Mugged in Spain
 

My son is traveling in Madrid and was mugged this PM by some young thugs. Unknowingly to him, they apparently hit him with something that broke the skin on his back. Although, he didn't think he was hit that hard, it apparently broke the skin and left a sore. Anyone familiar with this type of robbery?

No, but sorry this happened to him. Hope he's ok.

Sanderson, muggings can happen anywhere but I am so sorry this happened to your son. Is he alright? And did they get any of his personal belongings? If he is having a problem with the sore I hope he will get some memdical attention. Best wishes to both of you..I hate it when a loved one has a problem and they are so far away. Best regards.

The same thing happened to me last month on my first night in Madrid. I was knocked to the ground resisting a robbery. I still have pain in my back from the assault.

Is it gangs that are doing this type of muggings in Madrid? Gary, hope you are alright..what a miserable thing to happen while on a trip.

Add another good reason to avoid Madrid.

sanderson- I am so sorry that your son went through that. Mugging is so stressful and disheartening. I have never been hit before, but once my bag was ripped from my shoulder (it was crossed over my chest and they just yanked it really hard), leaving a really big rope burn on my neck.

There are lots of different kinds of robberies. Some are the kind you don't feel or notice and those are the most common. Then there are the ones where they hit and stun you, then take what they want. Then there are the more violent ones that use knives or guns (the latter not so common in Spain, the former, though, happen for sure) to force you to give up what you have. And I am sure I have missed a few things, but that is a basic breakdown.

Unfortunately, men are more commonly targeted with violence as the thieves want to stun them so they won't react.

NorthShore- word!

Yes, there are gangs. Mostly south american gangs, eastern european ones specialize more in house robberies (or shops, crashing with a car into the windows is a "good" method ...).

There is a south american gang that operates in the area of Puerta del Sol. One of them will go near the victim (usually a man), and burn him in the neck with a cigarette. Then, when the victim moves his hand to the burnt place to check what happens, another thief will get the victim´s valuables.

One of my colleagues, a serbian man in his fifties, was one of his victims a couple of months ago. What they hadn´t realized is that his victim had been 5 years in the yugoslavian army, and was quicker and bigger than them. He grabbed the hand burning him and also grabbed the man trying to steal from him, and literally dragged them to the nearest police van (there is usually a police van in the area since they closed the police station in the metro).

Talking about that, my friend says that he wouldn´t recommend anyone to react as he did. He knows it was instictive, but you never know how violent are they going to be, and they are far more violent with men, specially of they look like tourists (because you are going to be nervous, and wanting to continue your holidays, and you won´t have a clue about what to do ...)

But I´d also like to remind something : precaution ... Two Sundays ago I went to the Teatro Español in the Santa Ana square. If you have been to Madrid, you will know that it is full of outdoor cafes and that it is a great place to taste some beer and some tapas. Well, before the theatre and afterwards we had a couple of beers at Miau and the Cerveceria Alemana, and we counted at least 5 handbags and camera bags left on their own on a chair, with the owner wandering inside the bars or simply forgetting about them. All of them belonged to tourists, the spaniards were all carrying crossed handbags and kept at least one hand on them. It was too tempting to describe ... Never leave your handbag unattended, please. Don´t do it easier for the thieves, they are good enough ;)

Kind regards, Cova

NorthShore: What makes you so sarcastic and judgemental??????

>> Talking about that, my friend says that he wouldn´t recommend anyone to react as he did. He knows it was instictive, but you never know how violent are they going to be <<

But they never know how you're going to react, or whether you have trained your instincts or not, or how violent you may be...

Sorry about your son's attack. You must be worried.

European cities are generally safe but violent crime can and does happen. I was mugged by three men in Brussels.

Make sure your son sees a pharmacist; if they recommend he see a doctor, tell him to take that recommendation seriously.

Also, please don't let ANYONE make your son feel guilty or that in some way he deserved to be attacked because he's a traveler--hopefully, we'll get none of that rubbish here about being "more aware" or "not looking like a tourist" as an excuse for the attack (and I am NOT referring to Cova's post above, the advice about not leaving one's bag unattended is very sensible).

Hi Btilke,

I was thinking mostly of that. It was really surprising to see the handbags (and specially two very expensive Canon cameras) left so carelessly on the chairs or on the tables. In fact, in one of the cases the waiter went after the owner of the camera, who kept leaving it in the table.

Also, that thing about looking like a local ... many of the muggings occur on areas heavily populated with popular departments stores, and the victims are local people out on a saturday shopping spree. You can really be robbed any place ... an acquaintance of mine was robbed inside the austrian Economy Ministery, on her way to a meeting with the minister ...

Princessofpenguins, my friend was very lucky. He reacted quick, and his attackers didn´t carry any knife. Now, if they had been carrying any weapon, the result would have been very different for him. I know it sounds awful, but the two recommendations given by the spanish police in case of assault are : if you can, run away as fast as you can ... if not, don´t try to resist (specially now that there are more violent bands around, quite different to the traditional pickpocketing ...).

Rgds, Cova

cova - I agree with run away as fast as you can. I do not agree with not resisting though, especially when there is no visible weapon.

It is especially important for women to resist. Women are actually *less likely* to get hurt in an attack and come out of it better psychologically if they resist. And if you do resist, your attackers do not know if you are trained or not... they want easy money, or your body, not a fight...

About awareness of surroundings - while there is no excuse for attacking anyone at all, clueless of surroundings or not, attacks happen. And there are behaviors that make you more likely or less likely to be attacked, and being aware of your surroundings is one of the ways to avoid an attack.

It is very easy to be in a new place and still aware of your surroundings. From what I observe in people, people who are not aware of their surroundings in new places are often those who are equally unaware/lax in familiar settings.

Also, sort of paraphrasing what I said... from research:

"Research/profiling seems to indicate that if an attacker is likely to batter or stab, it will happen whether resistance is given or not."

"Very few who do resist get badly battered or cut."

Resistance is not futile.

Sanderson1, I am so sorry to hear about your son's mugging.

Cova, or anyone familiar with Madrid, I am going to be in Madrid for one night next month. While realizing such things can happen anywhere, I wonder whether there are areas where this type of attack is more common than others. Cova mentioned Puerta del Sol. Are there other sections of the city with a regular gang presence? Do attacks occur only after dark, or also during the day? Are people usually targeted when they are alone?

HI sanderson--SO sorry, I can imagine that you would be worried. Please insist that he see a doctor to consult about the wound.

I can't really speak for all of Madrid, but I would advise being very cautious late at night in the Chueca area, especially if alone. There are sections of street fenced off for construction and you have to walk around. There are guys lurking there around the corners. Once you're there, you kind of trapped. I know enough not to carry a wallet in this situation. I carry everything I need in an ankle moneybelt. I guess they got back at me for not being able to get anything. It was hard to avoid this area because my hostal was right around the corner. The same thing almost happened a second time a few nights later, but I avoided it. The owner of my pension blamed all the violence on immigrants.

Even though this experience understandably made me kind of paranoid the rest of the trip, I didn't detect the same kind of menace in Granada, Cordoba and Sevilla. Nothing can ruin the thrill of being in Spain, however, the the Spanish people are wonderful.

ok. you can be mugged anywhere in the world. it's just really, really unlucky that they went for you and no some other chump. you were there, thats all. a friend of mine here in madrid got mugged at knife point by two guys one night, but he was really,really drunk and lived in a bad neighbourhood ( calle ballesta, near gran via, best avoided) another friend was set upon by two young kids in calle montera ( again best avoided, prostitution, although there is a police presence, best be careful) , they punched him from behind and gave him hassle,agai, he was kinda drunk and it was bout 6am. all they got was a pack of cigarretes out his pocket. most muggings are of the kind that you dont notice happening. its true, certain types will look for those who are tourists and who seem like prey to them. its all about of being aware of where you are. for my humble opinion, i feel safer here in madrid than when i lived in the uk. i would recomend, sanderson, that your son goes to the police, if he hasnt done so already, a lot of people dont bother reporting this things. your son would incredibly unlucky if this were to happen to him again. madrid is not a dangerous city. there are places best avoided, like some of gran vias's side streets but, madrid is not a dangerous place. really

I am traveling to Spain for two weeks in October. The tour books are filled with cautions about most of the Spanish cities. Even when visiting Ronda you are advised to be careful of gangs in the ruins of the Baths.

I have been in Paris and Italy and have been pick pocked by Gypsy children in broad daylight in Rome (and I am a muscular guy). It was not the greatest experience but it certainly did not ruin my trip. Being mugged would really affect me. I can see why you would be upset.

Where and when did this exactly happen? Any other tips from travelers on how to avoid these situations?

I can well understand the original poster's distress over this situation. However, I also agree with InMiami that unless this is simply a vent or a rant it would be really helpful to know where the victim was at the time, what the circumstances were, etc. Otherwise it becomes something to feel sorry about but of little other use since most of us already know things like this happen all the time and not just in Spain.

I am sorry to hear that. I hope your son is feeling better.

I think muggings are commonplace in many areas....

Northshore---I don't think one would ignore an entire area because there is crime...

many could say the same thing about visiting NYC or any urban area...

Now traveling to a known warzone would be an entirely different topic altogether

In any city, there are places that are less safe than others. Messages in this thread have mentioned Puerta del Sol, Chueca and the Gran Via area as places that are best avoided.

On the other hand, one poster (who I think is Spanish) mentioned that tourists have left handbags and expensive cameras unattended on the Plaza Santa Ana and have not had them stolen. So evidently the Plaza Santa Ana is in a safe area in Madrid.

My guidebook to Spain pointed out these unsafe and safe areas in Madrid and similar areas in other Spanish cities. I've planned accordingly and have never had any difficulty.

This is not a new happening. We were mugged while en route from the Plaza del Sol to the Plaza Major (sp?) after dinner one evening about 11:30 PM.

Two young fellows snatched my purse and knocked my husband down. He bounced back up (he's a nidan in Aikido) and they ran like heck down the road.

This was more than twenty years ago.

I don't think Cova was saying that Plaza Santa Ana is safe or not, just that it is not advisable in any place to do what the people there was doing, leaving their belongings unattended. It can be the safest place in the world, and you can be left without your purse acting that way !

The OP's story reminds me of one of the more traumatic travel experiences I had as a child in Rome. While I was scampering ahead of my father and grandmother, they were crossing the street and thugs on motorcycles drove past and grabbed my grandmother's purse. (Sadly, my father had taken notice of the thugs before as they seemed to be circling the square looking for targets.) She refused to let go and was dragged a bit resulting in her fracturing her wrist. The Italian authorities were mostly useless. They provided little asisstance and my grandmother was not given medical aid. We wound up getting an emergency flight back home with my grandmother's arm in a sling with ice bags. Although this experience hasn't deterred me from wanting to go back to Italy (we missed Venice because of those SOBs!!), it has made me more aware of security and the need for good travel insurance, including medical evacuation services. I've also made sure over the years to be aware of the location of US embassies and consulates. I don't think my father knew who to turn to for help and the authorities, sadly, didn't provide any. The exact opposite occurred in London this past winter. My mother became very ill and had to receive emergency medical care. She received immediate attention and we walked out without paying a dime. I'm curious what the OP's son found in way of assistance from the police and/or medical staff in Spain.

Eloise, I mentioned the people leaving unattended handbags in Plaza Santa Ana not because it is an specially safe area, but because they were lucky that the waiters took care of their valuables.

Last December, sitting inside the cafe Miau in Plaza Santa Ana, a friend of mine grabbed a woman´s hand while she was trying to pickpocket an unsuspecting tourist handbag. She had left it hanging in the back of the chair, and my friend noticed something strange from the corner of his eye. The woman managed to run away, but empty-handed. The owner of the cafe explained us that she was part of a group of two women and a men, well-dressed, that used to "work" in the area. The only thing they can do is throwing them out as soon as they see them.

Bad areas ... I think someone mentioned the Ballesta and the Montera streets. I´d say some of the streets between Puerta del Sol and Gran Via are not really nice. Going out at night I, as a woman, feel safer in the Chueca and Malasaña area. Plenty of small bars and clubs and restaurants. On the other side, the discos and clubs in the Azca area are a no-no for me, mainly because many of the southamerican gangs ( maras and ñetas ) congregate there, and there are fights every weekend. Also, the area in the Castellana around Cuzco is not so nice late at night. A lot of night-ladies there ...

Regarding pickpockets, I´d say any place with lots of people, so right now ... the queues for the Picasso exhibition at the Prado and the Reina Sofia ;)

Rgds, Cova

I wrote about it as an example of carelessness, and I think that Btilke understood me pretty well.

Cova,

I did realize that you mentioned the Plaza Santa Ana in the context of a warning against carelessness, and you are, of course, perfectly right that no area is safe if one is careless.

But the Plaza Santa Ana is a much safer place than the Puerta del Sol. That is all I meant to point out.

Eloise, I don't agree with that. At night, Plaza Santa Ana surroundings are full of people going to pubs, bars..and where there are such amount of people ...there are muggers and pickpockets. I've been in a traffic jam there at 4 AM and I don't feel there safer (or unsafe) than in Gran Via or Puerta del Sol or Piccadilly Circus :)

Hi, All,

Does anyone know how safe the area between Jardines Lepanto and the Opera is? We rented an apartment on Calle de Santa Clara, for end of June, staying with two teenage daughters. How does it rate relative to the "less desirable" areas mentioned above?

Any info is greatly appreciated.


-e

After nearly 30 very interesting/diversed responses, wouldn't it be interesting to hear from sanderson1?

Kenderina,

I've stayed twice at the Reina Victoria (now a Hard Rock Hotel, I understand...) on Plaza Santa Ana and never felt unsafe. But I was not out there at 4:00 a.m. I'm not normally out at 4:00 a.m. in my own city, which is one of the safest in North America.

I can't help it, but I feel that any RESPONSIBLE government would post some undercover cops and some video cameras around public tourist areas or squares that are known to be unsafe. Just a few undercover police would soon spot the troublemakers and follow them to arrest them or encourage them to stop their game or go to less tourist inhabited areas. This applies for Rome, Paris and apparently Madrid. It seems to me that some European cities just don't care to protect the tourists.

As for the comment about NYC, the crime rate is now quite low and what crime does exist is generally not in tourist areas.

In all fairness, mikey, we do not all have the kinds of lives or jobs that allow us to check-in at various times during the day. He/she may only be able to access computer in evening....

I'm willing to wait.

gforaker, I suppose these governments had to care first for their own citizens..and security issues are not only a tourist thing.

I concur---all countries have issues with crime, be it against tourists or natives.

I concur---all countries have issues with crime, be it against tourists or natives

True, but Spain seems to have more than its share of crime issues.

My relative was also mugged in Madrid - near Atocha train station about 8am on a Sunday morning. She was knocked down and bruised as the thieve tried to get her day pack off her back and she was trying to get it off so he could take it - a very ugly scene that lasted about a minute and nearby shopkeepers opening up stood by and watched. I've heard many credible reports of muggings in Barcelona and Madrid - including now those in this post who have been mugged. Anyone who says it isn't a problem apparently isn't the average tourist. while i don't say avoid these cities i say be careful of anyone coming up to you and don't wear expensive jewelry, carry cameras around your neck, etc.
There is and has been for several years a serious problem in these two cities and why the local authorities don't do something about it is a mystery to me.