London, york and ??? With tweens
 

We're flying in and out of Gatwick in April. The kiddos are 10 and 14. I want to spend 4 nights in London and 2 nights in York. That leaves 3 nights for somewhere else and I'm trying to figure out where. I was thinking Oxford area, Cotswolds....any advice from experiences with your kids/ grandkids? What did they like best (besides London and York)? Thanks in advance!

Harry Potter World?

Looks like your first post on Fodor's; welcome!

Are you relying on trains or would you be willing to rent a car for a day or two?

If it was me I'd probably stick to the east coast and after York consider doing a tour of the northeast that includes Durham, Hadrian's wall, and possibly the Northumberland coast - Alnwick (particularly if the kids are Harry Potter fans) and Bamburgh (fab castle) and maybe the Holy Island of Lindisfarne. You could pick up the car in York and drop it back in Newcastle or Durham, or even Edinburgh, like this - https://goo.gl/maps/S1WryRvcE6z

We can rent a cat. Thanks gardyloo! I was thinking about this and couldn't decide if we should home base in York and do these as day trips or spend the night somewhere on the coast possibly?

Could go by train - York then Edinburgh which has lots for kids to like and fly home from there - check www.nationalrail.co.uk for cheap fares - www.seat61.com has adroit advice on booking your own discounted tickets; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

First question -- is this your/the kid's first time in London? If so 4 nights is very short. Especially since the first day or so some or all of you could be jet lagged.

With 9 nights I'd maybe suggest 6 (5 minimum) in London and 3 in York. Use York as a base with a car for a couple of days to see the Dales/Moors and/or Durham and/o the coast. Do Oxford as a day trip from London by train.

Since you are flying in to LGW, you can take the train from the airport to Kings Cross/St Pancras and then a fast train to York. Get over the jet lag car-less in York Explore the city on day 2, then on day 3 collect a car to explore the area. Drop the car Back in York (or in Newcastle if you go as far a Hadrian's Wall). Then take the train down to London for the last 5 or 6 nights so you will be there to catch the flight home.

Since you are flying in to LGW, you can take the train from the airport to Kings Cross/St Pancras and then a fast train to York.>

If getting discounted ticket at www.nationalrail.co.uk they are train-specific and non-changeable non-refundable I believe so if doing so with flight leave plenty of extra time between train and plane in case plane is late, long lines at Immigration, etc. But you can save a ton - check out platform 9 1/2 (?) at Kings Cross if kids into Harry Potter. Just buy Gatwick to Kings Cross ticket at Gatwick Airport -buy a return ticket if going to London as you can then use it to get 2 for 1 at many paying attractions in London.

>>9 1/2<< That would be 9 3/4 (and there is virtually always a queue).

With 9 nights, you really could just stay in London with a couple day trips, like to Oxford and somewhere else.

Travel takes twice as long as you think (traffic, packing, parking, public transport details, etc., etc.). I do get the desire to see more though.

When I was in London in June with students, the line to take photos at Platform 9 3/4 was over an hour; they contented themselves with shopping right next door and snapping the pix that could be taken without standing in the queue. It's worth a look,though, so definitely go, just either plan to take possibly a LLLOONNNGG time or prepare them to maybe not stand in line if it's long but still see the platform and take what pics you can.

I went to Alnwick by myself on a daytrip from Edinburgh; it was absolutely wonderful and would have been even more so if I'd had kids! But it will take a chunk of time to get there from wherever.

janisj's suggestion has merit. Or maybe 4 nights in York, 5 in London. That might give you time for Alnwick from there.

My students (older than your kids, but still kids) loved Hadrian's Wall, so if you are willing to drive, that's worth a day.

I'm not doing the maths or mapping, so don't know what you can actually fit in. Just remember to allow LOTS of time for travel; in the UK, we have found doubling the travel time by car suggested by mapping apps leaves some margin for error. And there's the time for getting car, parking car, returning car, etc. If using public transport, remember to allow all that extra time for getting to and from stations, any ticket-getting and security to get through, etc., etc.

Whatever you do, it will be great and leave you repining for all the stuff you didn't get to! Just be realistic in the planning about jet-lag, walking fatigue, and all the travel logistics.

What are the kids expectations of the holiday - it is important to involve them in the discussions. There is no point in suggesting Harry Potter stuff if that would leave them yawning. Ditto castles if they hate the thought of history and 'boring old castles...'

Public transport security, only really an issue if you are taking a train to Paris. But access to some museums (normally free) will include a security check.

York is a great base, if you decide to hire a car for this leg you'll need a hotel with parking, which is a bit constrained if you decide to stay in the old centre (i would) just include "parking" in your various searches.

Driving around York. York (new city) is held within a ring road, the version to the north can be very slow to move while that to the south is always free moving.

In York itself great thing for adults and kids is the National Railway Museum right near the neat old curved York train station - great especially for your kids - royal trains - old steam locos and lots of hands-on stuff:

http://www.nrm.org.uk/

And it's free (last I knew)

https://www.fodors.com/community/eur...mment-10160003
**We can rent a cat.**
I hope it is a Jaguar XF Sportbrake.��
Gender and likes/dislikes of the children have not been disclosed.
Near to York:
National Coal Mining Museum; Free entry. https://www.ncm.org.uk/
Eden Camp http://www.edencamp.co.uk/
Stump Cross Caverns http://www.stumpcrosscaverns.co.uk/

Thanks janisj and palenq. My only concern is buying the train ticket to York. If our flight is delayed any we could miss our train. Any ideas how long it will take us to get thru customs, baggage at Gatwick? We're coming from the US. Our flight arrives at noon.
My kids and hubby first time to England. I was in London 20 years ago. We've traveled internationally before. I like the idea of hitting London at the end of our trip when we're at full stride :)

Cat! oops my bad. Thanks for the link riberascara! My tastes and the kids are actually pretty similar. We like museums , history, food and bring outside. We are also very active. At home we're're actually more country mice than city. Although we all LOVE european cities. I'm liking the 4 nights in York (and surrounding area)and 5 in London. Maybe from Gatwick we can train to Cambridge (cheaper ticket if our flight odd delayed) spend one night and then continue on to York via train.

Thank you for putting up with my typos! I'm doing this from my phone in a car. Don't worry - I'm not driving!

with a noon arrival (I was assuming early AM since the majority of flights from NA arrive earlier) I might re-think going straight to York. By the time you get through immigration and travel in to London and catch the train to York it will be most likely late afternoon. And early evening by the time you get to York.

Here is a crazy idea: Fly from LGW to EDI - it is less than a 90 minute flight. Stay two nights in Edinburgh, pick up a car and drive down to York via Hadrian's Wall. This will be approx 5 hours drive time so basically all day with stops Hadrian's Wall and/or Durham. Stay two nights in York (You can turn in the car after arriving in York). Train to London - stay 5 nights. fly home.

I'd book the flight for approx 3 hours after your arrival.

great idea from Janis!

If you don't go with Janisj's not so crazy idea (I've done that itinerary) I like the idea to split your time between York and London and planning some day trips. Look for a copy of Shadows on the Wall by Phyllis Reynolds Naylor for the kids to read before you arrive in York. It's a compelling teen novel that brings out York's history.

With four of you a car service from Gatwick might not be out of line. The driver will wait for you if you are delayed and door to door service should take about the same time as two trains and a taxi at the end.

I absolutely endorse janisj's idea. Edinburgh is a much easier place to work off some time change and jetlag, and in April it won't be very expensive. Flights from Gatwick to EDI are US$85 or less, and there are several flights daily, including at least four that would depart at a time that would make connecting easy. At that price you might find it competitive with taxis and trains, and lots easier.

Two nights in Edinburgh, drive down the A1 past Holy Island and Bamburgh to Alnwick for the night, the next day drive to Durham for a couple of hours and/or Hadrian's wall, and overnight in York, having dropped the car.

Ending in London is lots easier than starting there; you'll have your bearings and probably more energy compared to walking around in a jet-lagged daze for a day or two.

You might consider staying close to the airport at Edinburgh and take the tram into town for your sightseeing. If you get a car, you'll want to do it at the airport anyway, and Edinburgh is compact enough that you can see lots in a day or two using the tram, buses and feet. Then when it's time to drive south you can use the city bypass to get to the A1.

>>With four of you a car service from Gatwick might not be out of line. The driver will wait for you if you are delayed and door to door service should take about the same time as two trains and a taxi at the end.<<

Can't agree w/ that. A car service from LGW to Kings Cross would take FOREVER. And there wouldn't be two trains nor a taxi -- one can take a train directly from LGW to KingX/St Pancras with no changes.

But IMO that would still be more hassle than just flying north straightaway

Janisj, I did not make that clear; car service from Gatwick to York if that is the OP's first destination after arrival. The two trains included one into London, another from London to York and a taxi to hotel in York. A car service can pick the family up at Gatwick and deposit them at their hotel in York. With four people and luggage a car service could simplify arrival for them.

>>Janisj, I did not make that clear; car service from Gatwick to York <<

Oh -- I'd never imagine you meant a car service all the way to York. That is one loooooong haul. A five hour drive on a good day.

A car from Gatwick to York would cost at least £400 and would take forever, especially with a trip round a good portion of the M25. Flights to Edinburgh would take a lot less time if you're already at Gatwick and cost about the same or less for a one way ticket.

Hadrian's Wall is better seen from the Carlisle side, where the fortifications are better preserved, i.e. Birdoswald, so this takes you off your route down the East Coast.

>>Hadrian's Wall is better seen from the Carlisle side,<<

For just the wall maybe, but if they go down the east side and detour over as far as say Housteads/Vindolanda they can see a lot of the Wall and a great fort or two and still have a reasonable drive to York.

Or as Gardyloo suggests make it a two day drive and see Alnwick/Bamburgh too.

That leaves 3 nights for somewhere else and I'm trying to figure out where. I was thinking Oxford area>

3 days rent car in York and drive over to Stratford-on-Avon and force the tweens to learn about Shakespeare! Hit Warwick Castle en route and drive through Cotswolds to Oxford, return car and train back to London?

York has more than enough to fill a week's visit. Some world Unesco centres and three major art galleries (one being a large open air park with interactive art), then stuff like Robin Hoods bay etc

there are actually 4 counties in Yorkshire so heaps of smaller area websites but this is a good place to start

https://www.yorkshire.com/

I beg to differ from Rubicund...

The best bit of Hadrians Wall is the central section - from Housesteads west to Steel Rigg car park, or even Cawfields car park. This is the section of stone wall which roller coasts along the top of the whin sill ridge with fantastic views in all directions. All the pictures of the wall are from this section. Birdoswald Fort is nowhere near as impressive as Housesteads. Also the wall to the west of Birdoswald was built of wood and all that is left is the turf bank. Views aren't as good either.
If time allows you can also go for a walk along the wall west from Housesteads fort to a milecastle and back.

Naw PalenQ, Warwick Castle is a big theme park now run by the people who own Madame Tussauds. It's not cheap either with adult tickets costing £36 and children £33....

Try nearby Kennilworth Castle instead. This belonged to Robert Dudley, Earl of Leicester, a favourite of Elizabeth I. He spent a fortune modernising the castle in anticipation of a visit by the queen in the hope of wooing her... It didn't work!
http://www.english-heritage.org.uk/v...E&gclsrc=aw.ds

Wow Warwick Castle allowed to deteriorate into that?

https://www.warwick-castle.com/plan/...et-prices.aspx

Guess castle and dungeon are two separate things - kids may like the dungeon? But the old castle is separate. But 36 quid?

>>Wow Warwick Castle allowed to deteriorate into that?<<

Mme Tussauds has owned Warwick for at least 20+ years - probably 30. So unless you last visited in the 70's, they owned it when you were there. The Dungeon is not 'separate' - it is in the castle. You need to pay extra to enter and see the live actors/animatronincs bits - just like paying extra in a museum for a 'special exhibition. (it is not the original dungeon which is still there too).

No need at ALL to go into the Dungeon -- the rest of the castle and grounds are well worth it

Wow wow - always thought Britain was so so whatever at preserving historical monuments' integrity - this makes it sound kind of cheesy. Thanks for edifying me.

Have I missed something? I just checked Warwick Castle website and an adult ticket for both castle and dungeon costs £ 23 not 36 quid.

While I wish that both Leeds Castle and Warwick Castle had somehow been taken over by the National Trust or English Heritage rather than their present owners/ operators, I have visited Warwick Castle within the last 20 years and, although, there is certainly a lot of additions which might be considered Disneylandish, it is still great for kids and a good introduction to medieval and castle life.

PQ -- aren't I <i>always</i> 'edifying' you???

They have done nothing to harm Warwick Castle -- they have not changed any of the historic buildings or rooms.

Naw PalenQ, Warwick Castle is a big theme park now run by the people who own Madame Tussauds. It's not cheap either with adult tickets costing £36 and children £33....>

They have done nothing to harm Warwick Castle -- they have not changed any of the historic buildings or rooms.>

2 differing opinions about that.

Yes you edify me and many others with your amazing (sincerely) encyclopedic knowledge of everything British. Cheers!

It is not a theme park -- it has some 'family fun' attractions that were added. If one wants to do that sort of thing it is there but they are easily avoided.

BUT the castle itself/the walls/ etc has not been touched <u>in any way</u>. They couldn't even IF they wanted to -- being a protected bldg.



Yes, I do tend to post about places I've been this millennium . . .

Yes, I do tend to post about places I've been this millennium . . .>

I traveled Britain at least once a year for decades until 2012 - (this millenium BTW) and led group tours and researched and wrote in-depth articles on just about every British place of touristic interest. I am well equipped to make general comments on many things without getting specific - like I just said Warwick Castle and that's it (it being one of the most visited English castles). And despite your continual snarky comments will continue to do so.

Cheers!

I agree the walls and keep haven't been touched and still stand proud (there are good views of the outside of the castle from Mill Street) but is now run very much as a theme park with prices to match. It is a very expensive day out for a family and there isn't a reduction if you buy tickets on line...

Actually if you want to watch the Trebuchet being fired, one of the best places to see this is from the delightful Mill Street Gardens... Entry last year was £2.50.

Forgotto attach a link to my pictures of the gardens... These are a delight to explore.
http://wasleys.org.uk/eleanor/garden...ill/index.html