Caution at Paris ATMs
 

I am an American and I live in Paris 6.5 months each year. Recently the gypsies have been doing an atm thing that tourists especially unaccompanied ladies should be aware of. At many bank you can go inside the foyer to use the atm instead of using one on the street. 2 or 3 gypsies youths will watch for a lady to enter the foyer to make a withdrawal. They will go in behind her and wait until she has inserted her card and entered her pin. Then one will grab her while the other enters an amount to withdraw and takes the money.

A friend of mine had this happen this past Monday at an atm near the Opera. She informed the bank and the police but did not find a lot of sympathy from either. I told her to speak to the bank manager tomorrow as today is a holiday and demand that they view the security camera footage and give it to the police and they should reimburse her for her loss as they should install locks on the foyer door for customer safety.

Be careful.

I never use one of those inside ATM machines unless I have someone else with me.

I thought you needed an ATM card to get access inside the bank which would serve as a locking mechanism.

This happens even in Florida. A mom turned her own son in since his picture from the security camera was flashed all across the news. He had the women in a chokehold. I usually try and go with my husband to withdraw from an atm these days. Nothing is safe anymore. I also thought you needed an atm card to get access inside the bank foyer where the machine was.

Oh, sandra, you had been doing so well lately. Go take a nap and start your day over again!

This is why I start the trip carrying all the cash I will need for 3-4 weeks.

This apparently can happen in places besides Paris and whenever people decide to use a certain type of ATM.

Agree that indoor bank ATMs in the US (outside of regular opening hours) can only be opened with an aTM card in the door. If not that way in europe - I wouldn't use in indoor ATM solo.

If ever in doubt I use an ATM in a 24 hour drug store, deli or supermarket to avoid potential problems.

Assuming that any thief in Paris is a "gypsy" is stereotyping to the point of bigotry.

Thanks, Southam That obviously need to be said.

Ackislander,

If your definition of "doing well" is not confronting this kind of rank bigotry on a business-driven travel website, then I don't want to play by your rules. There are more than 10 million Roma citizens of Europe, and they deserve defense from these ignorant, idiotic slurs that in the end only serve to threaten their lives -- and that is not an exaggeration if you knew anything, really, about Europe.

I have already "triangled" the OPs post for the offense that it is and if it is not taken down, don't worry, you will never, ever see me here again in any form or under name. I just will not stoop to hanging around with people like that or be associated with a business like Fodor's if they don't see a problem with what has been posted.

I don't see this as a a message stating any thief in Paris is a gypsy or that all gypsies are thieves although it probably could have been better worded. I see this as reporting that a group of gypsy youths have robbed some people recently at ATMs and that everyone should be careful about thieves (from any background) at enclosed ATMs.

I have been robbed by gypsy youths and non-gypsy youths. I am an equal opportunity victim.

The OP's post is not remotely offensive. The term "Roma" is kind of made up and the term gypsy is actually used by many of them and was not historically meant as any kind of slur, actually. It was just a descriptive term to refer to them as a group because originally they were though to originate in Egypt. There are people of that community who use the term themselves. I think it is often people who have the problem who think certain terms of derogatory when there is nothing intrinsically derogatory about them, nor did they originate to be derogatory. Know anything about the community in Spain, flamenco, etc?

And really, this is a good warning to many tourists who are clueless and I'm sure this is mainly a problem in the central areas (around Opera, doesn't surprise me). Where I stay, this isn't a problem and there are not actually many ATMs inside banks where I stay.

How did she know they were Gypies (Romans)? They could have been any street urchin. It's Paris after all, the international city.

Shouldn't the title of the post have been "Caution at ATMs anywhere in the world" ?

<if it is not taken down, don't worry, you will never, ever see me here again in any form or under name.>
For which, oh, be joyful!

<I just will not stoop to hanging around with people like that >
Don't! Don't stoop, please don't stoop!

Sign me,
Initially amused by, but now sick of the trolling

<i>Shouldn't the title of the post have been "Caution at ATMs anywhere in the world" ?</i>

It happened in Paris, let the reader generalize the meaning.

But did it even happen? Read the original post. It sounds like a fantasy in paragraph one and then in paragraph two it "happened."

The story is a strange jumble. But yes, there is a risk for anybody using an ATM anywhere.

Well IMO gypsies do have a look and I am wary every time I see a group of them. I will say that the time I was pick pocketed on the Barcelona metro, there was not a gypsy in sight or they have taken to dressing like business people before they block the metro door - could be, they are professionals of sorts.

I am sure that not all gypsies (or even a small percentage of them) are ne'er do wells but some are.

OK, triangle me.

I post on Fodors maybe 1 or 2 times a year for exactly the reasons displayed in the above comments. I live in Paris and my only interest is in warning fellow Americans and anyone interested in the dangers tourists can encounter here. If anyone is not interested in my warning...ignore it. If you don't like it .....ignore it. It is a true incident that happened at an atm near the Opera. If you don't believe it.....ignore it. I really don't care. Do you think I have something to gain by this post?

About the accessibility of the doors to the bank foyers in Paris: most open as you approach the door automatically while others can be opened using an atm or debit card from any bank on the planet.

As for how to spot a gypsy in Paris; if they wore a neon sign around their neck it could not be easier. Anybody living in Paris can easily identify one. If you think I am a bigot ....that's fine with me but profiling makes sense in this case because the streets are full of gypsies in the touristy areas of the city robbing tourists like you in a number of ways or ripping you off with their phony scams. The police occasionally round them up and send them back to eastern Europe but they return again and again. It is a massive problem here.

I try to help people on this forum but it seems the majority of posters here are just here to try to ridicule and show off and have never been to Europe in their miserable lives. Many thanks to Christina, a good member who actually travels in Europe.

Well they took out a comment. Not the one requested though.

Larry I wonder, that is not " new" news , this has been happening for years.

I visit solo and go to the machines alone. I have never been mugged.

It does happen though.

Millions of tourist go to Paris and are not pickpocketed either.

However it DOES happen.

One does have to be self aware.

What is funny is that in outer Paris, we have tons of gypsies, too. I know most of mine by name, but they don't try to rob anybody. They just beg. Some of them have understood that I might give them something if they <b>don't</b> ask. The others are always asking and have not yet realized that when I give them a coin or two, it is because they forgot to ask.

Nevertheless, they are all friendly and I absolutely never worry about them. In "tourist central" it is another matter, so I kind of feel sorry for the people who insist on staying there.

Hi LarryJ! I'm glad you're still enjoying Paris.
Debbie

<i>But did it even happen? Read the original post. It sounds like a fantasy in paragraph one and then in paragraph two it "happened."</i>

Nothing fantasy about the first paragraph, although giving the source of the information would have rendered it more credible. Do you question the second paragraph?

<< Many thanks to Christina, a good member who actually travels in Europe. >>

It's bad form to thank one person by name and ignore other posters who said the same thing first, as KTtravel did. You would have to read KT's response to get to Christina's post. But I guess you ignored KT.

I also guess that you found my question offensive.

<< Well they took out a comment. Not the one requested though. >>

Cold - a very offensive comment (even more offensive than usual) by sandralist was (thankfully) removed. Since this thread is still active I suppose we've seen the last of her.

Yes I saw the post Adrienne. Hate to lose a valuable poster.

<I> Do you question the second paragraph?</I>

No, I don't question it but I certainly find it offensive since it assumes that the security camera information would not be viewed without a <b>demand</b>. Not to mention the fact that it also assumes that the bank is not properly equipped for security. Frankly, I have never seen a single interior ATM entrance in France that did not require a card to be used to obtain access. The whole point of those inside locations is that they are more secure. So if she went through with her operation even though the gypsies came in behind her, she is totally irresponsible.

What a shame that this space is wasted on such petty bickering. Get with the program and offer support and positive suggestions instead of peck, peck, pecking.

I for one, appreciate fair warning of any new threat or travel scam. Just two weeks ago while in Cordoba, Spain, I was approached by a person resembling a gypsy but I didn't ask for I'd (gee, did I say that out loud?) offering a rosemary sprig. I knew enough from repeated mention of this scam to walk past and not make eye contact with the person.

Fodor's is losing members who are fed up with this unnecessary, impolite, overbearing and unwanted self important arguing. Stop already! If you can't say something nice, say nothing. Better yet, start your own misery web site.

Sorry, got carried away with my rant and didn't proof closely enough: should read: "didn't ask for ID".

LarryJ Thank you for your input. I leave for Paris, at last, Friday, and I'm happy to acquire new tips for safety, food, and fun. I had read before to use the bank ATMs because it's easier to retrieve an eaten card. OK on to searching for the best place for tarte tatin. And maybe some posters should take the advice from travelchat.

The advice I usually read is to use an ATM inside a bank as it is more secure than outside. This is the first note I have read about the dangers of using ATMs inside the bank, and it will make me more cautious.

Urchins?! Really, you are stereotyping to the point of bigotry! On behalf of sealife everywhere, retract!
;-)

Thanks for the reminder to use caution regardless of location!

Perhaps I'm paranoid but I would never think a dimly lit, enclosed space would be secure. You never know who is waiting outside the door or who is coming in after you have entered. Even in my small town I would rather pay the ATM fee at an out-of-network location than go to my credit union and use the ATM machine inside their lobby after hours.

My vote is for an ATM machine in a brightly lit area with plenty of people around.

Actually, you might be amazed at the number of people who go to ATMs in Paris just to check their account and not at all to withdraw cash.

So people lurking at an ATM have a very limited chance of encountering anybody who came to get money.

What Ktravel wrote is rational.

To suggest that some crime (one crime) was committed by gypsies (one gypsy) is neither to suggest that all criminals are gypsies nor that all gypsies are criminals. Both are as patently ridiculous as to suggest that no crimes are committed by gypsies or that anyone who speaks of gypsies as a class is colluding in the Nazi persecution of gypsies. It is OTT.

Larry, wish you would post more about your life in Paris. Ignore the snarky people please.

"I have already "triangled" the OPs post for the offense that it is and if it is not taken down, don't worry, you will never, ever see me here again in any form or under name.."

Boy, your sense of self importance is staggering.

<< Frankly, I have never seen a single interior ATM entrance in France that did not require a card to be used to obtain access.>>

I have...The BNP on the corner where we stay in Paris has sliding glass doors that open with sensors, no card required. Often, evenings, one or more, apparently homeless, people are sleeping inside.

Two dark skinned boys tried to rob me at an ATM on the Rue de Bretagne last October. I assumed they were Roma as they looked and behaved kinda similar to the petition gels who hang around the tourist spots of Paris. I didn't follow them home though to find out if the lived in gypsy camp though. But I would be willing to bet they were from a gypsy family/community.

As someone whose street smarts, never all that acute, have dulled by years in a sleepy low-crime area, I find it helpful to read reminders obvious to those living in big cities.

A few years ago I spent part of an evening watching Spot the Pickpocket clips on YouTube after a post here. Pickpockets are pretty much unknown where I live, and blocking the metro doors is caused by poor manners, not criminal intent.

Armed robbery, not far from here, sure.

Larry J great information and thanks for reporting the technical issue. I'm now aware and glad of it.