European crows
 

Are crows dying out from disease in European countries as they seem to be in the US? I think they are fascinating, intelligent, underappreciated animals and would hate to lose them. A friend sent me an article a few days ago, and I found the online link to it, for anyone who cares: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2003Jul31.html Every now and then I do a search on crows, but I haven't searched for info about their status worldwide. Does anyone feel like commenting?

Thanks, that was an absolutely fascinating article! You might be comforted to hear that crows are still thriving in the Boston area.

Although they seem to be succumbing to West Nile virus, and perhaps other diseases, crows are among the most intelligent and adaptable of creatures, and will prevail. Here in the Northeast, we lost most of our raccoons to a rabies epidemic ten or 15 years ago, but now the raccoons are re-appearing.

Indeed, I can't help wondering whether there's some relationship between crows' recent proliferation and the raccoons' populaiton dip. Not only do they fill similar niches as urban scavengers, but raccoons are among the few creatures that will prey on crows' nests, keeping populations in check; with raccoons scarcer due to rabies, the crow population expanded.

Another competitor around here is coyotes, which were unknown 10 years ago but which now regularly snatch cats and little dogs out of suburban gardens. We no longer see many road-killed animals along the highway, since the coyotes come in the night to do their grocery shopping, leaving fewer snacks for the crows.

There are plenty in the back of my place in Cambridge, Ma. What a raquet they make. Thanks for the link.

lol
no they are not playing tennis, i meant racket.Tho in the city, we also have racoons living in back, possums, skunks. We usually rattle something to anounce our arrival at night as one or the othere hangs out on the walkway.

Anonymous, you are almost certainly correct about the link between the raccoon population decline and the crow population increase. If you want to know for sure, try asking your local Humane Society or a wildlife care center if there is one in your area.

As for West Nile, crows (and other corvids like ravens, jays, and magpies) are unfortunately the most susceptible of birds and are considered a "sentinel species," i.e., their infection is often the first sign that the disease has reached the area.

In the back over the fence in one of the trees is a night bird, that makes one chirp like sound, a pause then another, this goes on for hours and sometimes I answer and it will wait til I chirp back. Anyone know what it is? It's out there now chirping and it's after ten pm.

Mockingbirds will do that. Some of them have long, complicated repetoires but others go for a simpler approach.

I never thought anyone would reply to this post, and I'm glad there are other people who pay attention to crows. Since some of you are interested in crows, you might like some of these links that I found about a year ago. There were more, but many of the pages can no longer be found.



http://www.jcrows.com/crolang.html

http://www.jcrows.com/crow.html

http://www.crows.net/language.html

http://www.crows.net/mjw.html

http://www.crows.net/culture.html

http://www.crows.net/project.html

http://www.clcookphoto.com/crows.htm

http://www.pbs.org/lifeofbirds/brain/

http://www.ux1.eiu.edu/~cfpvs/Moore&Switzer1998.pdf

http://omega.cohums.ohio-state.edu:8.../9506c.20.html

http://216.239.39.104/search?q=cache...en&start=7

Went to the weekly market in Knaresborough last week, and there was a vendor that had a raven walking around in her stall. The woman said her raven and one other are allowed to hang out at Knaresborough Castle as a sort of local tribute to the ravens at the Tower of London.

I got to hold the raven...she pecked me a few times, ow ow ow ow, but she sure was beautiful!

(I know ravens and crows are not the same, but I thought I would share, anyway....)

cmt, have you ever considered volunteering at a local wildlife rehab hospital? If there is one in your area, I guarantee they can use your help. You might be able to work directly with crows and actually do something concrete to help the population.

BR: This was a "pet" raven? Ravens and crows are closely related, I think, and maybe they are similar in intelligence.

Marilyn: No, I haven't thought of volunteering, but twice I brought animals to the county wildlife refuge.. First it was a baby squirrel that my apartment neighbors had supposedly found. Then a few years later it was a bird I found dying on my property. I checked up on it a week later. It had died. It had been on the mend and was being exposed to the outdoor air in prep. for its eventual release. But it was left out one night when it turned unseasonably cold, and it died.

Yikes, of course we're interested in crows -- they're interested in us, too! I intend to look thru all those sites tomorrow, thanks for the links.

Our neighborhood crows became my good friends the year I dug up a bunch of lawn and turned it into flower beds; every time I dug up grass, I produced LOTS of grubs and other disgusting/yummy things, which I tossed into the driveway. Didn't take long for the crows to learn my habits, and to come flying in immediately every time I left the house -- how flattering (or maybe creepy) to think they were paying such close attention! They certainly have a large vocabulary of cries, including one that apparently means -- hey, everybody, over here! The snack lady is out!

The woman explained that she had found the raven when it was quite young, apparently injured or abandoned, or something like that. I did notice that it was missing one talon, but it still seemed to get around just fine.

Anonymous, crows are very, very intelligent and easily bored in captivity. At the wildlife facility where I volunteer, their food is given to them wrapped up or otherwise hidden so they can have the amusement of discovering it.

cmt, I'm sorry the bird you found didn't make it. :-(

Another fan of crows!
Last year, we used to go to one section of the Bois de la Cambre (the beltway of woods around Brussels) and take along a big bag of peanuts for the crows. They all flocked over as soon as we arrived--we got to know some of their individual personality quirks.
Then we moved to another part of Brussels and then to Germany and didn't go to that part of the park for almost a year. We went this past week-end, and sure enough, the crows remembered us and came over. We felt so mean for not bringing nuts with us! One crow followed us on our entire walk. We're going back this week-end with a BIG bag of nuts to reward our loyal "customers"
Bird lovers should make note of two very special places to visit in Belgium and the Netherlands:
In Belgium, Parc Paradisio is one of the finest wild bird rescue and rehab centers in the world. The park has beautiful grounds and is well worth a half-day visit.
In the Netherlands, the Dutch Parrot Refuge in Veldhoven (near Eindhoven) is probably the world's best refuge for all species of parrots, mostly pets whose owners died or could no longer take care of them. Some wild birds as well. Also worth a half day's visit.
Neither of these sites make the tourist guidebooks, but they are truly outstanding.

Don't know about the rest of Europe but crows and magpies have become much more in evidence in London than they ever used to be - a real population explosion, and on purely aesthetic grounds I don't share other correspondents' enthusiasm for corvids. By contrast, there is real concern in Britain about a dramatic decline in numbers of the house sparrow - yer actual Cockney sparrer. The experts tell us the two are not directly related. But something in the environment must clearly have changed to favour the one and not the other.

BTilke, I agree with you about Parc Paradisio. We lived not far from the Parc when we were stationed in Belgium, and went there a number of times.

I don't think I've ever seen "decline" and "house sparrow" in the same sentence. Patrick, if the Brits ever run out, they can completely restock the nation with the flock that's in my back yard! Both species are thriving here.

It's true that crows will eat young birds, but other threats to sparrows would be environmental -- they thrive on weed seeds and in slightly-neglected residential areas where they nest in nooks and crannies that might not exist in well-kept places, and roost on ivy-covered buildings, which they especially favor in cold weather.

Can you please come and get the crows from my garden as they are digging up the lawn. I can't stand them; they're a real pest around here.

If sparrows feed in groups, like finches, and I think they do, they could be particularly vulerable to epidemics.


I've also heard that crows exposed to humans when young can make human-like sounds. I can't verify this, but heard that a crow flew up to someone and said "hello." That is not entirely implausible, since the crow may have been raised or sheltered by people for some time and may have learned that this is something humans say when coming up to someone. Crows are capable of making many different sounds, and it is not impossible that they might actually use them to communicate with the animals that they know happen to use those sounds. (African gray parrots, e.g., do so in a much more complex way, actually forming sentences to communicate their thoughts, and not merely "parroting" human speech sounds.)

I'm so surprised people are posting on this topic. I really thought it would probably be ignored. This is so nice :)

P.S. If you post here re whether there is an increase or decrease or no change in the numbers of crows where you live, would you indicate WHERE you are, i.e., at least the country. Thanks.

I'm in NJ--central/western NJ-- and here the numbers seem to be decling, probably because of West Nile virus. I noticed a big change in the size of flocks at sunset between winter 2001-2002 and winter 2002-2003.

Tulips wrote
>..please come and get the crows from my garden as they are digging up the lawn. I can't stand them; they're a real pest around here. <

You should be happy Tulips. The birds are digging up the grubs that attack your grass and shrubbery.

I live in Belgium, and there is definitely no shortage of crows here. Ira; you are right about that, but there is nothing left of the lawn after the crows finish with it. If you have any solution to the problem, I'll be glad to hear it.

We have plenty here but our real problem are the canada geese who are chewig up all the grass along the banks of the Charles River and in the Public Garden where they are polluting the swans home with their turds. Their droppings are slippery when you run or bike on them and sun bathers must be careful. I'm speaking of hundreds and hundreds of these birds. several film makers and news camera crews have been here to film this amazing sight.

A lakeside park near where we spent the winter in Germany became the new home of two pair of Canadian geese (don't know where they came from, they just showed up one day and decided not to leave). The locals were oohing and ahing over them because they are very attractive if you're not used to them. But my husband and I thought uh oh, you people have no idea what you're in for!

"Quoth the raven: nevermore" = can crows say this?

Tulips: I'm with you - the crows drive away all the other birds, especially the song birds, in my yard. They crap all over my car. They eat everything out of my dog's dish.

Will one of you crow lovers please come and take these crows away?! I live in Northern California.

I posted a reply to this thsi afternoon...what happened to it?

Crow numbers in Britain are significantly increasing year on year. Whereas we've lost over half our house sparrows and they are now on the red data list.

For more details about these facts and other esoteric things about birds , check out www.bto.org

Seems to be plenty of crows here in southern Wisconsin. I have heard recently of some crows who tested positive for West Nile.

Here's a link to another article someone just gave me. http://www.psych.auckland.ac.nz/psyc...tion/Gavin.htm It's about crows making tools. I'm adding this to the list of articles posted in the 8th message of this thread Aug. 20, using the thread as a place to store the list. (Crows fly, crows live in Europe among other places--sort of European travel related)

The crows have apparently vanished from the city where I work in NJ, and I'm wondering whether they have also disappeared in other places. Let me know.

The corvids are in healthy numbers here in S.E. Alaska. Good thing, too, since they are an integral part of Tlingit mythology/culture. I know they are pesky, but their intelligence and antics are soooo amusing. And yes, they can mime other animals...they are really good at meowing.

I'm glad, Klondike. And I can really understand how such an animal would have a prominent place in traditional mythology.

Still no flocks out my office window in Trenton. I don't know whether West Nile killed them or whether they're no longer roosting in the cemetery and therefore no longer following the same route in the evening.

Will post something later--topping to remind myself.

There are several nests of crows in my unused barn roof here in Provence - I've been told by a neighbor that they are the harbingers of good fortune here.
Last spring, a young crow fell from the edge of the roof (and it's quite a drop - over fourteen metres), but was unharmed. Because I have cats, I called my vet who told me to bring it over. It was adopted within a day, and has become a pet to one of the nurses who works there. The crow sits on her shoulder and goes everywhere with her... coming when called by a whistle. It also "fetches" things and is generally entertaining to those of us waiting to see the vet.

Because we aren't far from the Camargue, where West Nile was first found on the continent and threatens the horse population, I keep an eye on "my" crows, but so far none seem to have died, which is a sign that the West Nile virus is in the area.

Patricia

I had to eat crow following yesterday's Florida-Florida St game.
It doesn't taste too bad as long as you cook it thoroughly and drench it in barbecue sauce.

Certainly not in London, quite the other way around. There has been a noticeable increase in the numbers of crows and magpies, and a huge drop in the numbers of humble London sparrows (though I think the scientific consensus is that the two aren't connected).

I agree with Patrick, there are definitely more Crows and Magpies in London than there's ever been. I work in the City of London and there are Crows and Magpies always flying around outside. Infact a Magpie landed on the outside window ledge a couple of weeks ago and looked into the office!

Here's a fascinating article about bird intelligence that anyone who opened this thread might find worth reading. It's about bird intelligence. It was in the Tuesday science section of the New York Times on Feb. 1, 2005, so it will no longer be accessible for free after seven days from that date, I think. http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/01/sc...pagewanted=all


(I forgot what I was going to post on this thread in November, but I'm sure I'll think of something one of these days.)

Great post!
Cigale - I know EXACTLY what you mean about Canadian Geese. My parking lot for my job is very near a small lake where quite literally hundreds of Canadian geese live from October - April. They like to sit on the hoods of the cars because the cars are warm (even if it is cold outside, the sun beating down on the metal warms it). They scratch the paint and leave excrement all over your car (also damaging to the paint). And the smell... ugh!

They are beautiful birds and I don't mind sharing the lake with them, but I do get tired of sharing my car with them!