maybe train tickets could cost a bit ledd, but I dont see it could cost a lot less since we need to pây for 4 persons. And a car gives us a lot more flexibility between cities. But yes having a car in big cities could a lot hassle. We would take a look (when we have our flights) of making 2 rentals and combining them with train/bus if it can help. We dont need a big car, we travel light (4 carry on and 2 small back pack).

We know that most a the tim a car in big cities is an hassle. Once we got our flights secured we woulld look at all our options. We also have to take in account that leaving the car in a different coutries would mean a big fee most of the time. We can also stay outside Karkow and vist the city on day trip(s) with the car since we also want to go outside to Auschwitz, and Wieliczka. Money is alway an object for almost every travellers. We have an ok amount for that trip (I guess) but yes if we could avoid unnecessary expenses....

Bus travel would probably be cheaper than a car rental, especially if the tickets are purchased a couple of months in advance; here's an example:

https://www.rome2rio.com/map/Vienna/Krak%C3%B3w#trips

of course it would be cheaper, it could be doable for some parts but we still need/want to have a car for some parts of our trip. And car give us freedom of travel and we like it very much.

No doubt that there is a flexibility in having a car, but that is also limited by the fact that to work within a set budget you will have to have housing reservations made weeks if not months in advance to lock in an acceptable price. That puts a damper on the flexibility of years past when one could travel without reservations and still find acceptable housing.

A daily rental, while more expensive on a per day basis than a long term rental, might still be a better solution. You can rent a smaller car (no need larger luggage space) and it should include any environmental vignette appropriate to the locality.

One other thing I would consider adding to the OP's itinerary, you might consider going to see the Eagles Nest castles north of Krakow all the way to Czestochowa where there is an impressive monastery, Jasna Gora, a majestic sight. Of all the wooden architecture south of Krakow to the mountains, the church at Debno is unspeakably touching and humble. It brought me to tears. The town of Tarnow has a gorgeous main square with a dark past. The town was 45% Jewish before the war, and it became a site of devastating atrocity. it also has an ethnographic museum with an interesting array of roma caravans.

A lot of folks seem to want to talk the OP out of a car, but as someone who has done a lot of traveling with four, including kids through their high school years, I see the flexibility of car travel as being important for the kind of trip envisioned by the OP.

Plus, this is not the OP's first go-round, so it's condescending to tell the OP what is obvious, like bus travel is cheaper.

Thanks a lot Shelemm !
The idea of the eagle nest and Tarnow are good ones. Maybe we could do it as daytrip from Karkow and use the car we will have.

And thanks also for putting some things in perspective !

Costs aside, bus travel can offer irreplaceable opportunities to observe, and even engage with, the people who live in an area. Some of my most memorable travel moments have come from just such experiences. I think Micheal's suggestion that you consider bus travel well worth considering. JMO.

Kja: to be honest, the flexibility of the car is way more important to us than having some small talk with strangers ! We dont reject bus/train if it suits our needs but not for that aspect.

I'm on your side with respect to renting a car.

That written, your itinerary is, pardon my French, a hot mess. Doing a loop from Venice to Hallstatt to Poland to Hungary and back to Venice means you will likely "cut through" the Czech Republic and Slovenia, but if you've "seen them before," why are you not tailoring your holiday to those places you haven't seen?

I personally could take all 30 days in Italy or Austria alone; both countries have enough to offer to make the experience less complicated and with enough variety to suit everyone.

Also, you want to travel in the summer. Not all of Central Europe is air-conditioned; much of Europe will also be on holiday; and you may need to account for the occasional bank holiday.

Everyone travels differently, of course, but this itinerary sounds so much like the lofty plans of friends and family who would visit when we lived in Austria and after the first couple of days would discover that scaling down was a lot more enjoyable for everyone. Really take the time to research what everyone wants to do and map the way forward from there.

fourfortravel: thanks for the answer. Of course our itinerary could get some refining (and it will !). Like i've said Venice is only for now because it's save us 2000$ on flights, We think it woth a 7-8 hours drive if prices stays !
We already been in Italy twice, yes we could go back only in Italy, but dont feel the need to do so (beside maybe one or two stops).

In 35 days We think something like this https://maps.app.goo.gl/9Z7c2ibsDU3W7Qj49 is doable.

Would it be enjoyable for everyone ? I guess not, but we are kind of seasonned travellers and we know our pace. Having that said every ideas are very welcomed !

I am sure you already know what open jaw tickets are, and are keeping your eye on a number of possible routes.

If you do end up arriving in Venice, which you don’t want to see, consider the train. A previous poster, sorry forgot name, travelled from Venice to Munich on a very scenic route that you can also take, with one change at Verona IIRC, as far as Innsbruck. Relax in the Austrian Alps and proceed from there by your choice of transportation.

https://www.seat61.com/trains-and-ro...city-train.htm

If you rent a car in Italy you cannot rent at the Basic rate otherwise offered in the EU. Check rates by going through the process of renting a car at Autoeurope.com. In addition, for the time that you will have the car, a lease might be better, and again, that can be checked by going through the lease process on Autoeurope.com.

Yes we know what an open jaw ticket is and we have done it in the past. It's more complicated when a car is involve because returning the car in another country mean, most of the time, an hefty fee but yes it's something we would look into.

Thanks for the idea. We have use Autoeurope 3-4 times in the pass with freat results. We also have done a lease in our last trip. geting a brand new car with full insurance coverage was great but a bit more pricey. The main problem with leasing is that it's vaibles only in a limited number of destinations.

Hi Again !
Venice still the best deal/price from Montréal.
Yul-Vce is 1033$
Yul Vienna (or Munich, Budapest or Krakow) is between 1500-1600.
Since we are 4 it means 2000$ more.

What we could do:
Arrive in Venice. Stay one night in Venice Mestre (cheaper than Venice), may be drop our lugage and do a small daytrip in venice, have a meal, and go back to our hotel in mestre.
9:56 in the morning, take the direct train to Vienna. It would cost us 120$ for the whole family. That way we would have 4-6 nights in Vienna without a car. Rent a car at the end of our Vienna stay.
For the return we would do the opposite. Drop the car in Vienna. Take the 12:24 train to Venice (arrival at 20:00). Sleep in Venice Mestre and take our flight back to Montreal next day.

Not ideal, but a lot less expensive that way.

What do you think ?

Six nights off your car rental will save a bundle right there. You might price hotels in Mestre and the extra train tickets before committing to a Venice round trip — open jaw with return from Vienna or from your last destination might work out better… though oh no, the international drop off fee might be a killer if you return from outside Austria. But still, If you’re ending with more city time, shaving more days off the rental might compensate.

Glad it’s your spreadsheet headache and not mine!

I am quite sure you’ll all enjoy that train journey.

https://www.seat61.com/trains-and-ro...e-by-train.htm

Hôtels in Mestre is not that much a factor singe we have to sleep somewhere anyways. Like I’ve said train cost 90 euros one way (so 180 euros return) for the whole family.

It wont be an easy to plan but it’s part of the fun !