Andalucia / Andalusia Itinerary help
 

We are a group of six or seven couples who will visit Andalucia from October 5 until the 16. We arrive at Madrid on the 3rd and will fly from there on the 5th to our starting point in Andalucia. We will return by plane from Granada on the 16th.
We want to visit: Sevilla, Cordova, Granada, Malaga, Pueblos Blancos (Ronda, Grazalema, Arcos), Jerez de la Frontera or any other place you recommend for a short wine tour). Optional: Tanger, Cadiz, Huelva, Marbella,Estepa...We are open to recommendations.
We plan to rent 3 cars. We don't know if there's any private driver that could also transport us- and if that would be a good idea...

1-Our initial idea is to start in Malaga and drive throught Torremolinos and Marbella (not planning to stay there).
2- Since we want to stay in Ronda at least 2 nights we aren't sure if it's better to go from Marbella to Ronda or continue the trip on the southern coast (take the ferry to Tanger) and visit Ronda and the Pueblos Blancos on our way to Sevilla.
3- Visit Sevilla- maybe return the car there and take the train to Cordova and then to Granada.

Any input is well received (Itinerary, hotels, etc.) We are reading Maribel's guides. I know many of you are experts.

Maribel also offers trip planning services.

Wait--6-7 couples meaning 14 people in 3 cars?
Why drive through Torremolinos and Marbella? I would drive from Malaga to Ronda, and then drive through pueblos blancos on the way to Sevilla, and train to Cordoba and Granada like you said (or bus--the bus is fine too). I'd leave off all of the optional places. Jerez is an easy day trip.
5-6 Malaga (it does warrant at least one night)
7-8 Ronda
9 where the wind takes you (Grazalema? Zahara? Just stop in Arcos en route to Sevilla)
10-12 Sevilla
13 Cordoba (overnighting here is nice, but you can do day trip)
14-16 Granada

Drop Torre and Marbella.

You can do Malage, Seville, Cordoba by train etc. Cordoba Seville, Jerez, Granada are the top 4 draws. Most towns are not car friendly but at these numbers could hire a mini bus and or driver

I just did a recent trip to Andalucia last Oct. We were 8 in total, 4 couples as part of a larger group for part of the trip and independent in part. It was great fun, we were/are very close friends. Still, I would HIGHLY recommend a professional trip planner as Robert mentions, especially if you want to stay close friends, hehe. And especially to help you get the most enjoyment and best locations for your group. It can get stressful dealing with alot of people even if you like each other.

I will add more later..but check out maribelsguides.com.

I would indeed go to Ronda. Forget Tanjiers IMO...later gater.

Oh in the meantime, tell us about yourselves a bit, ages, interests, etc. Do you live in a warm area with great beaches? If It helps to know.

Amsdon, you guessed it- we live in Puerto Rico...We are in our fifties-and spend most of our weekends at the beach with some of our friends. We are all very good friends and have traveled together before, although not that many at a time. Eight of us traveled to Italy 2 years ago and drove 2 cars, took trains and enjoyed every part of it but particularly Tuscany and the small hotel we stayed at in Montefollonico.
We love to visit new places, learn history, enjoy good food and wine- and getting a taste of the places that the locals visit. We usually chose just one very nice restaurant for the trip. We enjoy the tapas and eating at other informal places.
Two of us (ladies) plan the trip- we make meetings to inform the plans and get input (it's also another excuse to get together) and the rest of our friends are just happy that we did all the research.

Thanks all of you for your suggestions. We are already considering leaving out the optional places and planning our trip around Malaga, Ronda, Sevilla and Granada so that we don't have to spend so much time checking in and out of hotels.

A ha! I thought so....I too am an ana..maria
I always ask about the beaches & weather. It helps to identify if the travelers are really into the coast for the water etc. Being from PR you know good beaches and this is not what you are going to Spain for. Also you must speak spanish so this will also help alot. (?) By the way we were not crazy about Marbella after all the hoopla.

Seriously, you can the Ave train first class from Madrid to Cordoba it's wonderful. Then to Sevilla too
Or consider having someone arrange a small bus to the other places like Granada since there are 8 of you it is alot more fun than 3 cars.

I think you will love Spain. We love many of the same things, tapas, good food, wine, flamenco.
Will you be in Madrid at all?

We stayed here in Gaucin http://www.lafructuosa.com/index_en.html
just a short drive out of Ronda. I wish we had timed it so we culd have had a lunch or dinner (weekends) We did like the hotel Gaucin is very small and lovely.

I also read from Maribel about the alcubilla del caracol and sent soome friends there. They loved it. http://www.alcubilladelcaracol.com/

Oh yes and we were sorry we did not dedicate more time to Malaga, whic we liked very very much thanks to Fodorite Josele. I would stay there a night perhaps at the begining or the end.

Next time we want to do Cadiz. But with your time table I think you best leave that out this time. Spend time in Sevilla, Cordoba, Granada & Malaga & white villages. Maybe get to Ubeda or Baeza (parador?)check them out online.I have not yet been there and sorry that I have not.

Have fun planning!

I basically agree with yorkshire, his looks a good plan. I rec. you refine on that. Then wqe'll go into details.
Hi, amsdon!

I also like Yorkshire's plan. I would make sure to spend at least 3 nights in Sevilla and 2 in Granada. Malaga is a cool city and a night there is good. I would skip Torremolinos and Marbella and especially Tangier.

We have been in Spain before and love it. In fact, we love Madrid so much that since it's a stop-over from Iberia's direct flight from San Juan, we'll spend there Oct 3rd and 4th. Our flight departs on the 2nd but it's an overnight flight so we arrive Madrid the 3rd.
And yes we all speak Spanish.
I've used this forum before and it has helped me a lot- I just read the forums and suggestions to other people. In fact, it was here that I got the suggestion use the lovely Hotel La Costa in Italy.
On that trip we used walkie-talkies to communicate from car to car without incurring expenses- and it was fun. But we're considering hiring the mini-bus or driver. We still have to research that since I don't know who gives the service.

Yorkshire, thanks for the itinerary.

We will start the trip in either Cordova or Sevilla. We decided to leave out our "optionals" as you all suggested.

5,6,7,8 Sevilla (day trip to Cordova)
0R
5 Cordova
6-8 Sevilla
rent the car or mini-bus with driver
8,9,10 Ronda
11 ?
12 Malaga
13 Ubeda/Baeza?
Return car in Granada the 14?
14-16 Granada

Is it easy to visit Jerez from Ronda? We want to do the wine tour.
Amden, I loved the hotels..the La Fructuosa may be too small for our group, but the Alcubilla would be perfect. We need to make those reservations soon...We can already picture ourselves in those places. We enjoy planning the trip so much!!!!

The owners of La Fructuosa are very nice. We had the place practically to ourselves.I think there are 4 bedroms and a lounge . If you do not go on a day they offer a cena or almuerzo (for which they are known) you will find it very quiet. I would also love to stay In Ronda though...so you have some deciding.

I also hear the owner of the Carmen Caracol really makes it special with all his information...and since you speak spanish all the better.

As for Ubeda and Baeza I know they have had some interesing reports here somewhere. Perhaps Josele (Hi Josele!) can enlighten us.

By the way did you see Josele's report on Pueblos Blancos?

1. Ok here is Josele's very informative Pueblos Blancos report.

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...ancos-trip.cfm


2. By the way our Fodorite Josele is an incredible artist you should all check out his website. http://www.jgonzalezbueno.com/

3. Josele what were the names of those GREAT tapas places in Malaga????? We LOVED them and perhaps we can direct Ana to them? . I personally thought them much better than in Sevilla. Additionally, our humble Fodorite has one of his works of art adorning the entrance of a certain tapa restaurante in Malaga...Jose can you help me out here my memory is tired today.... which place ...El Pimpi?

Oh and Oct 12 is a holiday but it really did not make much difference if I recall.

Both Ubeda and Baeza the UNESCO twin cities are worth a visit. I like Baeza best, it's smaller and has a friendlier feel about it.

Just outside Baeza visit Hacienda La Laguna http://www.museodelaculturadelolivo....lanovisita.php

The museum is really good and it's hotel reputation is good too. I've not stayed there but had coffee there several times.

Here are some photos of Ubeda http://www.museodelaculturadelolivo....lanovisita.php

Oops photos of Ubeda are here
http://www.andalucia-for-holidays.com/Ubeda.html

Ronda and Arcos are not a white village. Avoid the the real ehite Villages at all cost. There is nothing at all there worth seeing.

Don't even stop at Torremolinos and Marbella. Nothing by high rise condominiums.

In Ronda, there is a great little hotel, San Gabriel.

I would also consider staying a night in Carmona (outside of Seville) at the really beautiful parador. It's a nice little town, too.

I would also absolutely include Nerja somehow. It's the last nice place on Costa del Sol. Stay on the Balcon de Europa.

Lastly, if you plan on driving, be prepared for a lot of aggrevation and a lot of time lost. The roads off the major freeways are terrible. The Spaniards don't believe in road signs, except as means of confusing you. Finding your way to and through any town or city is a nightmare warren of narrow one-way streets whose name seems to change every other block.

All I can say is stay in Seville for 4 nights and 3 nights in Ronda would be too much for me.

You've gotten some good advice.

I fall into the "Do the AVE from Madrid to Cordoba, then AVE Cordoba to Sevilla" camp. [I did enjoy the drive from Malaga to Ronda but the AVE is so easy.] Don't pick up cars until ready to leave Sevilla. With the cars pick up Jerez, Grazalema, etc and Ronda. I think the best part of the "White Villages" is the scenery altho I have had some nice meals in the local cafes. In any event, I think the scenery puts it on the "must do" list. [BTW: There is a wonderful place to stay in Benoajan, 5 miles outside of Ronda, called Molina del Santo. About 15 separate buildings in cloistered garden. Peaceful and quiet and wonderful flowers. Good food. I don't think driving into Ronda is a problem because of the underground municipal garage right in the center of town. It might be a nice break after the hustle of Cordoba and Seville.] After Ronda I'd head for Granada and get rid of the cars immediately upon arriving. I am not a big fan of Ubeda altho the parador there is very impressive. I did enjoy the National Park just east of town tho. Re Granada: It is much more than the Alhambra. Poke about the Albaicin, and the old residential area just about 1/4 mile north of downtown [can't remember the name - senior moment], and even the "conventional" areas of town [Camino de Ronda, Avenida de la Constitution - you will find terrific small restaurants that survive because they measure up to the standards of knowing locals not just we unknowing tourists]

You will have a great trip no matter how you do it. There are no wrong answers.

Sorry, I didn't mean to leave you hanging in Granada. I think you have two options for getting back to Madrid. a] fly. b] Pick up cars and drive up through Ubeda, and the windmills in Consuergra. It will give you a tr understanding of Spain.

El Tapeo de Cervantes in central Málaga gets raving reviews for both traditional and innovative tapas.
http://www.tripadvisor.com/Restauran...Andalusia.html

Bar Lo Güeno in Calle de Marín García, 9 and El Cortijo de Pepe in Plaza de la Merced, 2 are traditional and sure bets in the center of town.

Casa Aranda in C/ Herrería del Rey, 3 must be among the best cafés in Spain (coffee, chocolate, churros).
http://www.casa-aranda.net/

Thanks so much to all of you for all the suggestions. We will meet this weekend and continue refining the trip- so keep them coming!!!

If you're interested in horseback riding... I did a wonderful 3-hour sunrise ride in Ronda. Gorgeous!

The white villages are small whitewashed and well-kept sierra towns. There are many others I can recommend, I know practically all of them, but Grazalema (with two beautiful churches)and Zahara (with castle and reservoir)are the most popular for their particular surroundings. In fact they are beautiful, and I disagree with this poster recommending to avoid them.
I like Nerja, but it is not worth the big detour to get there on this particular itinerary.
I know Ubeda and Baeza, and though they are impressive small cities, full (and I mean FULL) of Renaissance churches, palaces and buildings, it is not the idea most people have of Andalusia. Anyway, they deserve a 3-day stay and it is not the case here, it is a long drive for a day trip.
Ronda has more chance of lodging all of you, anav, and the trip to Jerez is an easy one from Ronda, I'd rather do it from here than from SSeville. Go refining your itinerary.
Amsdon, the place with the tile panel is El Pimpi, calle Granada entrance. I made the design and others painted it on tile. The other place is La Campana, as well in C. Granada, usually crowded, but places each sides and in front are very nice as well.
I still have not had the chance to go to El Tapeo de Cervantes, this week I went to El Perro Blanco, very near (calle Cárcer), a restaurant for a not-so-big splurge, which I highly recommend (a funny website, at www.perroblancorestaurante.com).

Ah, the wise wise Josele thank you. Ana take note of his comments re Ubeda..it sounds too fsr. Josele knows his way since he a Malagueño. Be sure to go to the places he mentions for tapas... delicious! We were sorry we only allocated one day. Two at least for Malaga. Perhaps at the end?

We will meet today:

This are the plans up to now:

3rd arrive at Madrid
5th- AVE from Madrid to Cordova
6th- AVE to Sevilla: 6-8 Sevilla
rent the car or mini-bus with driver
8,9-Ronda - visit Grazalema, Zahara, Arcos, Jerez.etc
10-11 ?
11-12 Malaga
13 ?- maybe an extra night in Granada
14-16 Granada

We already have plans to fly out of Malaga with Iberia. It takes to Madrid where it connects to our flight back to Puerto Rico.

I'm so happy all of you are willing to help us- and have offered great suggestioms. I'm taking notes also of all the good places to stay and to eat. Amsdon, thank you for your constant guidance- and for bringing Josele into the forum. Josele, are you currently living in Malaga?
I will update later.

I would add more time to Ronda. Ronda is worth at least a day on its own. We stayed 2 and didn't see everything. It's a lovely town. Don't miss the Arab baths.

At the bare minimum I would spend one day in Ronda, and the other day driving through Zahara, Grazalema, etc and maybe taking some walks through the beautiful countryside.

Agree - Ronda is amazing, and so are the White Villages. Not to be missed! We loved Zahara and Grazalema. We had lunch in both places. In Zahara, we climbed up to the top of the moorish fort with its incredible views over the town, mountains, lakes and countryside.

Have you considered Priego de Cordoba and La Subbetica area? It's a beautiful somewhat undiscovered/off the beaten touristy area. A very friendly town chock full of Baroque churches and surrounded by olive trees. Nearby are several white villages - Baena and Cabra probably are the largest. There is not much written in guidebooks or even in these boards on this area but it is quickly becoming one of my favorite areas of Andalucia.

http://www.turismodepriego.com/
http://www.subbetica.es/

Antequera and Osuna are also 2 stops that may fit well into your itinerary.

anav, I actually live in Malaga. I shall have an exhibition in London next October, but still do not know the schedule (which I'll post on my website in due time). We'll see this later on.
I find your itin OK, the night in Cordoba will let you see the Mezquita and Juderia and something else with no rush (I always recommend siesta time for the Mezquita visit, much quieter).
With base in Ronda you can stay three nights: one day for Ronda, another for Pueblos blancos, and another for Jerez. Arcos is very beautiful, on the way to Jerez, maybe a stop on your way back. But it is very similar to Ronda, do not worry much if you miss it.
If your plane to Madrid leaves early, better spend the night in Malaga, there are several hotels near the airport with reasonable fares (the area is not very posh, but the hotels are very modern), Ibis and Novotel.
When you have your itinerary ready, we'll begin with restaurants and what to see.

Oh you know what?...I think we were in Cordoba on the on the 11 or 12 of Oct and it was insane!!! Crowded at the Mezquita !! I can't believe I had forgotten. (Bad memory these days sorry it's just terrible ) This was just last Oct mid you. So I am very glad YOU are not there on that holiday!

Ana Ronda is beautiful and historic AND imo some of the best shopping for gifts etc...so allow time there for that. You would not want to miss that? :S- It also has the bullring yes and the oldest to boot plys it's where Madonna viseo was shot so when you go there be sure to take a pic of yourself in one of her poses. hehe ...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihIfM5VVcjk

Josele what about the hotel right there in the centro? Was it a room mate hotel? It would be a nice location for last minute feel of Malaga, and last minute tapas....

Lastly I was looking for CathyM our Cadiz expert!!! You should def look for her info too. Cathy how many trips to Cadiz/Jerez area now for you?

I just returned from my 7th trip to Cadiz - 6 during Semana Santa and 1 trip in April after Semana Santa! I'm returning to La Rioja and the Basque country in September. It's becoming my route - Semana Santa in Andalucia and September in the North.

12 de Octubre is Virgen del Pilar, a very popular religious festivity in Spain (and holiday I believe), so probably churches shall be crowded, but you may get in for free on the other hand ;-). This year is on a Tuesday, and many people may take a long holiday, so make sure you get your bookings right!!!
Spending last night in Malaga center depends on at what time you have to be at the airport. There is a short peak hour with a big jam on that road.

I think this will be our final itinerary:

3,4-Madrid
5-Cordova
6,7,8 -Sevilla
rent the car or mini-bus with driver
9,10,11-Ronda - visit Grazalema, Zahara, Arcos, Jerez.etc
12,13 Malaga
14, 15 Granada
Depart from GRANADA the 16th

Josele, I was in a hurry yesterday and made a few mistakes- we fly out of Granada. Being from Puerto Rico we know a lot about long weekends...somos latinos, je, je,. We will be in Malaga on the 12th. Any recommendations for Hotels in Malaga. What about Ronda?

I'm doing research also aa Trip Advisor.

I started to try to make hotel reservations and, in fact, am a bit worried. Contacted Alcubilla del Caracol and Santa Isabel La Real in Granada- and they don't have rooms for all of us.

Maribel's guides has a Granada section did you check it?
By the way itin. looks great.

Here's great thread on Malaga...be sure to read Josele's post in this re hotels. http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...s-315610-2.cfm

In Granada, I've stayed at the Alhambra Palace Hotel and the Parador de Granada. Both very nice!

In Ronda, I stayed at Husa Reina Victoria.

Hotel in Seville was the gorgeous Alfonso XIII Hotel.

Hi anav.
Departing from Granada is more reasonably.
Malaga hotels: Check AC Malaga Palacio, good views, and Hotel Don Curro, a one minute walk but no views, so lower priced. If you have a car, you'll need one with parking (AC has very limited space; don Curro, none). So I may rec. NH Malaga.
Ronda:
The Reina Victoria is a good old-but-renewed hotel with free private parking space, and easy walking distance from the town center. The Parador has its garage (12-15 eur. per night). Others (as far as I recall) have no place to park but the street, and that can be a serious problem.
Joannyc, I love those hotels, but they are pricey $$$, and the Parador you have to book with a lot of advance.

josele,

Yes, they may be pricey but I only get to Europe once a year so I like to do it right! ;-)