Its also rather annoying to have you constantly refer to drinking and driving since this thread is about people on vacation in Europe.

Now perhaps you drive when in London or Paris but I certainly don't so the issue doesn't arise in the first place.

And as both a lawyer and a PhD in biochemistry I am quite aware of both the legal and biological applications of alcohol consumption and don't need to be lectured by anyone on the subject.

Which is perhaps why I never engage in "boozing" under any circumstances and rarely drink more than a few ounces (i.e. a single glass) of wine in an evening. Nor have I ever driven a car impaired, or for that matter committed a single moving violation in 40 years on the road.

I find your constant implication of criminal or negligent behavior on the part of others who you do not know to be in highly questionable taste.

All this lecturing from vacationwannabe seems so VERY odd since he started a thread asking where they can find Jack Daniels in Europe????

I dont think vacationwannabe is lecturing nearly as much as Rillifane is - and he is giving his academic and professional qualifications as if that qualifies him to discuss kids in pubs more than others on this forum. I found his posts unnecessarily aggressive.

Oh for goodness sake who care what everyone else does.

The op wants to visit a pub for a meal with their children. Lots of people do it in the UK. It's not at all unusual or considered odd. A pub meal may or may not include drinking alchohol and it is their choice. Presumably as they are talking the middle of London they will not be driving back to the hotel.

The OP didn't state that they wanted to go out on a boozy bender with their kids carrying them home at the end of it.

I've also raised a very normal son who is neither an alchoholic nor a drink-driver or particularly irresponsible in any way. His first ever trip out of the house at 4 days old was a gentle stroll down to our local pub where we all sat in the garden eating a pub lunch and I had a nice glass of coke (breast-feeding). If I hadn't been feeding no doubt I would have enjoyed a nice glass of something else! In the UK pubs are not like bars - many of them are really family places with playgrounds, kids rooms, etc. If kids are allowed in then they are welcome. The pub is not necessarily just about drinking alchohol, it can be about eating a good but comparatively cheap meal, seeing your friends, relaxing in a nice atmosphere, stopping for a break, loo visit, and refreshments during a long day, etc etc...

I never witnessed parents drunk in charge of kids but I've seen plenty of parents drink while in charge of kids. Done it plenty of times myself. It's normal behaviour here and in most of Europe. To us, having a meal with the adults enjoying a glass or two, IS a family activity as we don't stick our children in 'child-friendly ghettos' but involve them fully in the community in which they live.

i don't know the policies of the pubs in question but since the discussion has branched out to a more general debate i will add that with few exceptions, london pubs are not appropriate for children. this is not a moral judgement at all just reality. central london pubs are especially inappropriate.

most are very crowded and smoky. the customers and overall atmosphere are quite "child unfriendly" and, if they do serve food, the serving hours are very limited and the food is not good. few people in london would bring their children down to the local. of course there are exceptions...some pubs in hampstead, for example, may have more of a family country pub feel on a sunday afternoon but this is the exception, not the rule.

the image of several generations of a family gathered around the dinner table eating and drinking in a warm and healthy way ...children being around alcohol from a young age and then growing up with a very healthy attitude to alcohol simply does not apply to britain. this stereotype is perhaps appropriate for the continent but not the UK. The overall attitudes to alcohol are not healthy here and misuse is more common here than most places in the world.

As others have pointed out, some country pubs are family gathering places where the atmosphere is much different. however, the pub culture is changing and i don't think that an afternoon at the pub with the family is as common as it once was (for no other reasons than other pursuits are more popular now).

by the way, i drink like everyone else so this is not coming from an anti-drinking angle.

I am not lecturing anybody about anything especially about drinking alcohol! As I have said before I am a wild drinker at times I just don't think it's appropriate to include children in it, EVER! but if you do, then good for you is what I said.

I have on disc notes of London pubs with lunch and sometimes supper, and says which take children (most in my lust do). Please tell me if you would kike a copy.;

Ben Haines, Londpn
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When a thread has seriously gone off in a ditch - we can count on ben to bring it back on track. Thanks :)

Hi, there's a website out there <a href="http://www.ratemypub.ie">Find and Rate an Irish Pub</a> that states whether or not pubs in Northern Ireland serve food.