia and Southern Bohemia), it became kind of a drag by the final day. Part of the problem was poor planning on my part - too many excursion drives that probably should have been grouped together or even avoided. The cumulative effect after a few days was that I was more than ready to drop off the car at the end.

Maybe I'll mostly park the car in Sarajevo for a day or two while I explore the city and take a break from driving. Either way, I have a feeling I'll be ready to drop the car in Zagreb at the end.

I just got the latest edition (almost two years old already) of Tim Clancy's Bradt guide for BiH. Jajce looks amazing. Banja Luka doesn't sound amazing despite your praise for it, but it is a convenient place to stop before Zagreb anyway.