I rest my case ...
 

A few days ago, on an Italian quiz show, there was this question:

"In the United States, what do people leave on the table for the waiter?"

:-)

A written note saying thank you.

"I looked for you all through the meal, now you can look for the tip."

Oh, good. Another tipping thread.

This question was on an American quiz show:

"What part of the typical US dining-out experience do Europeans never tire of commenting on?"

A signed credit card slip.

Do you think Trump ever leaves a tip?

Can his small hands handle the notes?

tip is nlack money here - service being included goes into taxation schemes.
I guess Trump tips, since it is a tax evasion system.

ah...."black" money

watcha Woin!

bvlenci - curious as to the reply as both you and I are familiar with Italian tipping experience.

However, as a frequent traveller to the US it is extremely stressful to load up one's wallet with appropriate bills to deal with all of those thrusting hands.

Comments about about Trump are frankly pathetic and better left to other forums.

"However, as a frequent traveller to the US it is extremely stressful to load up one's wallet with appropriate bills to deal with all of those thrusting hands."

I live in the US. Aside from checks to my chiropractor, my cleaning lady and my lawn service, I pay for everything by credit card. It's true I rarely stay in a hotel in the US, but when I do I don't have a car or I stay somewhere I park my car myself, and I carry my own bag. (Though it is true I had to come up with some cash last week to tip the guys who delivered my new mattress.)

I am already too much on this site nochblad. I haven't got time to post about Trump on another forum.
So you ll have to cope with pathetic Trump. Comments.

thursdaysd - as a European one arrives in the US without cash or high dollar bills. Assuming one has no dollars, one goes to an ATM and the minimum notes are $20 bills. So immediately one has to go to an airport outlet to buy a stick of gum or whatever to have some change - i.e. small bills.

Hopefully the taxi can accept a credit card which allows a tip - but not always.

At the hotel your cab door is opened for you - do you tip?

Before you put your hands on your bags they are whipped away from you - do you have to tip to get them back?

When you check in you are pressured to assign your bags to someone who will deliver them to your room. This person will then explain to you the minibar (often empty), how the lights work (are we so stupid?), and other remarkable features of the room as if we have never travelled before. Again how much do you tip?

This has to STOP!

Pay hotel staff a decent wage as in Europe.

<This has to STOP! >

For your convenience?? Not bloody likely, as they say across the pond.

You know, Americans who don't travel much find the hotel tipping situation confusing, too, and inconvenient.

And most of us are not opposed to paying workers a living wage--although restaurant servers fall into a different category from bell staff in hotels.

I guess I should add, for clarity, that restaurant servers are legally paid less than the minimum wage, on the assumption that most of their income comes from tips. A crazy system, IMO, but there it is.

Other people in the service industry who receive tips, such as the people who take your luggage to your hotel room, are paid at least minimum wage. Which isn't enough, IMO, as it's not actually livable, and there is a movement dedicated to raising the minimum wage, but it's a struggle and won;t get any easier under the current administration.

There are a few restaurateurs across the country who have raised wages for servers and outlawed tipping, but it has resulted in a net loss of income for their staff. It remains to be seen of the experiment is successful.

Nochblad- if the taxi driver says he does not accept cards, he's probably lying. I'm not guessing here- almost every time I've said, ok, I'll ask the next driver in queue and turn to walk away, their machine magically comes back online.

I don't normally stay in the class of the hotel where your door is opened for you...but when I do, I don't tip for that service nor do I know anyone who does.

If they take your bags before you can ask, then don't feel obliged to tip. I tip for excessive luggage, or if I have to wrangle kids or dogs, but that's it.

And that last one happened to me in Italy, never here, but you must really like giving out dollars if you tip for that lesson on how to use the minibar.

I tip valet and housekeeping sometimes. Usually more if I'm there for a few days and see the same faces.

So in short...I think you may be hallucinating those out thrust hands.

Waiters are an entirely different breed, and I suspect that's what you really resent. Heck, I resent that. But the good ones work hard for that money, and being cheap there is just rude if you enjoyed the service and the meal. And I don't see it as an income thing at this point- I tip the same percentage at a place that does pay their waiters fairly as I do at a chain. It's customary. Tons of stuff in Europe doesn't make sense but if an American complains, the locals would say...that's just how we do it here! I don't see how this is different...

This has to STOP!

Well perhaps we need a serious discussion on this.

Many restaurants are beginning to employ a no tipping policy. And many have been exposed as not fully distributing tips to staff - and let alone the distinction between frontline staff and those in the kitchen.

Hotels are another cesspit of tips. And do not get me into the cc charge for room extras which are non-exisistent - a totally empty mini-bar which is not even frigerated. Recently I contested this charge at a hotel at SFO (arrived at 22.00 with departure at 10.00) and was told that if I was in Las Vegas the charge would have been higher! A charge for what?

Yup - accept the status quo, pay through the nose, feel forced to take the doggie bag because the restaurant wants to reduce their organic waste, etc.

This is not necessarily an Italian rant - but it is certainly an American one.

And how many, truthfully, have experienced such?

And what newbe says about the net loss is true. It may be a good for business, but I haven't met a waiter who likes it. Local place that does it still put a tip line on the receipts so one can tip for "above and beyond service" on top of the service charge. This is to keep waiters happy. I have a lot of sympathy for people working minimum wage. It's not livable. ANYWHERE. But I have less sympathy for waiters, because they know it's a gamble and they like it that way. A set tip percentage is usually not in a waiter's favor and they know it.

Wanna change the world or been drinking early ?
If you want a serious discussion you should be clearer.

Your rant makes no head nor tail and mixes a lot of different things.

Customs are customs. We got rid of tipping by law. As long as laws don't change why should the habits change ?

I don't tip in Europe. I tip in the U.S.
What is so complicated ?

You could stay at a hotel that doesn't do a resort charge? Because I feel like that would be pretty easy to do at SFO. Nearly impossible in Vegas, and the guy was right, it'd be higher there, but SFO isn't Vegas. Resort charge isn't just for minibar, it's also for stuff like the pool and the fitness and business lounges. They charge it because they can.

The shady restaurants...if it wasn't tip withholding it would be something else. Not sure what you're getting at with the front and back of the house thing, though. Or the doggie bag. What restaurant has forced you to take a doggie bag because they want to decrease their organic waste?

@nochblad - I have most recently stayed in hotels in DC, New York and Boston. In each case I arrived by public transport. If you insist on using cabs, I suppose you could use Uber, which I understand requires you to pay by credit card.

If my (one carry-on size) bag were removed from my grasp I would not tip. I refuse the help in finding my room. The words you need are "no, thank you".

Although I grew up in England, in the US I tip at US rates in restaurants and to my hair stylist. I was most recently in South Korea and Japan, where I very much enjoyed not tipping, but I have no expectation that the custom will change in the US in my lifetime.

Follow ups -

I think that the trend is against exploiting staff and saying a decent wage as is evidenced by many restaurants in the the US and NY in particular.

WoinParis - I don't tip in Europe. I tip in the U.S.
What is so complicated ? PLEASE EXPLAIN YOUR TIPPING POLICY!

What really annoyed me whas the gratuitous introduction of Trump into a Forum which I tought was apolitical.

the gratuitous introduction of Trump

Isn't a tip a gratuity in English ? If so it fits the bill...


ain't I great to make jokes in English ?
- Americans can't in French, they are total disaster.
I swear, we are fantastic. You'll love Europe. We grab the words.

<i> At the hotel your cab door is opened for you - do you tip?

Before you put your hands on your bags they are whipped away from you - do you have to tip to get them back?

When you check in you are pressured to assign your bags to someone who will deliver them to your room. ... </i>

This kind of thing doesn't happen to me in the US. No one opens the taxi door for me. I always take my own bags to the room, and no one has ever whipped a bag from my hands, lucky for him.

I cited the quiz show (L'Eredità, by the way) only to offer proof that tipping was considered a foreign concept in Italy. Some people insist that it's not.

<<This kind of thing doesn't happen to me in the US. No one opens the taxi door for me. I always take my own bags to the room, and no one has ever whipped a bag from my hands, lucky for him.>>

Ditto.

<<ain't I great to make jokes in English ?
- Americans can't in French, they are total disaster>>

Shame on you, Wo��

If you're staying in a full service hotel, this sort of thing definitely happens. In a budget traveller hotel or a motel, you are pretty much expected to look after your own luggage.

The thing that gets me about all the tipping and added taxes in restaurants and hotels here is that it adds significant dollars to your bill, and that amount is not up front, like VAT, so you're never sure how much your travel is going to cost.

Food and hotel taxes here are ridiculously high. Tax upon tax.

One high-end restaurant in Vancouver tried the No Tipping rule, rather they upped the prices and increased wages. It just didn't fly, unfortunately.

@sundried - so do you call Marriotts budget or full service?

I'll let you decide Thursdaysd. My point is that there are hotels, particularly hotels that host a lot of business travellers, where your bags are taken to your room, as described by nochblad, and a tip is expected and graciously accepted by the bell person.

I don't agree with nochblad that it is done in such an aggressive manner. If a person really wants to carry their own bags, I'm sure he/she can communicate that easily enough.

But if one accepts a service, my personal feeling is that there is an expectation of a tip.

@sundried - the Marriott I use in DC hosts a lot of biz travelers, but I have never encountered difficulty taking my own bags to my room. Maybe you mean luxury travelers.

It's becoming clear that nochblad did not enjoy his travels in the US--fair enough! There are plenty of places to go in the world.

Or perhaps he is too sensitive a soul. I have never felt "pressured" to allow someone to carry my bag to my room--it's phrased as an offer, and if I don't want the help, I decline.

Nor have I felt "forced" to take a doggie bag. When I'm staying in a hotel and don't want to take the leftovers with me, I decline. At home, I accept because I like having leftovers for lunch the next day.

These customs differ from the way things are done in Italy--although I suspect hotels in Italy offer to help you with your luggage--but they are easy enough to navigate. Just say what you would prefer, politely, of course. Simple.

I have only had twice people rushing to me and grabbing my suitcase(s).

Once was in Morrocco and kids took - grabbed, stoel whatever our luggage and dropped them in the trunk of the taxi. Taximan asked us if we had asked the kids to carry the luggage, I said no, he slapped the kids... We told ourselves next time we'd say 'yes we asked for them to caary it...)

Second time was in Istanbul, a guy disguised as a valet of Louis XIV took my backpack (!) jumped into the elevator, pressed the correct button and managed to open the door of my room whilst litterally folding in 3. I guess that is what we call salamaleks.. I thanked him. No tip.

thursdaysd *Maybe you mean luxury travelers.*

I don't think I have ever stayed in a true luxury hotel...I guess it depends on your definition. We're middle of the road travellers in my definition (and budget).

We have also had our bags taken to our room, and the usual welcome walk around, but when we didn't have cash for a tip, we were still treated just as graciously...

Haha Wo good stories!

When we were in Italy last, we stayed in a convent. The nuns didn't offer to carry our bags anywhere. But they did run the bar as an espresso bar in the mornings and a liquor bar at night, and they whipped up a mean negroni. Which means I can't recall if we tipped them or not.

Ahh NewbE I think you just got the last word :)

Virtually the only times I stay in hotels in the US are when I'm attending an academic conference. Usually these are Hyatts or similar hotels, which I assume are full service hotels. The last time was in April, in Washington DC. If I had wanted a porter to take my bag to the room, I would have had to request the service. No one even offered politely to carry my bag. Maybe they only offer if you have a huge suitcase, or a lot of bags?

We usually arrive by car or taxi to the parking valet/ taxi drop-off. There are usually three or 4 bell hops waiting there to help with bags. We travel light but each have a carry-on plus another small back pack.

Some one travelling alone might have a different experience. Maybe it's assumed that help is needed when there's more than one person ie more bags?

In any case, I like your post. It's a good reminder for those of us who are accustomed to tipping here in N A.

I also am puzzled by this notion that no one helps you with a bag at a Hyatt (or Sheraton or Marriott) in the US. Most recently was at an academic conference in Denver, where it was snowing. Plenty of staff were helping people out of taxis, taking bags inside, etc. I had a roller bag carryon size, so I don't recall anyone offering to take the bag after I'd checked in. This was a Sheraton, but many times, even with a roller bag, I am automatically asked as a courtesy when I check in "Do you need help with your luggage?" Some people, of course, walk up to the check in desk without all their luggage, so that's why.

Of course I have also stayed at places where I walked into the hotel on my own steam from an airport bus or jumped out of a cab a few blocks away, or arrived when the door staff was occupied, so there was no one on hand to notice my arrival.

I am having a hard time figuring out today where it is people travel and why they have such strong opinions about the few things that happen to them personally, as if it were the whole world. I might have stopped going places if I didn't encounter a variety of quirks in the way things get done from place to place.

Also -- am I incorrect in thinking that tipping is common in Austria? I read above someone implying there is no tipping in European countries, but that's not my recollection.

I've been offered help with my bags even at very basic roadside hotels, not by a platoon of bellhops, of course, but by the person at the front desk. I think it's a normal inquiry at check in, and not just in the US?