Fair conpensation for you is 0, nothing, zero, nada. It was was your fault, so forget it.

Peter,<BR>I really don't think you are entitled to any compensation. You were late. It was an Act of God, nature, whatever. Had you been on time, you would have been on the plane. <BR> <BR>Let it go. It's not fair to travelers that really do have a case. <BR>

Peter, what a whiner! I think you are constantly coming up with excuses and explanations to alleviate this gnawing in your craw that says, in a teeny tiny voice: "I'm wrong. I screwed up. I'm upset! But this is my chance to make some money!"<BR><BR>I especially like the "I didn't know" crap. Even my 12 year old knows the changes in expectations in how early one has to arrive at the airport since 9/11. And for an international flight? What's the matter with you? <BR><BR>In conclusion, may I suggest you take up smoking, if you don't already. You can claim "I didn't know!" all the way to millionaire acres, but on your way to the morgue, of course.<BR><BR><BR>

The disagreements on this post seem to have to do with what, exactly, is meant by missing a flight. Did Peter arrive too late for his flight? Some say yes, I say the point is moot, thanks to AA, and here’s my reasoning – all critical analysis is welcome.<BR> <BR>The AA site does indeed say that you have to be at the gate, not just checked-in, 30 minutes prior to departure. (Actually they go further than this and say you must be seated 10 minutes prior to departure, which of course is possible only if you arrive with enough time to board.) Arriving at the gate later than 30 minutes prior to departure means you missed the flight, even if you were at the check-in desk 5.5 hours, let alone 55 minutes, in advance. <BR><BR>As it is, I agree that (55-30) = 25 minutes is not a lot of time, post 9-11, to get boarding passes, (especially if a line was at the check-in desk); get through heightened security procedures (again, lineups likely); and get to the gate with the required 30 minutes minimum to spare. So yes, Peter and wife might well have missed their flight deadline under these circumstances. <BR><BR>But here’s where I agree with Peter: AA never gave them a chance to miss their flight boarding call deadline. It isn’t AA’s call to say that Peter and wife couldn’t have made it from arrival at the airport to the gate in 25 minutes; they might have got lucky. But – and here’s the essential point – this was an event-driven desk closure, not a time-driven desk closure. The precipitating cause of the desk being closed to Peter and wife wasn’t the time they arrived but the fact that all the passes had already been given out. This could have happened even if they had arrived 2 hours in advance, if the remaining passengers had all arrived even earlier and checked in by that time. Overbooked is overbooked, and more time at the desk will not magically produce more seats on the plane. <BR>

Most of you are obviously only skimming the posts. Regardless of what they recommend you should could would do, according to AA's very own PRINTED policy in their conditions of carriage Peter was NOT late. He arrived to check in 25 minutes beyond the minimum 30 minutes. The flight was very simply overbooked which is not Peter's fault. If the price of your ticket is going up why don't you try blaming the airlines and their overbooking practices. Why are you accepting the use of 9/11 as an excuse to blame the customer for the airlines questionable(even if they are legal)business practices?

I would not say that they were bumped, I would say yhat they YOU were late for checkin and it was your fault, not AA. You should be thanking AA that the put you on a flight the next day

How can you say they were late for check in if they were there 25 minutes beyond the 30 minute minimum? It seems according to AA's own printed policy it would have been another 25 minutes before they could have been considered late. Regardless, Peter says that they would have gotten checked in if seats had still been available. So it is not a question of late, it is a question of overbooking. I don't see how some of you can justify overbooking? Yes that's the way things are but how does it make it right?

The reason that you have overbooking is that 30% of the people who have booked a flight don't show up. Would you be willing to pay more for your flight and then have it fly with 30% empty seats for the no shows?

Rita, We don't know when Peter even know when Peter arrived at the ticket counter, as another poster said. We only know he "arrived" 55 minutes before departure. Was that at the airport or in front of the desk agent? <BR><BR>There are too many lawyers here, looking at details, losing sight of the big picture, which is that Peter was late.<BR><BR>For Pete's sakes, we were traveling to Mexico over Christmas a few years ago and there was an ice storm in our town. the day before our trip, most flights were cancelled. We were breathing sighs of relief that our departure wasn't until the next day. <BR><BR>The next day, only 6% of the flights were cancelled. Guess what? Ours was included. So, we flew out a day late. We missed one day of our seven day advanced paid hotel stay. But guess what again? We didn't even think of complaining. That's life, folks. American wasn't trying to screw you Peter. You screwed up. Suck it up like a man. And all you lawyers, you're ruining America.

I have to say I can't imagine cutting it so close and would never have aimed for less than 2 hrs. before departure, given everything I hear, read, learn about international flying. Still I don't think the situation is crystal clear, and at least they did get you to Paris. <BR><BR>As for writing AA, the CEO or whomever: They have gotten a bit tight-a$$ed about compensating disgruntled passengers, even when the customers are in the right. I seriously doubt that you'll receive anything much by way of compensation, and I wonder if you'll get anything other than a letter telling you that in the future you will need to check in earlier, including some reference to increase security demands. <BR><BR>Please let us know what you do get from AA.

How do we even know that the flight was overbooked? Perhaps the seat was given to a standby passenger, which the airline has a right to do if the original passenger doesn't show up when he's supposed to.

Forest, It would behoove you to read the whole thread, not skim and jump to assumptions. It is not my intent to walk you through the facts as described, and this is no court of law – so disclosure is unnecessary. The point of whether we were there on time as the grand forum defines it is irrelevant. The issue is we were there on time as stipulated in AA’s own printed material, no matter how contradictory the spoken consensus is. The fact is this is a little guy vs. a corporation issue. Although I’m not planning a civil action law suit, I am also not interested in lying down and being walked upon by an industry, that was struggling before Sep 11, and received a load of cash from the US government in the wake of the fear and confusion that ensued. If the above mentioned policy was not printed on the boarding pass jacket, I would not bother with this, but by their own admission, AA is in the wrong. Ultimately I can’t believe that hard working individuals would let a huge, heartless, faceless corporation turn them into sheep. And just to clarify matters, the check-in agent had our passports in-hand 55 minutes prior to departure.

I'm not sure that overbooking works to keep prices down, given that discount airlines like Easyjet and Ryanair don't practice overbooking, and as a result, neither need nor offer to compensate bumped passengers. Maybe overbooking does help customers in dire need of a last minute seat to get one. So I can't say definitively it's a bad thing entirely, so long as I'm not the one bumped. : - ) <BR><BR>Agreed, Peter might have missed the flight anyway, but the overbooking makes it a moot point, we'll never know now. Given that that is the case, we can't just say that an eventual flight to Paris is fair. A day in Paris does have a dollar value attached; lost hotel accomodation, etc. <BR><BR>Forest, I think that ice storms that cause delay of flights are known as a 'Force Majeure' and no compensation is owing. I do agree that in such cases keeping one's mind on one's own health and safety is key. But Peter's wasn't a safety related issue, so the two situations aren't strictly comparable. <BR><BR>While not a lawyer, I must say that if I'm ruining America, then damnit I expect the White House to return my calls from now on. "George? Sue here. It's about my opinion on your last speech....." : - )

I've been avoiding this one as I have recent experience watching the cascading effects of the June 17th air traffic controllers "event" in Europe and enjoying the benefits of the same.<BR><BR>Basically this is a borderline case. Yes Peter "should" have been there -- but 5 minutes off in bad weather isn't punishable by death. And yes the airline should have been more sensitive, if only for good PR.<BR><BR>The reason I am touchy is that I watched people try to get seats on overbooked flights. Not to excuse the airlines, but post September 11 has made the standard "no-show"ratio unreliable. I benefited as I was willing to give up my seat for a quite nice deal including business class, hotel etc... This was on United -- and to be honest I avoid them, preferring American -- but they treated people with consideration at CDG and they followed through on the generous offer they made to me.<BR><BR>IMHO Peter and the airline are both right and both pf them are wrong. In that situation it would benefit the airline to treat a customer a little better.<BR><BR>I also haven't seen any discussion of how we are to accurately determine how long it takes to get to an unfamiliar airport in adverse conditions. You know Peter left early enbough to hit the airport 55 minutes before his flight -- in unfamiliar and adverse conditions that's not bad. The day I was flying United wasn't releasing seats until just before the flight -- so Peter -- next time leave earlier -- and American shame on you!!!!

Peter is not only a whiner, but he's got a chip on his shoulder, too. Little David against Goliath. Oh please! How can you expect the corporations in America to take responsibility when the "little men" are also on the take. Peter, if you were in charge of WorldCom, you'd be right in there ripping everybody off.

It appears that many of you are on Peter's case for being late. Would you feel the same way if you all were delayed due to bad weather? In criticizing another person you fail to see yourself in the same situation until it happens to you.

I just know that I use bad weather and bad traffic as an excuse all the time, when I know, in my heart of hearts, that I should have left home earlier.

Peter most carriers require more than 1 hour check in for International flights. Sorry dude just chalk this up to learning the hard way. <BR>No you deserve no compensation.

Yeah, right.

Oh, boy, now it is the little guy against the heartless, ruthless big corporation. Peter, you've got us all. Abdicate all self control and responsibility and blame your actions (or failures) on the faceless corporations. Peter, your fellow WTO protesters are waiting for you. Better hurry up. "We don't like big, American Corporations (unless we can screw em for some quick $$$)."